I am very proud of Hillary and very proud to be a supporter...

[Oleladylib]

She will not exit now or until as she says..EVERY voter has their say...That is exactly the way it should be...Exiting now says the remaining voters do not count. They do ..just as much as we early ones did. She is correct and practices justice to every voter.

[niyad]

1. it never ceases to amaze me that some here are so ready to throw over the democratic process,

especially since they are absolutely certain their candidate is winning.

why the rush, I wonder?

[Oleladylib]

5. generally fear, with or without reason causes the "rush".

[bobbert]

63. The only thing we fear is what Hillary will do to our chances in November

[bowens43]

29. Did you say that about hillary when she said it would be over on super tuesday?

[emilyg]

37. It's fear.

We have not heard Wright's reply. Who knows?

[rodeodance]

57. and they call them selves "progressives"! sick.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

2. Hillary: "It'll be over by February 5th."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4636361&mesg_id=4636361

[tekisui]

50. Bill Clinton called Caucuses "shams".

[JackORoses]

3. Hillary wants every vote to count except when she uses the Supers to overrule all the votes

How can your brain handle that paradox?

[Oleladylib]

6. it's easy...Hillary has taken the states that generally vote democratic.

how could you not know that?

[sandnsea]

19. Like WA, ME, VT, WI, MN, MD, IL, CT, OR

She hasn't even won the majority of the blue states.

[MonkeyFunk]

8. How do Obama fans

handle the paradox of Obama gaining more delegates in Texas, when more voters expressed a preference for Clinton?

[Youphemism]

It's not even one dox, let alone a paradox

I don't think I'd call myself an "Obama fan," though I do support the guy...

I don't think this is a paradox. The system in Texas is stupid. The system of having so many superdelegates is stupid. (I'd call it "elitist," but that's now an overused word that might make me sound "bitter.")

If the democrats don't fix these gaping flaws in their system -- including the flaws that allow republican state officials mess with their primary timing and arrangements, and the flaws that allow republicans to make crossover votes to keep the democrats at war with each other -- then they are just begging to lose in future elections.

I think, though, that this debacle will give them some incentive.

[NatBurner]

40. she dismissed the caucus process

she called it, what? a bunch of "activists"?

something like that-

but i don't think she understood how our system works until it was too late

just my opinion

[MonkeyFunk]

62. That doesn't answer the question

the point is, Clinton hasn't argued that the superdelegates should overturn teh will of the people. She's argued that the pledged delegate count isn't the best gauge of the will of the people.

A perfect example is TExas, where more voters clearly preferred her, but Obama got more delegates.

[Youphemism]

65. She is part of the system that made those rules

If she wants to make that argument, then she should try to change the rules sometime when she's not in the middle of an election. The fact is, whether she likes it or not, delegate count is the way the score is kept. Hillary didn't have any complaints about that system until it started working against her.

Because she thought she was inevitable, she didn't even contest the caucus states -- just as she didn't give say a word about discounting the votes of Florida and Michigan until she realized she needed them. When she realized what a mistake that was, she started complaining about the caucus system, just as she suddenly decided that Florida and Michigan were important.

She doesn't care about the people in Michigan who couldn't vote for their candidate because his name wasn't on the ballot. She doesn't worry about voters in the caucus states when she fails to add their voices into her "total US votes" tally.

She cares about the metrics that will show her as the frontrunner. This is one of the reason that people tend to get so upset with her. It's hard to respect someone who favors trying to change the rules after the game has started when they never said a word about those rules until they started losing.

[Kittycat]

4. Hillary McHuckalieberman

[rodeodance]

58. more IMMaTURE name-calling--just like HS bullies!!

[Kittycat]

60. Wah - wah

Why don't you go post more about 'black' voters.

[DJ13]

7. You do know that even if she quit the remaining primaries will be held?

No one is removing her name from the ballots if she quit.

Anyone wishing to vote for her would still have the chance.

:eyes:

[niyad]

11. a meaningless chance. or don't you get that?

