Clinton goes to Florida, Obama complains, Clinton brings up 2000 election

[Proud2BAmurkin]

Clinton has a hell of a nerve, like she wants those Florida voter's votes to count.

Will Obama come out and fight against those Florida voter's votes not counting? I hope so.

[thunder rising]

1. A link please to the Obama response. I am unaware of anything said

[robbedvoter]

36. There is a statement by his campaign manager on his site I believe

I sum it up to "sorry voters about your voting rights but...other more important squabbles to tend to". My take.

[Clarkansas]

2. Billary only cares about FL and MI when it benefits Billary

If Obama was on course to win FL, Billary wouldn't be talking about this.

[maddiejoan]

3. Of course he complained

He wants Florida voters to be at home watching his TV ads.

[Levgreee]

7. They are national TV ads, there was no way for them to not reach Florida

CNN and MSNBC said they couldn't do it. The Democratic party said Obama was completely in line and abiding by the rules for campaigning in Florida.

[papau]

12. Everyone else is off "national TV ads" for that reason until after FL-Obama irony as he breaks rules

[Tom Rinaldo]

16. No other candidate went the Obama route that sent ads into Florida

And still no one has shown me how "the Democratic Party" said Obama was in line and not breaking the 4 State Pledge that he agreed to with the Party Chairs of the 4 early contest States. The research I have done indicates that the agreement wasn't with "the Democratic Party", it was with those 4 State Chairs and there was no exception in it for allowing political ads to be aired to over 6.5 million Florida households if that was part of some national ad purchase. Only Obama took that route and the ads playing inside Florida now are designed to win him votes. Obama got advance approval from One Chair only, South Carolina, which happens to be a State where he has a lot of political support. I have seen no claim that the other 3 State Chairs signed off on it.

If you can explain and give evidence for how the Democratic Party approved that ad purchase into Florida I honestly would like to see it.

[boston bean]

20. That's the fuckin point no other candidate went that route. Jesus Christ

they can make an good excuse out of a total cluster fuck.

[george_maniakes]

29. the point is that those delegates dont count so there is no contest there in the first place, no?

So his ads appearing inadvertently in that market had no impact. Or am i on the wrong track here?

[Tom Rinaldo]

30. Wrong track. How often are Gallup and Zogby etc polls discussed here?

Forget here at DU, how often is national and key state polling data discussed in the media? What effect do you think poll reporting has on election coverage? I am talking about those voter samples with a 4.5% margin of error which are snapshots that can't prove which people will even bother showing up at the polling booth come election day. None of those polls award real delegates, but they have a real role in shaping perceptions regarding a candidates chances to get elected, and that effects coverage, and that effects fund raising etc.

If those public opinion polls have a real impact on a race, what about an actual election where millions of votes actually are cast and counted? How about if that real election is in one of the most populous and crucial swing states for the 2008 election?

Ads are designed to influence voters to vote for you otherwise money would not be wasted on them. The more people who vote for Obama in Florida the better it will be for him. Same for any of our candiates, but only Obama has ads showing there.

[Tom Rinaldo]

32. I guarentee you if Obama does much better than expected in the Florida vote

The Florida results will instantly become very relevent and highly significant to the Obama campaign and to Obama suporters. THAT is why Obama ads are running in Florida.

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[maddiejoan]

9. alerted

[bellasgrams]

18. gaiilonfong, so she's the crook and liar, but it's BO that is

braking the rules by running TV ads. Now go figure, just how does that work.

[desi]

5. Isn't she there for fundraisers, not campaigning per se?

And is Obama not running TV ads in FL, with the DNC's approval of course?

[tabatha]

8. Obama is running ads nationally.

He asked that they not be shown in Florida. He was told that that was not possible.

[Tom Rinaldo]

22. It was possible not to end up in his "unfortunate" situation

Neither Clinton or Edwards had a problem avoiding that "problem".

[ruggerson]

31. Then he shouldn't have run them

period.

[papau]

13. Obama had fund raisers in Florida over last 2 weeks

[GoldieAZ49]

6. Obama needs to take this to the DNC TODAY...Dean needs to allow Obama in FA

Hillary: On To Florida
by Aaron Bruns
Hillary Cinton isn’t dwelling on the drubbing she took in South Carolina; after a stop at a black church in Memphis this morning, she’ll get a much needed cash-infusion in Florida — where she’s holding three fundraisers, one large low-dollar youth event and two big donor affairs, to stock up for the expensive February 5th campaign.

She also announced this morning that as soon as the polls close in Florida on Tuesday, she’ll hold a rally for supporters in the Sunshine State — where Democrats have been forbidden from campaigning out of respect for the DNC-designated early states of Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina and Nevada.

Asked why she’d go to a state where the DNC has stripped the delegates as punishment for moving its primary into January, Clinton said “I’m going to try to seat the Florida delegates. I have said the people of Florida deserve to be represented in the process of picking a president for the Democratic party.”

“Florida will once again be a battleground state, and I want the voters in Florida to know that I hear them,” she said. “Hundreds of thousands of Floridians have already voted… they’re taking this seriously. They believe their voices are going to be heard, and should be counted, and I agree with that.”

Clinton has been mentioning the importance of Florida, where she holds a solid lead over Barack Obama, every chance she gets; that’s in part to ingratiate herself to Florida voters, and in part to convince the media that her likely win there on Tuesday should be counted as a victory worth covering — and one that can bring some of the momentum Obama took with his massive South Carolina win back to her going into February 5th.

[sunonmars]

10. Its a very smart move and the others are left behind again

If Obama comes out against this and wins the nomination, they will make him pay for it in the General because the Repugs will batter him over the head with this, get with the program, this is bigger than delegates here guys, get with the picture.

If we do not go to Florida, come the General we will pay for it big time.

[GoldieAZ49]

11. Foul, but not surprising

http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1707293,00.html

For her part, Clinton agrees. On Friday, she issued a statement pledging to request that Florida and Michigan delegates be seated if she's the presumptive nominee going into the convention. "I believe our nominee will need the enthusiastic support of Democrats in these states to win the general election," she said. Even though the campaign is supposed to be abiding by its pledge to ignore the Sunshine State, soon after she suffered a humbling defeat to Obama in South Carolina Saturday, her husband was rallying the faithful at a rally in Missouri by saying that the campaign was now moving onto Super Tuesday states, and notably, Florida as well. Clinton's stance on the delegates, not surprisingly, is not exactly an act of courage, or for that matter, principle: As the only major Democrat who didn't remove her name from the ballot, she easily won Michigan, and she leads Obama by more than 20 points in most Florida voter polls; if she's the presumptive nominee, welcoming Florida's delegates to the convention will simply pad her victory margin. The tougher call would be for Obama to issue the same promise: should he lose Florida but arrive in Denver as the presumptive nominee, calling on the DNC to include the state's delegates could theoretically cost him the nomination.

[Vinca]

14. Obama didn't cook up this stupid DNC deal and shouldn't be

penalized for it. I'm sorry for the voters of Florida and Michigan, but they need to take it up with their state parties. As for those of you who think Hillary deserves the delegates because she left her name on the ballot, how would you feel if Obama was the only name on the ballot?

[hayu_lol]

21. It was simply Obama's inexperience that caused him to join with others...

in removing his name from Michigan. The DNC rules did not require candidates to remove their names--it only required that they not actively campaign in the involved states. Hillary complied.

Cute phrasing in the article...Hillary was 'the only MAJOR candidate to leave her name on the ballot' as if she was a major candidate prior to Iowa. The ban didn't bother Dennis or Dodd, neither of whom removed their names, and Dennis went ahead and campaigned(not that it did him any good)in Michigan.

Just another ho-hum Hate Hillary thread--one more of them amongst the many here on this board.

[bellasgrams]

24. Vinca, I think he was pretty sharp, however he didn't and he isn't

[george_maniakes]

15. Didnt hillary agree before hand that those delegates wouldnt count? im confused.

Why on earth would she break an agreement like that?

[flordehinojos]

whine, whine, whine. that is all obama really does well! just like poppy's little boy seated in the

oval office.

[george_maniakes]

25. Im sorry, confronting something you believe is wrong is called whining?

Your attitude reeks of immaturity. You argue against someone who believes something wrong is being done by saying the act of pointing out the act is, what exactly?

[flordehinojos]

40. thank you for gaging my maturity instead of gaging b.o.'s maturity.

the only thing he sees wrong with hillary coming to florida is that he is afraid of her win here.
if he wants to confront something, why doesn't he too come to florida. that is the mature way to confront whatever he thinks is wrong with what hillary is doing. but the guy is a whiner. just like little pissypants bush. and, as far as my maturity goes ... well, it is not in the running for anything.

[GoldieAZ49]

17. Statement by Sen. Hillary Clinton

Statement by Sen. Hillary Clinton on the Seating of Delegates at the Democratic National Convention
January 25, 2008

"I hear all the time from people in Florida and Michigan that they want their voices heard in selecting the Democratic nominee.

"I believe our nominee will need the enthusiastic support of Democrats in these states to win the general election, and so I will ask my Democratic convention delegates to support seating the delegations from Florida and Michigan. I know not all of my delegates will do so and I fully respect that decision. But I hope to be President of all 50 states and U.S. territories, and that we have all 50 states represented and counted at the Democratic convention.

"I hope my fellow potential nominees will join me in this.

"I will of course be following the no-campaigning pledge that I signed, and expect others will as well."


oh really Hillary?

[VotesForWomen]

33. apparently she is not going to be campaigning there; it will only be a post-election

visit. nt

[robbedvoter]

37. Really. I like it. Now post Obama's.

[BringBigDogBack]

19. So you ever stop posting?

Jesus.

[GoldieAZ49]

23. FA Democratic primary does matter

http://www.fladems.com/content/w/democratic_primary_does_matter

January 22, 2008

Florida counts. Period.

Some have insinuated that the loss of delegates from the national party somehow means our primary doesn't count. But they're wrong. We count, and we matter - big time. As the final state primary before the potentially decisive Feb. 5 contests in more than 20 states, Floridians could have an enormous impact on both the Democratic and Republican races.

Tuesday's presidential primary isn't about campaign rallies, and it isn't about incessant television advertising. It isn't about delegates, and it isn't about big money. Florida's Democratic primary, more than ever before, is about the voters.

The primary counts because hundreds of thousands of Florida voters will go to the polls and make it count. In fact, more Democrats than Republicans have gone to the polls to cast early ballots - which is notable, considering the traditional advantage the GOP has had.

[george_maniakes]

26. So let me get this straight...

there was an agreement in place that florida and michigan delegates wouldnt count. all candidates agreed. Now, out of the blue, hillary is reneging on that promise for self-serving reasons, and this is a good thing? Where am i bizarro land?

[GoldieAZ49]

27. It isn't a good thing

it is a Clinton thing

[robbedvoter]

38. "is about the voters." - how 1999 of them! Voters righta to matter more than

party squabbles....

[Bitwit1234]

28. Maybe she is trying to make up for all those ads

THE OTHER CANDIDATE is running in Florida....I mean after all HE was not supposed to.

[Tatiana]

34. Lots of threads... n/t

[democrat2thecore]

35. SEE ALL THESE NEGATIVE THREADS? Making a point is all. -nt

[matcom]

39. KICK

[Tatiana]

41. For matcom

:kick:

[book_worm]

42. Why did she wait until two days before the election to start caring?

[still_one]

43. keep up the unsubstantiated statements, and see how will that moves people to your candidate

In fact the more antagonism and snide remarks I see being generated on different threads, spells big trouble for us in the presidential race in the general election

[Tatiana]

44. KICK

:kick: