Was listining to NPR today and Nader was on...

[ruiner4u]

I agreed with everything he said...

both parties have done nothing for the common people and everything for big business.. Hillary and Obama have done nothing for the working poor...

they have not tried to get a hearing on anything of importance <hey, we did get baseball steroids>

Unless something major happens I am going to spoil my vote on Nader...

[AtomicKitten]

1. Incoming rotten fruit.

[ruiner4u]

2. im ready....

i cant wait to be mocked because i actually care about democracy

[AtomicKitten]

4. Me too.

And you'll hear nothing nasty from me. If Barack can't convince you or if you can't discern a reason to vote for him, then you get on with your bad self. I am looking forward to taking this country back. Cheers.

[LSdemocrat]

3. Well at least you know you're wasting your vote

[ruiner4u]

6. cause obama is sure to win...

nothing will bring out the right wing bigot block like a black democratic nominee.. say hello to pres. McCain

[emilyg]

5. He was on CNN and made some good points.

[ruiner4u]

7. Yup...

[readmoreoften]

8. I'm redirecting my energy to local Democrats--particularly the progressives.

But for the first time in my 20 year voting history, I *might* vote 3rd party at the presidential level. It feels bad, but progressives have been pushed out in favor of joining hands with right wing concerns.

Obama supporters have been telling me my vote doesn't count? Well, I'm in Texas and I'm taking your advice.

[MagickMuffin]

10. I don't know what Obama supporter would say your vote doesn't vote, that's just ridiculious

Everybody's votes count unless it's on a Diebold machine without a print out.

No matter who you vote for your vote matters. I'm in Texas also and for the first time in a very long long time Texas will finally play an important role.

You can vote for Clinton, Obama, Edwards, Biden, Dodd, or Richardson.

[readmoreoften]

12. Oh it's a common theme here. There's a whole list of people the center doesn't find worth keeping.

The progressive wing of the party tops that list. I'll be voting for Edwards in the primary. I'm not sure about the general. I go back and forth.

[MagickMuffin]

14. I was a supporter of Edwards and wasn't sure what to do after that announcement to leave the race

I had planned to vote for him in the primaries as well, but have since decided not to.

I had a hard decision to make and after some of the attacks the Clinton's have made against another Democratic candidate, well let's just say they made my decision for me.

I have tried very hard to stay above the fray, but it is becoming increasingly hard for me to stay silent.

I will vote for whoever wins the nomination, however, if it is Hillary it will very difficult to cast that vote. But I can't in good conscience sit it out.

The progressive/liberal wing of the party has been marginalized. The DLC in particular has been the major source for that marginalization. They have taken our votes for granted for decades while dissing us after they win elections.

That's why I am so glad and thankful for Howard Dean and his vision of the 50 state strategy. It has worked and that's why the DLC can't stand him. Dean wanted our votes, knew if he could energize the base we could win elections. AND it is working.

I guess that's why Gov. Rendall wants to take Dean out and shoot him.

[LostinVA]

47. WE've been told our support isn't wanted, nor our vote needed

We, along with HRC (a good Dem who has done alot for the Party), should be "ostracized and eliminated."

[LostinVA]

46. I could have written your post

I've said the same thing about 20 times to Haruka over the last week. I'm not even a Dem, I'm a member of the DSA and the SPA, but I've always given my support to the Democratic Party.

To steal your line with a small change: Obama supporters have been telling me my vote doesn't count? Well, I'm in New Jersey, which should go blue, and I'm taking your advice.

[donheld]

9. In 2000 Nader said there was no difference between Gore and W

Only a fool would believe that today, only a fool. Are you a fool?

[Tesha]

24. Actually, he said it about Republicans and Democrats.

And the Democrats have pretty effectively proven
his point since they were returned to power in 2006.

War ended? Nope. Surged.

Warrentless wiretapping ended? Perhaps, but none of the perpetrators punished.

Torture ended? Nope.

Credit crisis corrected? Nope.

Bush and cronies investigated? Nope.

Powder dried? Yes indeedy!

