WHY is it a BAD thing that Repubs. want to vote for Obama?

[jenmito]

Isn't it a GOOD thing that we increase the number of people in our party/the number of people who cross over to vote for the person they felt would be best for our country? People here at the DU watch C-Span, right? How can you listen to the Repub. callers, call after call, saying for the first time they are voting for a Democrat because they're inspired by him/his honesty/his desire to bring the country together, and think they're "really" just voting for Obama to mess with the results? :shrug:

[Metric System]

1. I doubt these Rethugs will feel inspired to vote a straight Dem ticket in November. After all, Obama

says Rethugs aren't that bad, so what will prevent these folks from voting for Obama but voting Rethug down ticket?

[jenmito]

8. So you don't believe the Repubs. who say they LIKE Obama and THAT'S why they're voting for him?

[Sanctified]

10. So it would be better that they vote McCain and then Rethug down ticket?

This logic does not make sense, we need a Democrat in the White House, if Republicans are going to assist with that what is the problem?

[yellowcanine]

82. So it is better they vote Republican for President rather than vote Democratic if they are

voting Republican on the rest of the ticket? Your logic escapes me.

[Araxen]

2. People would rather fight with the repubs than work with them.

It's the sad truth and it is what Obama is trying to change. The party racism(what I call the hate between the two parties) has to stop.

[jenmito]

I think people who aren't Obama supporters feel that way...

And yes, that IS what Obama's trying to change.

[Bake]

97. Is everything "racism" with Obamites????

Why not just call it zealous partisanship?

Racism, indeed. Sounds like you've got racism on the brain.

Bake

[The_Casual_Observer]

3. There's a good chance that they are doing it to disrupt the Dem vote.

[jenmito]

14. So you don't believe them? You don't think it's possible for ANY Dem. to inspire Repubs. to cause

that to happen?

[The_Casual_Observer]

18. No, what possible reason would I have to trust a republican voter?

[jenmito]

21. They're "disillusioned" Repubs. They are tired of partisan politics and I believe them. They're

not all idiots-there ARE some who have seen the damage Bush caused and DO want a change.

[The_Casual_Observer]

24. And Obama is unique & "transformative" too, right?

[jenmito]

31. Yes.

[The_Casual_Observer]

62. So was Deval Patrick then.

[Bake]

98. If they were really GOPers, they could never be comfortable with true Dem positions.

Policy matters. A lot more than personal charm.

But hell, if they want to vote for a Dem, they're welcome to do so. If they've suddenly seen the light on Puke policies, more power to them and welcome!

Bake

[slick8790]

57. Do you really believe that all republican voters are hateful and out for spite?

I don't. I think that most of them are a lot like us, just misguided. And if they say they want to vote for someone, i'll believe them. Elected republicans are the ones we need to be fighting. Not most of your everyday average republican voters. We need to be educating them.

[griffi94]

42. i've posted this before

but my father is voting obama in the texas primary....he hates hillary....and as he said...we've already got mccain....he has no intentions of voting for obama in nov....just wants to knock out hillary....are all those white male repubs who crossed to give obama a huge victory in VA gonna vote for him in nov....or will they vote mccain.....i'm against letting the opposition pick our candidate

[jenmito]

45. I'm sure there are SOME people like your father, but would he call C-Span and LIE about it?

[griffi94]

my old man

has no use for any cable teevee show....he is voting for obama in the primary...in fact he already has...he will vote for mccain in nov...i don't know how many other people are like him....but ya can't say that all the crossover repubs have bought into obamas message because some of them haven't...i don't know if enough have voted to change the outcome.....but to assume that lifelong repubs in states like VA will suddenly switch to obama in nov is folly imho

[jenmito]

64. So then you DO believe all the Repub. callers on C-Span who ay they will vote for Obama because

they like him? Good.

[Emit]

79. She and her campaign had to have known this would happen

really, she had to have known. The Repubs hate the Clintons. Hello.

[yellowcanine]

85. And someone like your father is more likely to vote AGAINST Clinton

in November than against Obama, even if they are lukewarm about McCain. Not only that, there are many independents who will vote for Obama but will never vote for Clinton.

[bklyncowgirl]

41. Reagan Democrats

Ronald Reagan was able to win over older, blue collar, socially conservative voters who were disgusted with the tone of the Democratic party in the late 70's and early 80s. The Reagan Democrats were a very real phenomonem and probably one group that we will not win back this year no matter who is our nominee.

