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Obama and the Hispanic-American vote: Some points to consider (Part I)

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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:15 PM
Original message
Obama and the Hispanic-American vote: Some points to consider (Part I)
Edited on Sat Jan-12-08 01:20 PM by Katzenkavalier
As you know, I'm a staunch Obama supporter, and I'm Latino as well. I'm Puerto Rican. A black Puerto Rican, to be exact, born and raised in the island. Not only that, I'm about to embark in my PhD studies in Hispanic literature, with focus on Afro-Latin American literature and cultural expressions. So, when it comes to Latin American issues, I feel I can offer a particularly unique point of view about issues affecting our community.

Now, in another thread, it was mentioned that one of Hillary's posters suggested that Barack Obama might have a hard time getting significant support from the Hispanic-American voting community. It might have surprised some that instead of me refuting the point, I agreed with it. I feel it would be a good idea to share with my fellow DUers why I think Obama is in an uphill battle to earn the support of Hispanics in the US. I'll try to be as brief as I can.

-To start, we need to consider first: Are there any sort of racial issues in Latin America?

The simple answer to that question is yes. Absolutely. Some quick facts: Latin America is a multi-racial, multi-ethnic region, with citizens of about 20 different nationalities and of several ethnic backgrounds, including European, African, Native American, Asian and Middle Eastern descent.So, HISPANICS ARE NOT A MONOLITHIC GROUP.

Now, since the colonial times, there has been extensive racial mixing in Latin America, primarily because of the absence of European women during the early stages of the conquest and later because of the economic marginalization of the poor, which forced people of different racial and ethnic backgrounds to form communities together.

However, this situation, that is, masses of people of mixed racial heritage, blacks, Native Americans and poor whites dominated by a small but economically powerful white elite, promoted the creation of a PIGMENTOCRACY, which is simply a scale to measure social status that uses the skin tone of the individual as it's measurement unit. The closer the individual was to "pure whiteness", the more powerful he could aspire to be, while the closer the individual was to pure "non-whiteness" the person was, the closer it was to "non-power" and for instance, exploitation and the dehumanization that of tens comes with it. Standards of power, beauty, desirability, intelligence and all sorts of social standards were measured by skin color and, subsequently, economic power. (Please understand, that not all whites in Latin America are rich, but most rich people down there have always been white).

-Now, how has pigmentocracy affected the racial relationships in Latin America?

It has affected them greatly, and I will use several examples to illustrate it. Let's take the case of my country, Puerto Rico. Puerto Ricans are the result of the co-existence and widespread mixing among Spanish colonizers, African slaves and a few surviving Native Americans. It just takes one visit to the Island to see how strong both the Spanish and African heritage are, both in the phenotypical characteristics of the people but in their cultural expressions. However, since the formation of the Puerto Rican national identity in the mid 19th century, the African heritage of Puerto Ricans has been constantly ignored or, if not ignored, rejected. In a nation in which a very significant number of people are either mulatto or black, there has never been any mulattoes or blacks in any elective position of relevance. Blacks are a very small minority in the media, non-existent in politics, almost non-existent on Puerto Rican representations of itself as a nation. Maybe the best example I can give you of how pigmentocracy lives in PR without narrating my own personal experiences as a black PR is the last Census of 2000: About 80% of the population identified as white, while 8% identified itself as black, although most scholars and demographers agreed the figures are wildly misleading. It was said a couple of days ago that it is expected for the number of people that identify themselves as black to continue dropping while the number that identify themselves as white to keep going up... although there have not been any significant changes in demographics in the last 50 years.

To make it short, keep in mind that although Mexico's mestizo and Indian population is close to 90%, the last mestizo/Indian president in recent memory was dictator Porfirio Diaz, who ruled in the late 19th century and used to put powder on his face to appear white. Most of the poor in Mexico are mestizos and Indians, while most of the elite is white, and most of them have had their fortunes for generations. In Mexico, there was a significant African presence in the colonial times, and many Mexican national heroes like Vicente Guerrero and José María Morelos were mulattoes, but that is a fact most Mexican history books prefer to ignore, just like the existing 500,000+ Afro-Mexican communities in the pacific coast of Mexico have been ignored by their government and their fellow citizens since colonial times.

