I'm crying now, this is gutwrenching!

[SunsetDreams]

So tonight, I decided to enlighten myself with more than just 15 to 30 sec clips of Trinity United Church Of Christ. (Barack Obama's Church)

You can go there and sign up and download sermons for free. The choir moved me to tears! I can't believe what the Media has done to this beautiful church, with beautiful people in it.
I'm sitting here bawling right now. DAMN MSM!

I'm listening to "Finally Beloved".

Absolutely stunning! I am moved! I see why Barack really goes here.

If you are interested you can go here:

http://www.tucc.org/home.htm

[DearAbby]

1. Kicking for the truth

[elixir]

112. Now I have to ask, what is that hamster doing in your avatar?

[populistdriven]

117. A Satanic symbol to welcome our new rodent ovorlords?

[Hoof Hearted]

2. Cry for what the 527's are going to do in the unlikely event he's the nominee.

[tyne]

6. I don't know who we should watch out for

repub 527's or those from our own party.

Probably a toss up.

[Hoof Hearted]

21. Then it must be your first dance.

[ksquire]

110. LOL. Nice compliment! Remember back when Hillary

and her supporters thought that being new and interested and invigorated was a *good thing*? What happened. Since when did this become a potential insult?

[Hoof Hearted]

153. Try to follow along.

The general election is ALWAYS tougher than the primaries because no matter how bad the intercene warfare gets the Opposition party in a general election has 100 times the resources and motivation of any single primary campaign.

Thus your query concerning which is worse, a primary opponent or the forces of the opposition in a GE, (including 527's) is answered.

[EmilyAnne]

36. You said it!

[anamandujano]

68. Hillary is not touching this with a ten foot pole.

[Hoof Hearted]

156. Yup. Hillary doesn't have to say a thing about this, just stand back and watch.

[DerekJ]

13. 527 impact comes from new news , not old news

sorry try again

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

22. Yes, Vietnam was new news in 2004

[DerekJ]

29. read post number 28

[Hoof Hearted]

Yeah, John Kerry was in 'Nam and was in command of a boat.

That was really new news.

[DerekJ]

28. NEWWWW .. not as in recent events

They can't swiftboat you on news that already broke, and been on the news for weeks. Just as they can’t swiftboat Hillary with the Lewinsky crap anymore. How hard is that to understand?

[Hoof Hearted]

39. I'm confused. Are you saying Monica gave Obama a blow job in the 90's?

Did "reverend" Wright baptize Chelsea?

Hillary didn't have an affair with Lewinsky, genius.

[DerekJ]

45. I am restraining myself from saying stuff that questions your intelligence

The Wright-gate as you guys like to call it was already a swiftboating attempt. You can’t swiftboat twice using the same issue. It has already lost it’s impact. You can revive it again yes. But it will not be swiftboating anymore.

[Hoof Hearted]

61. No you're not. How facietious.

527's run on themes that attack a candidates strength or reinforce perceived weaknesses. Do you know what 527's are? Are you oblivious to what the SBVFT campaign debacle was about? I don't have time to give you a history lesson so I'll summarize.

Even before the G.E., BEFORE Kerry was nominated some disgruntled vets said bad things about Kerry. These few, mostly mild and disjointed comments were mostly statements of opinion and probably the last of anything resembling legitimate criticism of Kerry.

Then he got the nomination. THAT's where the SBVFT came in. They capitalized on the earlier murmurs of concern with outrageous distortions they should have been sued for. They went far beyond what the meaning of the word "is," is. THAT is what SWIFTBOATING is. Attacks unconnected to the truth and without evidence.

Wright is a lunatic and Obama calls him a mentor. You don't have to swiftboat that. It's there, on video and in print.

I can't help you if you don't understand this basic concept.

[DerekJ]

71. Yes, and the whole Wright thing was actually out long before Fox bought those tapes.. yet

The swiftboating attempt using those information happened only during the past few days. When the information hits the mainstream in full force, it either does its job and swiftboats the candidate or it loses it’s glamour and it dies.

[Hoof Hearted]

155. And it's not dying, nor will it after tomorrow.

And you're still confused about swiftboating but I guess that's your problem, and no concern of mine.

[CTyankee]

129. I said during the campaign that Kerry's foes from his antiwar days would be back.

I was fearful of his playing up his war record because I knew how much controversy he stirred up when he threw his medals (or ribbons) at the Capitol building steps. There are some people who never forgave him.

Well, mine was a wise fear. We saw what happened. We kept saying "But, but, he was a hero!" and it didn't work, did it?

[Hoof Hearted]

157. And I'm sure you were attacked for bringing up the obvious about Kerry

And here we go again.

[CTyankee]

178. Yup. It's called killing the messenger for bringing the bad news.

Altho I wasn't on DU quite yet at the time...

[Blue State Bandit]

139. 527's are not the true threat this season.

527's must divulge their donors. The true threat is 501(c)(4)'s. They can do as they please and need not divulge their donor lists.

