Can Anyone Provide A Few Examples Of Obama Distorting Hillary's Record

[THUNDER HANDS]

I'm serious. I would like to be educated. If you could provide links or examples that you remember, I'd appreciate it.

[thunder rising]

1. ahhh nope, can't think of a one...sorry. But the other way is a very different story

[rinsd]

2. Here

# Obama Continues False Attacks On Hillary (01/22/08)
# Memo: About Last Night (01/22/08)
# Factcheck: Sen. Obama Claimed He Sponsored Bill Protecting Privacy of Sex Abuse Victims (01/22/08)
# Factcheck: Sen. Obama’s Vote on Bankruptcy Bill Amendment (01/21/08)
# UPDATE Now and Then: Sen. Obama on Single Payer Health Care (01/21/08)
# Sen. Obama Misrepresents President Clinton’s Comments on Iraq War Record (01/21/08)
# Factcheck: Sen. Obama Announced Tens of Billions in Unaccounted Spending (01/21/08)
# UPDATE Obama Campaign Falsely Claims That One Year Ago Hillary Said NAFTA Was 'A Boon To The Economy' (01/21/08)
# UPDATE Fact Check: Sen. Obama Followed Hillary's Lead On Stimulus (01/21/08)
# Factcheck: President Clinton on Sen. Obama's record (01/20/08)
# Nevada Papers: Hillary Won (01/20/08)
# Hillary Wins Nevada (01/19/08)
# Bad Oppo Alert! Hillary Did Not List Ronald Reagan As Favorite President (01/18/08)
# Fact Check: Sen. Obama Followed Hillary's Lead On Stimulus (01/18/08)
# Sen. Obama Silent On Independent Expenditures He Blasted In Iowa (01/17/08)
# In Illinois State Senate, Sen. Obama Didn't Speak Out Against Yucca When He Had the Chance (01/17/08)
# Top Donor to Sen. Obama Spent Millions Lobbying to Store Nuclear Waste at Yucca Mountain (01/17/08)
# Fact Check: The Fundamental Difference Between Federal and Illinois State "Born Alive" Legislation (01/17/08)
# New Obama Campaign Ad Falsely Claims Sen. Obama Has Offered a 'Universal Health Care Plan' (01/16/08)
# Fact Check: Sen. Obama and Sen. Edwards on Yucca (01/15/08)
# Sen. Obama's supporters campaigning in Michigan (01/15/08)
# Obama Advisor Falsely Claims Obama Voted Differently Than Hillary On Iraq Withdrawal, Timelines (01/15/08)
# Fact Sheet: Sen. Obama's 129 Present Votes (01/14/08)
# Obama Camp Keeps Making False Claims About Sen. Obama’s Record on Troop Withdrawal (01/14/08)
# Obama Campaign Falsely Claims Sen. Obama Has Pushed For 'A Withdrawal of Our Forces' Every Year 'Since 2002' (01/14/08)
# Statement from Bob Johnson (01/13/08)
# Bad Oppo Alert! Sen. Obama's Senate Record On Iraq (01/13/08)
# On Meet the Press, Hillary Examines Sen. Obama On Iraq (01/13/08)
# Fact Check : Sen. Obama’s Iraq War Record (01/09/08)
# Sen. Obama Falsely Claims Hillary Called For A 'Reality Check' On What the Nation Could Accomplish (01/07/08)
# Fact Check: Sen. Obama's Bill Allows Lobbyists To Wine and Dine Members of Congress, As Long As They Are Standing Up (01/06/08)
# Obama Falsely Attributes AP Reporting To Hillary Surrogate (01/06/08)
# Sen. Obama Debates Himself on Health Care (01/05/08)
# The Chair of Obama's New Hampshire Campaign Is A Lobbyist For The Pharmaceutical Industry (01/05/08)
# Hillary's record in New Hampshire (01/05/08)
# Sen. Obama Promised to Support Repealing PATRIOT Act, Then Voted to Extend It (01/05/08)
# Sen. Obama Promised To Oppose Iraq War Funding, Then Voted For Every Iraq War Funding Bill (01/05/08)
# Now and Then: Sen. Obama on Single Payer Health Care (01/05/08)
December