Is it beyond the realm of possiblity to you that moderate, better educated Republicans my be disgusted at what their party has become--and are as fed up as any progressive at the way this country is going, may have a real interest in a candidate from the opposing party?

[yellowcanine]

84. Disrupt how? By helping to elect a more competitive candidate? What evidence is there that

Hillary would be as competitive against McCain as Obama? I haven't seen it. It is the other way around.

[HeraldSquare212]

89. Well, anecdotally some are, and some are voting for HRC for the same reason.

If the Reps could get people organized enough in the primaries for it to matter, I don't think they'd care who the Dem nominee was.

[TexasObserver]

4. It's great. Everywhere you go, there are R's who will vote for him over McCain.

[jenmito]

16. I agree. It's sad that so many Dems. DON'T believe that.

[Obamanaut]

61. I believe it. I just posted about this in another thread, that my

sister, a life long republican, told me she will vote for whichever dem is nominated rather than McCain. She fears with him the status quo will continue.

[jenmito]

65. I'm happy to hear it...

Thanks for the first-hand account! :hi:

[harun]

78. I believe it because Republicans I know will vote for Obama too (n/t)

[texas_indy]

47. I'm finding the same here in Texas. Not only moderate republicans

wanting to vote for Obama, but even some conservative but for a different reason.

The conservatives are so pissed that Romney is out that some will vote for Obama to stick it to the RNC and then count on getting Romney in office 4 years from. However, the one thing they detest more is an HRC win and that will make them vote for McCain in a heartbeat.


The moderates actually like him him. After all, don't forget how important the Reagen Democrats were for him in winning both times.


GOBAMA!!

[QC]

5. Will his new Republican friends be with him in November?

That's what concerns people, and rightly so.

[monktonman]

9. The question really is

Will YOU be with him in November?

[QC]

13. Is it already time for the daily loyalty oath? n/t

[jenmito]

23. Good question. n/t

[QC]

29. I have stated many times that I will support the nominee.

I have been doing it for twenty years, even when we ended up with such laughable candidates as Dukakis and Mondale. I will do it this time, even though both Obama and Clinton make my skin crawl.

Probably the single most unappealing thing about Obamanation is this whole "yer eether with us er agin us" mentality. It's so Bushlike. You really might want to drop that, as it does your candidate no good.

[jenmito]

34. Then why didn't you just say that instead of the comment you DID make?

And nobody ever said "you're either with us or against us" here except the Hillary supporters, more than one who called me a "Freeper" for disagreeing with them. :eyes:

[QC]

Because I am familiar with the practice of raiding the other party's primary.

I have seen it. In fact, I once saw it swing an election in my home state, garnering us the first GOP governor in more than a century. That's why I get suspicious when reptilian fascists suddenly start voting Democratic.

[jenmito]

36. All Repubs. are not "reptilian fascists." n/t

[Rageneau]

76. No, but all reptilan fascists ARE Republican!

[monktonman]

46. Why would we need pukes in November anyhow?

Your just mad cause they're voting for Obama.
If they were voting for your candidate in the primaries wouldnt you be happy?

Every puke in the country can vote for candidate A or B in the primaries, I really dont care.
The fact of the matter is the ENTIRE COUNTRY is sick of pukes running things and come the general election, we (Dems) wont really need their help. And then there will be you...all sour and angry cause some pukes voted for Obama in their states primary. Sorry.

Now about that oath: repeat after me "I QC.... will vote for the Democratic party presidential candidate....no matter who it is..."

[griffi94]

50. i've also been voting for democrats

for 20 years....and this will be the first time in all that time that i might not be able to hold my nose and pull the lever for the democratic nominee.....and for the very reason you cite above...the loyalty oath democrats that seem to make up the obama supporters...the don't dare say one negative thing about my candidate....don't even say neutral things about obama....praise him always....i just can't vote for that not even in the general against mccain....i live in texas so it won't matter as mccain will win here in a walk.....but i just can't support the groupthink that i see in the obama camp

[jenmito]

19. Yes. Unless you don't believe what they say. The Repubs. I know mean it.

[QC]

25. I don't trust them. You do. Time will tell which of us is right. n/t

[jenmito]

30. I listen to callers right after C-Span shows an Obama rally. I have no reason NOT to believe them-

especially when there are other callers who say they'll NEVER vote for him. Should we believe THEY'RE lying, too? :eyes:

[QC]

33. I live in the belly of the beast, a place that makes Utah look like Berkeley.

Perhaps that is why I am not so inclined to trust Republicans bearing gifts: I am surrounded by the extra-chromosome faction of that party.