Consider Colombia and its black population, the poorest in the country, most of them concentrated in the pacific coast of Colombia, with little or no access to schooling, running water, electricity and also ravaged by the guerrillas... while the money and power are concentrated in cities like Medellín and Bogotá, cities with a high concentration of Colombians of European descent.

And I could keep going and going, but by now you should get the point: RACE DOES MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN LATIN AMERICA, AND RACISM AND DISCRIMINATION DOES EXIST DOWN THERE, AND IN SOME CASES IN MORE DRAMATIC FASHION THAN IN THE US. That's our reality. That's the reality of millions of Hispanics who have migrated to the US...

That's "normal" to so many of us...

In the 2nd part of my report, I will tell you what is the political implication of this reality in Latin America, using Hugo Chavez, Leonel Fernandez and Evo Morales as examples, and finally, I will go over how that will impact how Hispanic-Americans might get to see Barack Obama... and why many wouldn't even consider voting for him.
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antiimperialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
1. I guess Latinos will choose Huckabee over Obama. What a silly argument
Edited on Sat Jan-12-08 01:23 PM by antiimperialist
Since it's a racial thing, it shouldn't matter if it's Democrat vs. Democrat or Republican vs. Democrat.

I want you to show me poll breakdowns in which Latinos support ANY white Republican over the black Obama.
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thunder rising Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Oh yeah ... me too .. Uncle Huck it is. n/t
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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. My argument doesn't rest on polls.
It rests on the how racial relations among Latin Americans, and it's adaptation to the American social landscape, might affect Obama negatively.

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Anouka Donating Member (712 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #4
25. Thank you for your post.
It's bookmarked. Good luck on your doctorate.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #1
12. Katz Wrote A Very Informative Piece...Way To Casually Dismiss It
In the instance you cited there would be a clash between party loyalty and long standing prejudices... The outcome would depend on which is stronger...

However if the candidates were of the same party ,presumably, the long standing prejudices would impact their voting choices..
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Little Star Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:26 PM
Response to Original message
3. Thank you for that insightful post. I....
am looking forward to the second part.
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Kurt_and_Hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:26 PM
Response to Original message
5. I'm confused Katz
I thought you had said once your first language was Portuguese. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Good topic. I have known a lot of Cubans, and they sure know who's black and whose "Spanish."

(When the Major Leagues were segregated circa 1900 a lot of black players started passing themselves as Cuban, playing on the fact that nobody really knew what Cuban meant as an ethnic classification, and with good reason.)
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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Hey Kurt, I'm Puerto Rican, but Portuguese is my 3rd language.
And yes, Cubans know a thing or two about those "issues", maybe more than many other Latin Americans.
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calteacherguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
7. Seems to me this is yet one more reason to vote for Obama.
Edited on Sat Jan-12-08 01:46 PM by calteacherguy
And a good argument for how his Presidency will not only change how the world views America, but also perhaps just as significantly how the rest of the world views itself and our common humanity.
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BeyondGeography Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Hopefully, that shows up in Part II
:freak:
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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. It will.
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BeyondGeography Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Great...I rec'd this piece
and I'm looking forward to the next one.
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ellacott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
11. Thank you for your insightful breakdown
Looking forward to Pt. II
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cloudythescribbler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 03:49 PM
Response to Original message
13. Very substantive, educational post; Katz's stuff usually is ...
The book LATINOS, by Earl Shorris, has a whole chapter on "Racismo" that goes into much more detail, especially regarding Mexico. No doubt there is quite an extensive literature on the subject, but for the layperson (like myself), Shorris' book is a good one for starters on this kind of thing.
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 04:04 PM
Response to Original message
14. Excellent info.
Thanks Katz!

:kick:
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
15. You were pissed at white people just days ago
How fucking dare you. Latinos are just as likely to not vote for a woman as they are to not for a black man.

I am so sick of these racist scare tactics. This is as bad as Hillary's "false hope" garbage.

