NOW goes to DNC

[mac2]

and asks for Florida delegates and votes to be counted. Seems Republicans are interfering in our primary.

http://www.now.org/press/04-08/04-29.html

[MaineDem]

1. Gee, who woulda thought...

[AllentownJake]

2. The same NOW

in NY that repeats Hillary Clinton talking points everyday.

[mac2]

3. You don't see a problem with the Republicans who made

the mess in Florida to begin with?

[AllentownJake]

6. You mean

The democrats who agreed with the GOP that got a little scared when the DNC told them what would happen and than did nothing to try to stop the GOP in the first place.

Sorry you can blame the GOP all you want the Democrats in Florida were complacit. How many democrats voted against moving the primary.

[billyoc]

4. The ones that threw NARAL under the bus?

:rofl:

[mac2]

9. You miss the point.

"Florida Democrats did not choose to move their primary earlier – the Republican-majority legislature did that, and they did it over the active opposition of the Florida Democratic Party."

Florida Democratic Party are not responsible for moving their primary earlier...the Republicans did it to cause punishment and lose their delegates.

FLorida Republicans once again remove the voting power of Democrats in their state and get away with it. Even our own party leaders blaming/punishing the Dems of that state.

[AllentownJake]

15. See my response

to that lie above.

[AllentownJake]

16. See my response

to that lie above.

[Johnny__Motown]

20. Not true, it is so sad that your position is so weak you need to lie about this (link provided)

http://blogs.tampabay.com/buzz/files/geller_amendment_fullh.264%20300Kbps.mov



The Dems wanted this too. They did not fight it. Stop lying about what happened.

[ensho]

49. the dems in Fl. have zero power

nt

[ClassWarrior]

51. There's value in fighting a losing battle, versus bending over...

...and dropping one's expensive tailored slacks.

NGU.

[ensho]

55. you know for a fact they didn't fight?

nt

[Gore1FL]

76. I do I saw the video

It's on DU, look for it. The Dem is there giggling and laughing about pretending to be opposed to it, but asking them to do it anyways. It's actually pretty sickening. I look for it and post another response to your post with the the link.

[Gore1FL]

82. Here you go a video record

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fs-SAYaJKN4

[mckeown1128]

58. wow...that doesn't matter..

because those powerless FL dems introduced the legislation and voted FOR it.

[mckeown1128]

56. Stop making things up...

Look I know it isn't your fault that you have bought the Clinton talking points that "the GOP forced this on FL Dems" but it isn't true. It was a FL Dem that introduced the legislation. The FL Dems voted WITH the republicans during the whole process.

[Catherina]

97. Bullshit. Jeremy Ring, D-Parkland, was the chief Democratic proponent of an early primary

State Sen. Jeremy Ring, D-Parkland, was the chief Democratic proponent of an early Florida primary.

He wanted to make the state a center of attention, a place that presidential candidates needed to cater to.

...

http://weblogs.sun-sentinel.com/news/politics/broward/blog/2008/03/jeremy_ring_sponsor_of_early_p.html

HE RAN ON THAT, DEMOCRATS VOTED FOR HIM, THEN HE SPONSORED THAT BILL IN THE SENATE AND DEMOCRATS VOTED FOR IT. Get your facts straight please.

[GarbagemanLB]

5. I wonder if they would endorse Condi if she ran. She is a woman, after all.

[mac2]

44. You've got to be kidding.

Condi? Stop getting off the issue. The point is the primary was Republican controlled in Florida.

[Double T]

7. I find it TOTALLY AMAZING that SOME DEMOCRATS ACTUALLY want to disenfranchise voters.........

from their own political party so THEIR CANDIDATE can falsely win. IT IS UN-FRIGGING BELIEVABLE!! KEEP ON KICKING ASS LADIES!!!

[NightWatcher]

8. Vaginas Uber Alles

[mac2]

13. And the scum is the Republicans.

Our party leaders mislead many into thinking it was the Democrats in those states who violated the "party rules". It was the Republican controlled legislative bodies.

