Need proof that Obama isn't a "uniter"? Look at DU

[Clintonista2]

Obama is one of the most divisive politicians I've ever seen. The general Obamaton excuse will be "It's Clinton's fault!" (Is there any other answer?), but that doesn't hold water because Edwards supporters have many of the same complaints that Clinton supporters do (McClurkin, Obama is a nice talker but never votes accordingly, etc).

Bush ran in 2000 on a platform of being a "uniter not a divider." We all know how that turned out.

[NightWatcher]

1. and Hillary gives universal 'warm fuzzies'?

[Clintonista2]

3. Hillary doesn't run on a "uniter" platform

She runs on a "Let's kick some Republican ass" platform. At least she's honest about it.

[sniffa]

22. She runs on dividing the party, and country.

But hey, that's ok, if she has just a slim chance of winning. That's all that matters, even if she wins by a hair, and loses both houses of congress. :thumbsup:

[harun]

67. She runs on Rovian politics of divisive nonsense (n/t)

[forsberg]

73. It's Obama's candidacy that's tearing the Democratic party apart

He should've stayed out of the race to begin with

[krkaufman]

75. Exactly! It was Hillary's turn to run ...

... and Obama's been too damned arrogant and uppity to think he had any right to seek the nomination.

[forsberg]

77. he's a media creation

and nothing more, they were waiting with baited breath since 04 for him to run. Then he'll be an easy kill in the 08 ge. Any republican will win easily.

[krkaufman]

82. I hear your speculation. And raise you mine.

I think there are plenty of people who are genuinely inspired by Obama's message and character, as they were in 2004 before he ever gave the convention keynote speech. It is even possible that his inspirational message may have led to his being selected to give the keynote position at the '04 convention, minimizing the "media creation" message since he received no national coverage prior to the keynote.

As for media coverage influencing the selection of our nominees, I'll speculate that whatever media hype Obama may have benefitted from is no greater than the media coverage Hillary Clinton benefits from as the former First Lady -- and most certainly to the detriment of all the Democratic candidates who received little to no national media coverage.

And, finally, it is debatable as to whether any of the Democratic candidates stand any better chance of winning in November. Whichever candidate is the nominee, the Democratic candidate remains the underdog, in my opinion, owing to our still having troops in harm's way and the state of our "news" media. The media doesn't seem to have learned from ANY of their recent mistakes.

[GoldieAZ49]

86. good thing

since she can neither unite this party or this country or kick Republican ass

It is a delusion that is not contagious

[tyne]

4. There will always be

those who will attempt to put a stranglehold on greatness.

That's okay though. The majority wants it.

[busymom]

9. Actually, she does.

If you have ever heard her speak, you realize she is a warm person that does give off compassionate vibes.

[sniffa]

29. more like a screeching, nasally speech

pretty much every time, except when she giggles, or almost cries.

[DutchLiberal]

2. Hillary Clinton is a nice talker but never votes accordingly

[Clintonista2]

5. Link? Proof? Thanks in advance.

[MercutioATC]

12. Do you really need another IWR vote link?

Hmmmm?

:shrug:

[krkaufman]

76. Touche! Or Kyl/Lieberman Iran vote? n/t

[DutchLiberal]

20. LOL!

:eyes:

IWR, Patriot Act, K/L, need I go on?

[Clintonista2]

26. Unlike Obama, she never premised her campaign on opposing those "from the start"

While at the same time voting for them. For instance, Obama's claim that he opposed the IWR "from the start," yet having an identical Iraq War voting record to Clinton.

[DutchLiberal]

72. How does that take away that HRC has voted the wrong way on all the important issues?

I'm not for Obama either, but this tactic of Clinton-supporters to yell: "Obama does it too!" to defend their candidates is both getting old really fast, it doesn't take away what HRC did and it's hypocritical.

[Deja Q]

21. Gee, don't you know your own candidate?

I don't. So I'll knock 'em all.