Strangly enough, the DLC was one of two 501(c)(4) organizations that missused their status in the 2004 Presidential elections to attack Howard Dean. The other organization, Americans for Job Security, was a Republican front that targeted John Edwards.

http://lists.democracygroups.org/pipermail/rightwatch/2003q2/000202.html


http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=501c4

[Hoof Hearted]

159. Very interesting stuff. Thanks for the links! But I think the 527's will be plenty active.

The average American isn't going to give a rip about the donor list when they see Wright sharing the screen with Obama screaming "God damn America."

[Blue State Bandit]

164. Or the revelation the HRC...

holds secret prayer meetings with those who actualy "Damned America".

[stillcool]

142. I think there are more of us....

than you think. And Kerry won Ohio.

[Johnny Noshoes]

144. Welcome to my ever expanding IGNORE list.

[indimuse]

79. lol...but you just did!

oh...my...

[Umbram]

91. Don't stop yourself. The truth is an absolute defense. (nt)

[Straight Shooter]

104. "The truth is an absolute defense."

Oh. That explains the wrongfully convicted in prison, not to mention wrongfully executed. Vicious rumors in high school? Unjust legal entanglements? Identity theft devastation? No problem, because the truth is an absolute defense.

[Hepburn]

78. Bitter much?

:puke:

[George II]

124. What does any of that have to do with nominating the BEST candidate to be President?

the BEST candidate to bring this country together again, to change the negative attitude pervasive in this country?

We have one in the Democratic party.

[Politicalboi]

140. She could have

[Jamastiene]

176. Thank you.

I couldn't sleep. I kept tossing and turning, so I decided to read a little DU until I finally nod out in the recliner. The image of Hillary and Monica would make for a sweet dream for me. No sarcasm intended. I really mean that. I know I'm a pev. :blush: :hi:

[Zee Miller]

168. Apparently beyond the wits of the Obama camp.

And although I agree with them (and Hillary, if they took time off from their irrational hatred enough to acknowledge her stand) that it's not for us to judge black Americans on the range of their rage, it ain't gonna play well in the US of A.

[JeffR]

15. Yes, he really does seem like a longshot candidate, doesn't he?

It would really be the upset of the century if he were to be nominated. The nation would just be shocked.

[parasim]

19. So why would you say "unlikely event he's the nominee"?

He is the front runner, is he not? If you are saying it's unlikely that he'll be the nominee based on his relationship with his church, then you can't put the blame on any 527, can you?

[Hoof Hearted]

27. No, I blame it on him.

[Politicalboi]

141. Don't worry Hillary

Will lose handily. The ONLY way she can win is if she steals it.

[ksquire]

94. nothing compared to what they'll do to Hillary

Do you not remember the blue dress?

[Jai4WKC08]

119. What does that have to do with Hillary?

Hell, before this thing is thru, they'll have Obama wearing a blue dress and giving Bill blow jobs.

Face it. Whoever the Democratic nominee is will be attacked viciously. Hillary has high negatives only because she has been fighting (and BEATING!) the GOP machine for 20 years.

If Obama wins the nomination, and IF he fights back, his negatives will be just as high. But there's no reason to believe that he will. He's the "can't we all just get along" guy.

[peace13]

127. It is Hillary's guys at FOX that are running the dear Reverend.

Go figure.

[Jai4WKC08]

135. "Hillary's guys at Fox"?

Gee, I only see him on MSNBC. But then, I haven't drunk the koolade that says Hillary has "guys at Fox."

Sheesh.

Fine. Whatever. Believe that Hillary is the devil. Whatever floats your boat.

But don't be surprised when the Obama version of swiftboating (previously known as being Gored) ends the same way it did with Kerry and Gore.

[peace13]

136. You do know that 'Murcock' is one of Hills big donors.

Last summer it was all the twitter. Big bucks for a big girl.

[Jai4WKC08]

138. Oh really?

Funny, but there is no record at opensecrets.org of his having contributed anything to any presidential candidate during this cycle.

I seem to recall something about a luncheon. Care to find a source for those "big bucks"?

Long way from having "guys at Fox" on her team tho.

[ima_sinnic]

95. yeah, like Billary isn't carrying enough baggage to sink a battleship

Why do you think repukes would have crawled over broken glass for 10 miles wearing shorts in their eagerness to vote for her in Democratic primaries?

Why won't she open her tax returns and other papers that are supposed to show how "experienced" she is? What is she hiding, anyway?

Unlike their feelings about Obama, repukes hate Billary with every fiber of their being and will leave their deathbeds if need be to vote AGAINST her. So look inward in your smugness at what your very own Divider, for whom it is now virtually mathematically impossible to win the nomination, is doing to the party to which she pretends to be so "loyal" and the American people, about whom she makes such a big act of "caring about." We have some VERY SERIOUS problems on our hands if she manages to slime her way into being the nominee.