[GarbagemanLB]

24. How many Democrats in the Florida legislature voted against moving up the date?

[mac2]

Apparently not enough to over rule the Republicans.

The whole state of Florida politician are involved in voting fraud. They should lose their right to representation as punishment. Our party leaders went along on the national level by punishing the Democratic voters of that state.

[JTFrog]

85. Had they put up any resistance they would not have been penalized.

Something to chew on.

[Irishonly]

88. There was one

Everyone else voted for it.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6122987

The Florida democrats also voted against holding a second primary.

[Double T]

30. The rethugs were THEN, the DNC continues what the rethugs started........

making THEM NOW responsible. COUNT ALL THE VOTERS AND THEIR VOTES!!

[AllentownJake]

11. Hillary had no problem with

disenfranchising them before she was losing. Than suddenly she was Ghandi, Rosa Parks, and Jesus Christ fighting for them.

Kind of funny one of her chief strategist voted to strip the delegates in the first place.

However cheap talking points work better than facts for Hillbots.

[susankh4]

14. Keep on Kicking Ass, Ladies!

That's right! Because"

"Failure is impossible."

[cali]

21. point me to one comment of yours

that objected to the FL and MI punative DNC measures, when that decision came down.

Then you might have some credibility.

[habitual]

29. this is not a GE, this is a party primary

The party is having a primary to choose it's candidate for the GE.

The party has rules for these primaries.

FL and MI decided, by their own accord, to break the rules of the party KNOWING they would be punished for it.

FL and MI decided that this was OK with them.

They broke the rules knowing there would be consequences, now they are crying foul about having to live with that.

Tough shit.

Type in caps all you want, I am totally amazed at all the followers of a particular candidate that are so outraged by this now that their candidate is losing, when they were happier than pigs in shit to accept it before their candidate was losing. The hypocrisy is so blatant and obvious.

To top it all off, instead of seeing their own disgusting hypocrisy, they want to blame supporters of the opponent of their candidate.

Un-friggin-believable.

[Cassandra]

39. Fl and MI pushed against the rules to take on Dean.

Those state leaders are DLC and they feel they win either way; if they prevail, the votes get counted and if they don't, they get to blame Dean. It is the DLC which has trashed the votes of the voters in Mi and FL.

[mac2]

I just told you the Florida legislative body decided on the date of the

primary not the Florida party leaders. It was not Hillary or women or anyone else trying to steal the election from god Obama.

[habitual]

52. ummm you just told me what?

get your facts straight, you didn't just tell me anything.

and I don't see how we disagree anyhow... u sure you responded to the right person?

[Johnny__Motown]

32. compared to lying, cheating and changing goal posts for political gain? it is the lesser evil

besides, FL and MI have both forwarded compromises that will get their/our delegations seated without changing the outcome.

Hillary lost, Deal with it,

[mac2]

48. You lost your country. Get over it.

[skipos]

38. This MI voters says DONT YOU & HILLARY TRY TO TRICK ME!

MI was told that our vote would not go towards delegates. Even flip flopping Hillary said our election wouldn't "count for anything." Many of us stayed home instead of wasting our time on this faux vote.

So now you and Hillary want to say "Surprise! We fooled you! These votes are going to count for delegates!"

You and Hillary disgust me.

[Johnny__Motown]

42. THIS MI VOTER AGREES

[seaglass]

63. You sound like those Bush voters from the FL panhandle that

whined that they didn't vote because the state had already been called for Gore. Did you know about that? All the election problems of the past 8 years didn't motivate you enough to exercise your right to vote? I really don't get that thinking.

[Kierkegaard]

40. Are you kidding me?!?

You may also find it TOTALLY AMAZING that SOME of us actually want to play by the rules that were established BEFORE THE GAME BEGAN! You CANNOT change the rules MID-STREAM! Is there any part of this that is difficult to understand???

[mac2]

50. You like the rules when they have been manipulted?

[Kierkegaard]

61. Who manipulted the rules again?

Dag nab those manipulterers!