# Fact Check: Hillary versus the Republicans (12/29/07)
# Fact Check: Sen. Obama's False Attack On Clinton Foreign Policy Advisors (12/21/07)
# Sen. Edwards Repeats Discredited Attack, Falsely Accuses Hillary Of Iraq Flip Flop (12/21/07)
# Gov. Bill Richardson Misquotes Hillary, Launches False Attack (12/21/07)
# Sen. Obama Goes Negative in the Mail, Misleads NH Voters on Health Care (12/17/07)
# Fact Check: Hillary Was First Senator to Propose Requirement That FEMA Director Be Qualified for the Job (12/14/07)
# Hillary: Rumors About My Campaign Staff Are False (12/12/07)
# Obama Campaign Comes Clean: Sen. Obama's Health Care Plan Provides Universal Access, Not Universal Coverage (12/11/07)
# Fact Check: Sen. Edwards Attacks Hillary on Social Security (12/07/07)
# Clintons Not Attending Google Wedding (12/07/07)
# Fact Check: The South Dakota Abortion Initiative (12/06/07)
# Sen. Obama Shifts on Using American Forces in Iraq to Blunt Iranian Threat (12/04/07)
# Fact Check: Sen. Edwards and Sen. Obama on Iran’s Nuclear Threat (12/04/07)
# Sen. Obama Shifts on Iran Negotiations (12/04/07)
# Fact Check: Hillary’s Iowa Remarks (12/03/07)
# Sen. Obama Attacks (12/03/07)
# Sen. Obama Rewrites History, Claims He Hasn’t Been Planning White House Run (12/02/07)
# Axelrod Misrepresents Washington Post Quote to Falsely Claim that Obama's Health Care Plan Covers Every American (12/02/07)
# Only the Obama Campaign Is Encouraging Out-Of-Staters to Caucus in Iowa (12/01/07)
November
# Fact Check: General Kerr and the YouTube Debate (11/29/07)
# Recap: Health Care for All v. 15 Million Uninsured (11/28/07)
# Bad Oppo Alert! – Hillary Has Always Supported An Individual Mandate (11/28/07)
# Fact Check: Hillary Supported An Individual Mandate In 1990s (11/27/07)
# Fact Check: Bill Clinton On The Iraq War (11/27/07)
# Fact Check: Polls Show Hillary Beating All Republicans (11/27/07)
# Experts: Without Mandate, No Universal Health Care (11/26/07)
# Fact Check: Sen. Obama's Plan Has Mandate, But Only For Kids (11/25/07)
# Sen. Obama's Shifting Positions On Health Care For All (11/25/07)
# Hillary's Health Care Plan Cuts Costs As Aggressively As Sen. Obama's Plan; Doesn't Leave 15 Million Uninsured (11/24/07)
# Sen. Obama First Claims His Health Care Plan Covers All, Then Admits It Doesn't (11/21/07)
# Obama Campaign Falsely Claims Hillary Flip-Flopped On Merit Pay (11/20/07)
# Sen. Obama Falsely Claims He Has 'Basically the Same' Health Care Plan as Hillary; Actually Leaves 15 Million Uninsured (11/19/07)
# Sen. Edwards on the Constitution: 'Who Cares?' (11/18/07)
# Sen. Edwards Falsely Claims Hillary Didn't Support Universal Health Care 'Earlier This Year' (11/18/07)
# Obama Campaign Tactics (11/17/07)
# Sen. Obama Recycles Discredited Claim From Failed Book (11/17/07)
# Obama Campaign Falsely Claims That One Year Ago Hillary Said NAFTA Was 'A Boon To The Economy' (11/16/07)
# Sen. Obama's Shifting Stance on Social Security (11/15/07)
# Sen. Obama Falsely Suggested He Opposed Kyl-Lieberman 'At The Time Of The Vote' (11/15/07)
# Sen. Edwards Supported Drivers Licenses For Illegal Immigrants In 2004 (11/15/07)
# Sen. Edwards Opposed Universal Health Care In 2004 (11/15/07)
# Sen. Obama's Health Care Plan Would Leave At Least 15 Million Uninsured (11/15/07)
# Sen. Edwards Proposes Unconstitutional Law In New Ad (11/13/07)
# Fact Check: Sen. Obama on Records (11/12/07)
# Fact Check: Sen. Obama on Meet the Press (11/11/07)
# FactCheck.org Updates Item On Clinton Presidential Records (11/09/07)
# Sen. Obama Misrepresents Hillary's Views On Social Security (11/08/07)
# Fact Check: Bill Paid, Tip Left At Iowa Maid-Rite (11/08/07)
# Edwards Would Continue Combat Missions Against Al-Qaeda In Iraq But Attacks Hillary For Having The Same Position (11/08/07)
# Fact Check: What Did Bill Clinton Say? (11/07/07)
# Obama Distorts Hillary's Record On Ethanol (11/06/07)
# Barack Obama Falsely Claims That Hillary Controls Release Of White House Records (11/06/07)

