I found an interesting video about Obama on homosexuality..

[AGirl]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SG5u04Gbg0A&feature=related


It's unfortuante he thinks marriage right is not a civil right..but otherwise, hes okay. Keyes was(is) a major asshole.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BT7qhGvykiQ&feature=related - Obama would love his child if s/he was gay..

no mention of transgender, obviously.. we dont exist.

OH YEAH, HIllary doesn't support same sex marriage either. (They both suck on this issue) Just saying it so I don't get crap.

[jlake]

1. Obama is a liar. His church supports gay marriage.... what's his real reason?

[AGirl]

2. to be fair, the same reason Hillary is not supporting same sex marriage.

[jlake]

4. I will not excuse her for her view, but unlike Obama it is not a lie

for Hillary to claim it is because of her religion.

[AGirl]

5. he doesn't have to agree with his church on everything.

[jlake]

6. Did you listen to the clip you posted? That is what HE uses as his excuse.

He claims his religous views are the reason.
He needs to be honest with his reason for opposing gay marriage.

[AGirl]

11. the church he goes to might not be in total agreement with his religious views

stop being bias, its not about Hillary.

[jlake]

14. Then he should choose another denomination.

[AGirl]

19. not your problem, jlake. It's his religoius choice.

[jlake]

20. Seek help.

[AGirl]

21. I ask for help all the time.

[goletian]

26. ive got it right here:

Disentangle gay rights from the word "marriage"

Q: If you were back in the Illinois legislature where you served and the issue of civil marriage came before you, how would you have voted on that?

A: My view is that we should try to disentangle what has historically been the issue of the word "marriage," which has religious connotations to some people, from the civil rights that are given to couples, in terms of hospital visitation, in terms of whether or not they can transfer property or Social Security benefits and so forth. So it depends on how the bill would've come up. I would've supported and would continue to support a civil union that provides all the benefits that are available for a legally sanctioned marriage. And it is then, as I said, up to religious denominations to make a determination as to whether they want to recognize that as marriage or not.

Source: 2007 HRC/LOGO debate on gay issues Aug 9, 2007

[jlake]

30. Yep. Cynical political BS....brought to us by O'bigot.

[goletian]

31. come on, im trying to have a rational discussion with you here.

cant we just be friends?

[2rth2pwr]

3. No wonder Richardson endorsed him.

[goletian]

7. hes practical, this is why he proposes civil union...

see, this country is full of bigots and idiots. the word, "marriage," is so important to them, theyre so irrational, that the very use of the word shuts them down and prevents any progress in this area. this is why obama approaches the gay marriage issue as he does. the problem is mostly in the word. you gotta crawl before you walk. besides, if civil unions are allowed, whats to stop people from just considering it marriage anyway? its just a damned word.

obama is a master tactician. keep this in mind, people.

[MADem]

Bush is a master tactician. Tactics got us Iraq. I've had enough "tactics." NT

[AGirl]

8. marriage is just a damned word? No, its not.

He also said in the video that his religious view on marriage might not reflect his public policy view..but than went back to saying the law should states marriage should be between a man and a woman. Maybe he will *change* his mind later, but don't tell me marriage is just a "damned word" and yes, hes being practical and also has no courage to do the right thing on this issue.

[goletian]

13. if civil unions grant all the same civil rights, marriage is reduced to a mere word...

thats my point. im in favor of gay marriage, but obviously thats too fast a move for some idiots in this country. if theyre more favorable to the same thing under a different name, then the smart thing would be to take that step and then keep going. if there is no compromise, there is no compromise - its that simple.

[AGirl]

17. words don't matter, right? Marriage is not just a word to me, my bf, my friends or my family

thanks.

[goletian]

23. well, then youre guided by emotion, my friend.

everything youre reading right now... theyre all words. whats important is what the words mean; in the case of the word, marriage, the connection it implies. with civil unions that grant equal rights, the only difference is the word used. thats an easy hurdle to jump once we come to it, if we have already made some progress. if neither side will budge, youll spend the next four years concerning yourself with this same issue. you gotta play it smart.

[AGirl]

27. yeah, I have emotions.

I am not guided by emotion, but I do have emotion and the social meanning of words do matter, so does the emotional meanning of words, admitting that words matter is not the same as "guiding" by emotion. But feel free to keep on dismissing my feelings though, because i am sure you know all about how I feel.

[goletian]

29. right now, because there is no legal equivalent to marriage, it matters...

but im talking about the word in the context of civil unions already being a reality. thats bound to happen soon. its a civil rights issue. focus on the goal of marriage, not the word. once you get the rights, fight for the word all you want. but you have to go one step at a time if you want quick results and a path to the ultimate goal. things dont just change on a whim, there are too many conservatives around for that to happen. but gradual change is within reach, you just have to reach for it.

[AGirl]

32. thanks for your advice. But no.

I know you are trying to be nice and all, but i am kind of annoyed you are telling me what I should fight for only after certain things have happened, um no. Kind of reminding me the idea that I should wait for gays to get their right under ENDA before trans people do. So , this conversation is ending here. Thanks. Goodnight.

