I cannot believe Samatha Power called Hillary a monster. That

[applegrove]

is way out there and I always like Samantha Power. Now she has had to resign. I hate it when someone you admire goes down. I don't think Obama could have done anything else.

[grantcart]

1. she resigned several hours ago

[applegrove]

10. I just found out. I think it does show that the Obama people are very

upset about Clinton doings. I guess it is heated all around.

[Tellurian]

15. Obama made the claim at the outset of his campaign..

he would not allow the 'tearing down' of his opponents by anyone associated with his campaign and anyone doing do would be fired. Apparently, Power failed the test for the Political Canmpaign's Rules of Engagement and was likewise rewarded. Obama had little choice but to keep his word.

[movonne]

2. How many have you been disappointed in....

[applegrove]

7. I was sad when biden had to drop out of the 2000 election because of

lifting somebody's speech. In Canada I was sad when a certain NDPer got caught lifting a ring. It happens. I know this isn't the end of her career but I was shocked. I just found out.

[MonkeyFunk]

23. That was in 1988, not 2000

[applegrove]

26. Right. It was before the Primaries.

[islandmkl]

3. unlike the McClinton campaign and their disciplining of their minions...

Ken Starr, anybody?

[Tribetime]

4. what a slap in the face

to monsters

[Cant trust em]

5. Thanks for at least showing some respect for her

a lot of people seemed content to totally trash her. Classy post from a Clinton supporter. Thanks.

[applegrove]

12. Oh I liked her very much when I hear her talk of Darfur.

[MrCoffee]

18. If you haven't read "A Problem From Hell", run to your bookstore

In the meantime, read her article "Bystanders to Genocide", Atlantic Monthly, Sept. 2001.

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200109/power-genocide

[iverglas]

39. now I know who we're talking about!

Thank you! I have a hard copy of her article on Rwanda around somewhere, and now I have the bookmark back on my new computer.

I had to read quite a lot, in considerable detail, about the genocide and its instigators for work purposes several years ago (relating to the attempts to expel one of the instigators from Canada), and I found her enormously comprehensive macro view of the situation the perfect companion to the on-the-ground micro view I had had.

Dallaire (Canadian peacekeeper Gen. Roméo Dallaire) pleaded with New York, and Bushnell and her team recommended in Washington, that something be done to "neutralize" Radio Mille Collines.

... The United States could destroy the antenna. It could transmit "counter-broadcasts" urging perpetrators to stop the genocide. Or it could jam the hate radio station's broadcasts. This could have been done from an airborne platform such as the Air Force's Commando Solo airplane. ...

... In early May the State Department Legal Advisor's Office issued a finding against radio jamming, citing international broadcasting agreements and the American commitment to free speech. When Bushnell raised radio jamming yet again at a meeting, one Pentagon official chided her for naiveté: "Pru, radios don't kill people. People kill people!" (underlining mine)

Read that all those years ago, and have never forgotten it (from page 8). Having already read translated verbatim transcripts of those radio broadcasts, I could only gape on reading that.

Heaven help a United States that is perceived by people like the victims of the Rwandan genocide if that is how they perceive the US: as more concerned about the "free speech" of their murderers than about their lives.

Too eerily similar to how the Bush administration is more concerned about "gun rights" in the US than about the lives of peasant farmers in Colombia ...


Anyhow, huge tangent, and I'm still not in a position to assess Power's comments on Clinton, but at least now I know who she is!


(typo fixed)

[KAZ]

6. If the mask fits... Oh wait, that's not a mask.

[lligrd]

9. BWAAWAAHAAA

:rofl:

[applegrove]

11. ROTF

[lligrd]

8. Silly Me, I Thought Progressive Supported Free Speech. nt

[anamandujano]

40. She spoke freely. No one stopped her. She just got called on not living up

the the stated high standards of the Obama campaign.

:nopity:

[Bake]

42. Free speech doesn't mean there aren't CONSEQUENCES.

She said sometihng stupid and YOUR CANDIDATE fired her. You people seem to think Hillary fired her or something (an earlier poster today blamed it all on Hillary). Obama fired her.

She was free to speak, and when she did, her campaign people axed her.

Bake

[locker13]

13. i can't believe it either

I can think of a lot more words to describe Hillary.

[EmilyAnne]

14. Calling someone a "monster" is truly the most vicious thing that one could do. Its enough to require

years upon years of psychological treatment and medication just to cope with being called a "monster". I don't think children should even be allowed to dress up as monsters for Halloween anymore, because the sight of them could open up some wounds in any people who have been called "monsters".