[OzarkDem]

53. There's no excuse for it, none at all

One more example of Democrats being asked to sacrifice a hard won cause - free and fair elections - just to support Obama. No way.

If Dem leaders go ahead with disenfranchisement we will never again be able to successfully contest vote rigging or stealing by Repubicans.

Why do Obama supporters opposed to free and fair elections?

[ensho]

54. we will - Fl. and Mich. women's votes need counted

Dem men hold the power

count Fl. and Mich.

[Leopolds Ghost]

10. Is this the group that said Obama supporters were "gang-raping" Hillary Clinton?

[AllentownJake]

12. Sure was

they also went after NARAL for having the audacity to endorse Obama.

[mac2]

17. You fail to miss the point of who was responsible for the FL

early primary violation. Republicans.

I don't give a bat about the candidates but the process was manipulated and the DNC leaders failed to tell us about it.

[AllentownJake]

18. Oh no

I don't miss the point. I've responded to you on that issue above. Still waiting.

[GarbagemanLB]

27. How many Democrats in the Florida legislature voted against moving up the date?

[Jazzgirl]

100. Get a clue.

It was Democrats that introduced the legislation and the date change. They wanted it! It was okay when Hillary was up but now that she's losing it's not okay??!!?? I am definitely takin' a break from this board. I can't stand the hypocrisy anymore.

[mac2]

22. I'm not talking about NARAL

I'm talking about the primary in Florida!!

Obama and Hillry with their globalization hurt many women and their children indirectly. How? Low wages and loss of jobs to off-shore.

[Tippy]

19. We all know Floridians are not smart enough to follow the rules...

The DNC told them more than once how to do this....just vote no and we will work out a deal..That is all they had to do and we would not be having this discussion but they voted with the Republican legislature....Now they are crying in their beer calling the DNC and all who back the DNC cheats....

NOW should have gone to Florida before the vote...and told them to vote NO...I am getting sick of all the talk about votes not being counted coming out of FL.....Their elected Democratic officials sold their votes down the river...

[mac2]

25. The elections have been stolen since 2000

They are smart enough to know that. NOW did go to both parties.

[AllentownJake]

26. You won't get a response

It's off the talking points from the conference call and the OP isn't sure how to deal with it.

[Johnny__Motown]

23. Anyone gonna cry Sexism? If a group of men did something like this ......

[mac2]

31. It's not about Hillary or women. It's about Republicans

being the reason for the early primary election.

How can we get back power if the large states such as Florida were disenfrancised, etc. ever since 2000?

[AllentownJake]

33. FAIL

The democrats were complacit. You know this your just lying for your girl.

[Johnny__Motown]

34. LIES... that just isn't true... watch this video

http://blogs.tampabay.com/buzz/files/geller_amendment_fullh.264%20300Kbps.mov

[GarbagemanLB]

35. How many Democrats in the Florida legislature voted against moving up the date?

[Johnny__Motown]

36. posting this video again... 3rd time this thread... feel free to copy the link

http://blogs.tampabay.com/buzz/files/geller_amendment_fullh.264%20300Kbps.mov

[Catherina]

99. Big steaming pile of horseshit n/t

[dkf]

28. Harold Ickes voted to strip all delegates from FL and MI.

He agreed with the decision until it became inconvenient.

Of all the factions in the rules committee, the largest are loyal to Clinton. Ergo, it was the Clinton team behind the original decision.

Hillary caused this problem, not Obama. She only wants to fix it when it works for her. Classic Narcissistic behavior.

[mac2]

37. He can't over rule the Republican legislative body but

did decide on the punishment.

I DON'T CARE ABOUT HILLARY OR OBAMA. I'm worried about the democratic process with so many lies and manipulation within our own party. Why punish at all? Even if a candidate of your chosing wins the primary the others will feel it was not fair. That's what elections are for...to make it fair for both sides instead of out in the streets.