[jenmito]

35. And have you seen/heard many Repubs. from Utah claiming they'd vote for Obama

when you think they really just want to mess with our election?

[QC]

37. The Republicans I live around are the sort of people who breathlessly run up to me

declaring that Obama took the oath of office on a Koran. Would you trust them?

[jenmito]

40. No, I wouldn't trust them. I also wouldn't expect them to VOTE for him.

I'd expect them to be the callers on C-Span who say that Obama took an oath on the Koran.

[scheming daemons]

6. Because it will cause Hillary's coronation to NOT occur.....

....get with the program.


If it is bad for Hillary, it is a Bad Thing(tm).

[atreides1]

7. People say things all the time

We won't know until the GE whether these Republicasn are as sincere as you think they are. If they are truly inspired then Obama should win hands down, if he doesn't then either they changed their minds or they wewe "really" just voting for Obama to mess with the results!

[jenmito]

26. Correct. We WON'T know 'til the GE. But why don't you believe them?

[lastliberalintexas]

58. Because they are saying they will vote for him BEFORE the media attacks

Clinton has sky high negatives for a reason, and it isn't anything legitimate. Do you honestly think that the media won't turn into a pit bull and go after Obama if he wins our nomination? How do you think his negatives will look sometime in October, when it really matters?

Your posts on this thread lead me to believe that this is the first primary you've really paid attention to. if I am wrong, I am sorry, but you do sound incredibly naive about how well Obama can fare over the summer.


And I'm not a Clinton supporter.

[jenmito]

66. You can't be serious when you say Hillary's high negatives are not for any

legitimate reasons! And of course the media will go after him. Just as the Clinton camp has gone after him.

Nope, this isn't the first primary I've really paid attention to. I'm not naive. I know there are Repubs. who believe (from the media/the Clinton camp) that Obama is a secret radical Mulsim who wants to change our govt. to Sharia law. I also know there are Repubs. who believe Obama would make a great president.

[bigtree]

11. They shouldn't be allowed to meddle in OUR primaries.

[jenmito]

38. If they want Obama to be president they should be allowed to vote for him.

[bigtree]

83. not where we are trying to determine the direction of our party

too much opportunity for meddling on the slim prospect those votes will hold through the general campaign

[jenmito]

88. "Our party" includes people like Zel Miller. There are some Repubs. who want to vote for Obama. We

have open primaries in many states. And I'm happy about that.

[Mz Pip]

12. Because it's all part of

the evil plot by Republicans to get us to vote for Hillary by making us think that they want to run against Obama thereby actually having Hillary win because that's who they really really want to run against. Or maybe it was the other way around, depending on whose side your on.

I know this is true because I read it somewhere on DU. :sarcasm:

I suppose there is some "strategic voting" going but I doubt it happens en masse. I doubt that so many people are that political.

[jenmito]

43. Yup...

I've read the same stuff here.

[Barack_America]

15. Because they don't matter.

Nor do Democrats who live around too many of them. "Not mattering" is highly contagious. It looks like Texas is now coming down with the early stages of it. Wisconsin and Hawaii? Well, their fates are as good as sealed.

[jenmito]

49. Yup-nobody matters unless they vote for Hillary in states that vote for her over Obama.

Sad really.

[LisaM]

17. DU has been complaining about Pelosi and Reid not fighting the GOP hard enough

Now, voila! Republicans are crossing over to vote for a Democrat. Obama is to the right of Kucinich and Edwards, and, on a few things, to the right of Hillary (health care comes to mind). So now what do those who complained about Pelosi and Reid, but like Obama have to say?

[liberalnurse]

20. You need to ask yourself why they're crossing for Obama.

It's not for the same reason you will vote Obama but because they want Junior Senator Obama to go up against in the General Election. Guaranteed they won't vote for him in November.