[invictus]

137. Exactly! The neo-cons want Hillary to win. n/t

[Name removed]

169. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ima_sinnic]

177. awww, poor widdle HilBilly worshipper

who needs rightwingers, indeed--rightwingers are what got BILLARY the vote in Texas--but you know that only too well. Right wingers are the only ones voting for her in primaries. Right wingers love Bush-enabling corporate ass-kissing greed-head payola grubbers who they know will inspire their like-minded right-wing limbaugh listening dittohead brethren to come off their deathbeds to vote AGAINST her--why the FUCK do you think they were so eager to vote for her in the primaries? DUH?! get a clue card!--plus look at ALL the Democrats who are sick to death of the way things are and fed up to here with Bush-Clinton-Bush-Clinton.

"Black Nationalist"?--like Obama hasn't shown his loyalty and love of country--unlike your sell-out, who has no qualms about sending our sons and daughters out to be murdered and murder so she can collect her big payout from her corporate overlords. She could give a flying fuck about you, me, or anybody else--unless you're a billionaire, of course, and a career booster.

What's she hiding, huh? People ARE sick of her scandals and bullshit. And her backroom deals. They're just plain sick of her.

[CaliforniaDreaming]

100. Unlikely event. lol. He IS the nominee. Do the math.

[DadOf2LittleAngels]

106. Unlikely that he is the nomoniee?

Your girl is fading fast if her only hope of wining hinges on fallout from what someones pastor says! Still if not for this the rethugss would be playing Hillary's endorsement of McCain over Obama in the general

[ExPatLeftist]

108. "Unlikely event"

What planet do you live on? It is one thing to support your candidate and another altogether to deny reality in the process.

Right now, it is much more likely that Obama will be nominated than Clinton. So for you to say, "In the unlikely event..." ...that Obama wins is either disingenuous or delusional. Either way I would say it will be difficult for some people to believe anything you say after that obvious partisan spin.

[elixir]

114. You got that one right.

[rucky]

115. Better beat 'em to the punch!

before it's too late.

[LSK]

123. and the 527s would have sat out a Hillary nomimee

:rofl:

[George II]

125. Should we choose a candidate based on what 527s will or won't do?

Totally ridiculous!

[gtar100]

152. This is not specific to your post - but everything above sure went downhill fast

Barack or Hillary. Hillary or Barack. No one is changing any minds anymore around here. Better leave that to the candidates themselves. One of them is going to be *our* nominee. Wouldn't you all prefer not to crap all over the one you may have to support just to keep the wing-nuts from sending us further down the hole we're in now?

Since you forgot, this thread is about the church and the distortion of its image in the MSM. That is just !wrong!, whether it supposedly helps or hurts your favorite candidate. Surprise of surprises - not every Sunday was fire and brimstone. Think, ye nay sayers, think...eth.

(And again, George II, this is not in response to your post, in which you make total sense. I was just looking for a dividing line on the diversion.)

[Hoof Hearted]

160. 'scuse me?

I don't have to support anyone but candidates do have to earn my vote.

Unless Obama pulls a rainbow out of his ass tomorrow, he will never win a general election.

[George II]

162. But I'm afraid that even if Clinton DOES pull a rainbow out of her ass she'll never win a GE.

[gtar100]

166. Like I said, ain't nobody changing minds here.

Least of all yours, seeing as how dead-set you are on trashing Obama. You've talked yourself into a corner and it's your right to defend it. But I'm not following you in. For me, I hope we have a second, yet more thoughtful President in Hillary Clinton. Or on the other hand, a refreshingly new and intelligent President in Barack Obama. I will breath a little easier knowing one of them has control of the big red button instead of some war-monger like McCain. It's sad that an otherwise well-celebrated and positive church has to be slandered in the mudslinging of politics. But I suspect they will come out of this all the better because from watching some of the videos, I think they know exactly what they have - fellowship and truth seeking. Good stuff. Could use some of that around here (just maybe not in the form of church-stuff, though). Seeing how both Clinton and Obama are rising above the crap we all are putting them through, I think they too will come out of this election all the better too.

[olkaz]

154. Sounds like you'll be great help in planning to deflect those attacks.

I'm glad we have so many thinkers here!

[FrenchieCat]

3. Church is beautiful........

and sermons can be too. And watching a pastor get the holy ghost while preaching is fascinating.

Our preacher gets a bit worked up at times......and we just love him the more for it.

[SunsetDreams]

75. absolutely!

I wish I lived in Chicago, I would sure go to that church.

[ClayZ]

4. It is a beautiful church!

Thanks for the link!

K and R

[Swamp Rat]

5. k&r

[SunsetDreams]

7. Guys I am really sad...

These people don't deserve this!

[BeHereNow]

10. Think it's an accident? Think again. Think MSM and who controls it...

Just sayin'
And then imagine a Hill vs. McCain election.
McCain, with the Poopy Bush Sr. endorsement.
Can you read the writing on the wall?
Many here seem not to be able to.
BHN

[DearAbby]

11. McCarthyism...

Instead of the RED SCARE, its the BLACK SCARE witch hunt. Many many good people were hurt by the McCarthy Red scare, I fear many many good people will be hurt by this...don't we ever learn from our mistakes?

