The Obama "attack" on Hillary (the GOP agenda)

[Essene]

Let's be honest.

The target of these talking points and making an issue out of race is Obama. The GOP wants Hillary to win the nomination because they think she's easier to beat.

It's expected to see folks on the Republican side trying to pretend he made some nasty comment and now we see what he's really made of, etc. Hillary supporters may as well take talking points from Krauthammer:

http://www.nydailynews.com/opinions/2008/01/11/2008-01-11_be_grateful_for_new_hampshire.html

"Rising rock star puts down struggling diva - an unkind cut, deeply ungracious, almost cruel, from a candidate who had the country in a swoon over his campaign of grace and uplift."

I want to SLAP any democrat who is spewing this same non-sense.

Not only didnt he attack her, but SHE THANKED HIM FOR THE COMPLIMENT.

This is so disgraceful when democrats are chewing on the same divisive talking points as Rove and Krauthammer.

Watch it objectively. He was DEFENDING her... she thanked him. The entire thing was handled with grace by both.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ac7RuzYvtCw

There is a good reason the republicans want to smear Obama... whether folks want to admit it or not.

[Skip Intro]

1. It killed him to say that to her. Obviously. Gracious it was not.

Please.

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

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[DemocratSinceBirth]

12. It Had Nothing To Do With Color

Either you're gracious or you're not...

[Essene]

13. The Clintons are most certainly making this about color as are the GOP

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SMEAR FACT CHECK:


### He's likely to get assassinated.

Yes, somebody who introduced Hillary Clinton emphasized the comparison with JFK and how he got killed. “Some people compare one of the other candidates to John F. Kennedy. But he was assassinated." The Clinton admin distanced themselves from his comments, calling them inappropriate, but the damage was done. http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/07/civilrights/

### He's no MLK.

She dissed MLK first of all, suggesting REAL change only happened because of President Johnson not MLK's dream. She then implied that he doesn't remotely compare to MLK or Kennedy. "“You know, today Senator Obama used President John F. Kennedy and Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. to criticize me. He basically compared himself to our greatest heroes because they gave great speeches." Think about what she's actually saying. Sad. http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/07/civilrights/

Think about it...

“Dr. King’s dream began to be realized when President Johnson passed the Civil Rights Act.” “It took a president to get it done.”

“You know, today Senator Obama used President John F. Kennedy and Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. to criticize me. He basically compared himself to our greatest heroes because they gave great speeches. President Kennedy was in Congress for 14 years. He was a war hero. He was a man of great accomplishments and readiness to be president. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. led a movement. He was gassed. He was beaten. He was jailed. And he gave a speech that was one of the most beautifully, profoundly important speeches ever written in America, the “I have a dream” speech. And then he worked with President Johnson to get the civil rights laws passed, because the dream couldn’t be realized until finally it was legally permissible for people of all colors and backgrounds and races and ethnicities to be accepted as citizens."

### Al qaeda will strike!!

"Look what happened in Great Britain," she said. "Tony Blair leaves, Gordon Brown comes in, the very next day, there are terrorist attacks... So you've got to be prepared on Day One with everything ready to go." Sorry, but that's a disgraceful comment, directly suggesting terrorist will strike with the election of Obama. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0801/05/cnr.06.html

### Flip flopper (abortion swiftboating)

Just watch the ABC debate from 1/5/08. She repeated this charge in various ways, although in fairness she did get into specifics in a few cases (which i think is fair game if you challenge the record itself on the issues). However, for a couple months... this has been her primary charge against him. http://abcnews.go.com/print?id=4092530

However, when they intentionally distorted his record on abortion to effectively swiftboat him in NH, that's really the kind of politics the democrats cannot afford in the primary. http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080106/NEWS01/801060396/1043

### False hope.

"An untested man who offers false hope." "We don't need to be raising the false hopes of our country about what can be delivered." Clinton herself said this. http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/Story?id=4088317&page=1 & http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2008_01/012851.php

### Obama lacks depth and reality.

"On a lot of these issues it is hard to know where he stands, and people need to ask that." "As famously was said years ago, 'Where's the beef?'" Clinton said that herself. http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/story?id=4088317&page=1