What's your excuse?

:yoiks:

[Deja Q]

14. .

.

[mikelgb]

6. pot, kettle

[LittleClarkie]

7. Obama, and his supporters, are not the same

and you expect the primary season to be all warm and fuzzy here on DU? Riiiight.

The sad truth is when you are attacked, you have to attack back, on either side. Otherwise you risk being "swiftboated."

[Clintonista2]

11. Well then, who is Obama supposed to be uniting?

[LittleClarkie]

50. The country if he gets elected

Problem with unity? What will Hillary be if she's elected? A divider?

[MercutioATC]

8. One of your funnier posts.

Were your candidate of choice anybody but Clinton, you might be able to lay claim to some sort of point.

Clinton is exponentially more divisive both here and in the general populace.

[cali]

10. yes, bitlir, DU is so representative of the real world

after all, everyone knows that Dennis dropped out even though he was doing spectacularly well and that now JE is the frontrunner.


:rofl:

[Clintonista2]

18. DU certainly represents a wing of the democratic party

Or is Obama only supposed to unite certain factions of the Democratic party, and not unite others?

[Occam Bandage]

24. Yes. The gadfly wing.

[Clintonista2]

33. The Paul Wellstone wing, as it's known in the Obama camp?

[Occam Bandage]

37. Sure. The people who are always pushing for things to be better.

Which means the people who are never satisfied with things they way they are.

Which means the people who always find what they have to be unacceptable.

I think it's magnificent.

[Clintonista2]

You might call it magnificent, your candidate calls it a "mere gadlfly"

[Occam Bandage]

I don't recall the word mere there, but I've never actually read the full interview.

I've just read Sirota's hacked-apart article about it. Do you happen to have it? I'd be interested.

[Occam Bandage]

23. And John Kerry ran away with '04. The few Bush supporters in America were tombstoned.

[Jamastiene]

13. Exactly.

He's Bush all over again.

[1corona4u]

48. Especially because he will have advisors telling him what to do...

given his limited experience.




Chimpy 2.

[Occam Bandage]

15. DU is indicative of nothing but DU. We hate everyone and everything.

[Deja Q]

28. Not true.

I love myself.

:P

[Occam Bandage]

30. I'm sorry, you're completely right.

I love you too.

[MercutioATC]

35. I occasionally "love myself" too....

...welcome to the club :)

[racaulk]

85. Are you trying to get this thread locked?

:rofl:

[MercutioATC]

87. Naw...

...the mods are much too busy with locking handshake threads now...I was just being honest :P

[dionysus]

52. ok Bender, have another martini

:)

[ErnestoG]

16. "He's Divisive" - the budding DLC Clintonite meme for 2008!

It's not quite as the last one you guys did, in 2004 ("he isn't electable"), but a damn good effort I must say! What college intern sat up all night grokking that one out?

[bigwillq]

17. Both are divisive

IMo.

[KittyWampus]

19. Edwards supporters are pissed off because it turns out Obama is the successful challenger

to the Clintons. They refuse to admit Edwards message and how he packaged it SUCKS.

As for Clinton supporters?

LOL!

[FlyingSquirrel]

32. Nice broad brush there

Especially the "refuse to admit" part. The reason he's not winning has nothing to do with his message and everything to do with corporate sponsorship of the other two, and corporate media attention lavished upon them, partly because of their novelty as the first "black" and "woman" candidate with a chance of winning.

If you take away the big business contributions to Obama and Clinton, and if there had already been a black president and a female president in this country, do you honestly believe things would be the same right now?

[Critters2]

42. Nice unity message.

Yep, that'll bring us to your side. :thumbsup:

[FlyingSquirrel]

25. Ok well I'm not a current Obama supporter, but

your argument doesn't hold water. Especially if you're a Clinton supporter, because as you can currently see, the majority of DU supports Edwards. Primaries are divisive, because the candidates in the same party have to draw distinctions between themselves when they overall (supposedly)have the same general goals. That's the way it goes.

