So how does a tie translate to a victory?

[ClassWarrior]

Sen. Clinton has $100 million, the majority of the party establishment behind her, and advisors in the punditry (Begala and Carville), yet the best she could do in her neighbor state is a virtual tie?

Not much of a victory in my view.

NGU.

[ccpup]

1. with an opponent in Obama who came out of Iowa

with a win and a huge amount of momentum and Press Adulation as well as the Polls surging in his favor, for her to have won at all was huge. I think your Post is driven by sour grapes and an understandable disappointment that your candidate (whoever that might be) didn't win. Take heart, though. The race is far from over.

[ClassWarrior]

4. I agree, the race is far from over, and as a new DUer said last night...

...that's the best thing to happen to the Dem Party in 48 years. But no sour grapes here. Just a bit of needed perspective for the folks frothing at the mouth this morning.

NGU.

[ccpup]

8. my apologies

and thank you for the perspective

[ClassWarrior]

13. No apologies necessary.

And you're welcome.

:toast:

NGU.

[elixir]

2. I understand your disappointment but a four point spread is not a tie. Best of luck to all candidat

[ClassWarrior]

7. Not disappointed, just a little amazed that some folks are taking victory laps.

As I said above, I'm thrilled we actually have a race. A vigorous campaign means we all win.

NGU.

[FrenchieCat]

10. My, the spread has spread.......

on CNN it is at 2%, on MSNBC it is at 3%, and here it is at 4%...guess tomorrow, it will have grown even more, hey?

[Dawgs]

14. "four point spread" - The best I can find is a 2.75 point spread.

Clinton 110,550 39.58%
Obama 102,883 36.84%
Edwards 47,803 17.12%
Richardson 12,987 4.65%
Kucinich 3,845 1%
Biden 616 0%
Gravel 397 0%
Dodd 195 0%

[elixir]

15. Sorry, 2.7453 to be exact. I'll take it.

[JackORoses]

29. this is a Microcosm of Hillarism, bend reality by saying 4 pts,

then when you are disproven, say "Oh 2.75 that's the ticket, yeah!"

[DemocratSinceBirth]

3. Can People Stop This Neighboring State Crap?

New Hampshire is in New England...New Hampshire is as different from New York , culturally and demographically , as Lebanon is from Saudi Arabia...

[monarch]

5. agree n/t

[DemocratSinceBirth]

11. Ha

You're in Connecticut... I grew up in New York City...We used to call going to Connecticut going to the "country"... That's how different New Yorkers are or (think) they are from New Englanders...

[leftynyc]

16. I shook my head at the same stupid

thing. Since when is NH a neighbor of New York?

[ClassWarrior]

19. So, take that out of the equation. It's still a pretty lame "victory."

NGU.

[calimary]

21. It was certainly a narrow victory. But a victory nonetheless.

Hey, it just means the voters don't think it should end this soon. Which is more than okay by me. Besides, it gives the bad guys more time to get kicked around and dirtied up. I can get mighty excited about that!

NGU!

[ClassWarrior]

26. A Pyrrhic victory, if anything. But I'm all for having bad guys to kick around.

You know me. :evilgrin:

As I said upthread, the fact that now it's a real campaign makes all of us winners.

Haven't read your article yet, Sis. Look forward to it later.

NGU!

[leftynyc]

33. Whatever you say spanky (eom)

[sandnsea]

32. It's in the neighborhood

It helps to be able to pull in campaign workers from the region. She should have done much much better there than she did.

[Warpy]

6. Same way a last minute field goal in a tied game does

or the fact that one racehorse's nose is half an inch longer than his closest rival's.

Politics, like sports, is a human endeavor designed to produce the maximum number of losers.

[peace13]

9. It is all about the media.

They control the story and the count.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

12. she could have done a lot better but her advisers let her down

she should have swept in at Iowa and NH but she didn't. Her lead was narrow in NH. Luckily she had good ground troops in NH and her husband out there fighting for her. Her campaign should have been anticipating Obama right from the start but they didn't. She had been ill served. The scramble to attack and remodel came ALMOST too late.

It's still a 2 horse race.

[Clarkansas]

17. The media will present it as Clinton comeback. eom

[Zynx]

18. And Obama won in Iowa, a truly neighboring state.

New Hampshire doesn't share a border with New York.

[Freddie Stubbs]

20. She won when she was supposed to lose by a solid margin

[ClassWarrior]

23. By less than three points. When for more than a year we've been told that...

...she's the heir apparent.

:shrug:

NGU.

[Freddie Stubbs]

30. I guess then she must be heir apparent again

[Adelante]

22. It's not a tie. She won.

Obama came in a close second, but there is no MOE when it comes to votes as there is in a poll, so no tie; even as Edwards' lead on Hillary in Iowa, which was far smaller, was no tie. He was second there and she was third despite barely a quarter of a point difference.

[William769]

24. Not only did she win, she won going in with a negative in the double digits

The spin here is un fucking believable.

[RummyTheDummy]

25. She doesn't havre $100 million

Time magazine had a piece about her running low on cash two days ago. I'm sure that has improved with last night, but she's in no better shape than he is at this point with regard to money.

[pgh_dem]

27. it was a small victory, and good for Sen Clinton's campaign's morale I'm sure

But it was a tie in the sense that Sens Obama and Clinton were both awarded the same number of delegates from that state.

Still, the perception of *winning* this early probably has a much greater effect than the delegate numbers (even though the del. numbers are what will really count at the convention). For example, in Iowa the delegate distribution was O.14, C.13, E.12 if i recall correctly. But it was the 8% margin for Obama that made the news.

Finally, the most important thing for Sen Clinton's campaign (i'd say) would be *not* losing. They really needed to stop the momentum Sen Obama's campaign was generating, before they got to the super-Tuesday dates. This will help their fundraising, and the overall image of Sen Clinton's campaign.

[Occam Bandage]

28. Because 39>36.

[sandnsea]

31. absolute tie in delegates

You've got it right on the money. Although I'd have rather finished her off right there.

[fightindonkey]

34. Wait, Edwards and Clinton WHO WERE TIED, Now Never Were, And Obama is now tiedw wtih her

Get over it sore losers!

[ClassWarrior]

38. Show me one link where I said Edwards and Clinton weren't tied.

Just one. I'm waiting...

:eyes:

Another prime example of a Clinton defender's paranoia.

NGU.

[fightindonkey]

35. Obama LOST, No Tie

[hfojvt]

36. Factual challenge: New Hampshire does not border on New York

Plus, sometimes neighboring states just don't like each other. Just wait until that FIBber Obama comes up to Wisconsin.

[Jai4WKC08]

37. It's called the "expectations game"

Clinton was initially expected to sweep the primaries. In that sense, she is way behind.

But expectations change swiftly. After Iowa, Obama was supposed to win NH, and by the day of the primary he was expected to win with double-digits. Even if she had lost, it could have been called a win. That's what Bill did in '92. Except of course the media is not nearly so friendly (or fair) as they were back then.

From a practical standpoint, they tied, because they ended up with the same number of delegates. But by that same token, she barely lost to Obama in Iowa, since he ended with only one more delegate, and she beat Edwards, also by one.

But from a different perspective, she beat the holy crap out of him, because she shut down his momentum when everyone in the media (and many here at DU) were speculating that she might as well quit and go home. Psychologically, she turned things around in a major way and surprised the hell out of everybody.