Tesha

[Charogne]

31. Indeed, the congress quite proves his point

[mtnester]

11. Cya then, cause the rules here don't allow support for third party candidates

Ralphie is not a Democrat. And you should find a warm fuzzy place that you and the rest of his supporters can talk about it, like his OWN website instead of burning up Skinner's bandwidth with it. You all can talk about wasting your vote there.

Edited for clarity.

[sandnsea]

13. There was a difference between Gore & Bush

and there is a difference between Hillary or Obama and McCain. If you can't see how different the country would have been under a Gore Presidency, then you're as stupid as the freeptards who think McCain is a liberal.

[Guava Jelly]

15. It is your vote and you have every right to cast it as you like

No flames from me.
I just wouldn't campaign for Nader here because you could get in trouble

[eridani]

16. Too bad Nader invests exactly zero in organizational structure

You can't do electoral politics without it.

[1awake]

17. and so it begins...

Don't think I'm bashing you for what you just said.. I'm not. The thing is, while your right in your op, that still doesn't negate the fact the he will peal away much needed votes that would go against keeping McCain in the white house. Unfortunately.. both are true.

[cali]

18. fine, but leave, and leave now.

I've alerted on your post. The management has made it clear that people like you are not welcome here.

[Tesha]

21. Maybe the management can manage this without your help?

After all, they've made it clear they're not so keen
on YOU either.

Tesha

[Charogne]

32. Et tu, McCarthy?

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

19. Yes, he makes sense and is right on many issues

That's why his presidential bid is so dangerous. He will attract many left-leaning, green, anti-corporate votes. Not enough to win, of course, but maybe enough to hand McCain the victory.

McCain is not the same as Obama or Clinton. Their supreme court nominees will be different. Dems might do a little bit for health care (don't expect too much here), and they might start getting out of Iraq (again, don't get your hopes up). McCain is Bush.

Vote for Nader if it makes you feel righteous. But in terms of selecting electors, it's really a vote for McCain.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

20. Nader would be an interesting person were it not for the fact that he is transparently an

egotistical asshole, really. He never seems to do much of anything at all to advance his so-called "causes" between election cycles, and yet there he is every four years trying to act relevant. If he ever seemed to do anything at all besides run randomly in elections, I could believe that he actually cares about what he proclaims to want in America, but as he doesn't, it's easy to consider him an attention-mongering fool who leads a group of, as Andy Borowitz put it in his daily satire for Sunday, "self-absorbed whackjobs."

:shrug:

[Tesha]

25. He does plenty but you're not allowed to hear about it. (NT)

[Charogne]

34. à la Kucinich

[Tesha]

40. Precisely! (NT)

[WinkyDink]

36. "Not allowed"? Like we're mentally shackled?

And somehow only YOU and Ralph know where this hidden info is?

[Tesha]

39. Don't be foolish -- you know exactly what I'm talking about.

The media covers the stories that promote the points
of view that they want to see promoted and buries the
stories that oppose their points of view.

Nader routinely opposes corporate points of view and
stories about him are routinely buried.

Tesha

[LostinVA]

49. *Gasp* I completely agree with you, kiddo

I think he likes the attention and having his ego stroked. If he was serious about running a viable Third Party (which I think is a wonderful idea), he would through more into local-level politics, and he himself would run for Congress, governor, etc.

I like many of his ideas, but I do NOT like the messenger.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

52. Jesus, what's up with this?

Agreement?

:rofl::rofl:

:P

:hi:

[PeaceNikki]

22. Certainly I am not the only one who sees the irony of your username

combined with your OP...

Am I?

[City Lights]

42. You're not...it jumped right out at me.

:hi:

[Tesha]

23. In a sane world, Nader would get "traction" and Democrats would listen to him.

In a sane world, Nader would get "traction" and Democrats
would listen to him.

But instead, in our corporate-media-run world, he's ignored
for 3.5 years our of every four and then used for that
other half-year to tip the election towards, surprise,
the corporations.