[goletian]

35. but its practically the same thing! if you get equal rights, the word is all thats left.

and no one is going to throw you in jail you for saying youre married... just think about it. its not even half the battle, its virtually the whole battle, fought and won. didnt mean to annoy, and i apologize for annoying you. but just consider what im saying. your consideration, thats all i ask.

[FrenchieCat]

12. Bigots and then some......

We see how easy they jump on him for his audacity of running for President while Black. Let's just also give him the added "prestige" of being for Gay Marriage. Let's see where that would have taken Obama in this election. :eyes:

[AGirl]

16. maybe you should give a shit about my audacity to live as a transsexual everyday

and demanding i get equal respect and rights from all politicans.

[FrenchieCat]

22. I'm just telling like it is......

It ain't gonna happen the way that you think. Someone has to get in there first. So you can make your demands all you want, if it will make you feel better, but it's not gonna bring you what you want right this minute.

Hell, I wish that Obama didn't have to keep explaining his Blackness away, or affirming his patriotism either. I wish that all people would give him that respect, but life is not that simple.....as I am sure you would know if you are a transsexual.

[AGirl]

24. I am also telling it like it is...

I demand and expect what is mine, even when I know it is probably not possible.


I don't care about Obama or Hillary , i don't feel sorry for Obama for running as a president being black, if I have to feel bad for anyone, I have enough to feel bad about myself, thank you very much.

[lligrd]

37. I Don't Even Get Your Dilemma

What is it that you want? If you want to be a woman, act like one. If you want to be a man, act like one. I seriously doubt anyone gives a f*** which sex you choose to be. Let me give you one hint though, a girl is a child and not a valid sexual choice.

[Traps]

9. Barack Obama echoes of Nelson Mandela

http://www.thoughtleader.co.za/traps/2008/03/21/barack-obama-echoes-of-mandela-the-rainbow-nation-address/

Obama is a brilliant man who will change the mood of the planet from negative to positive.

Having watched Nelson Mandela over the years I can tell you that this is a younger version.

[jlake]

10. No, you really can't. Obama is a cynical politician.

[FrenchieCat]

15. No...You are the cynic......

the cynic that we were warned about.

Obama is not cynical at all....which is why he's winning.

[jlake]

18. Frenchie, I know you are a true believer.

But I am sorry, Obama's whole message is falling flat with 60% of Americans... I am among the large portion of those who do not buy his message.
He is a brilliant politician who has capitalized on marketing and PR gimmicks.
He offers me nothing. If he were ever elected, he would be a nominally decent president -- unfortunately, he won't survive the GE.

[lligrd]

25. If You Knew Hillary Had The Same (Actually Lesser) Take

on this issue, it was disingenuous of you to Post this with the subject being Obama. You are really learning Repuke techniques well.

[AGirl]

28. Yeah yeah whatthefuckever. I don't give a crap about the pissing contest between Obama or Clinton

so take a hike.

[lligrd]

33. Then, What The Hell Are You Doing Here?

Just taking up bandwith?

[AGirl]

34. what the hell do you THINK i am doing here?

Talking about the fucking issue important to ME in this primary, that's what. You got a problem? Ignore me. Don't expect a reply if you have nothing productive to say to me. I WILL ignore you.

[lligrd]

36. Ignored By A Troll, Hurt Me... nt

[FedoraLV]

38. If you are living daily

as a transsexual (or as a gay person) then you already know how unready (and uneducated) most people in this country are about our issues. Would you sink either of our candidates by demanding they look and talk just like hardline activists within our community? (Who don't always meet with universal agreement even when they're talking to us, alone?)

Remember that advocacy requires education and diplomacy: you can't simply go at a broad audience with requests and demands that the LBGT community is still sorting through, among ourselves. (We have a long history of not being sure if the lesbians belonged ... if the people of color belonged ... if the bi folk belonged ... if the trans folk belonged ... if the intersexed folk belonged ... if the queer theorists belonged ... and whether we should push for some kind of separatism - or for acceptance and integration with the larger society - or if categories like "gender" and "orientation" should just be dissolved as meaningless or theoretically untenable ....)

Would it be better for global warming if all of us became lifelong raw foodists,tomorrow? Yes. What is Al Gore asking of us? One vegetarian meal a week.

I know that frustration and injustice tempts us to ask for everything *right now* ... but tell me a time when a minority group's global and unequivocal demands, by themselves, have been successful. History shows such demands spook the very people we are trying to coexist with ... and they don't work without majority allies, societal change, and positive political and economic pressures. I'm not advocating incrementalism as an excuse to give up fighting (and I think occasionally shocking the majority can be useful ... heaven knows we have a long history of that, too :D ) but let's get a Democrat in office *then* push them to be more progressive.

(Have you ever considered that perhaps they're deliberately moderating their positions on the campaign trail in order to get into office? ;)

Go listen to Obama's speech from Tuesday again ... and to his 2004 convention speech if you haven't heard it recently -- this man, this Constitutional law professor, works from principles, not issues. He truly believes in thoroughgoing equality before the law, on every front ... even if getting into office requires him to tread carefully with a nation of voters that *isn't* as progressive as he is. (Again: go listen to the "More Perfect Union" speech ... he's way ahead of us.)


-FedoraLV