UPDATE---from ABC Jack Tapper---on the Clinton 527 ads: First one was deliberate Hillary smear!

[rodeodance]

UPDATE---from ABC Jack Tapper---on the Clinton 527 ads: First one was deliberate Hillary smear!

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/02/new-pro-clinton.html

From ABC---Jack Tapper----the same blogger who has made 2 recent ‘mistakes” when writing about Hillary Clinton. He corrects them later when the damage has been done.

Tapper has now Omitted this phase:
“ALP has developed three ads aimed at tarnishing Sen. Barack Obama, “

Many here in GD-P have translated this to assume that all these ads will be **attack”** ads
And have subsequently posted demeaning comments about her and the campaign.

Also the original poster had inserted the word ‘attack” into the OP

“ABC News: Clinton supporters have set up a 527 to attack Obama”

Lets not assume these to be attach ads. Thank you.


REVISED POST-from Tapper: (earlier writing was posted here on GD-P also-see below)
....

“ALP has developed three ads aimed at pushing the idea that Sen. Barack Obama, D-Illinois, is a talker and not a doer -- the ads are called “If speeches could solve problems" -- and they will contrast Obama and Clinton on issues of importance to middle class voters, such as the economy, health care, and the mortgage crisis.
.....

NOTE: Some minor tweaks in diction to this post were made for accuracy about the actual ads. And the sentence about the ads not mentioning Obama by name was added”

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/02/new-pro-clinton.html


This is FROM an earlier post:


http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/02/new-pro-clinton.html

New Pro-Clinton 527 to Ding Obama in Ohio



……….ALP has developed three ads aimed at tarnishing Sen. Barack Obama, D-Illinois, as a talker and not a doer -- the ads are called “If speeches could solve problems" -- and they will contrast Obama and Clinton on issues of importance to middle class voters, such as the economy, health care, and the mortgage crisis.

………..

[Renew Deal]

1. They're not aimed at helping Obama.

Hillary's supporters are in the league with the swiftboat vets. I hope they can live with themselves.

[rodeodance]

3. "Hillary's supporters are in the league with the swiftboat vets."--you outdid yourself this time.

They're not aimed at helping Obama.
Posted by Bleachers7


Hillary's supporters are in the league with the swiftboat vets. I hope they can live with themselves.

[Renew Deal]

7. Got anything original?

Boring :boring:

[rodeodance]

9. your words fit the occasion. Shame on you for coming Hillary supporters to Swiftboat Vets

[Renew Deal]

10. Shame on you for behaving like them.

This was deplorable in 2004. Nothing has changed.

[rodeodance]

12. You are one equating Hill supports with that horrible vet ad. Check your own behavior.

Bleachers7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Journal Click to send private message to this author Click to view this author's profile Click to add this author to your buddy list Click to add this author to your Ignore list Wed Feb-20-08 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Shame on you for behaving like them.

This was deplorable in 2004. Nothing has changed.

[Windy]

13. Lets hope it is not discovered that your candidate was behind editing Michelle Obama's speech!

If that is found to be true, she may as well kiss her chances bye bye...

[rodeodance]

14. Your response is a "Rovian Whisper"

[leftynyc]

19. Because we all know Hillary controls

the media. Or better yet, the Clenis did it.

[Hieronymus]

25. It does take a lot of nerve to point to anyone attacking Hillary, when ..

she has run such a dirty attack campaign against Obama .. to her own detriment.

[PresidentObama]

4. Are you comparing me to the Swift Boat Vets?

I'm giving you a chance to apologize before I alert...

[Renew Deal]

8. If you support her doing this

Then yes. Truth hurts huh?