[babylonsister]

8. Don't cry, just convince everyone you ever know to vote for him! nt

[SunsetDreams]

12. I can't help it...

I am heart sick, this was sooo not fair at all.

[JeffR]

17. The church will be fine and so, I suspect, will Obama as nominee

As we say in the First Generally Skeptical Church of Me: Rejoice. It's all good.

[babylonsister]

25. Ah, the FGSCoM, Gotcha!

Very cute! :toast: I think there's one over here, too.

[SunsetDreams]

48. What is that? n/t

[donheld]

9. K & R

[IndependentDem]

14. K&R

[rug]

16. I'm looking. Where can the hymns be downloaded?

[babylonsister]

24. Try "Give me your tired, your poor' at the base of the Statue of Liberty.

I'm 52 and sung that in HS choir when I was 16.

[rug]

26. I know the poem but not the song. But I'm trying to find the TUCC choir on their site to download.

I'll check youtube for the Emma Lazarus one. Thanks.

[merh]

34. I can't find the music either, any help with that will be appreciated.

thanks for the help and the link.

[SunsetDreams]

46. you have to click on

the the second box in the middle of the page that says Trinity on Demand, past sermons

http://www.tucc.org/home.htm

[merh]

53. thank you and thank you for the link

:hi:

[SunsetDreams]

55. Your welcome :)

:hi:

[merh]

58. Oh, and welcome to DU.

:blush: rather rude to not welcome you from the get go, forgive the oversight.

:hi:

[SunsetDreams]

67. ;)

Thank you and no worries :)

[DerekJ]

18. K & R

Thanks

[psychopomp]

20. Thank you for saying something positive about this church

I don't believe a person's religion should be a criterion for the Presidency, but if we are going to discuss the problems let us not forget the benefits as well.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

88. You said it!

[Usrename]

23. I cannot fathom the depths of their depravity.

The ones that would do this to Obama's church, for no other reason than to damage him politically, I just can't understand it.

The only explanation that makes any sense to me is that they are monsters. Yep, I said it, MONSTERS!

They will not stop, they will not police themselves, they don't even know why they should have to. We just have to carry on, is all.

Maybe Oprah will do a show about the church. That would be nice.

[Hoof Hearted]

30. Oprah peeled away from them some time ago. She has a little better sense, apparently.

[babylonsister]

33. Oprah? That's all you've got? How about telling me/us how great

your candidate is. You must be in dire straits. Too bad, so sad. If I'm wrong, prove it.

[Hoof Hearted]

41. Your fellow O-bot brought O-prah into trying to save O-bama but it's O-vah.

talk to him.

[babylonsister]

47. Gotcha. You don't give a shit about supporting Clinton, it's all about

tearing down Obama. It won't work. Sorry, cartilage-hearted. I hope to see you later than sooner. Bye now.

[SunsetDreams]

49. I can't see ignored...

There are a few on this thread

[beezlebum]

99. me either...

i was wondering what babylonsister meant by "cartilage-hearted" until i realized she was replying to ignored.

[Moochy]

161. It's a beautiful thing

who farted? something stinks.

[Hoof Hearted]

63. Well then, I'm all for listening about what you think Oprah should do.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

89. Which is why Hillary is history and will NEVER get my vote for anything, including Obama's VP!

[donheld]

52. You always post crap like this with out proof, Why?

[cutlassmama]

31. Even IF, and I mean IF there was something untrue or "offensive"

his preacher said, there is still one major point people are forgetting...Obama DOES NOT write this man's sermons. He cannot possibly be responsible for what someone else says or does. He is responsible for HIS actions alone.

That being said, I agreed with every word his preacher said. Even if I didn't, I would still vote for Obama.

[Liquorice]

32. Well Wright is pretty divisive and has said some

very nasty things. So it's not like Obama and Wright didn't know it was coming.

[babylonsister]

38. B.S. Wright said them, Obama didn't. Do you think they were in kahoots?

Gimme a break, or prove it. Provide a link, or I will have to conclude you're full of shit.

[Liquorice]

51. Obama knew that his mentor was a polarizing figure. That's

why he decided to disinvite Wright from appearing when he declared his candidacy.

"There was no doubt that there was controversy surrounding him,” Axelrod said Sunday. “And we didn’t want to expose him … make him the target and a distraction on a day when Sen. Obama was going to announce his candidacy.”

So if the savvy Obama campaign knew Wright was a problem a year ago, why did the Illinois senator, a parish member for two decades, wait until last week to disassociate and denounce the minister's inflammatory statements?"

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/03/throughout-his.html

Obama clearly knew Wright was divisive long before these videos surfaced.

[babylonsister]

59. OK. Obama disinvited him, but the media reintroduced the controversy

because video appeared. So what's the beef? Obama apparently knew this would happen; how is that dumb? He loves his preacher, doesn't mean he agrees with him wholeheartedly. There is no there THERE, despite what you're trying to profess. Bye.