[Oleladylib]

30. That's not the point...but closed minds are not worth time.

[RaleighNCDUer]

49. Just as it is now, then.

There is no legitimate way for her to win. For the SDs to carry her over the top would be disastrous for them as the majority of them (and she needs the VAST majority of them) come from states that have already voted for Obama - meaning next time they are up for re-election they will be shown the curb. They know that. Therefore, they will not vote against the votes of their home states.

It is over, and any further votes for Hillary are just as meaningless.

Don't you get that?

[Oleladylib]

12. Now that show no faith in the process...Please! She is right in what she is doing.

And if it isn't decided until the convention..there needs to be alot of soul searching done on the part of the DNC.

[DJ13]

22. She is right in what she is doing.

You do realize she's coming across as a person driven by ego and lacking enough sensibility to know when to quit (even to her formerly supportive MSM friends) I hope.

She isnt doing you, or herself, any favors by staying in.

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Oleladylib]

15. your language shows your dirt eating ability as an American.

low class or no class?

[BlooInBloo]

17. Have fun with your Whites Only campaign.

[Oleladylib]

23. Naw...I'm good with colors. That's always a pretty good ploy though.

[DMorgan]

42. So why is Hillary so BAD with colors?

[BlooInBloo]

43. Well obviously it's reverse racism. There's clearly no reason why black folks shouldn't vote for her

:rofl:

[DMorgan]

48. Love your sarcasm!

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

10. We're waiting on Her Majesty.

However, could I have a towel or sponge on which to rest my kneeling knee?

[Dr Fate]

13. Or, you could argue that Obama deserves the same courtesy given to Kerry, Gore, Bill Clinton, etc.

The courtesey I'm speaking of is clearing the way early enough to allow them to rally the DEMS and campaign against the GOP.

This has been done for every other DEM candidate in the past several decades until Obama...

[Oleladylib]

20. it's never been this divided a contest...

[Dr Fate]

39. Divided enough for my analogy to hold water. What if Dean had behaved like Hillary?

He certainly had plenty of supporters who would have stuck it out with him as long as he wanted to go, despite his chances.

He could have smeared Kerry enough to gain more supporters and keep the race going on even longer- but he didnt...

In any event, I'm ready to start fighting McCain/GOP/media instead of each other whenever you guys are...

[CK_John]

24. And that worked out real well for the party. n/t

[Oleladylib]

25. is the party more important than the eventual president...NOPE

[greguganus]

34. Is the party more important than that narcisstic war monger who only cares about herself.....YEP

[RaleighNCDUer]

51. ABSOLUTELY.

We are a party of the PEOPLE, by the PEOPLE, for the PEOPLE. The party is FAR more important than any individual leader in the party. It is the party - the collective will of all the Democratic voters - which passes its principles from one generation to the next. As long as the party is preeminent, its fate won't depend upon one good leader, nor can it be destroyed by one bad leader.

We cannot allow any cult of personality to become more important than the principles of the party. THAT is the road to royalty - not some mythical 'dynasty'. When a party leader thows over our principles, adopting Republican tactics and espousing American exceptionalism and empire, it is incumbent on us to put that leader aside.

[Dr Fate]

31. I included Bill Clinton in my statement as well. n/t

n/t

[Big Blue Marble]

14. Did you feel that way in 04 when Kerry was the nominee much earlier?

Whether she stays in or drops out ALL THE VOTES WILL COUNT. Your Clinton talking point is a feint.
In all the primaries all the votes count. I live in Kentucky. Our primary is always after the nominee has
been picked. Our votes still count. "Every voter has their say."

Now the most important thing is party unity. The party needs to rally around their nominee. And
that is what will happen over then next two weeks.

As I said I live in Kentucky. Our primary once again will be after our nominee has been decided.
It happened last night.

[Oleladylib]

18. Nope it didn't ...so sorry..Stay with the process ..until the convention..

if you can stand it.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

21. Did you feel that way when Clinton said the race would be over in February?

[Starbucks Anarchist]

28. I linked to that upthread.

The OP didn't answer. :rofl:

[SemiCharmedQuark]

41. Here's video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saBU6ux0hsQ

[DMorgan]

46. WOW, Obama should use that in his TV Ads....

That would really help Clinton win Super Del's now!