http://facts.hillaryhub.com/archive/

[Quixote1818]

3. Thats one of Hillary's Website probably filled with more lies. nt

[rinsd]

8. So? Obama supporters post shit from his fact hub.

There are links there, feel free to investigate.

[THUNDER HANDS]

10. I'll go through some of them...

Sen. Obama misrepresents President Clinton’s comments on Iraq war Record
Today, at the debate, Sen. Obama falsely asserted that President Clinton was arguing that he did not oppose the war from the start:

"That is something that I hear all across the country. So when Senator Clinton or President Clinton says that I wasn't opposed to the war from the start or says it's a fairy tale that I opposed the war that is simply not true."

Sen. Obama misrepresented President Clinton’s comments. President Clinton simply questioned the level of media scrutiny Sen. Obama had received regarding his position on Iraq:

"It is wrong that Senator Obama got to go through 15 debates trumpeting his superior judgment and how he had been against the war in every year, enumerating the years, and never got asked one time, not once, well, how could you say that when you said in 2004 you didn't know how you would have voted on the resolution, you said in 2004 there was no difference between you and George Bush on the war, and you took that speech you're now running on off your Web site in 2004, and there's no difference in your voting record and Hillary's ever since."

---

okay, on that one, the Hillary site leaves out the whole fairy tale quote at all. Which is kinda head-scratching, since everyone remembers that and it's actually in OBAMA'S QUOTE above Bill Clinton's.


I'll go on in separate posts and I go through this.

[THUNDER HANDS]

16. and this ...

Senator Obama just claimed that Senator Clinton called NAFTA a boon to the economy. This is not accurate.

The Obama campaign has said this before. Here's their chief strategist David Axelrod:

On this issue of NAFTA, just a year ago Senator Clinton said it was a boon to our economy and one of the great achievements of the Clinton administration.
An Obama campaign memo attributes the "quote" to the September 11, 2006 edition of Newsday. But that article does not quote Hillary saying that. It just asserts what Hillary "thinks" without any substantiation:

Clinton thinks NAFTA has been a boon to the economy, but voted against the Central American-Dominican Republic Free Trade Agreement, saying it would drive jobs offshore.

Sen. Obama lamented this kind of politics in his book, Audacity of Hope:

For that is how most of my colleagues, Republican and Democrat, enter the Senate…their words distorted, and their motives questioned.

----

Except, in this article, also cited in the memo...

1996: In Brownsville, TX, Clinton Said NAFTA Would Lead To An Economic Improvement In Border Regions. On a trip to Brownsville, Texas, Clinton “touted the president’s support for the North American Free Trade Agreement, saying it would reap widespread benefits in the region.”

and I looked on Newsday's site, but I couldn't find the article at all.

[THUNDER HANDS]

23. and this...

Sen. Barack Obama is falsely claiming that Hillary called for a "reality check" on what we could accomplish as a nation:

Senator Clinton saying don’t feed the American people false hopes. Get a reality check. You know? I mean, you can picture JFK saying, we can’t go to the moon. It’s a false hope. Let’s get a reality check. It’s not, sort of, I think what our tradition has been.
Actually, Hillary called for a reality check on each candidate's record of delivering change and fighting special interests:

CLINTON: Can we just have a sort of a reality break for a minute? Because I think that it is important to make some kind of an assessment of these statements.