[Liquorice]

73. I don't really get what your argument is about and why

you seem so angry (??). My initial post was that Wright said nasty things and Obama knew about it. You asked me to prove it, so I did. Now it sounds like you think I said Obama is "dumb," which I didn't. You also seem to think I said that Obama agrees with Wright. I wrote no such thing, so I don't know where you're getting that, although I do assume Obama agrees at least some of the time with his mentor. I said that Obama knew Wright was polarizing. Obama clearly did know Wright was divisive long before these videos surfaced, contrary to what Obama now claims, which makes Obama a liar. And that's the THERE there. Bye.

[redstate_democrat]

107. I'm going to give you some advice

God don't like evil. I suggest you watch this church's sermon from yesterday (Palm Sunday).

"There was a crucifixion, but there was a RESURRECTION!)

[2rth2pwr]

35. I thought Oprah left the church because of the

preaching there.

"...Obama's two decades of close ties to Wright and how another congregation member and a prominent Obama supporter, Oprah Winfrey, had joined the church in 1984 but withdrew her membership some years ago allegedly over Wright's preachings."

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/03/breaking-news-1.html

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

43. But Oprah had her reputation to consider

She's got a lot invested in her TV personality. She can't afford to be associated with that sort of thing.

Oprah's situation isn't some trivial thing where's there's nothing on the line, like running for President.

[2rth2pwr]

57. !

[Hoof Hearted]

65. LOL! n/t

[anamandujano]

70. OMG! No shit!

:rofl:

[SunsetDreams]

44. it says allegedly..

Until I hear it out of her mouth, I am not believing it.

It's hard to trust any media outlet after this, for me anyway

[emilyg]

62. Good for her.

[SunsetDreams]

40. Yes that would be nice if she would do this...

I cannot believe they have done this!

[Usrename]

72. I haven't watched her show for many years.

This used to be the kind of thing that she did very well. Better than anyone else in the business.

I know that if she put her mind to it, she make a great show out of it. It's right square in her wheelhouse.

[SunsetDreams]

74. I haven't

watched he in a while either, but I know she would do the Church proud.

[txaslftist]

77. You need a dose of cynicism to get it.

They call it "realism", but what they mean is that "winning isn't everything, it's the only thing." This is the creed Hillary's folks and McCain's folks believe whole-heartedly. "Making America Better" really doesn't factor into their thinking. They figure if they win, they might get around to making America a better country every other Tuesday, if they have time, between lunch and dinner. Meanwhile, the most important thing is to work together to take down this uppity Chicago senator who hasn't made his bones yet.

So whatever it takes, including the kitchen sink. After all, all's fair in love and war and politics, and winning is what matters; and if you can't win, at least take your enemies down with you.

[redstate_democrat]

105. I;m in tears

I just watched a service and I saw the children praise dancing right after everyone in the sanctuary hugged each other. Those children were beautiful. I don't know why anyone would try to destroy a church. Out of all the things someone could do, this has to be the most depraved and evil thing they could do. These people are praising Jesus and they want to destroy them. I just can't believe it.

I URGE PEOPLE TO WATCH THE SERVICE I THINK UNDER "BROADCAST".

Also, this church is on television on TV-ONE on cable, this station is owned by the same people who own Radio One (they have urban radio stations R&B, Soul, Hip Hop in almost every urban market). They also are on the radio in the Chicago area. This church is magnificent.

[Usrename]

118. !

:hug:

[lligrd]

37. I've Been Very Impressed With What I Have Seen There

Maybe this will end up being a good thing for the church.

[SunsetDreams]

50. me too! I am very impressed!

[Window]

42. K/R.

:kick:

[Catherina]

54. Don't cry! I don't go to church anymore but I think you just got me hooked

Barack's Church rocks! I may have to rethink where I am in my life.

The Lord sure works in miraculous ways.

This is how I feel right now, with all the cacaphony coming from the Clinton camp: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7ZT5sajkys

[SunsetDreams]

56. Yes he sure does

work in miraculous ways, and I believe the Lord is going to lift this church up through these troubling times.

Love the link!

[Catherina]

64. Considering how all the other attacks have back-fired

it would be par for the course ;)

[Tatiana]

60. He really does work in mysterious ways. And I believe some good will ultimately come of all this.

:hug:

[Catherina]

66. I think so too.

I thought our country was on the brink for a long time. So many people tried to wake up our consciences and failed.

These attacks are opening people's eyes to how racism is still a question and exposing more people to Trinity's excellent message. This is great!

That's it. Next Sunday, I'm getting dressed and going to Church. I'll be quietly sitting in the back you understand ;)


:hug:

[earth mom]

69. I don't watch mainstream news. I don't need to to know that Obama lied about Wright. nt

[Hope And Change]

76. K&R!

:thumbsup:

[moobu2]

80. Why did Oprah stop attending then?

[uponit7771]

96. SHE MOVED!!!

[moobu2]

81. .

[moobu2]

83. Self delete

[meow mix]

82. kick for my favorite new website. i love UCC

very cool

[Stephanie]

84. They replay those 20 seconds of Wright over & over just like the Dean Scream

This is exactly the treatment Dean got, only this time it wasn't even the candidate himself speaking.