[AlertLurker]

23. Sometimes. Here's some painful truth:

NO SUBSTANCE:

Important votes from Obama's Senate voting record:
http://votesmart.org/voting_category.php?can_id=9490

10/18/2007 Prohibiting Funds for Groups that Perform Abortions - DID NOT VOTE
09/06/2007 Prohibiting U.S. Assistance for Groups that Support Coercive Abortion - DID NOT VOTE
06/22/2006 Defense Department FY 2007 Authorization bill - Voted Y
10/26/2005 Low-Income Home Energy Assistance Funding Amendment - N
04/18/2005 Future Military Funding for Iraq Amendment - DID NOT VOTE
11/01/2007 Children's Health Insurance Program Reauthorization Act of 2007 (CHIP) - DID NOT VOTE
10/18/2007 Prohibiting Funds for Groups that Perform Abortions - DID NOT VOTE
10/03/2007 Border Fence and Customs Appropriations - DID NOT VOTE
10/01/2007 National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2008 - DID NOT VOTE
09/10/2007 Bridge Repair Funding - DID NOT VOTE
07/26/2007 Implementing the 9/11 Commission Recommendations Act - DID NOT VOTE
07/26/2007 Department of Homeland Security Appropriations - DID NOT VOTE
07/26/2007 Border Fence and Customs Appropriations - DID NOT VOTE
07/26/2007 REAL ID Funding - DID NOT VOTE
09/07/2007 Student Loan Lender Subsidy Cuts and Student Grants - DID NOT VOTE
07/20/2007 Student Loan Lender Subsidy Cuts and Student Grants - DID NOT VOTE
10/30/2007 Amtrak Reauthorization - DID NOT VOTE
05/07/2007 FDA Drug Import Certification Amendment - DID NOT VOTE
07/19/2007 Sense of the Senate on Guantanamo Bay Detainees - DID NOT VOTE
06/06/2007 Denying Legal Status for Immigrants Convicted of Certain Crimes - N
06/14/2007 Offshore Drilling in Virginia - DID NOT VOTE
11/08/2007 Water Resources Development Act of 2007 - DID NOT VOTE
09/06/2007 Prohibiting U.S. Assistance for Groups that Support Coercive Abortion - DID NOT VOTE
10/31/2006 Secure Fence Act of 2006 - Voted Y
09/26/2007 Expressing the Sense of Congress Regarding Federalism in Iraq - DID NOT VOTE
09/26/2007 Expressing the Sense of Congress Regarding Iran and the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps - DID NOT VOTE
03/02/2006 USA PATRIOT and Terrorism Prevention Reauthorization - Voted Y
06/07/2006 Same Sex Marriage Resolution - Voted N
06/29/2006 U.S. -Oman Free Trade Agreement - Voted Y


Certainly can't call it "SwiftBoating" if it is the TRUTH! ANY fucking moron can NAME A POST OFFICE!

[grantcart]

2. as with other swiftboating operations they never unload with the dirty stuff

There is first a period where they soften people up and gradually raise the bar so people won't choke on the pure nastiness of the final stage. Also the dirtiest stuff will be unleashed 48 hours before the election so that there will not be enough time for the candidate to respond.

Party elders will recognize this for exactly what it is and start stepping in to end the charade.

Ah wait a second yes the Teamsters and the Boilermakers just endorsed Obama. The elders are starting their intervention. Please thank the 527 for helping to speed up the stampede.

[rodeodance]

6. You continue to smear her campaign by using the word "swiftboatin"--you knew that didn't you.

[grantcart]

15. she has not renounced the effort but again you refuse to answer the question

when they start raising the bar will you or will you not renounce Hillary as your candidate given the fact that she has not publicly distanced herself from these ads.

You have also not provided any facts to dispute my contention that swiftboating starts gentle and raises the bar.

Here is a detailed bunking of the plagerism charge by a neutral source http://www.slate.com/id/2184070

It details

1)According to U.S. News & World Report, the Feb. 18 network news broadcasts "were not particularly sympathetic to Clinton's charge, with two of them playing down its importance."

2)ABC News' Jake Tapper dismisses with "Hmmmm" Clinton communications director Howard Wolfson's claim that had Clinton used Gov. Deval Patrick's, D-Mass., words as Obama did, it wouldn't have been that big a deal because, Wolfson said, she's "not running on the strength of her rhetoric."

