Which President is more likely to help progressives realize their goals?

[Padraig18]

It's a simple question. :)

[Zynx]

1. Kerry.

[mike_c]

2. do you still beat your wife?

Another simple question.

edit: my vote-- neither!

[debsianben]

3. The basic outlines of their policies

will be the same. Both will continue the erosion of civil liberties at home (which was already well underway in the Clinton era with Clinton's "Anti-Terrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996"), imperial violence abroad (how many Iraqis died from bombings and sanctions under Clinton?) and both will worship at the anti-democratic cult of the "free market" everywhere.

Sure there will be differences, some relatively minor, some relatively major. Perhaps even enough to easily justify the typical desperate ABB insistence that "Kerry sucks less." But any pone who believes that Kerry has the slightest interest in "helping progressives realize their goals", at least if peace, justice and the preservation of constitutional civil liberties figure into those goals, is delusional.

[Monte Carlo]

4. You know, Rome wasn't built in a day.

And we are not going to achieve our little workers' paradise in any one election. The process will take time and involve numerous steps. President Kerry, one who has worked with Ted Kennedy for 20 years, might just be a very big gain over 2-term President Bush.

[ulysses]

5. which implement would help me hit a homer in Yankee Stadium?

A regulation bat, or a dandelion?

The bat will definitely get me closer, but that's about it.

So I'll go with the bat for the time being, but keep bulking up and building that cannon. :)

[AntiCoup2K4]

6. This is the equivalent of polling Stalin vs Hitler in 1942

It may have been neccessary to side with Stalin to get rid of Hitler, but that didn't make the bastard progressive.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

7. So Kerry is the equivalent of Stalin?

Let us know how you really think.

[AntiCoup2K4]

8. Don't put words in my mouth

I didn't say Kerry was Stalin. But he's not much different than Bush when it comes to foreign policy.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

10. I'm asking a question.

You said: "This is the equivalent of polling Stalin vs Hitler in 1942"

I'm asking if you see Kerry as Stalin in your metaphor or as Hitler.

[AntiCoup2K4]

11. Historically, it's the same thing.

You're asking me to side with someone evil to defeat someone arguably more evil. The comparison is not a direct one between Kerry and Stalin.

And if you ask why I consider Kerry to be "evil" it's because I cannot stand this DLC sellout to the PNAC global fascist agenda, and so far, Kerry has said nothing that would lead me to believe otherwise. So while he would probably nominate more reasonable judges, and possibly be kinder to Mother Earth than Bush, that is probably the end of any measurable difference between the two.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

16. No I'm not asking those things. The question I'm asking

is the same as it was the first time I asked it, and the second time.

You said: "This is the equivalent of polling Stalin vs Hitler in 1942"

I'm asking if you see Kerry as Stalin in your metaphor or as Hitler.

[corporatewhore]

9. voting for kerry or bush would be counterproductive

over the last year i have been working to
raise awarness of israeli apartheid and palestinian rights
addressing the issue of ending american colonialistic occupation
organizing against and travelled risked arrest and bodily injury to protest the FTAA/freetrade (kerry has a solid freetrade record and voted for bushs fasttrack to FTAA w/o any provisions for human environmental rights)

and have organized and passed an anti-patriot act resolution (it is 100 percent anti patriotic so it should all go)
can we really count on a guy who vote for plancolombia to further our cause

[Monte Carlo]

12. People do not want a revolution.

They want an election, and unless people start dying, one of either Kerry or Bush will be President next year.

Global trade is here to stay, and handled right, is highly desireable. Do not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

[AntiCoup2K4]

13. People just might want a revolution if....

1) Bush steals another election - by whatever means.

or

2) Kerry wins, but the fascist imperialism continues.

Either one will be my breaking point :grr:

[corporatewhore]

14. all those jobs that will not be here if the FTAA gets passed

it aint gonna be pretty

[LividLiberal]

15. I don't get how Bush would help progressives

But I voted for Kerry, obviously.

[saoirse]

17. Must be nice living in your fantasy world

Where voting for Nader didn't push Bush into the White House.

Guess clinging to the illusion of your ideological purity puts some salve on your conscience.

How you can live with yourselves, is beyond me.

The choice is:

Kerry or Bush.

Which is as stark a choice as:

Life or Death.

F*ing deal with it.