Will Obama supporters who have used the misreported Cuomo story now apologize to Cuomo and Clinton?

[Karmadillo]

http://www.theleftcoaster.com/archives/011711.php

Rumor, Hysteria, and Reflexive Hillary-bashing

by Turkana

Yesterday, the internet went viral with claims that New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo made an odious racist remark about Senator Obama.☼ Even though Cuomo doesn't even have an official capacity with the Clinton campaign, she, once again, was held personally accountable, as if she is responsible for every person who merely supports her. Well, it turns out that Cuomo didn't actually say what he was purported to have said.

<edit>

Of course, it did go viral, as does every rumor that can be used to demonize Senator Clinton.☼ But the Times Union now offers the actual transcript of Cuomo's comments:

You know I’ve spent a lot of time in other races, especially in Iowa and in New Hampshire, back with Gore and back with Clinton. Those races require you to do something no other race does, you know, and I like it, and I agree with you, it’s a good thing. It’s not a TV-crazed race, you know, you can’t just buy your way through that race , it doesn’t work that way, it’s frankly a more demanding process. You have to get on a bus, you have to go into a diner, you have to shake hands, you have to sit down with ten people in a living room. You can’t shuck and jive at a press conference, you can’t just put off reporters, because you have real people looking at you saying answer the question, you know, and all those moves you can make with the press don’t work when you’re in someone’s living room. And I think it’s good for the candidates, I think it makes the candidates communicate in a way that works with real people because you know in a living room right away whether or not you’re communicating, and I think the questions are good and I think the scrutiny is good, so you can, you can say they’re small states and they get a lot of attention — they are very good for the process, I believe that.

In other words, he wasn't talking about Senator Obama, at all. He was talking about the game of politics, in general, and all politicians, in general. His actual comments on Senator Obama? Politico's Ben Smith offers this:

"Barack Obama is a beautiful symbol. He's a powerful speaker. He's a charismatic figure. And what he has to say is important for the Democrats," Cuomo says in the interview, with the New York Post's Fred Dicker.

Will the Obama supporters who have used this misreported story now apologize to Cuomo and Clinton? I'm guessing not. Will Senator Obama be held accountable for the despicable comments of his own campaign co-chair? I'm guessing not. This race is getting ugly, and it's going to take a great deal of effort to get people to focus on the honest facts.

end...

[sandnsea]

1. He was talking about Republicans

Cuz they're always shuckin' and jivin'.

:eyes:

[LostinVA]

2. Hmmm... interesting

[HeraldSquare212]

3. Right, the stereotype just came to his head while he was thinking about Dennis Kucinich

I don't buy that. I know the context is, he was talking about all the candidates but I think it's obvisou he was thinking of Obama. If I were supporting his opponent in a primary and I said, well, you know, sometimes candidates make you an offer you can't refuse, don't you think he would be outraged?

[aquart]

11. How many words from the African American experience are now in common speech?

If I say "Okay," am I being racist?

[HeraldSquare212]

13. How often do you hear 'shuck and jive' in conversation? nt

[bunnies]

36. Never.

I had to look it up. Slave-era rhetoric is NOT part of my vocabulary.

[Sparkly]

53. I have heard it, referring to sales pitches.

Those "shucking and jiving" were white.

[wyldwolf]

58. My teachers in grade school used it often.

[Didereaux]

27. 'Black' slang and colloquilisms permeate our everyday language. No pun, it adds color.

[2rth2pwr]

43. Your usage of "pun"...

The word pun itself is thought to be originally a contraction of the (now archaic) pundigrion. This latter term is thought to have originated from punctilious, which itself derived from the Italian puntiglio (originally meaning "a fine point"), diminutive of punto, "point", from the Latin punctus, past participle of pungere, "to prick." These etymological sources are reported in the Oxford English Dictionary, which labels them "conjecture." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pun


...could be seen as calling someone an Italian Pr*ck

[2rth2pwr]

38. Yes, because it's a reference to Oklahoma. nt

[Kucinich4America]

41. No, but if you said "OTAY"

You might be.....