3)Time's Ana Marie Cox writes, "No one's buying" the Clinton charge of plagiarism, "not even the Republicans," linking to a National Review Online post.

4)At the New Republic, Noam Scheiber catalogs the "multiple riffs filched from other candidates," and Jason Zengerle establishes that if Obama did plagiarize Patrick, he robbed a source that he's credited before: In a December speech, Obama prefaced a quotation thusly: "I'm stealing this line from my buddy Deval Patrick

5)Patrick and Obama, who rely on the same campaign wizard, David Axelrod, have shared enough campaign rhetoric to be declared separated at birth, as this Boston Globe article from 10 months ago shows.

6) Here's additional evidence of Patrick-Obama sharing from Jake Tapper's blog. As someone who has endorsed and advised Obama, Patrick occupies the position of a campaign volunteer or even a collaborator. Given the conventions of campaign oratory, I'd have a hard time diagnosing plagiarism on Obama's part—as opposed to poor form—unless Patrick alleged that his friend fleeced his words, which he hasn't and won't.

and that is without detailing Hillary's lack of acknowledgement to her ghostwriter for "It takes a village".

But all of these and the dozens more that I could list came out after the election or too late for circulation. Do you really think that was an accident.

Do you really want to stake your reputation on, not defending your candidate, but defending a 527 that you know nothing about - of course unless it is campaign related and then a violation of law.

How is it exactly that you know the full extent of what they intend to release? Do you have inside information or are you just assuming that 527 guys are really good guys.

[rodeodance]

18. I watched the ad. NO switfboading ----in the sence of "attack" ads.

[grantcart]

21. And again unless you know what the entire sequence is you do not

know if this is a swiftboating operation or not. But lets be clear

1) You - and I take it - the Hillary support 527s entering the campaign at this time. Can you confirm or deny that?

2) You can vouchsafe this group will remain on its positive approach and that no negative campaigning will be launched by these people simply because their first ads were not nasty.

3) The "plagerism" smear which was unleashed 48 hours before the election was simply a coincidence and there will be no negative charges in the last hours before Ohio and Texas.

-How do you know repeat know # 2 and # 3. Now please understand I am not asking from an ontological perspective as interesting as that is but from and epistimological perspective. Or please tell me how you know what you know, not what you think you know.

In any case while you may not think it is not swiftboating my prediction is that others like the Teamsters and Boilermakers will and that it will speed the end. So I think its great or as another DUer said "Blowback is a Bitch".

[rodeodance]

22. You are assuming what the "sequence"--will be. And the word Swiftboading is flamebait and you know

that and deliberately use that term

[grantcart]

24. Typically you do not respond to any point that is raised and try to divert the discussion

But you have put yourself 100% behind this operation and all of their future messages. You cannot defend them now and then be surprised later. This is not like MoveOn.org which is a transparent organization. This is an organization which has been established to have an impact on a single campagin - Ohio. But don't worry about it the party elders are going to close down this charade before they can really humililate themselves - as they did with the bogus "plagerism" charge - that worked so well in Wisconsin turning a relatively close election into a landslide.

[rodeodance]

26. I hope Hillary uses this as contrast ads. If, the day comes when i see differently

I will denounce them.

I believe hillary has her faults, but i also believe she is the best for the WH.

[DJ13]

5. YAY! Lets hear it for smears, distortions, and outright lies!

Way to go team Hillary!
:eyes:


(Are we sure she's not a Republican operative?)

[Window]

11. ..

Peace:thumbsup:

[grantcart]

16. no she is a bona fide kool aid for Hillary drinker usually when

she starts losing arguments she will start requesting you leave the thread alone.

[RoadRage]

17. Uhh.. so these are "non" attack ads aimed at negative information about Obama?

Pardon me while I remain confused to your point?

If a group supporting Hillary wants to start pushing negative ads, they could aim at McCain... he really is the "enemy", right?

[rodeodance]

20. I will pardon your misperception--These are the Democratic Primaries. Did you

watch the ad?
its posted on du.