You ought to be ashamed of yourself.
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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. Ashamed of myself for explaining something?
What's wrong with you?
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. This is race baiting and it's sickening
Just sickening. People, regardless of race or culture, are completely different from one to the other. I grew up in central California which has always been practically half Mexican. There are racists and not racists from every culture. Some Armenians were racist, and some weren't. It is ridiculous for you to buy into that kind of stereotyping. There are Latinos in Nevada right now working very hard for Obama. To feed into this racist shit is horrible. You know there is already a thread linking to YOUR post as a reason to not vote for Obama.
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jackson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
17. This is a racist thread. Hispanics are not any more racist than whites/blacks
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OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
19. If Hispanic voters take the time to study the issues
Edited on Sat Jan-12-08 04:41 PM by OzarkDem
and look very closely at the candidate's stand on those issues, their experience and their record - then that is what they should base their choice on.

If they choose to vote on race, well who knows what they'll end up with, and it may not be good.

Its not American Idol. Its a presidential election and middle class voters have flubbed the last 3 elections. They should really think harder about taking the issues and candidates seriously this time, not falling for every gag or publicity stunt and making a serious choice. Don't pay attention to their voice, their haircut, the style of clothes they wear, or any of those frivolous things.

If working class voters mess it up again this time, it could ruin this country and their future for a very, very long time.
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Muddy Waters Guitar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 06:54 PM
Response to Original message
20. Great post, Katz, this needs to be reposted to other Blogs
We need to combat this stupid meme about Blacks and Latinos being in conflict. Both groups have fought hard for their rights against a repressive power establishment, and both need to unite.
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AspenRose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 07:20 PM
Response to Original message
21. You know what really chaps my hide?
Watching novelas on Telemundo and seeing the dark-skinned servants...either black, mulatto or mestizo :mad:

The heroes/heroines are almost always white and have blue or green eyes.

One of my mexican-american friends in college told me about how her family reacted to her puerto rican boyfriend: "What if she marries him? The children could end up looking 'black.'" :eyes:

Oh yes, Virginia, there is *definitely* colorism in Latin America.
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MzShellG Donating Member (835 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
22. Wow Katz...
This is such an eye opener. There seems to be a world wide cast system mentality. However, I understand that in Europe, for example, Sen. Obama is very popular over the other candidates. Issues regarding history, culture, and anthropology are always intriguing to me. Thanks.
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fujiyama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 08:33 PM
Response to Original message
23. I found this to be a very interesting post
and it sheds light on the lasting consequences of colonialism in Latin America with regards to race.

My own feeling and hope is that Obama can transcend many divisions of race. He is after all mixed himself. He has not made this election about race. He has made it about unity. I think it's a compelling message to many Latinos as well. BTW, what sort of role would sexism play though? Could Hillary appeal all that well? Personally, I think she'll have a very difficult time appealing to men of all races in the general election, and am skeptical whether female turnout would be enough to offset the resentment she causes.

I think the honeymoon with the republicans was short lived and many have come back to the Dem fold. McCain and Huckabee might be a little better at appealing to Latinos though.



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Muddy Waters Guitar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-13-08 01:42 AM
Response to Reply #23
26. Outstanding history here
This is honestly one of the best courses on Latin American history I've read in a while-- I learned a lot here, Katz. Thanks so much!
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knowledgeispwr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 08:37 PM
Response to Original message
24. Great informative post!
I appreciate you taking the time to give such valuable information to the DU community. I don't understand the negative responses.

I've been studying Spanish for over 7 years (and studied in Spain for a bit) and part of what I do to keep my practice is up is to occasionally watching Spanish-language media (Univision in the US, and occasionally stream other Latin American networks on the web). I noticed a long time ago how white most of the protagonists/news anchors/politicians were compared to the "people on the street" ('gente de a pie' like the said in Spain).

One thing I heard once (that startled me) was Argentinians saying that their population of African diaspora died out because "they couldn't take the climate." That was, of course, on top of the slurs they used against their darker colored fellow Latin Americans.

Racism isn't a problem unique to the United States.
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