### Obama is soft on crime.

"Mandatory minimums take too much discretion away from judges." "Barack Obama's kind of change is where you sit down and you cut a deal with the corporate world." http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/story?id=4088317&page=1 & http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/04/hillary-hits-obama-for-op_n_79918.html

### Obama is just poetry.

She's been stumping with comments about how he's just talking poetry and she's ready to govern with prose. Cute. " a doer, not a talker." http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080107/ap_on_el_pr/democrats_rdp

### Obama is just a fairy tale.

Bill Clinton's rant the other day that i think shocked more than a few of us. Clinton flat out called Obama a liar, said he was a fairy tale. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLDx4NZr2u4

### Obama is in this still because of blind media.

Bill Clinton also suggested it was "wrong" that Obama has been able to get through 15 debates without being called a liar by the press. He implies the blind, uncritical media is the problem. "The press never reported on" yadda yadda. "Give me a break!" He thought Hillary was going to lose NH and was basically blaming the media for this "fairy tale." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLDx4NZr2u4

### Obama is too conservative.

They claimed he was "unwilling to take a stand on choice." His controversial gay marriage position is a legitimate issue, for sure, but they've tried to paint him as too conservative. http://tpmelectioncentral.com/2008/01/hillary_mailer_hits_obama_on_abortion.php

### Muslim (danger danger!).

Several Clinton campaign folks were removed over this. One may argue this absolves her from responsibility, yet anybody paying attention realizes this smear is arguably one of higher impact ones. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/12/10/second-clinton-volunteer-_n_76047.html

But this is only wacky emails having nothing to do with Hillary's camp! Not like Bob Kerrey and others kept this issue alive in the public dialog or anything. http://themoderatevoice.com/religion/islam/muslims/16573/clinton-support-bob-kerry-continues-to-raise-obama-muslim-issues/

### Drug record makes him unelectable.

Top Clinton advisor steps down after making various arguments about how Obama can't get elected due to his drug use. http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/politics/2004077664_obama17.html

### Male chuavanism and the gender card.

Folks may reasonably disagree on the interpretation, but she's clearly playing the gender card lately - even implied that her gender alone equates to meaningful change in the White House (just imagine the outcry if Obama said that about being black). She said that in the 1/5/08 debate. Similarly, the spin out of NH is that his comment was rude and poor Hillary's being beaten up on by the boys *tear*. That's how i intepret this spin, and it seems very clear to me. And if you question her crying about her campaign hardships, she implies THAT is male chuavanism too. http://abcnews.go.com/print?id=4092530 & http://bourbonroom.blogs.foxnews.com/2008/01/07/clintons-candid-assessment/

And additionally... i'd like to just focus on this clip from the NH Debate. She was attacked on the issue of likability. She joked that he's likable. He DEFENDED HER in return. She even says "i appreciate that," yet all the Clinton spin doctors (and Rove) are trying to pretend he attacked her. Watch for yourself and be honest. These 2 were just handling an obnoxious question with grace, but now the Clinton base is trying to turn this into a chuavanistic attack by him? Get real. Watch it. It was friendly. http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ac7RuzYvtCw

Lying about a black man's "tone" towards a white woman is easy to get away with in 2008, I guess.

### Obama is Bush 3.0

"He’s very likable . I agree with that…. You know, in 2000 we, unfortunately, ended up with a president who people said they wanted to have a beer with." “I think it’s good to have a likeable president. But if I remember right, many people said they wanted to have a beer with George W. Bush. Maybe they should’ve left it at that – have a beer, don’t vote him in as our president.” It's a slick way to deflect the likability argument, but she even tries to imply this has policy implications, electing an inexperienced guy just because he's likable.

### Obama is too liberal.

"Hillary's aides point to Obama's extremely progressive record as a community organizer, state senator and candidate for Congress, his alliances with 'left-wing' intellectuals in Chicago's Hyde Park community, and his liberal voting record on criminal defendants' rights as subjects for examination." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/01/04/new-hampshire-will-be-key_n_79873.html

### Obama just shucks and jives

Andrew Cuomo, NY Attorney General, and Clinton fan... came out swingin at Obama after NH primary. “You can’t shuck and jive at a press conference,” he added. “All those moves you can make with the press don’t work when you’re in someone’s living room.” http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0108/Dept_of_word_choice.html

### Hispanics won't vote for him

Clinton pollster Sergio Bendixen: “The Hispanic voter—and I want to say this very carefully—has not shown a lot of willingness or affinity to support black candidates.” http://thepage.time.com/2008/01/12/racial-tensions-a-potential-boost-for-clinton

[fightindonkey]

30. Baloney, Again. Keep Reaching Obamanuts. Hispanics Won't Vote For Him

Get over it.

