I must admit, Kerry has won me over.

[trotsky]

He's not my ideal candidate, hell none of the 10 was perfect, but more than anything else you know what's impressed me?

He has stated, repeatedly, he WILL NOT BACK DOWN from the Republican smear machine. Folks, this is how Al Gore lost. This is how Democrats lost in 2002. We let the Repukes control the debate. Kerry is a fighter. If he's true to his word, and can answer the filth that will be spewed from RoveCo in the upcoming months, we have ourselves a winner.

[NNN0LHI]

1. The Rethugs know you are not wrong. And they are scared shitless n/t

[dennis4868]

2. I am not sure about that....

the media have gotten their orders from the republican party to portray Kerry as a flip-flopper on the issues. No one from the Kerry campaign is fighting back. Every politician flips flops....Bush flip flops on the issues every 10 minutes for crying out loud but you would not know that from the media.

[trotsky]

5. Check out this post:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1171465#1174299

[CWebster]

3. Really with what?

Smirk's AWOL status to prove that he is alpha male while we are trapped in a quagmire Kerry supported?

Kerry can't stand up to the Republican smear machine--because he has been complicit with Bush policy all along.

[trotsky]

4. Have you even heard Kerry's IWR justification?

He voted for it, but on the condition that we exhaust all UN-related attempts first. Bush* lied. If you want to blame someone, blame the current occupant of the White House. You know, the guy we want to defeat?

[CWebster]

9. IWR justification, huh? Drink the koolaid.

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0301-01.htm


http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0302-03.htm

[library_max]

14. Kerry's position puts him right alongside the American people.

Most Americans supported the war at the time. Now, when no WMDs have been forthcoming and the death toll is mounting and the natives with roses have turned into suicide bombers, they're feeling betrayed. Which message has more resonance? "I knew better than you all along," or "Bush lied to all of us"?

[Iverson]

17. there's a "third way"

It goes "I was fooled by a man with the IQ of a hammer."

[library_max]

24. That's the same as the "first way"

Yet another way of saying, "I'm much, much smarter than you, so vote for me."

[CWebster]

18. No they weren't

War drums were pounding day and night to shape consensus. The link between Saddam and 911 was broadcast more than Dean's scream, around the clock for months, and still the polls indicated hesitation and a preference for UN inspections and multilateral cooperation if necessary. Kerry did nothing to counter the mindset or challenge the intent when it was obvious to most of the world that Bush was acting on a fantasy fed by some dangerous ideologues. Even in the harsh light of day, when the jig was up and the ruse was revealed, Kerry still was silent when he promised he would be the first to speak out.

We are being sold a Kerry campaign, like we were sold the war--ain't nothing but another bandwagon and because sheep are easily led we should seek those qualities in a leader as well to make us all feel good about how so many are so easily duped?

A real leader speaks out before the first innocent is nailed to a cross, not one who listens to the mob and washes his hands.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

33. A real leader

A real leader is someone people follow.


The people choose their leaders by choosing who to follow. Americans are now in the process of choosing to follow either Bush or Kerry.


Who will you choose?

[shimmergal]

22. Plus, Kerry said Bush could and would have gone into Iraq anyhow.

Which is just what I believe. O'Neill's book certainly supports it too. Kerry listed other military actions which presidents took without Congressional authorization (also true.)

Sure, I wish more Dem. Senators had voted against the IWR. But I honestly believe the war would have come just the same. Maybe even sooner, as * wouldn't have felt any pressure to even go to the UN first.

[einniv]

39. Right. It is a nice campaign strategy to be sure.

Just like the American public were not informed enough by our media to know that "No one could have imagined that terrorists would hijack planes and use them as weapons" was not true. They will be fooled by Kerry's claim that he couldn't possibly have known any better than they did (which again, was the fault of the media not the people).

And that is fine. It is great. Nice to have the media distorting FOR our side for a change. But, lets not call it what it isn't. The truth.

[Iverson]

10. good for you

Frankly, though, Kerry's IWR justification is weak. If a Republican came out with such lame rationalization and wishful thinking, he'd be eaten for lunch around here.

Pointing to Bush as the cause of it and the enemy is belaboring the obvious. It doesn't follow that Kerry's rationale is rehabilitated.

[lindashaw]

7. Here's how I look at Kerry's voting record and war protest...

When Clinton was a young man, he arranged his entire life to running for president. Kerry didn't. I'm sure if he planned on running for President, he would have thought hard about some of his positions and done the expedient thing. I do have faith that people can change. I think Kerry will alter his position on some things. He may not say so, because admitting to making mistakes is grounds for crucifixion by the press. But I think he'll try as hard to do the right thing as any of the other candidates. I'm not in love with him, either, but I will support and work for him. The enemy of my enemy is my friend. :)

[CWebster]

12. Really?

It is frightening how little Kerry cheerleaders actually know.

Kerry has spent his entire life fantasizing about his destiny of subjecting us all to his JFK act.

[BeyondGeography]

6. He did a second tour of duty in Vietnam

so he could sail the wrong way up the Mekong Delta in a tin can called a Swift boat.

The Swift boat strategy was in part a response to charges that the Americans didn't have the guts to take the fight directly to the enemy on the ground (Vietnam's waterways are basically its highways).

Yes, the war was wrong, and Kerry was the first to say so when he got home, but not before serving his country and saving the lives of many men.

This a great and fearless man.

The Republicans and their accidental President should be nervous.