[sniffa]

4. nice spin

and i'll give you a rec to send you to the GP so more can see it. :thumbsup:

[suston96]

14. Spin? What spin? He quoted the exact words which people here have misquoted....

...and turned into a racist attack on Obama.

I gotta say - are the Obama internals telling something really so bad that it has cranked up the racism brigade?

[sniffa]

18. you're really desperate

but what do i know, i'm just shucking and jiving.

[suston96]

28. Desperate? Seeing racism where there is none is real desperation.

Two African-American Congress ladies say there was nothing racist about the MLK or the fairy tale things.

Go here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Stephanie Tubbs Jones. ; Sheila Jackson Lee, comments

.........“To say that there is a pattern of racist comments coming out of the Hillary campaign is ridiculous,” said Ohio Rep. Stephanie Tubbs Jones. “All of the world knows the commitment of President Clinton and Sen. Clinton to civil rights issues — and not only the commitment in terms of words but in terms of deeds.”


Referring to the King quote, Sheila Jackson Lee, another Clinton supporter, said Clinton was trying to contrast King and Obama, not to diminish King: "It really is a question of focusing on the suggestion that you can inspire without deeds — what is well known to the child who studies Dr. King in school is that yes, he spoke, but he also moved people to action."
...............


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0108/7845.html

[sniffa]

30. um, no, that's racism

and to defend such shit, is sickening. and yes, desperate. but i'm glad you were able to trot out some black people to say it ain't so.

DU has been quite offensive lately.

[ellacott]

52. Stephanie is her national co-chair

She's going to try and spin it for her candidate.

[Joe the Revelator]

5. Keep on spinning

[Name removed]

6. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Clintonista2]

7. Chances of an Obama supporter coming in this thread to apologize?

Less than winning the lottery while being struck by lightning twice at the same time?

[aquart]

8. NEVER.

AND they will keep repeating the old, incorrect story.

[Marrah_G]

9. Divide and conquer- we always fall for it.

[David Zephyr]

10. He was clearly referring to Barack. Cuomo endorsed Hillary.

http://www.andrewcuomo.com/newsroom_details.asp?id=998

[Seabiscuit]

50. Your first sentence has already been demonstrated to be absolutely false by the OP

which contains Cuomo's actual words, which don't refer to *any* of the current candidates, but rather to campaigning in general.

Are you trying to reignite the flaming falsehoods spread earlier by the vile Obamazombies responsible for twisting and misrepresenting Cuomo's words?

[MonkeyFunk]

12. He should've said

"You can't tap dance around the questions at a press conference."

Oh wait...

[regnaD kciN]

15. If you don't think that "shuck and jive" line was a reminder that Obama was one of THOSE people...

...you're so deep in denial, you'll need to be rescued by Egyptian scuba-divers. :eyes:

Sorry, but no apology. As your candidate says about her vote to authorize the Iraq War, "get over it."

[1corona4u]

16. People see what they want to see...

they hear what they want to hear. Even if it wasn't the intended meaning. It's just paranoia if you ask me. And no, I don't suppose any of them will apologize, or even acknowledge that they were over reacting. As usual.

Eventually, our vocabulary will be so limited, so sterile, that saying HI will be seen as an accusal of being on drugs.

You just can't say anything anymore. We need a verbiage manual to apease everyone these days.

[durrrty libby]

17. No they won't. Many are small and petty. They not only perceive slights where there is none

but they see "code" in their acid trips

Don't bother to HOPE they will Change to classy individuals, anytime soon

[sniffa]

20. you add so much to DU

:thumbsup:

[durrrty libby]

21. You too

:thumbsup:

[jackson_dem]

24. Durtty Libby does

:thumbsup:

[durrrty libby]

26. Thanks JD. Back atcha

:thumbsup:

[Barack_America]

19. Nice try. The question is, would he have used that expression if a black man..

weren't in the race? We'll never know. But many journalists, politicians, etc. who have analyzed these comments say "NO".