[Quixote1818]

27. Blame that on this

http://goleft.tv/viewer.asp?v=928

[BenDavid]

31. YOU are so right. It was the obama folks in here that started with

this race crap. it was you obama folks that started the name calling and called me a bigot and a racist. It is only words on a page but those words others see and if you say those words on paper no telling what vile sprews out of your mouths....but that is alright, I will tell you obama folks, We're gonna win this thing. We're gonna get the votes we need and we're gonna win this thing. And you know what I'm gonna do after that, I mean that very night, I'm gonna go to Sam & Harry's, I'm gonna order a big steak, and I'm gonna make a list of everybody who tried to fuck us this week and watch those senators and representative try to convince us there was no harm intended....

[totodeinhere]

34. Look, it's the primary season.

Of course there are going to be disagreements right now. There are three formidable candidates, all of whom have passionate followers.

We won't know if the eventual nominee, whether it be Clinton, Obama, or Edwards, is a uniter until after the nomination fight is over. Then we will see if most everyone unites behind that candidate or not.

[southern_dem]

43. Took the words right out of my mouth n/t

[tammywammy]

36. Anywho who says "look at DU"

as their basis, loses the argument. Seriously. DU is hardly representative of the real world.

[Clintonista2]

38. Do you not think that DU is a faction of the Democratic party?

Gee, I didn't think that Obama was running on a "selective uniter" platform.

[tammywammy]

44. DU is far more left than most people

And more left than the majority of democrats. Kucinich was the favored candidate for a long time here. (Not that there's anything wrong with that, but he hardly had that kind of following with the majority of people.)

[Cant trust em]

55. DU isn't even that far left

DU is more partisan than it is liberal. I've heard plenty of moderate positions on here but I've NEVER seen anyone give a republican credit for anything. Just because people on here hate republicans doesn't make them socialists.

[tammywammy]

57. I never said it did

I said that it's more left than the majority, not a socialist haven. I've been here awhile and that's what I've seen through the years.

[Cant trust em]

59. I was just adding to your point

Funny how on DU we're just used to people going on the attack. I've totally gotten defensive when I didn't need to.

[tammywammy]

62. I'm not defensive

I was just clarifying, since you "adding to my point" wasn't what I meant at all.

:)

[Crunchy Frog]

39. DU is proof that everybody is divisive.

:shrug:

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

40. People on DU do not represent Obama

And writing a post lumping all Obama supporters together with a few idiots is what is divisive. There's idiots in every camp.

[cd3dem]

41. Bush said he was a "uniter" and look what we got

[Yael]

45. He isn't uniting me.

I am not a hopes and dreams person -- I like reality and I want to see a fighter in the POTUS office.

[Skidmore]

46. Funny. I see the establishment fighting to hang onto power.

[ErnestoG]

49. Yep. The last gasping wheeze of the Old Guard DLC

They pulled the same shit in 2004 and we LOST.

[Clarkansas]

47. From a Hillary supporter, no less. The irony.

:eyes:

[dionysus]

51. you think this is Obamas fault?

i got some real estate to sell ya...

[Cant trust em]

53. a republican being a united not a divider worked out great for republicans

by that logic Obama being a uniter not a divider can be great for us too.

[Cant trust em]

54. I would never hold up DU as representative of the country

If that were the case then we'd have Dennis Kucinich as Ambassador to the UN.

[Alexander]

56. Wow, racist Shillbots hate Obama! I guess I can't vote for him!

Too bad I already mailed in my ballot.

[jenmito]

58. You're right. Everyone here should stop arguing and rally behind him for the good of the party!

[Skinner]

60. This is the silliest criticism of Obama I've seen yet.

Blaming any of the primary candidates for what happens on DU is ridiculous. It is especially ridiculous to single out one candidate for special blame.