[AllentownJake]

41. Who would you like to be the Nominee?

I already know the answer

EPIC FAIL

[mac2]

45. Edwards.

[Johnny__Motown]

46. Come on Mac2.. watch this video and try to blame the rupugs for this.. Please

http://blogs.tampabay.com/buzz/files/geller_amendment_fullh.264%20300Kbps.mov

[mac2]

66. Your video does not come up on my computer.

Repubs not interfer in elections? Since when?

[Johnny__Motown]

43. WATCH THIS VIDEO AND RESPOND.. Please

http://blogs.tampabay.com/buzz/files/geller_amendment_fullh.264%20300Kbps.mov

[dkf]

57. It was a punishment to keep our primary season from becoming chaotic.

My state petitioned to become one of the early states, but once the ruling came down as to which states would fall into this category, we didn't protest. Small states obey the rules, because we don't believe we can do whatever the hell we want to.

And I've read enough of madfloridian's journals to know that the Democrats weren't kicking and screaming when the Republicans decided to move the date up. On the contrary, they had a completely bogus vote where some guy sarcastically remarked that this was proof they were against moving the primary.

[mac2]

60. Small states are Conservative and McCain rules.

They didn't target you for that reason.

[Johnny__Motown]

64. Oh Come On... Watch the video and respond... it proves you are lying

[mac2]

95. And it also proves you have only one source....which

won't come up on my computer. Bye.

[dkf]

92. I'm in Hawaii. Talk about ethnically diverse. If anybody gave a rats ass about the Asian vote

we'd have been moved up.

And we have been a Democratic state for YEARS.

[ensho]

47. thank you NOW for speaking up

nt

[mac2]

59. It's the same ole...sit down and shut up to women isn't it?

These Obama posters don't get that the primary was manipulated period.

I as a Edwards supporter was out of it after the smaller states decided on who they wanted. Florida and Michigan Democratic voters were disenfranchised regardless of who they wanted for President. Once again two large liberal states have election fraud but before the GE.

How do they expect to win against McCain with so many pissed off Democrats? Republicans around the country might think we go against our own too.

I want Dean fired. He didn't bring us together as he keeps saying but made a big divide.

Ever since 2000 our party lacked backbone and manipuated elections to lose. I keep fighting because there is no other good choice.

[Johnny__Motown]

65. No.. it isn't FL has proposed a compromise.. why isn't that good enough?

[mac2]

67. Not good enough for democracy or our party.

Dean's answer is all about compromise isn't it. Strange how that is always true. For the good of the party. Ya...for his own good only.

[Johnny__Motown]

68. For the good of the party Florida should take the full punishment.. as should MI

What will happen next cycle if Fl and MI are excused this time around?


This is like Shrub and Scooter... no punishment for wrong doing.


Actions have consequences. The compromise is a reasonable one.


To bad you won't comment on the video that proves you are lying about this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=6122987&mesg_id=6122987

[mac2]

71. I don't agree.

It's not a good thing for anyone in a democracy. Punishment? Voters of those states are being punished for the party leaders and the Republican legislative bodies bad behavior?

[MagickMuffin]

86. Then you should take your anger out on Terence McAuliffe because he was Chair 2001-05

He served as chairman of the Democratic National Committee (DNC) from 2001-05.


Howard Dean didn't MAKE the RULES, he is just following the Rules (unlike some people) set forth before he was Chair. Get your facts straight.



Texas also considered moving our primary up, but decided against it because we would lose our delegates. Too bad the Florida and Michigan Democratic Party didn't give a rats ass about their voters.



Now that FL/MI have broken the RULES watch out for 2012. All states will use Florida and Michigan as Role Models, because hey they're trying to get away with breaking the RULES, and if they succeed then we'll see what happens in future elections.

[Evergreen Emerald]

62. National Organization of Women is run by progressives to help women.

It is another entity whose members have worked so hard for the rights of women. And they are accused on this board of being "republicans?

I do not understand?

