The Limbaugh Effect..(ABC's Jake tapper)

[SoCalDem]

THIS is Hillie's "win" in Indiana (and Texas & Ohio & PA probably too)

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/05/is-limbaughs-op.html

Is Limbaugh’s Operation Chaos Working?

May 06, 2008 11:03 PM

Melanie Kerr is an Indiana voter we met over the weekend at the "Orchard In Bloom" festival.

She was looking forward to casting her ballot for Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-NY.

But she doesn’t like Clinton.

She likes Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz.

She’s a Republican.

So why was she planning on voting in Indiana’s open Democratic primary?

“I want to keep the primary going as long as possible,” Kerr said. “I want to keep a debate going between the two of them…. Obama would have been untouched in my opinion if she didn't stay in the race. Then her staying in longer and even longer than (her attacks) will be in people's minds in Democratic people's minds when November comes around.”

It isn’t that Kerr thinks Clinton would be easier than Sen. Barack Obama, D-Illinois, for McCain to defeat in the Fall. It’s the idea that with Clinton “in there, that keeps the debate between them going and we get more, uh, more chaos.”

Kerr giggles. “That's the name -- Operation Chaos.”

**

snip

[nadinbrzezinski]

1. Operation Chaos= strategic voting

he can do all this till the cows come home as disagreeable as we might find it

I draw the line at calling for riots in Denver... that is a felony

But...with the exception of one state... this is fair game

Oh and I don't expect that particular DA to charge him... since he has proteksia

[KittyWampus]

19. yeah, it figures you are STILL advocating for Limbaugh.

[Tatiana]

26. Yep. Democrats in Michigan voted in the Republican primary to try to stop McCain.

Everyone does it.

But calling for riots damn well crosses the line.

[Mike Daniels]

29. It's inane to believe the Dems don't do this as well

My guess is they just don't loudly announce that they're doing it. They sure as hell did it when John Warner was up for reelection after he torpedoed Oliver North's Senate bid.

Admitted, there was a difference in that the Dems knew Warner would be a tough opponent but they crossed over during the Republican primary most likely as a way of showing "thanks" for dealing the blow to North.

Of course, most times you want to be up against the weaker opponent and if you don't take advantage of the opportunities that offer that chance you're a fool.

[Cha]

2. Low information voters.. that's

who's deciding :wtf:

[hisownpetard]

3. That is, after all, Hillary's base.

[SoCalDem]

4. The Guardian UK calls them "Agro-Americans"

:rofl:

[Fly by night]

11. "Clueless-uhMurikans" is more like it.

Pardon the freeper spelling -- I want the freepturds among us to feel included.

[billyoc]

32. OMFG!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[SoCalDem]

34. those Brits have a way with words, don't they? n/t

[bhikkhu]

5. Even Limbaugh will have to form a new plan after tonight

His old one is played out.

[KSinTX]

6. Limpballs - highly ineffective

1. His call to get Repubs to change the game failed as they voted in direct ratio as Dems.
2. The minor numbers who tried to change the game were insignificant.
3. Most importantly, the audience Limpballs is seeking to influence don't mainly vote in the first place. This unfamiliarity with the system explains why those who actually made the attempt (last minute) passed the deadline.

Bottom line, Idiots! :banghead:

[SoCalDem]

7. not necessarily..

up until Mccain had been named the "winner", her share of republican crossovers had remained fairly constant..as had Obamas (although his was higher)

Starting with TX, her totals of republicans voting for her all of a sudden jumped..and has remained higher than would be expected..

She is the red-meat that republicans love to grill on an open fire, and to think that all of a sudden, just as their primaries got more boring and inconsequential, she would be "their gal-pal, Hillie"...well it does not pass the smell test..

She did not care, because a vote is a vote is a vote, BUT when you look long term, those republicans who loathe the very sight of her, were NEVER going to vote for her in Nov.. They were there to prop her up, to force Obama to waste money on her Quixotic quest...and to allow her time to muddy-him up ..

[KSinTX]

9. I have no stats to back this up, but ...

I think it was less a Limpballs factor than it was a racial one. Obama came through Texas roaring and walked out limping once the Clinton machine started muddying him up. Their play was directly to White "gun-clinging" voters (scared of the big black man at 3 a.m.) and it worked. Listen, when this primary season started, Obama had every cross-over Republican and Indy in his pocket. The genious of the Clinton campaign was to turn him into a black candidate. In talking to some of my neighbors and friends, while they were uncomfortable saying "I can't vote for a black guy," cause I supported him, they started using "the Hannity code" - patriotism, Wright, Ayers, any old excuse. Prior to that they were pretty excited about the newcomer. Seems they suddenly realized he was black!

I could be wrong, but they really seemed uncomfortable in that "white guilt" sort of way.

[seabeyond]

16. i am in the panhandle. i am surprised the number of obama stickers

not one hillary. not one mccain. couple huckabees and a couple hillary signs. but now at least ten stickers....

i had my suspicions in texas during primary day standing in line number of dems

had one upperclass lady, old, all put together in line at library holding obama's book. asked her about it and it was the speech he had made, cause her tears just telling me about it. on the other hand, .... at the delegate convention i got a good look at the hillary supporters and the obama supporters. hillary is the white uppermoney in this area anyway and obama was the average person.