You must remember that politicians are essentially professional speakers. They make a career out of knowing how to choose their words carefully. Are we to think that Cuomo has gotten this far in his political career without a knowledge of which terms are racially charged? Gotten this far with a habit of blurting out statements without considering them first?

You may be naive, but I am not. He knew what he was saying.

[sandnsea]

25. He's said it as many times as Hillary's cried

Why do people pretend to not know why these things happen.

[Anouka]

42. No, he would not have. n/t

[moriah]

48. Uh, yes, he would have, I think -- the term is used in politics

People who, according to Google, have been accused of "shuck and jive":

The Clintons
Scott McClellan, the former White House Press Secretary under Bush
George Allen, Republican senator
Steve Forbes (in referring to his advocacy of the flat tax)
Donald Rumsfeld
George Bush
Ronald Reagan
Al Gore
Jaime Rubin, adviser to John Kerry
Robert Beauprez, former Republican representative
Rudy Guiliani
Mike Huckabee
Alan Greenspan
Karl Rove
Tim Russert (he may not be a politician but he sure gets into politics)

and too many more for me to list.


I'm not saying that it was smart for him to say it -- but if he was stupid enough to say it, I really don't think he thought about the racial implications. I mean... think about it... if he's a Clinton supporter would he WANT his candidate to be associated with racism???

Oh, and if you really want to see offensive, check out the hit from Google for the term from Rense. Yes, it's about Obama, from March of 2007. Of course, it was Rense, a website with already notable racism against Israel. From his context, it was obvious it was about Obama and his race.


edited for typo

[moriah]

49. and to clarify...

I cannot see how the supposed "Clinton strategy" -- race baiting -- would work for a Democrat. For a Republican, maybe. But not for a Democrat, and not in a primary election.

Why?

Look at South Carolina, where half of the registered Democrats identify as African-American. Clinton's strongest support in both Iowa and New Hampshire came from registered Democrats -- Obama swept the Independents. Why alienate 50% of your prime base just to attract bigots to the polls? Even in other Southern states, like Georgia where 25% of registered Democrats are Black, that's still alienating 25% of your base who might have otherwise supported you.

Now, for Rethuglicans, the strategy might work. The Democratic party has depended on the support of the Black community, and with good results. A Rethuglican who doesn't care to attract Black voters and likely wouldn't attract them anyway would benefit from the few bigots that got motivated to go to the polls who might not have otherwise.

Hillary is depending on Super-Duper Tuesday, and most of the states in that primary are Southern, including mine. When many white Southern registered Democrats already vote Rethuglican in national elections, she NEEDS that base of support. If the "Clinton Machine" is so calculating and so dangerous, wouldn't they have thought about this???

It makes about as much sense as trickle-down economics.

[Recursion]

22. If somebody talked about candidates needing not to be "hysterical"

It would give me pause just as much as this did.

[DURHAM D]

23. I hope so.

The people pushing the race agenda do so at their own peril. The people in Iowa voted for someone they thought was a good man and would make a good President. Keep it up and the rest of the country will begin to think about the fact he is a black man first and then decide if he is worthy of the office or not. Demographics are not on Obama's side. This division is what the Republicans are hoping for.

This situation is going to tear the Democratic Party and the country apart. I am now praying that this divisive activity on all sides stops.

[Barack_America]

32. When the comments are coming from the Clinton camp, tell me..

Who exactly is pushing the "race agenda"?

Am I to hold Barack Obama responsible for comments made by Bill or Hillary Clinton or their supporters? Am I to hold Barack Obama responsible for journalists deciding to publish these remarks.

Please tell me how this has anything to do with Barack Obama.

[DURHAM D]

34. You think Clinton - I think Obama.

And who is pushing the sexist agenda - Obama. As in his Co-Fucking-Chairman Jesse Jackson Jr.