This is the normal state of affairs on DU during a presidential primary. It ain't the candidates' fault.

[tammywammy]

63. LOL

Thanks Skinner, that's what I was thinking. :)

[madrchsod]

61. look at du?

i am and all i see is some words that imply that obama is not a uniter. nothing else that even remotely backs up your assertion that he is not a uniter....nice try

[DiamondJay]

64. its called THE RACE CARD!!!!

[lynch03]

65. says the person with a clinton avatar

The clinton's are running a very sick, and divisive campaign. Obama for the most part is staying above the fray. When you hear the clinton's spew their, baseless attacks against obama, in contrast to obamas message of hope and unity, who appeals to you more?

[stray cat]

66. Only Bush is a uniter on du

[Skip Intro]

68. K&R.

Nail on the head, once again, Lirwin2.

[Al Cleveland]

69. Trouble ahead

I was very impressed with Barracks speech at th 04 convention. He was a true leader in the mold of Jack Kennedy. I also love Jon Edwards ideas of the problems with corporate America. I have much respect for Bill & Hilliary because the were the only Democrats able to get elected on a consistent basis. This was due to their centrist stance. NOW I find myself turned off to Ob ama ever since Oprah's endorsement change him from an eloquent young leader to the "second coming of Martin Luther King. This election is going down hill fast and if it keeps going this way you will see hugh numbers of Reagan Dems voting for McCain. And Republicans eager to vote against Ob ama. While if hillary gets in Blacks will end up staying home because their candidate lost.

[Califooyah Operative]

70. wait,

So it's Barack's fault DU is going through it's normal primary election division? It's his fault there are three credible candidates with significant and loyal followings including on DU? Try again.

[Al Cleveland]

71. Not a matter of fault

It is nobody's "fault" I am commenting on the effect the candidates will have in the general election, If you look at the Republican side dirty politics in their primary now, it should be clear that either Hilliary or Barrack will be divisive in the fall. You may be a good leader but it doesn't mean the other side wants to follow you!

[krkaufman]

74. Chuckle. Blasting Obama supporters for divisiveness... and calls 'em "Obamatons" ...

... within the next 3 words. What utter hypocrisy.

And we're supposed to now castigate every current and future politician who pledges to "unite" the country as being the reincarnation of George W Bush? Might it not be more reasonable to view George W Bush as being full of sh*t, as many citizens clearly saw before he stole the Presidency?

[Lucinda]

78. Touche.

:)

[RiverStone]

79. DU is not a valid sample

We are but a tiny slice in the BIG universe. Mostly, leaning to the left of the Democratic party's center.

We are internet savvy, somewhat geared toward being political junkies, and on balance - prefer the blogs to reality TV.

If you want to get a real judge of Obama's capacity to unite - look to all the blue dog Dems, independents, and even pukes that are leaning his direction. I see many Dems (both here and personally) who could vote for him - even as a default position to Kucinich, Gore, or Edwards...I see very few who will change and vote for Hillary.

Her negatives are higher than ANY candidate from either party.

DU does not represent the majority of the (real world) and Obama can "unite" better than anybody OUT THERE!

[nolabels]

84. Ha, I suggest you watch or just listen to one those republican debates with McCain and the gang.

The reason republicans chose their candidates so quickly is that they really don't want voters to know there are REAL issues out there to debate on :shrug:

[LibraLiz1973]

80. Look at you... trying to talk sense.

:banghead:

I think we know how trying to be sensible is going with Obama supporters.

[Sanctified]

81. Sorry but DU is not a representation of the rest of the Country.

When you think Uniter you need to think of uniting two political parties to work together for the progress of the country, not uniting one political party to win an election.

[Strawman]

83. He can't pay off the national debt by shitting gold bricks either

Why not criticize him for that too while you're at it? Expecting any candidate to "unite DU" during primary season is about as unreasonable as that.