[jenmito]

52. I DON'T need to ask myself that. YOU need to ask yourself why you don't believe them.

They've already SAID why they're crossing for Obama-they're tired of the division in the country, they're inspired by him, and they see him as honest.

[liberalnurse]

68. I know their game for Chrissake.

Thats what they do....McCain is in now......they won't waste a vote. A vote for Obama is for the greater good of the GOP.

[jenmito]

70. If you knew their game you'd know the Repubs. are NOT voting for Obama "for the greater

good of the GOP." Get real.

[TooBigaTent]

22. I do not trust any repuke any farther than I could throw them.

First - it is a conscience-alleviating act for them to be able to say they "support" a black man. It is an easy way to "prove" they are not the racists we know them to be.

Second - many of them are surely fucking with the "Democrat" voting process to produce a result they think they want (i.e., no HRC).

Third - I doubt many actually intend to vote for the D in November. Some are outright lying and the rest are deluding themselves (see First above).

Fourth - coming together to them means the Democrats will compromise and the repugs will get what they want. Recent history proves this.

Fifth - the way the BO has positioned himself, he really is DINO-like or worse and thus, more acceptable to the enemy than HRC who has been demonized for decades and has espoused some Democratic positions.

My conclusion is that I do not want these shits in my party because then we really will have a monolithic, Republicrat group ruling the country.

[GoldieAZ49]

59. you consider your fellow Americans "the enemy" how pathetic

Posted by TooBigaTent

Fifth - the way the BO has positioned himself, he really is DINO-like or worse and thus, more acceptable to the enemy than HRC who has been demonized for decades and has espoused some Democratic positions.

*********************************************************

you take yourself far to seriously, I can see why Obama is so appealing when this kind of hate is spewed.

most Americans are moderate, some right leaning some left leaning.

There will never be a 'far' left or 'far' right POTUS.

I have family members that are dems and some are repubs, they are not enemies.

What a sick, disturbed attitude. I am glad our elected officials of both parties do not think like you do, it is hard enough to get anything done in DC.

America was set up with a two party system for a reason, checks and balances, and it works.

Maybe you prefer a totalitarian government, America does not. Good luck.

[TooBigaTent]

94. You do not consider Shrub to be far-right? Have you been awake since 2000?

And it would appear that you have no problem with racists and those who wage war for corporate profit and those who are destroying the planet, again for corporate profit. I guess that is why you are supporting Obama - because he will continue the policies of his buddies in the GOP.

As for "our" elected officals - almost every one of them has willingly participated in the destruction. They do not rock the boat because they enjoy life on the yacht that our tax dollars pay for. Plenty is being done in DC - just none of it good.

Finally, I have not seen anything in the way of checks and balances recently.

You can blindly and blissfully walk into the propeller blade with BO and his fellow sell-outs, but some of us would like to see America return to what it was supposed to be. That is why we do not want to work with (capitulate to) the repukes.

[Bluerthanblue]

60. sorry friend, it ain't 'your' tent-

it is ours.

And 'we' together make up the tent.

The Democratic party isn't some kind of gated community. This reality is what sets us apart, and makes us the best choice for any thinking person.

Your user-name is self-defeating.
IMO- which is no more valid than yours, which also means it is no Less valid- :hi:
peace~

[TooBigaTent]

95. If you are so in love with the big tent, why don't we just ask the rethugs and KKK

and the rest of those who are doing so much damage to join us? Excuse me. We are asking to join them because you have to know that they will not give an inch to reach any agreement. Note this list of "compromises" engineered by "our" Senators supplied by another DUer:

In almost every case, the proposals that are enacted are ones favored by the White House and supported by all REPS lawmakers, and then Democrats split and enough of them join with Republicans to ensure that the REPS gets what it wants. That's "bipartisanhip" in Washington:

To support the new Bush-supported FISA law:
REPS - 48-0
Dems - 12-36

To compel redeployment of troops from Iraq:
REPS - 0-49
Dems - 24-21

To confirm Michael Mukasey as Attorney General:
REPS - 46-0
Dems - 7-40

To confirm Leslie Southwick as Circuit Court Judge:
REPS - 49-0
Dems - 8-38

Kyl-Lieberman Resolution on Iran:
REPS - 46-2
Dems - 30-20

To condemn MoveOn.org:
REPS - 49-0
Dems - 23-25

The Protect America Act:
REPS - 44-0
Dems - 20-28

Declaring English to be the Government's official language:
REPS - 48-1
Dems - 16-33