[quantass]

85. K&R

[redqueen]

86. K&R

Thanks.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

87. You can thank Hillary & Ferraro for giving a "green light" to the kind of hate mongering we've seen

over this decent church that has done so many good works in the Chicago community. It's shameful!

[me b zola]

90. WWJD?

Yes indeed. If I were ever to attend church again, it would be that church.

Kicking for social justice. Kicking for preachers who preach as Jesus would have. :kick:

[RiverStone]

92. Hopefully the M$M will eventually represent...

That there is a lot more to the church then a 30 second (or two) sound bite.

Eventually the good stuff has to come out too.

[Levgreee]

93. Oprah lives in California currently... I don't know when she moved there, but

that might have something to do with her switching churches

[itcfish]

97. How Sweet!

Now imagine it was Hillary's church. LOL You would be singing another tune

[99th_Monkey]

98. Come on Obama, use your intellect & rhetorical skills to turn this lemon into lemonade

i know you can do it. your lemonade will be much more tasty than the M$M Koolaid .. it will
blow people's socks off, because you have truth & justice on your side ... like another black
man I remember who moved so many 4 decades ago.

[wiggs]

122. Yep...I think the response is still to come. He has plenty of time

before the next primaries and before the GE. He and his team will craft the appropriate, honest response to all the Wright fever. It will include painting a truer picture of the church and wright and Obama and the people who attend the church. It will condemn those who smear, polarize, use fear based on skin color and religion. His statement will appeal to higher values and reject the lowest common denominator (fear and hate and voyeuristic ridicule) that rules msm.

Letting everyone cool down is a good idea. Then come with the real story. Do an interview with Obama in his church with the people he's been with for decades. Show the good work they do.

The video on youtube is a good first step.

[Tarc]

101. "what the Media has done to this beautiful church" Er, no.

"What WRIGHT has done to the church" is what you should be up in arms about. Don't blame the messenger.

[GarbagemanLB]

102. When they air a minute of quotes out of 30 years of sermons, I'd say they have a right to be mad at

the media.

[Tarc]

109. One minute is all that counts

[stillcool]

143. I guess the OP did a little research...

Maybe she doesn't judge a human beings life by some excerpts from one sermon. Crazy isn't it?

[cooolandrew]

103. I think Wright was bribed and all those folk linked ott the church many rich germans are removing ..

investment as we speak to america.

[elixir]

111. No thanks I don't have the stomach for the sermons, they might drive ME to tears.

[Horse with no Name]

113. ......

:puke:

[ClayZ]

116. Kick

[1776Forever]

120. The NEW Pastor at Obama's Church - video & bio - An oppurtunity in the making!

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/channel-08/2008/03/the_new_pastor_at_obamas_churc.html

The NEW Pastor at Obama's Church

Several news organizations are reporting on the racially-charged words of Rev. Jeremiah A. Wright, the founder and retired pastor of Barack Obama's Chicago church, Trinity United Church of Christ.

Otis Moss III, 37, is Wright's hand-picked successor at Trinity. He's the son of Otis Moss Jr., who preached with Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. at Ebenezer Baptist Church in Atlanta.

Here's video of Moss, posted on YouTube on March 7th. He discusses the teachings of Matthew 6:13: "And lead us not into temptation, and lead us not into the evil one. ... For yours is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, Amen."

In the sermon Moss says: "One thing that humanity has not been able to do, is eradicate evil."

Later he adds: "In this post-modern age, we must learn how to engage evil, to deal with evil, by dealing with it from the perspective of 'For thine is the kingdom, the power, the glory.'"

……………………………

Bio:

http://www.tucc.org/pastoral_staff.htm

Rev. Otis Moss III
Pastor, Trinity United Church of Christ

Prior to joining the pastoral staff at Trinity United Church of Christ, Rev. Moss served as pastor of the historic Tabernacle Baptist Church in Augusta, Georgia. After his arrival, Tabernacle was blessed, through Christ, to go from 125 members to over 2100 disciples.

Rev. Moss received his BA in Religion and Philosophy from Morehouse College where he served as Student Government President. During his matriculation at "the House," he was inducted as a Ford Foundation Scholar, named by the NCAA as an All-American Track and Field athlete and graduated with honors.

He continued graduate work at Yale University and was awarded the FTE Benjamin Elijah Mays Scholarship in Religion and the Yale University Magee Fellowship. Rev. Moss is recorded as one of the few African-Americans to ever receive this award in the schools' 300-year history. Rev. Moss graduated from Yale with a Master of Divinity degree with a concentration in Ethics and Theology.