RIGHT!

[benddem]

16. Hilary wants all the votes to count

when she cheats and after PROMISING to keep her name off the ballot in MI she did it anyway and now wants those votes to count? Give me a break. She wants all the votes to count when none of the candidates campaigned in FL, but because of her obvious name recognition...she got more votes. She also promised those votes wouldn't count. I am sick of her and her followers moving the goal posts.
She'll be creamed in OR. So I wouldn't wait for those votes.

[sandnsea]

27. Is she stll coming tomorrow?

I would love for there to be a huge protest along the road, singing good bye songs to her. Last I knew she was going to be in Ashland and Central Point. She has to be driving somewhere along the way there.

[bowens43]

26. She had no problem with them not counting

when she said the race would be over on super tuesday. You didn't see her saying that the race should continue beyond super tuesday when she thought she had it wrapped up.

Your candidate is liar and a hypocrite who will do or say anything to get the power that she believs is rightfully hers. Don't think for a minute that she cares about the voters, she doesn't.

[Oleladylib]

33. I love worthless opinions...they generally exhibit ignorance..

[helderheid]

32. I thought according to her it would be over on Super Tuesday

:shrug:

[Cha]

35. Every low information voter.

[ShortnFiery]

36. She's shameless and could very well TRASH our chances both for the Executive and Legislative...

branches come the GE.

She embarrasses herself and if she continues, she'll be lucky to be re-elected to the Senate, much less become "majority leader." :thumbsdown:

[MannyGoldstein]

38. So Did Others (e.g., John Edwards) Do The Wrong Thing By Exiting? [nt]

[shayes51]

44. I'm with you.

[PATRICK]

45. It has been incredible

I would have thought that somewhere along the line one of the candidates would simply fade into total meltdown. The persistence is not what most would have predicted, nor the fact that none of the memes, gaffes or shortcomings have stuck to either candidate. Setting aside the heat and the complains it has been most remarkable and fully justifies Clinton's legitmacy as a campaigner and candidate.

Also, she has moved far beyond the point where her delegate bloc will simply meld into the Obama coronation. This is more a realistic issue than her nomination possiblity has been for months. That will not simply disappear.

[blm]

47. Except there is no sincerity in that since she famously said it would be all over by Super Tuesday

back when she expected to be the nominee by then.

[Texas Hill Country]

52. agreed.

[mkultra]

53. with all due respect

Not every vote counts.

[Orsino]

54. Do you think, then, that all the other Dem candidates who left earlier...

...were saying that the remaining voters do not count? Or is this a special rule for Clinton?

[MadHound]

55. So I suppose those same voters didn't count when Kerry wrapped the nomination up early?

Or when Bill did the same thing, twice?

Sorry, but this is not a general election, this is a primary election, and it has been traditional that when it becomes apparent that one particular candidate will be the nominee, the others bow out gracefully in order to allow the party to concentrate on winning in the fall.

Instead of doing that, Hillary is tag teaming with McCain, and both doing their best to try and sink Obama, McCain so that he can get into the WH, and Hillary in the mistaken believe that by following this route she can have another shot in 2012.

This isn't some noble "make every vote count" scenario, this is Hillary willing to sacrifice the party and the country on the alter of her own vanity and greed in order that she can become president at some point.

[Bright Eyes]

56. Did you hear that?

It's the sound of the party splitting in two.

[rodeodance]

59. then demand that Obama step down. Go for it.

[L0oniX]

61. Pride comes before the down fall ...welcome to the reality

[gbrenna]

64. I don't mean to be offensive but....

how can you be proud of someone who is making the argument to super delegates that Obama can't win because he is black...some random exit poll had data stating that 10 % whites won't vote for Obama because he is black. She is using this poll to influence super delegates in her favor. I heard this on the radio-ABC news. Personally, I am sickened by this sort of behavior.