[mac2]

69. I'm NOT thinking it's about NOW being Republican

It's about being pro-Hillary. Forget they have a right to be pro this or that. The churches can support Obama for their own agenda (violation of the Constitution).

NOW supports Hillary since she is a woman and is concerned over their issues.

I'm concerned about Republican's attempt to stealing our voting power. It has divided us and the party let them do it.

[Johnny__Motown]

70. I am gonna step on every post you make until you comment on the video.. you are lying. again

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=6122987&mesg_id=6122987

[mac2]

72. IT WON'T COME UP ON MY COMPUTER.

You are a arrogant person to accuse me of lying just because I don't support your candidate for President.

My spam filter or AT&T may be blocking it.

[Johnny__Motown]

79. I accuse you of lying because you say things that are not true.. let me explain the video

it is of Sen. Steven Geller, the minority leader of the Florida senate


He says that because the Democrats "really really want this measure to pass" (moving the primary). There is more to it than that.. about how they need to make a lip service protest because the Democratic party may punish them for moving the vote... it ends with a "throw me into the Brier patch" reference while everyone in the senate is laughing about it.



Your assertion that it is the Republicans who are to blame for moving the primary is a lie, that is why I call you a lier.
You are an arrogant person, and an ignorant one, to make such statements without anything like an understanding of what happened.

[mac2]

98. Get off my back.

[Evergreen Emerald]

80. what? Are you admitted to stalking someone?

What the hell is wrong with you? Back the F off.

[Johnny__Motown]

84. I didn't know the video would not come up for him/her... I did back off once I knew that

[OzarkDem]

74. NOW is for women, Hillary is a woman, Obama is not

What don't you understand about that?

[mac2]

77. Well that too.

[OzarkDem]

73. They've done a pretty good job

there's no one else out there advancing the cause for women. They and Emily's list have been the vanguard for helping Dem women get elected to public office.

The Presidential Glass ceiling is hard to break in the Democratic Party, but well worth the fight.

[mac2]

75. Considering our population is over half women

they are under represented. Only 16 or 17 in the Senate are women.

[OzarkDem]

78. Dems have an abysmal record on women's rights

I'm glad to see the women in the party finally standing up for themselves and for each other. Its the only way to save the party and the country. I seriously don't think this country can recover and move forward into the future without women leaders playing a much, much larger role.

[mac2]

83. Judging from this FL and MI thing I'd say there is a lot to

do within the party leadership. We let the Republicans hoodwink us and steal elections all the time.

[Johnny__Motown]

81. and only one African American.. if NAACP was doing something like this for Obama would you support

them also?

[mac2]

87. Yes.

I support African American groups. Their fight is ours. I am a Progressive.

I was angry on that weekend of Katrina that none sent lawyers with a court order to rescue the people from the flooding and lack of food, shelter, etc. I told them so.

I like Shelia Jackson Lee, Conyers, etc.and have sent them money for campaigns. I did vote for Obama the first time since I live in Illinois.

[OzarkDem]

89. They have been already

and no one has objected. So why is it ok to object to NOW and Emily's List becoming involved.

The repeated presence of double standards in this primary is stunning; and it will be fought every inch of the way.

[Johnny__Motown]

90. Really... NAACP is trying to influence the decision of the RBC? any evidence of that?

If so I am unaware of it

[OzarkDem]

91. Of course not, it favors their candidate

They and their surrogates have used their influence in numerous other situations during this campaign.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=naacp+obama+primary+campaign+DNC&btnG=Search

[Johnny__Motown]

93. Then how is it a double standard when they are not doing the same thing?

It seems to me that people supporting the rules .... and people supporting Breaking the rules are not the same. Therefor it can't possibly be a double standard.

[mac2]

96. Thanks I didn't know that.

[Johnny__Motown]

94. Here is the youtube version of the video

sorry about "stalking" you, but the idea that the Democrats did not agree to have the primary moved up in Florida is just plain wrong.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r25wUeMAwdE

[MilesColtrane]

101. DAVID BRANCACCIO IS DEAD TO ME!!

;)