After finishing seminary, Rev. Moss journeyed to Denver, Colorado to pursue a Ph.D. in Religion and Social Change at the University of Denver/Iliff School of Theology, under the tutelage of African-American historian and theologian, Dr. Vincent Harding. While not completing the program due to his call to serve the Tabernacle Baptist Church he maintains a high level academic commitment to research and teaching. He has been Adjunct Professor of Voorhees College, Guest Lecturer for the Interdenomonatial Theological Center, Emory University, Presbyterian College, Paine College, Dillard University, Howard University, Yale, Harvard University and Morehouse College. While in Denver, he continued his ministry to youth and young adults as the assistant to the pastor and Minister of Youth Programs at New Hope Baptist Church. Pastor James D. Peters, D.Min became a mentor to Rev. Moss and inspired in him a love for African-American homiletics and church history.

Rev. Moss has done extensive research in the areas of African-American culture, theology and youth development. Four-G published his first book, Redemption in a Red Light District, in December of 1999. His essays, articles and poetry have appeared in The African American Pulpit Journal, Sojourners Magazine, and the Urban Spectrum. The African American Pulpit Journal recently named Reverend Moss one of the "20 to watch" ministers who will shape the future of the African American church. Belief.Net named Rev. Moss as one of the future religious leaders who will impact the African-American Church. As a result of his commitment to intergenerational ministry and prophetic preaching Rev. Moss has had the honor of speaking at the Hampton University Ministers and Musicians Conference on three occasions. This is largest African American ecumenical conference in the nation. In addition he holds the distinction of being the youngest lecturer ever to present to this body.

His passion for youth and intergenerational ministry led him to create the Issachar Movement, a consulting group designed to bridge the generation gap within churches and train a new generation of prophetic church leadership.

His love for God and young people has led him to speak and preach in churches, seminaries and colleges across the globe; Including places such as South Africa, Bermuda, Puerto Rico and Egypt. Newsweek magazine cited Rev. Moss as one of "God's foot Soldiers' committed to transforming the lives of youth. Currently Rev. Moss serves as a frequent guest commentator on the Naomi Judd New Morning Show on The Hallmark Network He is the husband of Monica Brown Moss a graduate of Spelman College and Columbia University and the son of Dr. Otis (Edwina) Moss, Jr. of Cleveland, Ohio. They have one son, Elijah Wynton Taylor Moss and one daughter, Makayla Elon Moss.

……………..

I think it would be a fantastic opportunity for him and the Church to not only show support for Obama but give the African-American community a basis for more openness in this issue. I see it as a generational issue and grew up in the 60's so I heard a lot of fire from some of the MLK speeches that did not go as far as Wright's did but had some of the same passion. A white person (which I am) I believe has to weigh what this man had seen in his lifetime. Lynchings and the history of the Tuskegee Experiment using poor blacks in the U.S. supported experiments were all a basis for his outrage I think. I don't think a lot of white people can even grasp what it was like in the 50's and 60's and maybe even some younger black citizen's might not be able to feel that degradation. I do not have an issue with Rev. Wright and feel that some but not all his parishioner's would believe like him and some would not. This is supposed to be a free country.

My pastor when I was 16 handed out pamphlet's in 1960 JFK election saying he was going to let the Pope run the country if he got in right from his pulpit! That is one reason I quit structured religion and went to the Thomas Jefferson type natural deist God.

I think this is so important right now to give us a basis to see why this happen and move on!!!!!

[Critters2]

165. One little problem--we're not supposed to hand pick our successors in the UCC.

This flies in the face of who we are. The people--not the clergy--make decisions about calling a new pastor. Wright would have done well to keep his ego in check.

[sudopod]

121. The backfire from these attacks on the church is going to be epic. nt

[SunsetDreams]

147. agreed

[loyalsister]

126. Thank you for this

I hope that some people can gain some much needed perspective.

As an aetheist, I have a lot of respect for this church largely based on my familiarity with a local historical black traditional church.

The stated goals of social justice and advancing and correcting systemic racism are laudable IMO.

I am not sure how it has been labelled as seperatism. I thought that by now, these were goals shared by most or at least many Americans. Certainly Democrats!

The truth is, there are a limited reasons or "types" of curches\pastors who would be investigated.
Mormonism isn't quirky enough to warrant journalistic investigation. Over the edge R\W churches are not worthy of investigation.
But-- a Black church is far enough out of the norm, weird enough, to get the press out and make a national spectacle out of the pastor.

The whole thing has made me very angry. I hope that people will try to understand this aspect.

[TexasLady]

179. It's beginning to feel like a witch hunt

Is white America going to start scrutinizing how more traditional AA churches do things? When there's enough hate from Hagee and friends to go around?

[loyalsister]

181. It seems that way

I am sad to see that the criticism has mostly been about style as opposed to substance and by extension culture.
I've seen a lot of posts that say "I agree with what he said but"
How people can not see the legitimacy of these objections and at the same time respect the "style" in which they were made is beyond me.

[nvme]

128. I respect the fact that Clinton isnt attacking on this one

It would damage her campaign to no end to jump on the bandwagon with this one. Because religion has no place in our politics. I am also impressed by Obama planning a major speech over race and this campaign tomorrow it is time that this one is laid to rest. I may dispise Camp Clinton, but If she manages to pull out and " legitimitely " win the nomination (I dont see how) She will get my vote. No matter how much it hurts me to do so I will VOTE DEMOCRATIC! The War, Economy, Healthcare are what needs to be tackled. I am sure she will do it as much as Barak will. Again I am no friend to Camp Clinton, but we need a democrat in the White house.