[amandabeech]

31. Obama also offended a lot of people with that bitter clinging speech

whether people on this board are willing to admit it or not.

He's also from the liberal end of the party, and most non-urban dems are moderate to conservative.

These are areas where kids are joining the service because there are few opportunities and college is expensive, just like during Vietnam. And they're coming back in body bags, just like Vietnam. Obama is too cool to put his hand over his heart during the anthem or wear a flag pin given to him by a disabled vet, and his intellectualizing of patriotism doesn't play well in a town where the local weekly features an article about some local kid who got shot up in Sadr City.

He also comes across as a slick article from the city--the kind that occasionally will swoop into town, try to bamboozle a local or two and treat everyone with disdain.

These issues are real, and are not excuse for racism. Obama's done plenty to lose these voters all without any consideration of his skin color.

Why vote for someone who acts like you don't count?

I'm from one of these places, and I know the people that you here are all looking down upon. I also know that most of them are good, decent people who will help you out when you need it. Yes, even you who so disdain them.

The Obama campaign needs to figure out a way to reach folk who are too busy making ends meet in this crappy economy to pay too much attention to politics. Why don't you spend some bandwidth here trying to figure out how to win over these reluctant voters instead of constantly putting them down?

[SoCalDem]

37. "Primary" feelings are always more "tender"

People who only vote every 4 years..and don't research it a lot won't care one way or another..

they will choose:

the white old guy
the young black guy
the lady

[amandabeech]

38. I'm not following your meaning. n/t

[SoCalDem]

40. My meaning is this..

people who are primary voters are usually the most motivated..and the most likely to "fall in love" with a particular candiate, so naturally, when their candidate falters or seems to be being "picked on", they FEEL the pain more acutely..

There is a larger group who only vote every 4 years when the general elections come along.. they are not "poilticos", and may not have even followed the primary angst

[amandabeech]

42. Thanks for the clarification. n/t

[spirald]

8. Public confession of a felony?

It will be interesting to see how many "Operation Chaos" supporters will brag about their "accomplishment" to the media and thus unwittingly admit to felony voter fraud in the process. This law may be realistically unenforceable, but will it remain so in the presence of a public confession? I doubt that "But Rush told me I wouldn't get caught" would fly as a defense.

[PDittie]

10. There aren't enough Chaos Agents

left over from fighting Maxwell Smart in the '60s to be effective. Besides, they're outnumbered by all the reasonable Republicans, who have already crossed over and are voting for Obama.

(Yes, reasonable Republicans IS an oxymoron, but you know what I'm talkin' 'bout.)

[formercia]

21. Real Conservatives

Only the crazies play the Chaos game.

[npincus]

12. Obama would have won IN without Repub mischief.

perhaps we can pay them back someday: "Operation Payback".

[SoCalDem]

30. we will... In November

:rofl:

[mod mom]

13. This is now getting the awareness it deserves. Let's hope the Super D's take this into account.

[Stuart G]

14. Do you think that there were 25,000 of these voters yesterday? In Indiana?

If yes, then the numbers speak for themselves.
..If the number was say 15,000, then what?

[SoCalDem]

22. I don't know how many there were.. that's the problem

There is no way to quantify the "taint" .. But when it comes down to the "argument" over states won, size of states won etc, counting any states for her after McCain won, will have to have an asterisk beside it because the implication is there..

Texas was very telling, because as fired up as people were to vote, apparently the Dittoheads were okay with the primary thing, but could not figure out that they had to do the "two-step" and show up at the caucus as well...hence the low performance for Hillary there.. It was not that Obama's people were MORE inspired..just that the primary support from the dittoheads that she got earlier, was not carried through for her..

I am sure the SDs "know about" this, so they are probably weighing the results..

Primaries/caucuses should be LIMITED to party members.. I know that some people will get upset at the idea, but why SHOULD independents and members of different parties ever be choosing our candidate?.. If they care enough about our ideals, or are pissed off at their own, they should be willing to switch membership 120 days before any election (for switchers)..New, never-voted-befores could register 30 days before.

Independents have every right to vote for anyone (as we ALL do), but they should not be allowed to choose the candidate of any party. They want to be "independent"?..then they should be willing to sit out the primaries and wait to see which candidates emerge..

[anigbrowl]

23. Go look at CNNs exit polls

it seems she derived about 60k votes more than Obama from people who plan to vote McCain in the GE.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

15. They are admitting that the Republican Party is irrelevant

I posted this in another thread. I'm starting to think this is the larger point.

Following the advice of their morally bereft, self-important radio guru, they vote for Hillary for "fun" in order to prolong the primary season for Democrats. Ironically, I think they HAVE made a difference and Obama is now a far tougher, more seasoned candidate who has prevailed over Clinton, the kitchen sink, the media, and the corrupt chaos vote. It also forces Hillary to have an asterisk next to her very slight margin of victory in Indiana. If they also came out in NC for Hillary, then Obama had an even larger margin than we know.