[Skip Intro]

38. So any criticism of Obama, any call to justify his record, is racist?

You gotta be kidding me.

[Marrah_G]

17. Thank you for your concern

Somehow I doubt you had any respect for her before the day before the primary.

Stirring the flames of division....We here at DU are smarter then that and those who do it will fade away quickly, as they always do.

They are loud and dramatic, manufacturing outrage wherever they can find it. But I assure you, the intelligent, rational, long time members of DU will still be here once the "dividers" have gone the way of the dinosaurs.

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

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[Marrah_G]

22. Spamming the boards is not allowed. Enjoy your visit to DU.

[Essene]

23. yea... DU shows it's true colors. heaven forbid people see the facts

but obviously im "spamming" when i keep presenting the facts when i make my points.

[robbedvoter]

26. Neither was it worth the time and space we give it here. A small thing.

[maddiejoan]

2. It wasn't an attack

Obama merely voted "present" on Hillary's likability.

[libbygurl]

3. At this point, I don't think anyone knows who's really easier to beat by the GOP....

...but regarding this incident, it's the "enough" in Obama's comment that really offended me - like he was so puffed up with the report that he's so likable and she's not, and condescends to her, as if she were a puppy or a five-year-old. He didn't even glance in her direction. But that's the way it came off to me.

To give him the benefit of the doubt, he may have been taken aback by the idiot question, too.

I must say that a better thing she should have said was, 'This election isn't about likeability - but about experience...etc. etc.' (20//20 hindsight is so smart, I admit)

And the question was a dumb one to begin with. Why can't the level of discourse in these so-called 'debates' go beyond high school clique contests and such?

[FrenchieCat]

21. Obama was telling the truth.....Hillary is likable enough to be President....

because No.1, it is a well known fact that Hillary's biggest negative is that people think that she is "cold" (up until NH). It is impossible for Hillary to go from high negatives in Likability to "VERY" positive. And so, in fact, Obama was simply calling it "just right" saying that there is only a certain amount of "likability" required for the job that they both aspire to. To be likable enough is all that's needed.

Obama understand that this race isn't simply about being most likable (as the moderator told him that he was)...Obama understands, as well as Hillary. BUT, the winning candidate MUST BE Likable ENOUGH.

Obama is an original thinker who has good instincts and says what's on his mind. Voters who watched that debate and wanted to take it wrong, certainly could. But at the end of the day, there was no there, there....and OBama is not required to have to look at Hillary Clinton, smile a big smile while looking in her eyes, and tell her that he likes her a lot. That's the problem with those who want to interpret this incorrectly. Obama is Obama....and yet you want to judge him as being a kiss-ass calculated politician who panders. He simply isn't. Give it up! You'll find much more predictability with a candidate like Hillary, who is very much stage managed. If the media tells her in Iowa that old people standing behind her makes her look like the past...she will say...yessum, and by the time you get to NH, the crowd behind will be young people. She doesn't have an original bone in her body, and she has to look up as to what original thinkers like Obama are doing, in order for her to get it done right. It's not her fault. But it ain't Obama's neither.

[Essene]

24. exactly. he defended her from a disgraceful question and folsk are spinning it into something else

And also using it as part of a wider smear campaign.

[libbygurl]

34. No spin from here. Just saying that's just the way that comment sounded to me. And...

...I do not smear, nor have I smeared, anyone at anytime, here or elsewhere. Guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this point.

[rocktivity]

4. Turn Obama into a black candidate in order to repel the white ones.

that's the strategy.

She's attacking Obama's "colorlessness," just as Bush went after Kerry's war record.

And she's struck a gold mine with her "crying game." Notice how Krauthammer is again turning her into a female victim in order to generate pity.

And of course the Rethugs want Hillary to win. She'll be easiest to beat, and if she wins anyway, she'll be easiest to control via the DLC.