You know, Senator Edwards did work and get the patient bill of rights through the Senate -- it never got through the House. One of the reasons that Natalie may well have died is because there isn't a patient's bill of rights. We don't have a patient's bill of rights...

So, we've got to have a plan and a real push to get it through.

You know, when it comes to lobbyists, you know, Senator Obama's chair in New Hampshire is a lobbyist. He lobbies for the drug companies.

So, I think it's important that all of us be held to the same standard -- that we're all held accountable.


You know, the energy bill that passed in 2005 was larded with all kinds of special interest breaks, giveaways to the oil companies. Senator Obama voted for it. I did not because I knew that it was going to be an absolute nightmare.

Now we're all out on the campaign trail talking about taking the tax subsidies away from the oil companies, some of which were in that 2005 energy bill.

So, you know, words are not actions. And as beautifully presented and passionately felt as they are, they are not action.

You know, what we've got to do is translate talk into action and feeling into reality. I have a long record of doing that, of taking on the very interests that you have just rightly excoriated because of the over-due influence that they have in our government.

-----

The article talks about what clinton said after the reality break part. But it doesn't mention what Obama said before that, which is what she said that in response to.

Here is what Obama said before Hillary stated they needed a "reality break"

But here's the critical point that I want to make. Not only does this have to be personal, John -- and I completely agree. When I think about health care, I think about my mother, who when she was dying of cancer had to read an insurance form because she had just gotten a new job and they were trying to figure out whether or not this was going to be treated as a preexisting condition, and whether or not they would pay her medical bills.

So I've seen the costs of a health care system that is broken in very personal terms.

But what I also believe, if we're going to bring about real change, then we have to bring in the American people. We have to bet on them.

OBAMA: And that's what's been lost. People, I think, feel that they are not heard at all, they are not involved. And the only way we're going to muster enough power over the long term to actually get something done is if we've got a working majority, which is why it's so important...

(CROSSTALK)

CLINTON: Can we just have a sort of a reality break for a minute? Because I think that it is important to make some kind of an assessment of these statements.

[THUNDER HANDS]

25. and this....

At last night's debate, Hillary quoted reporting from the Associated Press:
And I do think that, you know, part of what this primary process is all about, and New Hampshire voters are, you know, famously independent in making their judgments, is to look at our records, to evaluate where we stand and what we stand for.

And I think that there is a lot of, you know, room to ask all of us questions.

You know, Senator Obama has been -- as the Associated Press described it, he could have a pretty good debate with himself.

Sen. Obama claimed that the Associated Press was just quoting a Hillary surrogate:

Well, you know, I think the Associated Press was quoting some of your folks
Actually, Hillary was quoting reporting from the Associated Press:
If he wanted, the Barack Obama of today could have a pretty good debate with the Barack Obama of yesterday. They could argue about whether the death penalty is ever appropriate. Whether it makes sense to ban handguns. They might explore their differences on the Patriot Act or parental notification of abortion.

----

Well, two things with this one. A - the associated press story she links to doesn't have the article on it, so there's no way to verify that. B - after Obama claimed it was her surrogate, she said nothing to refute that.

so that, as far as I'm concerned, is not proven.

[THUNDER HANDS]

29. and this...

Hillary Clinton has consistently opposed merit pay for individual teachers and supported merit pay on a school-by-school basis. Here's Hillary explaining her position on the Today Show on May 11, 2000:

You know, I am for pay for performance, but I do not believe singling out individual teachers is the way to do it. I think we should look at school performance. And I think we should look at some of the extra training that we know now makes a difference in teachers' qualifications. Because if we have merit pay, who's going to want to teach the poorest kids? You know, if you know that your pay is connected to, OK, you take this group of children, who come from very disadvantaged backgrounds in September, and you have to move them to advance by June, who's going to want to go to that classroom? I want to go where the kids are easier to teach, you know. So I think we can do pay for performance, and we can provide financial incentives, and I'd like to see that.
Yesterday, the Obama campaign falsely asserted that she has "flip flopped" on merit pay for individual teachers.