The Military Commissions Act:
REPS - 53-0
Dems - 12-34

To renew the Patriot Act:
REPS - 54-0
Dems - 34-10

Cloture Vote on Sam Alito's confirmation to the Supreme Court:
REPS - 54-0
Dems - 18-25

Authorization to Use Military Force in Iraq:
REPS - 48-1
Dems - 29-22

I do think it is too big a tent because at some point (that we have long passed) the values that used to be held by Democrats have been thrown out and the party is looking like a slightly moderate version of the GOP. How do you compromise with someone who believes in preventing some people from marrying because of the gender of the people involved? How do you compromise with people who believe that it is perfectly fine to invade a country for no god-damn reason? There are issues where I do not think it is OK to simply say, "we each believe in what we believe and we can accept that?"

[Bluerthanblue]

99. nothing in your very factual post has anything to do

with the voters who CHOOSE to come over to a "Democratic Candidate" because they clearly see and hear someone who offers them a platform that is better than their own party can offer- People (not another species- but people much like you and I) who see a place where they can 'fit in' without demanding or expecting the Democratic party to change-
Show me where Obama advocates putting policy into place that is in line with what you would call the "Republican" platform. Your questions about 'compromising' about marriage restrictions is a good one. Who is advocating compromising on the right of people to marry freely? (And please, think before answering. I'm not asking for examples of guilt by association)

Where do you hear Obama say that invading a country for no or even for GOD- DAMNED "trumped-up" reasons, is any good? You must be familiar with his stand on the Iraq war at a time when many other Dems wouldn't speak out against it, for whatever reason-. ??

As for the ways that the Democratic party has changed, I will agree with you, that many of the issues I feel strongly about, have fallen by the way-side. The concept of a society where people are more important than profits, where the taunt of "nanny state" is dismissed for the distraction that it is, where corporate greed is not protected, or promoted, where oppression is not tolerated, (regardless of a persons 'nationality' or social standing or ANY other factor) is something I myself see less and less of.

I cannot and do not blame Obama for this. I feel that the most powerful of both parties have abandoned their own, to some degree.
AND- MOST IMPORTANTLY:
You may also want to look back with your eyes wide open, and remember that there were not a 'few' southern Democrats, who were acknowledged racists, not all that long ago. And were it not for Republican support against southern Democrats the Civil Rights Act would never have passed. This is the same bill that Hillary credits the Presidency of Lyndon Johnson with, but which only got 61% of Democratic House support, (vs. 80% of Republicans) and 69% of Democratic Senators voted to approve it (21 Democratic Senators voted against the bill) while 82% of the Republican Senators voted For it (only 6 voting against it).
Our own Robert Byrd actually fillibustered against this bill for 52 days!

I'm not advocating for the Republican party- I am trying to point out that WE have changed- in some ways for the better. And if we will open our ears, and our minds- (while not compromising on our principals) we will end up being the better for it again.

Peace~

[rinsd]

27. Because its the Democratic primary.

[jenmito]

67. And the Dem. party's rules allow for open primaries.

[Catherine Vincent]

28. It's only a bad thing when republicans vote for a Clinton. nt

[Renew Deal]

32. It's bad because we want to LOSE elections.

We're democrats. Winning is no fun.

Seriously, the point of politics is to expand your side. That's how you get stuff done.

[Mr.Fitzgibbons]

39. Don't be a wide-eyed innocent! They WILL NOT vote for a dem ticket in November n/t

[emilyg]

44. Welcome to DU.

[WTyler]

55. Really?

Kind of like those Reagan dems didn't vote Republican in the general election? A couple of election cycles later there weren't even any Reagan Democrats, they were just regular Republicans.

[jenmito]

69. Don't be in denial! They WILL. n/t

[Raejeanowl]

48. The Theory I've Heard

Is that by assuring Obama the nomination, they will not have to battle Hillary but someone they feel they can beat handily in the general election. I've have also heard that-even if they have miscalculated and Obama wins the general, he will be more easily "contained" in office and recycled out in four years.

Whether that is creditable or not, everyone would do well not to underestimate the mutual detestation society between the GOP and Hillary Clinton.