Now, calling someone's teenage daughter "ugly" while making an anti-lesbian Janet Reno joke is totally cool. In fact, its a sign that one is ready to cross the threshold to the White House. ESPECIALLY if the teenager is called "ugly" in front of a huge room of anti-choice, homophobic Republicans. John McCain is awesome!

[KAZ]

16. This should be a thread on it's own. Great post!

[Tellurian]

21. Here's a thought...why not try a substantive issue for a change..

Or don't you think Power has hurt Obama enough with her stupid comment.. but carry on... let the damage persist throughout the weekend!

[MrCoffee]

28. Her name is Power, not Powers

Learn her name, at the very least.

[Tellurian]

35. Duly noted and corrected..

[EmilyAnne]

30. A substantive issue? Yes, exactly. The whole "monster" issue is stupid.

Hillary's defense, endorsement, respect for, accolades or whatever the hell you want to call it for John McCain is a substantive issue.
Sorry, but it just sucks. I have been defending Hillary and have been openly bashing negative comments about her since signing up on DU. This McCain thing, however, has me shocked and disgusted. I am just so disappointed in her. For ten years, I looked to her as the first female president in waiting and I was so proud to watch her move in that direction. A lot of sexism and really unfair criticism has been thrown at her and it pisses me off. BUT, this is just beyond my ability to excuse nor understand. Sorry.

[Tellurian]

34. Well, Obama did it with his adoration of Reagan's presidency..

and how Reagan was the model visionary he intends to imitate. All Hillary said was McCain has more experience in politics and Foreign Policy than Obama (which by the way is true) The Obama campers are making a mountain out of a molehill. If you think that is a track worthy of pursuing, by all means do so..

If your looking for "meat" for starting a thread, here's some:

Obama Leads on Veterans issues. (yeah, right!)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4935219

See the hard evidence refuting the claim in post #55

[EmilyAnne]

37. But there is no danger of Reagan running as the Republican candidate. Furthermore, he never said

that Reagan is more qualified than Hillary Clinton.

I really don't think its a molehill. To me, who has had a very beloved cousin die in Iraq, any support for that warmongering bigot is a big deal. I know our decisions about the candidates come from a very personal, subjective place. I hear the same thing you hear, yet reach a different conclusion. Still, I respect your loyalty to Hillary and, like I said, I don't hate her. I don't even dislike her. I am, however, profoundly disappointed in her.

I look at pictures of her when she was young and, as shitty as this may sound, I wish that she had remained untouched by all this political bullshit. I think the vicious RW attacks lobbed at her took a truly brilliant and hopeful woman and turned her into someone who now attacks anyone and everyone. She was put in a very defensive mode for so long that it has changed her. I wish she could disengage herself from this for a while, like Al Gore, and come back into another arena where she can do all of the good things that she was meant to do.

Sorry to blab on and on, but does any of this make sense?

[Tellurian]

20. No, I think it involves a sense of place..

Power is not the type of person to have out front in a presidential campaign. Not when she needs to be reminded she has to take responsibility for her words because her words would be representing her candidate in print around the world.

[EmilyAnne]

27. I completely agree! Calling someone's 18 year old daughter "ugly" has an appropriate place.

That place is a Republican fundraiser so that everyone can have a good laugh. Plus, its an appropriate place to call Janet Reno a man. Because, as you know, strong women in positions of authority are actually men.

Ha ha. Oh, my sides!

[Tellurian]

38. I believe it was a 12 year old daughter..not 18..

and it's up to them how they handle a possible opponent not with retribution but with strategic diplomatic skills I'm afraid is beyond your limited comprehension of running a campaign for the presidency. Think...picking your battles..not reacting to someones attacks.

[EmilyAnne]

53. Chelsea is the girl I am talking about. She was 18. John McCain told a joke about her appearance,

said she was "ugly" because Janet Reno is her father. So he dissed two females, one with, in my opinion, a very anti-lesbian attack.
He said it before a crowd of homophobic, anti-choice Republicans who, of course, laughed and laughed and laughed. He is a toad who has no business anywhere near the White House.

[applegrove]

24. I hate McCain. Why are you bringing him into this?

[EmilyAnne]

31. I am disappointed in Hillary for saying that he has earned the right to cross the threshold to the

White House. He has not. He is disgusting. His website talks about overturning Roe vs. Wade. He is anti-lesbian. He's a warmonger. He has no business anywhere near the White House. Sorry, that's just the way I feel. I have never understood the "Hillary-haters". I don't hate her and I've been hoping for her ascendency to the presidency for over a decade. Now, I can't believe how disappointed I am by her. I never imagined I would feel this way about her.

[PITBOS]

44. Hillary sure talks respectful of JM

[surfin]

50. How about the 12 year old who was raped

by a man and Hillary attack the little girl. She is a monster to many of us for that.