The Obama campaign provides two examples. The first example, from New York Daily News, simply quotes Hillary discussing her support for school-based merit pay. The second example is a clip from a New York senate debate. If you look at the original source, you'll find that it is part of an exchange where Hillary expresses her opposition to merit pay for teachers and is attacked for it.

The citations the Obama campaign provides only illustrate Hillary's consistency on the issue of merit pay.

-----

Except Obama provides three examples, not two, and she fails to mention this from November of 2007...

NOVEMBER 15, 2007: Clinton Said She Supported School-Based Merit Pay, Refused To Answer Whether Merit Pay Should Be Given To Individual Teachers. "Well, I support school-based merit pay for a lot of the reasons Chris was talking about. We need to get more teachers to go into hard-to-serve areas. We've got to get them into underserved urban areas, underserved rural areas. But the school is a team, and I think it's important that we reward that collaboration. You know, a child who moves from kindergarten to sixth grade, say, in the same school, every one of those teachers is going to affect that child." Asked again whether "Do you give just everybody the merit pay, or do you give it to individual teachers?" Clinton said, "Well, you need to weed out the teachers who are not doing a good job. I mean, that's the bottom line. They should not be teaching our children. I mean, what I believe so strongly is that our education system has served this country very well. But we're in the 21st century. We do need to reimagine it. We've got to get everybody to talk about it. But what I object to with the Bush administration is it's always talking down. We need to have a collegial collaboration. And the teachers need to be at the table...helping us figure out what the best way is to achieve our goals."

[THUNDER HANDS]

30. and this...

Today, Barack Obama is on the attack, taking issue with Hillary's new energy plan that has been widely praised by the League of Conservation Voters and the CEO of Google, among others. Obama says that Hillary doesn't actually support ethanol.

"It's hard to believe that she is a strong ethanol supporter given her track record and this is something that represents a major reversal and what we need is consistency on these issues," Obama said in an interview. "If she's willing to shift this quickly on this issue, we don't know whether she will shift back when it gets hard."

Actually, Hillary has a long record of supporting ethanol. Here are some highlights:

Hillary voted for energy bill that requires ethanol production to grow to at least 36 billion gallons a year by 2022, a sevenfold increase of the amount of ethanol processed last year.

Hillary has supported extending tax incentives for blending ethanol in gasoline. In 2004, Sen. Clinton voted to extend the 51 cent per gallon ethanol blending credit through 2010, and has proposed a further extension to 2012.

Hillary is the sponsor of a 50% tax credit for the installation of ethanol pumps. "I Support comprehensive legislation that would...up the availability of ethanol by providing gas station owners with a 50 percent tax credit for the cost of installing ethanol pumps"

Hillary is the sponsor of legislation to make ethanol more available nationwide by providing loan guarantees for commercial production. "I support comprehensive legislation...that would speed the development of cellulosic ethanol by providing loan guarantees for the first billion gallons of commercial production capacity."

Hillary co-sponsored legislation to dramatically expand renewable energy, including ethanol, by 2025. Senator Clinton cosponsored a concurrent resolution which expresses the sense of Congress that it is the goal of the U.S. that, not later than 1/1/2025, the agricultural, forestry, and working land of the U.S. should provide from renewable resources not less than 25% of total energy consumed in the U.S. and continue to produce safe, abundant, and affordable food, feed and fiber. Grassley sponsored and Harkin was a co-sponsor.

Hillary supported increasing biofuel production on 'a much faster track' to revitalize rural and reduce dependence on foreign oil. "We have an underused resource, American farmland, and rural communities across our country eager to try something new and do their part to help solve our energy problems. Today we have 97 biorefineries located in 19 different states with the capacity to make nearly 4.5 billion gallons of ethanol. Now, over the next 12 to 18 months, we will increase that capacity by 50 percent. And we're seeing it in New York as we're seeing it around the country... We need to be moving on a much faster track."