Granted, there may well be many sincere crossovers. What I find curious is that they aren't being excoriated here in the same manner any Dem who admits to having done the reverse for similar reasons. It's all just seen as manna from heaven.

I suppose as long as it's crossover to Obama, "party disloyalty" is above question and presumed straightforward in motive?

You asked, I opined.

[jenmito]

73. delete-dupe

[jenmito]

74. I've heard over and over and over that Repubs. do NOT want to run against Obama but would

LOVE to run against Hillary since she's so polarizing that she'd motivate the Repubs. like nobody else could-not even McCain. And polls show that to be the case.

[goldcanyonaz]

90. Great post. Bravo!

[Bluerthanblue]

51. because then we can't execute them, and if you aren't one of "us"-

you are the enemy.

:sarcasm:


Because some -SOME people who call themselves Democrats, are not interested in any kind of unity. They nurture and live for their anger, and have a strong desire to get 'back' at 'them' to make up for all the sufferings of 'us'. - .

IMO-


peace~

[WTyler]

53. Idiocy

Simple as that. A large portion of activists are unable to separate Republican voters from elected officials and institutions. Republicans who are willing to vote for a Democrat aren't some strange Newt Gingrich type villain. They're just people who for whatever reason bought into the conservative movement. The fact that they are now supporting a Democrat is a victory. Even better Obama is winning them over without selling out Democratic principles. So much for the Clinton's DLC tactics.:P

[cooolandrew]

54. Yes, Barack isdoing what he set out to do uniting the country. Once the nominatio end they will see.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

56. majority of voters can be swayed either way

if they were voting that way to keep Hillary out and think Obama is easy meet they may be sorely disappointed.

[Hepburn]

63. Well, like I have said before....

...the Pubbies I know do NOT like McCain and they are not of the ultra-RW Limpbigot ilk either. However, the hate Hillary just as much as they hate McCain. But.....they do NOT hate Obama and do show some interest in him. So, if one of those Pubbie friends of mine said they were voting for Obama, I would totally believe this to be their true intent.

Hi, Jen....as usual, a good thread...a K&R for you!

[jenmito]

72. Same with the Repubs. I know...

I think the only people who don't believe them are people whose candidate is hurt by the Repubs.' votes. And those would be Hillary supporters.

Hey, Hepburn! Thanks for the K&R! :hi:

[butterfly77]

71. But, I have also heard callers ...

like the one this morning who said her strategy is to vote for Obama to knock out Hillary and then vote for McCain in the General election.

[jenmito]

75. Then you made my point-if you believe THAT caller you have to believe the OTHER callers who

say they'll vote for Obama because they LIKE him.

[JimGinPA]

77. We SHOULD Be Trying To Build A Majority...

We lost a lot of Democrats to the "Reagan Revolution". A lot of them don't like the way that's turned out for them. All they needed was a reason to come back. Obama gives them that reason.

[Guava Jelly]

80. Thank you

:applause:

[jenmito]

81. Exactly. But it seems like Hillary supporters want to keep fighting anyone who's not now a Dem.

Go figure-they want to keep the country divided.

[babylonsister]

86. It's not. The thinking rethugs probably feel as betrayed by their

government as we do, and they have nowhere to go, especially if they think this illegal occupation is bogus.
I welcome them.

[jenmito]

87. I agree...

Thanks for the common sense! :hi:

[OzarkDem]

91. Because they won't vote for him in the GE

Its a very old trick, crossing over in the primary to vote for the candidate you can beat in the GE.

[babylonsister]

92. How can you possibly know that? More than half the country is

against the illegal occupation; do you honestly think they'll vote for McCain? Do you own a crystal ball? :eyes:

[jenmito]

93. Please. It's HILLARY they can beat in the GE.

[GPSrulesall]

96. I'd have to disagree...

Some of my best friends are die-hard conservatives. They are also registered as independent or unaffiliated. Their reason for this is to vote and to have the weakest candidate on the democratic ticket. They openly admit it and are proud of it. They're voting for Obama. They feel that when he gets up there with McCain that he will eat him alive using experience as his weapon. They're also doing this to stick it to Hillary, and openly admit that McCain v. Hillary in a GE would not be easy. I'm not saying that all republicans are doing this but it would be wise to remember this when we hear or see large amounts of people crossing party lines. Nothing is ever as it seems.