[surfin]

51. How about the 12 year old who was raped

by a man and Hillary attack the little girl. She is a monster to many of us for that.

[mudesi]

17. I cannot believe Hillary is so pathetic...

...that she had to call for her resignation. Is Clinton really so fragile?

Oh wait, it was a calculated political move. Nothing to see here, folks!

[DUyellow]

43. LOL

[Bake]

45. Of course it was a calculated political move.

Everything in this campaign is a calculated political move. If the she were on the other foot, the outrage from the O-bots would be deafening, and you would be praising The Big O for calling for her resignation.

The hypocrisy around here is astounding.

Bake

[SoCalDem]

19. Ohhhh Monster... run away run away...

such a nasty thing to say ....except for the "other" words that are SO much worse..

she got caught up in the moment and popped off..

If someone had been trashing a friend of mine like what's been going on, I might (probably would) have said something much worse :rofl:

Next thing you know, someone's going to cross that line and call HRC a "doo-doo head" or "a meanie" or "a brat"..

We may have to call in the National Guard to save poor little Pauline before the train gets her..

oh wait.. Pauline sent the National Guard off to Iraq..
Curses, foiled again !

[Bake]

46. I suppose the Pukes have so poisoned the public discourse

That you think it is OK to use terms like "monster" for fellow Democrats.

It's not. Stop thinking like a freeper.

Bake

[digidigido]

54. Great Poster

But you should say the Democrat Party

[Cha]

22. I feel the same about hilary..she was

someone to be admired at one point in her life, I'm sure. And, then she started going down hill after voting for the Iraqi War Resolution without reading the 90 page NIE.

The way she's been driving her campaign over a cliff(or are you blaming it on mark penn) is enough for anyone with the power of observation to call hilary a "monster". And, she is..as far as I know.

[casus belli]

25. In some cultures, monster is a compliment.

Sort of like burping and farting at your chef.

[Hoof Hearted]

33. Thanks for the funny!

[CK_John]

29. This is a good example of the real world vs the virtual world. n/t

[Eric J in MN]

32. In context...

..."She is a monster, too – that is off the record – she is stooping to anything."

It's not quite like saying: she is a monster terrorizing the countryside.

[IndianaGreen]

36. Samantha campaigned against cluster bombs. Hillary supports their use on civilians.

In a vote on an amendment last year sponsored by CA Senator Dianne Feinstein, Hillary vote FOR continued use of cluster bombs.

Obama VOTED AGAINST the continued use of them.

Need we know more?

Published on Thursday, February 7, 2008 by Reuters
Red Cross Says Global Ban on Cluster Bombs Urgent
by Robert Evans

GENEVA - The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) called on Wednesday for urgent conclusion of a global pact to ban cluster weapons even if big powers like the United States, Russia and China were not ready to join.

The Swiss-based humanitarian body’s senior arms specialist, Peter Herby, told a news conference the ICRC hoped the text of a treaty would be approved at a conference in Dublin in May and be signed by many countries by the end of the year.

“We need a strong, legally-binding treaty urgently, in 2008, that would ban the use, development, stockpiling and transfer of inaccurate and unreliable cluster munitions,” said Herby, who heads the ICRC’s Arms Unit.

Herby discounted arguments from some producer states that the weapons — which can spread hundreds of bomblets over a target area — can be made to self-destruct or otherwise rendered harmless after conflicts in which they have been used.

Cluster bombs — which campaigners say have killed or maimed thousands of civilians stumbling on them — can never be made totally reliable, he declared.

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/02/07/6900/

[backscatter712]

41. Powers should have been promoted for that comment.

Sorry, but Hillary IS a monster.

[Bake]

47. The GOP thanks you.

Your talking points for tomorrow will be on the fax machine.

Bake

[surfin]

48. Why? she was called a bitch by SNL and loved it

She went on the show.

One thing this shows is the double standard in the press for Clinton.

I would not call her a bitch, but a monster is not that bad. What do you think a mother who had a son killed in the war would say of her. Or that little 12 year old girl that was raped by a man and Hillary attack the 12 yr girl. That is a monster the man and her.

[AnnieBW]

49. It's an insult to monsters everywhere!

Okay... here's my take on it.

Dr. Power writes a book critical of something that Bill did (actually, didn't do) while in office.

While promoting said book, Dr. Power accidentally lets her true feelings show about Hillary (and Bill).

Hillary sees and opportunity to discredit someone who just wrote a book criticizing what Bill did in office.

[Fox Mulder]

52. Hillary is a monster.

Samantha Power shouldn't have apologized.