[Barack_America]

39. Wait, you think that Obama is writing Bill and Hillary Clinton's speeches?

That the Obama campaign is saying, "hey Andy Cuomo, why don't you try saying "Shuck n' Jive"?". That they are telling Hillary's staffers, "call Obama an 'imaginary hip black friend'".

You think that these things are coming from the Obama campaign and that the Clinton campaign is actually listening?

[DURHAM D]

44. No response about Jackson? Ummh.

Go read up on the Cuomo comment now that it was all been posted. Also, Cuomo is not working for the Clinton campaign.

Hip black friend - thought I read that this was un-sourced. It was not a staffer.

Jesse Jackson - I watched it spew right out of his mouth on the tv. He is the National Co-Chairman. Dig out of that.

As for you - goodbye.

[indimuse]

51. And WHERE is OBAMA'S APOLOGY RE: JJJ???

Funny how Obama's National Co-Chairman escapes criticism for the most DISGUSTNG comments on National TV and yet you people hold Hillary's feet to fire for statement she has ZERO control of. And still she is honorable enough to make public apologies for...you're a disgrace to the party!

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

29. BTW, please remember it was Ben Smith at politico who misrepresented then "amplified" the remarks.

POLITICO IS DETHPICABLE



MKJ

[Barack_America]

31. That is a very good point!

Truth be told, the Albany reporter who first blogged about them did take them out of context. But it was Ben Smith who got the ball rolling on this.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

33. politico is trying to position itself as THE online political reporting site, but it's as RW as

they come.

MKJ

[MethuenProgressive]

35. So the "outrage" was false? Knowingly false?

That's not surprising, unfortunately.

[vee]

37. What do you say about this?

You have to get on a bus, you have to go into a diner, you have to shake hands, you have to sit down with ten people in a living room. You can’t be a Miss Prissy at a press conference, you can’t just put off reporters, because you have real people looking at you saying answer the question, you know, and all those moves you can make with the press don’t work when you’re in someone’s living room.

How's that? Is this offensive?

Would Hillary supporters be upset if this is what he said? Hell yeah, and for good reason.

[jasmine621]

40. I doubt it. They are going to "Cheney" these media-hacked issues for their benefit.

To "Cheney" an issue: To continue to repeat previously proven lies and unproven and unsubstantiated allegations to fit a propaganda point...as in Iraq and Saddam were involved in 9/11.

[CyberPieHole]

45. Good luck in getting Obamanations to see the light...their love of Obama is FAITH BASED...

and not subject to facts.

:kick: and recommend

[ellacott]

54. I hate this name calling

[SIMPLYB1980]

46. Nope.

[Beacool]

47. Cuomo's words were taken out of context, but Jesse Jr.'s were not.

To those looking for "code" words at every corner, please stop with the race baiting!!! The only thing that you're doing is ticking off a lot of white people. A good friend of mine shocked me this evening by saying that if Obama's campaign is going to continue race baiting she might consider voting Republican if he were to get the nomination.

We don't need to go down the path of race and gender baiting, in the long run it'll only end up hurting all our candidates.

[ellacott]

55. We don't want to tick off the white people

It's not Obama's campaign who is pushing this. It's many African Americans who felt uncomfortable about these comments. I do agree the that Clintons are not racists and that JJJ's comments were wrong.

What many whites don't understand is that their is a huge difference in intent and perception. There have been a series of statements made that ahve been insensitive. The choice of words have been ill advised and I'm actually surprised that the Clintons, of all people, were not more sensitive to this.

[Cameron27]

56. Turkana

posted the same thing at KOS, but it was given a lot more consideration there, than it will probably receive here. The replies are interesting:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/1/11/153410/328/73/435213

[Karmadillo]

59. Thanks for the link. A nice discussion.

nt

[MethuenProgressive]

57. The Obama attempt to Swiftboat Clinton over this was successful.

No one will listen to the retraction.