[jonestonesusa]

132. Amen to that...I think!

Given that the next president will probably pick 4 Supreme Court justices and have a big role in energy policy, health care, and the economy as you say, it's clearly better to have a Democratic president. I really regret HRC's foolish vote for the Iraq War Resolution, and I am incensed over the race-baiting by the Clinton campaign, black voters getting played like chumps election after election - even when African American votes get discounted in 2000/4 not even our good liberals have the guts to stand up, except my hero, Barbara Boxer (why isn't she running?). Even my 80-year old mother, a progressive from way back in the day in Arkansas (she was born in Forrest City, named for the founder of the Ku Klux Klan) has said she'll never vote for a Clinton again, and she was a BIG Bill Clinton fan. The only time I've ever been a Clinton fan is when Bill was pandering to liberals in the 1992 campaign, though I did appreciate his stances on health care (Hillary's efforts), on gays and lesbians in the military, family leave, and to some extent fiscal conservatism. But we're also stuck with NAFTA, telecommunications reform, welfare reform, and endless war in Iraq, all due largely to Bill Clinton-era policies. That being said, I'll try my best to be the good soldier as in 2004 and convince my socialist-leaning friend to do organizing again; last time I actually got him to vote for Kerry, but he has promised me to be more vigilant this time!

[madrchsod]

130. ya the holy ghost spirit

scares some folks half to death....

[4_Legs_Good]

131. Wow! Thanks for the link

I can't wait to get home and check it out!

Much appreciated!

David

[class2068]

133. Sorry, no

After hearing that bum Wright blame we Jews/Mossad/Israel for destroying the towers on 9-11 I had to keep from throwing-up. Wright is a poisonous traitor to the country. If he brings-down Obama it will be because of Obama's acquiescence in this poison for 20 years. And do not get me started on "G-d Damn America"... I was proud to serve two tours in Vietnam and I will NOT let a bum like Wright get away with this crap.

[jonestonesusa]

183. For the record, Wright is also a veteran.

In the end, though, we all vote our conscience, with thoughtful reflection, I hope.

[FedoraLV]

134. Obama Responds

The first two sentences of this ran on the Saturday evening news, here:

""We've got a tragic history when it comes to race in this country," Obama said, citing "pent-up anger and mistrust and bitterness." But, he added, "I continue to believe that this country wants to move beyond these kinds of things."

Noting his own ethnic background -- his mother was white and his father black -- Obama said: "As somebody who was born into a diverse family, as somebody who has little pieces of America all in me, I will not allow us to lose this moment."

As the crowd rose shouting, "Yes we can, yes we can," Obama said that it was important to speak up against inflammatory words like those of Wright, but equally important to come together.

"It is within our power to join together, to truly make a United States of America," he said. "That's the only way that we're going to deliver on the big issues we're facing in this country. We cannot solve healthcare divided. We cannot create an economy that works for everybody divided. We cannot fight terrorism divided. We cannot care for our veterans divided. We have to come together.""

<http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-campaign16mar16,1,7577197.story>

-FedoraLV

[David Zephyr]

145. Thank you. Those who participated in smearing this church here should wear sackcloth.

Thank you.

[SunsetDreams]

149. You're welcome and I agree.

[tblue]

146. Where exactly did you go to sign up? I can't find the link.

[SunsetDreams]

148. You have to click on

the the second box in the middle of the page that says Trinity on Demand, past sermons It will prompt you to sign up. Then you can view them

http://www.tucc.org/home.htm

[TexanDem]

158. Hope I'm wrong, but I think the link has been disabled -- lol

[Double T]

150. What a bunch of colossal obamaganda.................

will it EVER END?

[oldgrowth]

151. A good read on this by Frank Schaeffer

Obama's Minister Committed "Treason" But When My Father Said the Same Thing He Was a Republican Hero

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/frank-schaeffer/obamas-minister-committe_b_91774.html

[still_one]

163. The ultimate swift boating. What do you expect from a country that used

African American in nonconsential syphlilis experiments, or an American government who tested the effects of fallout on unwitting GIs, or unconsential LSD experiements

McCarthyism is alive and well

[RichKay]

167. I'm crying now.

OH PLEASE!

[Name removed]

170. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Life Long Dem]

171. Obama should see if Oprah can say a few words. She goes there as well.

:popcorn:

[hifalutin]

172. Not any more she don't,

she flew the coop long ago.

[jlake]

174. Didn't you hear? She left several years ago because of Rev. Wright's

offensive sermons........ this may also drive a wedge between Oprah and Obama.

[2rth2pwr]

175. stirring it.

!lol

[ClayZ]

173. Kick

[better tomorrow]

180. sad, huh?

Double standard?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7irdvIQmTA

[Tatiana]

182. KICK

:kick: