It's all about the frame people, Hillary Clinton will not destroy the Democratic party

[burythehatchet]

no matter what she does in the next couple of weeks before the inevitable occurs.

This has been a struggle for control of the party. It's simply a continuation of the Dean vs. DLC battle that is currently raging. Now I don't see Obama as a huge liberal but I do see that any powerful figure tha is not DLC is the enemy of the DLC.

Indeed, this is an excellent time for the battle to surface into the public domain. If the DLC is the stronger faction and has more grass roots support, so be it, I'll find another party to support. However, if the DLC fights this battle and loses big, as it appears will happen, then we come out the better.

I don't have any expectation that worms like Penn and Wolfson and Carville will just go away. No, they will simply continue to undermine the progressive movement, that's how they get paid. But if they can be bloodied and exposed as the Republican wannabees that they are, we win.

I do feel that there are plenty of people who would like to see the Democratic party become distinguishable from the Republican party. This battle is good for us in the long run.

[HughMoran]

1. That which does not kill us, makes us stronger

:D I think we'll be fine :D

[griffi94]

2. what happens

if the dlc loses the nomination...but the repubs win the white house again....
i don't think hillary can win the nomination at this point.....but i don't think obama can win in nov...i don't know that hillary could have won in nov either.....imo when the repubs put up mccain they got a lot closer to winning...he's a moderate and has the reputation of being a maverick....also the dems seem to be on the verge of fracturing like the gop....

[burythehatchet]

3. We disagree on our assessment of Obama's chances

Look at it this way. During the period well before an election, the candidate with the name recognition polls better. But then the other candidate catches up when people begin to learn who that candidate is. McCain, who has very high name recognition is already losing to Obama. That does not bode well for him. On the other hand, America is just beginning to know Obama, and from all appearances they like what they see.

[griffi94]

8. ok

but i still don't think obama will win in nov...america is just beginning to know obama...and the remarks by his wife are already leading the news...and he hasn't even won the nomination yet...also as someone who reads lots of blogs...how long till that weird sex scandal surfaces...i think it's a bullshit charge....but that won't keep it out of the media....and i wouldn't be surprised to see a fair amount of democrats break for mccain.....i know all this stuff gets dismissed out of hand by obamas supporters....but kerry should have been bullet proof on the military issue...and yet he got swiftboated.....if the people supporting obama think that's not a possibility....then they are delusional.......

[burythehatchet]

9. You'll just be plesantly surprised then. That's not so bad

:)

[griffi94]

11. i doubt it but in any case

i'll be casting a protest vote....

[dchill]

4. Not any more...

than she already has.

[reality based]

5. I hope you are right.

Then I see that Obama is getting money from Wall Street interests, that he may not be solid on Social Security, that he doesn't support mandatory health insurance, that he "is open" to school vouchers, that he got the endorsement of Dino Senators like Ben Nelson of Nebraska, and that he is getting the votes of crossover Republicans in the open primaries. His vagueness and feel good message reminds me of the campaign of the current resident of the White House. I think this is much more than a DLC-Liberal fight.

[burythehatchet]

7. I don't discount any of thoe concerns, but for me all of that is outweighed by

one prevalent issue: Republicans have succeeded in dividing the country. The use the labels of Dem and Rep to keep us divided with phony issues. The end result has been that people with whom we have much more in common that not end up voting against their interests. If this group is ready to see a ray of light that counters the darkness on the other side, I believe we will win these voters back. As I've said before, Obama will do for the Dem party what Reagan dd for the Rep party.

[reality based]

12. Explain to me how this is any different than the third way triangulation

that is often attributed to the DLC. Bill and Hillary can give the same speech.

[dchill]

6. "Penn and Wolfson and Carville"

Oh my!
Penn and Wolfson and Carville
Oh,my!

[billyoc]

10. She may, however, end up helping to destroy the DLC.

Go Hillary! :woohoo:

[Armstead]

13. I wish it were that -- Unfortunatly it's become all about personality

I think if Edwards were still in the race that might be the battle line.

But at this point, it's more about whether Obama is a Messiah and his followers are "cultists" or if Hillary deserves to be President because of her "experience" and because her last name is Clinton.

Alas if Obama is nominated (which I hope) I doubt his plans include distancing the Democratic Party from the DLC.