:headbang:
rocknation

[Essene]

9. Exactly, and look at all the people here buying into it...

It's sad.

It's just like the NYC Mayoral race in 2001 where the race baiting Mark Green got ahead in the primary to beat Fernando Ferrer... and lost it all for the democrats because of the low turn-out and backlash from the divisiveness.

As far as i'm concerned, the Dem party in NYC has yet to recover from that.

What the Hillary campaign is doing is PERMANENT DAMAGE to the democratic base. I cannot believe more people aren't outraged.

[fightindonkey]

31. Uh, Obama is The Easiest To Beat. No One Is Going To Vote For Him.

Except maybe 30% of the country. They're dying for Barack.

[Essene]

32. Then why are the GOP supporting Hillary?

[libbygurl]

39. Why are the Republicans crossing over to vote for Obama? nt

[rocktivity]

37. Hillary is the easiest to for the GOP to beat for the same reason why Kerry was

Of all the candidates, she has the most in common with them.

And if no one will vote for Barack, why can't Hillary beat him by more than three points?

:headbang:
rocknation

[MethuenProgressive]

5. It was said with a dismissive sneer - and gleefully echoed by his DU supporters,

"some of" his supporters, that is. The overwhelming majority of DU's Obama supporters seen better than that.

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

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[MethuenProgressive]

8. "KARL ROVE AGREES WITH YOU, SO YOU MUST BE RIGHT" Nice sneer. Where'd you learn it?

You're not helping your candidate.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Marrah_G]

16. Somehow I doubt you ever liked her- which is okay too

[Essene]

19. was a huge Bill fan and thought she was admirable.

I'd like to see Bill step in and clear this mess up, but given that the smearing is continuing... i am losing all respect for both of them.

This is so beyond the realm of acceptable politics.

It's SO disgraceful i cant fathom the lack of moral spine for those deflecting and defending it.

[Essene]

11. btw... The Truth isnt a team sport

[Marrah_G]

18. Sure she is- considering who her candidates are. She is just full of concern for our party

[ruggerson]

14. Of course she thanked him. She wasn't going to look shocked and insulted on national tv

You're very wrong if you think this wasn't a very bad moment for Barack. Many of us noticed it right here before there were any media stories about it.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[libbygurl]

40. Precisely. No one was spinning this in our household! We watched the debate!

She said thank you to be gracious about Obama's condescending offhand comment.

[robbedvoter]

25. It's a meaningless moment that didn't sway anyone, not any more than "the tears"

Not Obama's best moment, but hardly a deal breaker.
Rove was trying to capitalize on it calling it "cruel" - consider the source.
What MSM wants at this point is a good fight - 2 candidates with money (that they'll cash) damaging each other for the GE. Win win for them.

[Essene]

27. agreed on all points. but there are other ramifications

when placed in the context of the wider smearing and race baiting, it has huge implications.

i might add that she's also in danger of more gender baiting dialog, as we've already seen happen with the "iron my pants" stupidity. once you "go there" on the issues so dramatically, you open the floodgates.

these floodgates only hurt the democrats.

[robbedvoter]

28. You read it all wrong. "Iron my shirt" (not pants) was sexist - and got women steamed

This "event" is as phony as the other "events" they were trying to create.

[Essene]

29. You misunderstand my point. It's baiting into "playing the gender card"

Just like Hillary's camp is baiting the race card.

I understand perfectly fine that it was a sexist comment and what they were trying to accomplish. They were NOT merely trying to insult, but to get the media buzz going in the wake of her theatrics (yes) in New Hampshire.

She's walking a very dangerous road... and in the case of their race baiting... it's disgraceful.

[libbygurl]

41. "theatrics" in NH? How can you prove that? By merely insisting on it? That's your opinion,

and that's all it is. It isn't a fact.

[Maven]

33. She thanked him to appear gracious.

The comment he made was condescending and rude in its tone.

[indimuse]

35. I noticed that was sponsored by Face Book...Isn't Face Book Owned OR Operated by

Obama's best bud? I thought I heard that somewhere>>>>>>>>>>>>>>hmm

[annie1]

36. Her thank you was cheeky. as in "well aren't i special, you think i'm likeable".