[CWebster]

13. I was actually awake during the Viet Nam years

men who claim heroism for participating in the slaughter of innocent people for no reason don't win my respect.

[library_max]

16. I'm just curious.

Now that the nomination is pretty much sewed up for Kerry, what exactly do you hope to accomplish by croaking this tune over and over?

[CWebster]

19. Betcha you wish we all go away

so you could seig heil in peace?

[Feanorcurufinwe]

34. You lose (Godwin's law)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_Law

[AZCat]

35. Link needs to be corrected

you have an extra slash

Here is the correct one:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_Law

I like the link to Benford's law of Controversy:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benford%27s_law_of_controversy

Lots of application in our online 'world'.

[BeyondGeography]

20. He called us on our own slaughter and never "claimed" heroism

I was awake too, my friend, and, unlike you, I have a healthy appreciation for the facts.

So when John Kerry is raked over the coals this fall by the chicken hawks for telling the truth about our atrocities in Vietnam, whose side will you be on?

[CWebster]

21. Oh, I apologize, I forgot this election is about Viet Nam. nt

[BeyondGeography]

23. I'll take that as, "I'm sorry,

I wrongly accused John Kerry of claiming heroism for slaughtering innocent people."

[CWebster]

26. You would be wrong

however you twist it.

[BeyondGeography]

27. You're the twisted one, CW

Try another line of attack on Kerry. This one has officially fallen apart.

[CWebster]

28. Well, I guess you told me!

[kiahzero]

8. Yay!

Looking at his campaign for his Seat in 1996, he fought and fought hard.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/

The Kerry-Weld race was supposed to be, and in many respects was, the fight of Kerry's political life. And going into it there was good reason to believe that Kerry would lose. But he kept in it and fought and fought and fought and eventually won the race. His persistence and tenacity were impressive.

By national standards, it was a pretty clean race. But it was extraordinarily hard-fought. And since then Kerry's always struck me as someone who was a fighter, someone who'd never give up, give in, let himself get hit without fighting back or flag in the home stretch.

[enough]

11. Yes, even in the Florida fiasco,

Gore played softball.

You are right that the only hope for us is to FIGHT BACK, and even FIGHT FIRST. We have to overcome our natural desire for civility.

Howard Dean took up the battle and showed how it was done. I was sorry to see him defeated, but it does look as if Kerry has got the message and has the stomach for it.

He is going to need massive and active support to keep it up, and we are going to have to keep the media's feet to the fire. They have to be told, over and over again, that we're out here and we know what grovelling patsies they are. (And when they report honestly, that we see that too.)

I think of the recent small example of NPR's Juan Williams interview with Marc Racicot who said that Bush* had volunteered to go to Viet Nam. Williams of course did not call him on it. NPR got so much flack from the public that they
had to run a second story laying out some of the facts on the other side.

So we're going to have to do our part in this fight as well. Bring it on.

[CWebster]

15. Kerry didn't fight back either

When asked if the CBC had appealed to him to address the injustices in FLA, kerry responded that they hadn't but he wouldn't have helped them if they had. "Quit crying in your teacups"

[mdmc]

25. Well, we have Kerry now

win lose or draw.
The discussion should now turn to how do we win, and how do we change American policy.

[CWebster]

29. moot point.

[trotsky]

31. So, CWebster, do you have anything constructive to say?

Or do you just want to piss and moan?

Democrats in two dozen states have spoken, and their choice was overwhelmingly Kerry.

I'm sorry that your opinion is not the only one that counts.

Kerry has shortcomings. Big deal. So did every other candidate in the race. You can whine about it, or you can live with it and help work to defeat Bush. What are you going to do?

[CWebster]

32. I don't know, I haven't decided yet.

I don't know whether the party is hopeless-or whether it is worth changing the party from the bottom up up counter the current leadership which dictates top down. In any event I will no longer enable enablers.

But dispense with the crap about the voters speaking, enough spoke for Bush too, that doesn't mean I jump on their bandwagon.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

38. I personally hope you join the Green party

If your efforts in favor of the Democratic party are any indication, the best thing you could do to help Kerry would be to advocate for the Greens.

Or Nader, maybe you should back Nader. That would also be a positive for the Kerry campaign.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

37. So vote for someone else then

if you think Kerry is the enemy. lol

Bye! :hi:


By the way, I find your mischaracterization to be pathetic. Those are some mighty thin straws you are grasping at in your effort to attack Kerry.

[quinnox]

30. Great! Kerry will win!

Bush better pack his bags.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

36. Fighting the Bush lies: don't miss this one

If you haven't seen Kerry's ad "Keep Our Word" you owe it to yourself to check it out:

http://www.johnkerry.com/pressroom/releases/pr_2004_0227e.html

http://www.johnkerry.com/videos/console.php?video=022704_word

[KerrySupporter]

40. kerry has won many of us because he has vision and knows what we need

we must all get behind him and send him every penny we have that we don't need to survive. i sent my entire two week paycheck last week to him and enlist everyone here to do the same.

[salin]

43. tipping the hat a bit

eh.

[George_Bonanza]

41. Congrats to you, enjoy his victory in November!

The world will be happy and celebrating.

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

42. Im coming around too.

Kerry will need to be pretty aggressive, like he was in the primarys.

[Ramsey]

44. We'll see

Talk is cheap. But I truly hope he means it. We'll see if Kerry comes through, when he has failed to many times in the past, because I have no doubt that a no prisoners stance is what is required in the battle royale that is about to ensue.

[oasis]

45. Good post. Many others will be won over as well.