Democrats embraced Ralph and his positions decades ago,
but the rise of the corporation-loving DLC within the
Democratic Party left the relationship strained, then
non-existent. Ralph is still speaking the absolute truth
but the leaders of the Democratic Party no longer wish
to listen to him or even let him be heard.

So now he's off free-lancing, to the detriment of both
his own ideals and the Democratic Party.

Well, maybe someday the Democratic leadership will again
remember that they are supposed to represent the living,
breathing, natural-born people and not the artificial
persons who have lately bought and paid for them.

Tesha

[Jacobin]

26. McCain applauds your position

[misanthrope]

27. Just the other day I was taken to task...

...for telling another poster this wasn't a progressive board, but rather a Democratic one.

Much of the content of this thread illustrates what I was talking about.

[WinkyDink]

38. Doesn't Nader have enough fans to get his own board?

[Charogne]

41. They love to silence dissent

Especially those of us who perhaps supported Kucinich and/or Edwards and are now hung out to dry. A vote for "a democrat" is not a vote for Democracy.

[saltpoint]

28. So what does Ralph Nader do in the interim between elections besides

sulk?

I don't see the man doing community work anywhere, I don't see him building a scaffolding for independent parties, I don't see him significantly bolstering the causes he says he cares about and which he claims both major parties have betrayed.

He ain't doin' shit.

He re-emerges every election cycle to belch criticism but does nothing, IMO, to meaningfully address the very things he says comprise a rationale for his "candidacy."

I don't like grown-ups who pout. Ralph Nader is a pouter.

[Tesha]

43. Start here...

http://www.citizen.org/

[saltpoint]

44. You get to vote for anyone you please, Tesha.

Nadir is lazy and opportunistic.

He sulks for 4 years between elections than comes at the cycle like a jack-in-the-box, blasting Democrats.

To hell with him.

[Tesha]

48. Full disclosure: I have never voted for Ralph Nader and probably never will.

But his pillorying on this board is just naive, petty,
and evidence that many here are very poorly informed.

Tesha

[saltpoint]

50. You might be surprised. Some of us are fairly up with the news.

Nader is lazy-spirited and drab -- and that's at best.

You might check out his positions on LGBT issues prior to calendar year 2000, for example, and his significant corporate stock holdings before setting him on the Citizen's pedastal.

He's up to no good and I hope voters opt for the Democratic ticket in crushing percentages.

You may consider that an informed opinion.

[WilliamPitt]

29. He's always right

But he's like some false-ass Jesus who can't actually heal anyone.

Tough fact: we need to win shit to change shit.

Nader who can't win anything = no Nader at all.

So.

Now what?

Glad you asked.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/WilliamPitt/414

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/WilliamPitt/410

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/WilliamPitt/407

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/WilliamPitt/402

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/WilliamPitt/401

REAL CHANGE: http://journals.democraticunderground.com/WilliamPitt/397

...and the bad news: http://journals.democraticunderground.com/WilliamPitt/391

You in?

This is the hard work. If you think one vote or one election or one candidate will solve everything, my kindest and most respectful suggestion for you is to go back to bed.

Then get up.

And come to work with the rest of us.

:hug:

[From The Left]

30. The Crazies Now Have Their Candidate

Very sad.

[WinkyDink]

33. You didn't need Nader, if that's your opinion of Democrats in general.

So why bother even coming to DU?

[sfam]

37. Did Nader mention if the Republicans were paying him for running this time as well?

Seriously, why bother agreeing with ANYTHING Nader says. He's more narcissistic than Paris Hilton at this point. He has absolutely nothing to contribute to the conversation, and even less so to the race.

Until he owns up to his complicity in electing the horror that is our current president, and his fallacious comments about there being no difference between Gore and Bush, I really don't want to see him on TV again.

[zbdent]

45. Nade(R)

[cooolandrew]

51. Mike Malloy " In a political vacuum in walk monters like Cheney ahd Rumsfeld"

Yep can't deny Dems haven't always delivered but they give Americans a lot better ride than damaged reputation and constitution.