What I personally find hilarious is that these "morans" willingly gave up their voice and vote to stand behind and select any state or local Republican candidates that might have been on the primary ballots. Maybe the message is that really, NO ONE , including Limbaugh and his ragtag group of miscreants, takes the Republican Party seriously anymore.

[Stuart G]

17. I agree with what you say here..good point..

"Following the advice of their morally bereft, self-important radio guru, they vote for Hillary for "fun" in order to prolong the primary season for Democrats. Ironically, I think they HAVE made a difference and Obama is now a far tougher, more seasoned candidate who has prevailed over Clinton, the kitchen sink, the media, and the corrupt chaos vote. It also forces Hillary to have an asterisk next to her very slight margin of victory in Indiana. If they also came out in NC for Hillary, then Obama had an even larger margin than we know"


You are correct. Obama is much stronger, has more tools to use in November. Creating those tools, and a tougher skin, sort to speak, is very difficult. These additional strengths will serve the country, progressives, and Democrats quite well.

[SoCalDem]

27. and after going through what he has gone through, he might be in a perfect position

to try and push for some REAL election reform..


For starters:

Like 4 regional primaries ..a month apart..
No "switching party" within 120 days of a primary
(new voters could register up to 60 days before)
Have Independent ballots with ALL candidates from all parties (for information purposes only)

and of course the BIGGIE..

in the GE:

paper ballots with ONLY the nationally held offices on them

senate
house
president

it would be a very concise, small, easy-to-figure-out ballot

names, check boxes & a sharpie pen

COUNTED via scanner at EACH polling place

Whatever the location has on THEIR ballots would be their choice, as would the design of the ballot, and method of counting or casting the ballot...but the "biggies" that we all agonize over and stay up until 2am to find out about, should be voted on a SINGLE, uniform-for-every-state cardstock ballot the size of a 5x7 greeting card..with no more than three marks ever needed

[high density]

18. Do these people really go through life acting as robots?

I wouldn't waste my time, let alone the ink in a marker, to cast a vote for somebody I didn't like simply because an entertainer/comedian told me to do so. I just can't fathom it.

[EstimatedProphet]

20. I knew someone would have to post crap like this

Yeah, you hit on the reason the primaries are going on still - it's because RUSH LIMBAUGH is destroying the system! It couldn't possibly be because there are people who actually support Hillary, could it? and if they actually do, it must be because they're stupid!

And it's always people like you who refuse to believe that anyone could see liberals as elitist. Usually followed by a statement that anyone who does think liberals are elitist is an inbred redneck.

[anigbrowl]

24. Then explain the exit poll figures

It looks like a 6th of the votes in Indiana were from McCain supporters.

[SoCalDem]

25. "...people like you..."...moi??

because I read the papers, listen to the news, and can think, and do math ??

This is not some super-dooper secret underground plan he cooked up.. It's NEWS.. Look at the percentages, listen to the blowhard's own words and the words of his minions..

I don't think there were millions of them , but in CLOSE elections or when she is trying to use the "popular vote" as a measure by which she plans to wrest away a presidency, it does then become at least a factor to consider.

"Electibility" seems to be the keyword tossed around, and normally, when someone comes out and votes for you in a primary, they have sent you a message..the message is "Hey, I like you. I want YOU to be the candidate, and I will vote for you again, in the fall"... BUT, if there were shenanigans in the primary, and the numbers of people who voted for you cannot be trusted, how can we be sure that you are "electible"?

[DearAbby]

28. Down side to this

and I don't know if the blow-hard thought of it, but the down ticket races. What about the nomination process of republican offices on a local level, or state level?

They tossed away their vote on playing this game. Now are stuck with candidates they never voted for?

[Dr Fate]

33. Since we are going to talk about Rush all day- I may as well bring up Norm Woodruff.

And "Jeff Christie"

Happy googling, Rush lurkers!!!

[Texas Hill Country]

35. too bad that republicans in PA broke more for Obama...

[kaybea]

36. These are the same peeps who get all verklempt at the ink-fingers of Iraqi voters and yet

piss on their own democracy by voting like this. Fuck them.

[samsingh]

39. clearly, limbaugh hates democrasy

[kerry-is-my-prez]

41. He would have been touched in Nov. by all this. It was Sean Hannity who brought up Wright/Ayers.

Better it be brought up this early rather than right before Nov.

[rove karl rove]

43. Rush just wants attention again

Operation Chaos was a flop this week, but stunts like his DO make a compelling case for the closed primary.

[tokenlib]

44. I believe Limbaugh's friends tilted Texas and Indiana...

I listened with amusement to Morning Joe mocking the idea that dittoheads had a significant influence.

But as one of the Michigan dems who voted for McCain in 2000 to embarass our asshole governor (he'd assured Bush of the primary win) at the time--I know mischief makers can have an influence.