Hillary co-sponsored of a tax credit for production of flex-fuel vehicles. Clinton co-sponsored a bill that would provide a $150 per vehicle manufacturer tax credit to encourage the production of "flex-fuel" vehicles that are capable of running on 85% ethanol fuel, known as "E85."

Hillary co-sponsored an amendment to create a program to produce ethanol from municipal solid waste. Senator Clinton cosponsored an amendment that directs the Secretary of Energy to establish a program to provide guarantees of loans by private institutions for the construction of facilities for the processing and conversion of municipal solid waste into fuel ethanol and other commercial byproducts.

-------

Except she includes her own note at the end of this where she admits that she voted against ethanol in the past...

Previously, there was evidence that mandating ethanol production might negatively impact the economy in New York and some of Hillary's earlier votes on ethanol reflect that.

[THUNDER HANDS]

31. and finally, this....

In an interview Tuesday that just posted on National Journal, Barack Obama says that Hillary "is not willing to say" how she would address the long-term challenges of Social Security:

You know, Senator Clinton says that she's concerned about Social Security but is not willing to say how she would solve the Social Security crisis, then I think voters aren't going to feel real confident that this is a priority for her.
In fact she has. Here's an excerpt from an October 9 speech:

Don't you believe all these people running around crying wolf about Social Security. That is exactly what they're doing. They're trying to get people confused and upset and agree to a bad deal.
When I am president, we'll have our priorities in order. We will return to fiscal responsibility and fair tax policies first, and then we will address the long-term challenges facing Social Security.

When my husband left office, because we had a balanced budget and a surplus, there was a plan in place to extend the solvency of Social Security until 2055. That gives us plenty of time to figure out what else we need to do.
Once the country is on the path to fiscal responsibility Hillary will create a bipartisan process to meet the challenge, an approach that has worked before:

"But I am strongly advocating a bipartisan process, similar to what we had in '83, and when that gets set up, as I hope it will be when I'm president, then I'm going to see what the bipartisan members are going to come up with."

----

Correct me if I'm wrong, but saying that you're going to address the long-term challenges facing social security is not exactly the same as saying HOW she would address social security.

And what she does say, she says she'll advocate a "bipartisan process" - which is so vague it might as well be saying "eh, we'll do something."

Again, Obama is right on this one.

[THUNDER HANDS]

32. so that's it

7 alleged distortions, and six were disproven within minutes. one could not be proven or disproven.

got anything else?

[Barack_America]

12. To be fair, that's mostly their own spin.

I would need to see that a third-party has debunked Obama's claim, rather than Hillary's interpretation.

[DrFunkenstein]

14. Sen. Obama Rewrites History, Claims He Hasn’t Been Planning White House Run?

Statement from Bob Johnson?

Obama Falsely Claims That Hillary Controls Release Of White House Records?

Maybe you should have "cleaned" this up a little.

[rinsd]

15. If I had, people would have said I was hiding something.

So I posted it, warts and all.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

4. After she said his specific statement that he would

meet personally with the list of "enemy" leaders in his first year, was naive, he suggested for weeks that she had said it is naive to negotiate with our enemies.

She said nothing of the sort, of course, and what he had literally said was inane. (I doubt he really agreed with the detailed hypothetical he was agreeing to because he's not an idiot. He just spoke inexactly in response to a silly question.)

I do not present this as a big deal. Merely as an example of his established style of twisting her words in the same way she twists his.

IT'S POLITICS! They twist each others' words. Always have, always will.

[Ravy]

5. Just last night he claimed Hillary and John's health care plans

didn't count the numbers of hardship exemptions and were using that fact to fudge the numbers. That was false.

[Barack_America]

7. Please explain....n/t

[ThatPoetGuy]

6. How about distorting both their health care plans?

Obama's plan would leave the 15 million poorest Americans with less health care than they get now. Yet he lies and calls this "universal."

Then he attacks her plan with false claims -- made-up nonsense about mandates.

[Barack_America]

9. Please prove that claim

That it "would leave the 15 million poorest Americans with less health care than they get now".

How so?

I don't recall seeing the dissolution of Medicaid in his plan. Or is he planning on taking away ER care for the poor?

[ThatPoetGuy]

17. Hee!

I love it when Obama supporters demonstrate that they don't even know what he stands for.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgryrneaPSI
http://www.factcheck.org/clinton_vs_obama.html

I bet you don't even know that Obama wants to keep more troops in Iraq for a longer time than any of the other candidates, either.

[babylonsister]

18. Yea, how about that healthcare distortion?

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/01/21/debate-blogging-hard-truths-and-half-truths-on-health-care.aspx

snip//

That said, I also thought at least one Clinton accusation was off-base. It was this one:

You know, if you look at the recent article about Senator Obama's work on health care reform in the Illinois legislature, it's a very interesting piece about how he basically did the bidding of the insurance companies during that effort.

During the debate, the Clinton campaign circulated this Boston Globe article as proof of the charge. The article examines something called the “Health Care Justice Act,” which Obama co-sponsored and which passed during his final year in the Illinois state Seante. And, as that article establishes, Obama held discussions with representatives of the insurance industry and made some changes on their behalf.

But the Globe piece tells only a small portion of the story. I looked into this episode (along with some of Obama's other health care reform efforts) as part of an article that's in our current print edition. The full text is available to subscribers only, but I can give a few relevant paragraphs here:

From 1997 to 2004, as a member of the Illinois Senate, Obama advocated several proposals to make medical care more accessible--culminating, three years ago, in a bill designed to force the creation of a universal coverage system for Illinois. And, while none of these efforts come even close in scale to what he's promised to try in Washington, they do provide a window into the governing style he would pursue there.

Time after time, Obama brought adversaries into the process early, heard out their concerns, then fashioned compromises many of them ultimately supported. In other words, he used the very strategy he's been describing on the campaign trail--the one giving people like me such angst. And yet, if you talk to liberals in Springfield, the ones who've spent decades fighting for universal health care, you don't hear a lot of disappointment with him. As far as they are concerned, Obama's signature inclusiveness was always a means to an end--a way to push the limits of reform rather than accept them. And, they say, it worked.

In 2002, when Democrats won back control of the Senate, Obama became chairman of the Health and Human Services Committee. And it was from that perch that he adopted his other noteworthy health care cause, a measure called the Health Care Justice Act. The brainchild of grassroots activists tired of fighting losing battles to create a single-payer system for Illinois, the act, as originally proposed, would have created a task force, empowered it to develop a universal coverage plan, and then forced the legislature to vote on that plan. Predictably, it aroused the ire of insurers and other business interests, who, by all accounts, lobbied to derail the effort. "They--the insurers--pushed really hard," says Jim Duffett, executive director of the Campaign for Better Health Care, the group championing the plan. "They also tried to use other people to push him really hard."

Publicly, Obama used hearings to rally voter support for universal coverage. Inside the statehouse, he pursued a two-track strategy. He made common cause with doctors and hospitals, two groups that had become more sympathetic to universal coverage because of the financial burdens charity care placed on them. This gave cover to moderates who wanted to support the bill, while increasing pressure on the insurers to fall in line. At the same time, Obama carried on discussions with the insurance and business lobbyists directly, eventually granting them two key concessions: He altered the makeup of the task force to make it more industryfriendly and dropped the provision requiring a vote from the next year's General Assembly. "We had significant concerns and looked to Senator Obama, who is an extremely bright and accessible individual," Phil Lackman, who represents the Professional Independent Insurance Agents of Illinois, told me. "My experience is that he is willing to listen to anybody willing to talk to him."

It's those kinds of statements that lead to stories, like one that The Boston Globe published in the fall, noting that "Obama's own experience in lawmaking involved dealings with the kinds of lobbyists and special interests he now demonizes on the campaign trail." But, whatever the contrast with Obama's campaign rhetoric, reformers in Springfield say the concessions worked out just fine. As it turned out, binding a future Assembly to vote on a measure was probably unconstitutional anyway. And the presence of insurance representatives on the task force may have actually bestowed it with additional legitimacy. Although those members would end up filing a dissent to the task force's final report--which was issued after Obama had moved on to the U.S. Senate--press attention focused on the majority recommendation. And that recommendation was just what many advocates hoped (and opponents feared) it would be: a comprehensive plan for universal coverage, financed and overseen by the state government. "He didn't back down," says Duffett. "There was no mandate , but that was a constitutional issue. ... We got everything else we wanted."

Duffett's quote is important because he is among the state's most prominent and committed advocates on behalf of universal health care. (For the wonks out there, he's the Illinois equivalent of Ron Pollack.) If Obama were in the pocket of health care lobbyists, he'd be the first guy to complain. But Duffett has only good things to say about Obama. Very good things, as a matter of fact.

--Jonathan Cohn

[ThatPoetGuy]

22. Are you a member of the Non-Sequiturs Club?

Cuz that article has nothing to do with anything under discussion.

The question is, did Obama deliberately misrepresent Hillary's stance on health care? And the answer is a resounding YES.

That article says that Hillary misrepresented Obama's history regarding health care. It might be true, but it's a complete non-sequitur.

And I'm an Edwards man, so the Hillary thing doesn't reflect on me at all. Though I'd vote for her over Obama, if I had to pick one.

[babylonsister]

24. She distorted his record and brought the article up DURING THE DEBATE.

Are you a member of the clueless club?

[ThatPoetGuy]

28. The dude asked a question. I answered it.

And you posted an unrelated article.

How bout this: you concede that yes, Obama distorted Hillary's plan, and I concede that Hillary told lies about Obama's record.

And then I can eat waffles and vote for Edwards.

[K Gardner]

19. Oh dear lord, you really know absolutely nothing about healthcare, insurance,

universal single payer (HR 676) v. universal INSURANCE v. mandated insurance (i.e. The Romney plan in MA), do you? And, as typical of Hillary supporters, you don't care to learn but only care to spew lies and distortions based on total fallacies. Please, do some research before you post these ridiculous claims.

Thanks.

[ThatPoetGuy]

27. Project much?

I'm not a Hillary supporter, for one thing.

And if you pretend to know anything, anything, anything at all, about the American health care system, you're lying.

If you pretend to have any compassion at all for the people in America who have suffered, who are suffering, and who will continue to suffer through the health-care industry, you'll read a book or two. And then you won't support Obama anymore.

So stop your lying. Stop your self-deception. Stop supporting a candidate who is planning to do bad things.

Read Paul Krugman's book, The Conscience of a Liberal. The economist who predicted everything accurately about the Bush administration, from the tax plan to the failure of Iraq to the subprime collapse, talks about good ideas vs. bad ideas in the health care reform. He wrote this BEFORE Obama announced his bad ideas.

Read Jonathan Cohn's book, Sick: The Untold Story of America's Health Care Crisis - and the People Who Pay for It. People like Cohn and Krugman who have put lots of time and thought and energy into pushing for a better health-care system, ALL of these health-care reformers, argue that Obama's plan is less than the plans of Hillary and Edwards.

Or maybe go spend some time in the hospital. Visit some sick people. Ask yourself which of them will be left out under Obama's plan.

I wonder if Obamania is a sickness. Its symptoms include: self-deception, empty words, and a total lack of compassion for the poor.

[AtomicKitten]

11. It's all smoke and mirrors for the Clintons.

They are using the Rovian tactic of preemptively accusing their adversary of EXACTLY what they are doing, the worst and most shameful example being Bill Clinton accusing others of suppressing the vote when HE by proxy filed a lawsuit to do precisely that (see my sig line).

[K Gardner]

21. Exactly, and the entire campaign has been conducted this way.

[Lucinda]

13. You can go to this site and find links to articles on the web

http://www.attacktimeline.com/
Just scroll down. Obama's list is on the left.

And yes. It IS a Hillary website. They link to outside sources to back up their claims. Just mouseover the "Source" listed and click for the original article.

[asdjrocky]

20. She was really on the board of Walmart-

for 5 years and 11 months.

He's such a LIAR!

[elizm]

26. No...no one can...because he HASN'T. nt

[THUNDER HANDS]

33. anything....anyone?