We blew it when we allowed TPTB to diss Edwards. Actually we really blew it when we allowed TPTB to

[SammyWinstonJack]

diss Kucinich. They were the only two Dem candidates that were addressing and offering real workable solution to the majority of Americans. Is it any wonder why they were marginalized and ignored? Hillary and Obama if either is able to get elected, won't gain any ground. They are both ensconced in the corprat community. Both are corprat whores. IOW, they are in this for themselves!

[goddess40]

1. TPTB = ?

You're right about the only two real liberal leaning democrats were chased out by the MSM and the leaders of our party. It's time to drag this party back to the left.

[Tunkamerica]

2. the powers that be

[SammyWinstonJack]

28. Way past time!

:thumbsup:

[stevedeshazer]

3. Okay, I'll bite. WTH is TPTB?

[Tunkamerica]

5. the powers that be

[stevedeshazer]

6. thx

[ColbertWatcher]

4. It started with...

...Reagan and the dismantling of the Fairness Doctrine.

Then when the law was broken to give control of the American citizenry's air waves to a foreign entity (FOX).

After that, any idiot could get air time to spout their lies.

Like, Ralph Nader for instance.

Here is a guy who cannot convince any section of the population to elect him to any public office and yet he wants to muddy the public conversation with the lie that there is no difference between the two major political parties.

Talk about a whore.

[JayFredMuggs]

12. Yes, exactly, I think you should start a thread with that as the title

Ralph Nader is a political whore!

Or something to that effect.

[ColbertWatcher]

16. Does he even deserve an entire thread?

And, it isn't so much that he's a desperate attention whore, which has made him dependent on the pimps who give him air time making him a essentially a corporate whore, but it's because he wants to be elected president while not being able to demonstrate anyone will elect him for anything.

He cannot lead.

But he wants to be leader of the free world.

He's delusional and using the current occupants of the White House as an example, is very dangerous.

So, no, Ralph doesn't deserve so much as a thread on a political forum. Why doesn't he just go back to his radio show.

Oh, wait, he can't even get a radio show.

[onehandle]

7. I wouldn't go that far, but both are most definitely centrists.

Socially things will get Much better under Any Democrat.

Otherwise, it will be pro-business as usual.

Only Edwards was ready to stand up to corporate America. And they are bigger enemies to the average American family than any conservative or terrorist.

Edwards called out the enemy and we failed him.

[SammyWinstonJack]

21. Edwards was ready to stand up and that is why he was struck down.

So sad and too bad for us. We did fail him. x(

[karynnj]

26. Edwards did less to stand up to corporate America when he was in the Senate than the 2004 nominee

and the likely 2008 nominee.

Kerry authored Clean elections/clean money with Paul Wellstone . It is real campaign finance reform and Arizona and Maine used it as a pattern for their state law. Kerry also spent 5 years investigating the Contras and BCCI. On BCCI he stood against the entire Senate to get that bank closed. Kerry is the only Senator to run 4 Senate elections without taking PAC money.

Obama has put real teeth in the ethics bill - including making lobbyist bundling checks transparent.

What exactly did Edwards DO.

[SammyWinstonJack]

29. Well Kerry chose Edwards for his running mate so I guess he believed in him

as I did in them both. I don't trust Obama. You can trust in whatever you want and thanks to the corprat media and TPTB in the Democratic Party, Edwards isn't in play.

[karynnj]

30. Note that I did not say that Edwards was NOT trustworthy

What I think is that in terms of action - Kerry is the one I trust more than anyone. Fighting BCCI had a very real potential of destroying his career. He was called by both Jimmy Carter (because Bert Lance was involved) and Jackie Onassis (because Clark Clifford a JFK aide was involved) to beg him to stop investigating. The problem was that BCCI was a corrupt Pakistani based bank that was involved in laundering money for international crime, terrorists, and drug dealers - and they had bought off powerful people in both parties and had gained control of an American bank. Kerry stood ALONE against all of these people and when his committee was taken away and the justice department did nothing, he took the information to Robert Morgenthau, who was a NYC DA. (Kerry himself was near bankrupt - and it would seem likely they would have tried to buy him off.)

The point - there is no way that Edwards was prevented from winning because people stopped him. The fact is that Edwards spent a HUGE amount of time in Iowa - and lost. There was no chance for Edwards in 2008 if he lost Iowa. He got 30% to Obama's 38%.

[onehandle]

33. The MSM stopped Edwards in this campaign because they found two shinier objects...

...and because he was talking threats to their corporate masters.

[SammyWinstonJack]

35. Bingo!

:hi:

[onehandle]

32. Stood up to corporations in THIS campaign in his platform.

Unlike the two centrists, ether of which I'd be happy to vote for, but who will tow the corporate line.

And as the other poster pointed out, Kerry (who I supported over Edwards in 2004) picked Edwards in 2004 as VP.

[SammyWinstonJack]

27. Yes they are centrists but they are coprat enablers and as so, they don't have

our best interests at heart, don't you agree?

[DrFunkenstein]

8. WWJD With My GMAC SUV, OK?

And who the hell are the NKOTB? WTF?

[SammyWinstonJack]

10. would jesus drive an suv?

:evilgrin:

[matcom]

9. Toilet Paper Tuberculosis?

THOSE BASTARDS!

[TheDonkey]

11. The Phantom Menace?

[hulka38]

13. Then vote Nader in '08 so you won't really really really blow it.

[SammyWinstonJack]

15. The point was that Obama and Hillary are beholden to the Corps whereas

Kucinich and Edwards were not and that is why they were not given the opportunity to speak out. Not to mention the fact that the corporate media wanted an "historic" election. Think!

I would never vote third party. I am a Democrat. But nice try!

[SammyWinstonJack]

19. Oh and I not only would I never vote third party, ever but I would never vote Nader the GOP spoiler

candidate. Which is what he always is.

[LWolf]

14. You're right. n/t

[SammyWinstonJack]

17. Well thank you but most here don't agree sadly.

:shrug:

[LWolf]

20. Most here wouldn't agree

that the sky was blue, grass was green, that the earth rotates around the sun, or that bears shit in the woods if it reflected poorly on the candidate they are stumping for.

[SammyWinstonJack]

22. True.

:evilgrin:

[QC]

18. Yeah, but Edwards and Kucinich didn't have a talk show host attached to them,

so what ya gonna do?

[SammyWinstonJack]

24. Get rid of the talk shows? It's a start!

:evilgrin:

[SammyWinstonJack]

25. Oh and not to put to fine a point on it but Edwards is a cutie!

:rofl: :silly:

[Colobo]

23. Bah! Democrats have spoken.

[onehandle]

34. They spoke a lot since 1976. How did that work out?

Oh yeah... President Clinton. Twice.

Oh wait... Now I'm told that was a bad thing.

All bad since 1976. Except that some DUers don't like Carter's policies either.

Definitely not Johnson's policies.

So Kennedy and Obama are the only good choices since FDR. Really?

We'll see.

If Obama is nominated I'll stand behind him 100%.

We'll see how that works out.

[Spider Jerusalem]

40. Just wondering...

do YOU happen to think free-trade neoliberalism, large-scale deregulation, intensification of the 'war on drugs', and 'welfare reform' were good things? Those were Bill Clinton's policies. That is his record. That is what he accomplished. He left a record on the economy and on social issues that is significantly to the RIGHT of Richard Nixon. Explain to me, if you can, why he should be ADMIRED for that here just because he got elected twice.

[onehandle]

44. I didn't say he should be admired or not.

But if you don't admire Bill Clinton, then prepare yourself for more of the same.

I'll back either candidate, but they are both pure centrists. Socially Liberal, but that's our party core.

[PresidentObama]

31. John Edwards had the electability and the platform we needed.

[SammyWinstonJack]

36. And TPTB shut him down, would you agree?

[Spider Jerusalem]

37. It's extremely naive to think Kucinich ever had a realistic chance.

Had he, by some miracle, succeeded in gaining the nomination, the election results against any marginally sane Republican would have made Nixon/McGovern and Reagan/Mondale look GOOD for the Democrats in comparison. Edwards would be by far the more electable, but it was his misfortune to be running when Hillary Clinton was, so his second-place Iowa finish didn't help as much as it may have otherwise.

[SammyWinstonJack]

38. Well of course he didn't but Edwards might have had a chance if it weren't for the

corprat media. Edwards chance at running was ruin when Obama threw his hat in the ring. And he said he wouldn't run in '08. He lied. He all along planned on running in '08. He spoiled Edwards chance at the '08 GE. And for that I will never forgive Obama.

[Spider Jerusalem]

39. That's just silly.

The presidency isn't an entitlement, nor is the party nomination; Obama had as much right to run as Edwards did.

[SammyWinstonJack]

41. Really?

You are naive. How did Edwards have a right to the party nomination? He didn't. But Obama and Hillary , well, who chose them?

[Spider Jerusalem]

42. Hillary chose herself.

Because she thought beinng married to a former President and having carpetbagged her way to a safe Senate seat to set up for her own run at the Presidency would make her 'inevitable'. And then the voters chose Obama, in thirty-one out of forty-four contests so far (not counting the invalid primaries in Florida and Michigan). And I'd be lying if I said that fact didn't give me a tingle of schadenfreude.

[SammyWinstonJack]

43. Oh really? I think Hillary always had thoughts of running for the Presidency.

And why shouldn't she have had those thoughts? I guess Obama had thoughts of running for the presidency because he is black. I guess being black made Obama think he was "inevitable" And maybe that is so? :shrug: And btw Obama had a "king maker" in the Illinois Senate. He thinks he is owns this presidency because he is black. Make no mistake about that. Oh and Obama made his self a safe seat running against Alan Keyes.

[SammyWinstonJack]

45. Before I get banned and I don't care if I do I will say this.

Obama is where he is because he is black and Hillary is where she isn't because she is a woman. Racism in this country is taboo and sexism in this country is overlooked. So ban me. I don't give shit!