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As an RN this is one area I hope Edwards challenges Hillary on,

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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 12:22 AM
Original message
As an RN this is one area I hope Edwards challenges Hillary on,
Edited on Sat Jan-05-08 12:45 AM by caligirl
The California Nurses Association expresses concern over Hillary and her ability to innovate reform given the deep pockets keeping her campaign funded by health insurance groups. Bottom paragraph below.

hehttp://healthnewsdigest.com/news/National_30/How_Hillary_Won_Over_the_Health-Care_Industry_printer.shtml
How Hillary Won Over the Health-Care Industry
By
Sep 17, 2007 - 3:44:19 PM
(HealthNewsDigest.com) - Sept. 17, 2007 - They were an army of two: Harry and Louise, those middle-aged, middle-class icons, frustrated that the government was limiting their health-care coverage. There they sat at their kitchen table, bills strewn before them, an adding machine at hand, despair in their souls. Bureaucrats were taking away their freedom—especially one named Hillary Clinton.

Cooked up in 1993 by the health-care-insurance lobby, Harry and Louise starred in a series of ads critical of the then-first lady’s dramatic plan to overhaul the U.S. health-care system. Her proposal for universal coverage actually kept private insurers in place, but she favored strict regulation—including price caps on insurance premiums. And she wasn’t going to compromise, not with the insurance companies, not with Congress, not with doctors. So Harry and Louise fired back, spooking Americans with their veiled references to socialized medicine. The fictional pair triumphed in 1994, helping to sink the 1,342-page bill—a centerpiece of her husband Bill Clinton’s first term.

Fast-forward 13 years. Hillary has announced a new plan for universal health-care coverage—a plan she hopes will help propel her to the Democratic presidential nomination in 2008. Surprisingly, her past health-care flop has become a significant political asset. Sixty-five percent of all voters—and 91 percent of Democrats—are confident that she would do the right thing for the health-care system, according to a Gallup poll released in July. And the captains of the health-care industry who once viewed her as the root of all evil are now filling the coffers of her campaign. (Her proposal calls for mandatory participation, which the industry tends to favor.

But insurance companies will also be required not to turn anyone away for pre-existing conditions under Clinton’s new plan.) As of the first quarter of 2007 she was the recipient of more health-care-industry donations than any presidential candidate—Democrat or Republican—according to a recent study by the Institute for Health and Socio-Economic Policy. Even Charles Kahn, who, as executive vice president of the Health Insurance Association of America, orchestrated the Harry and Louise ad campaign, is hopeful that a President Hillary Clinton would tackle health-care reform again. “She knows a lot about health care, she’s interested, she can speak the language. It’s a natural constituency,” says Kahn, who is now president of the Federation of American Hospitals and says he met with her just a few months ago to talk about the issue.

How did the woman once demonized by the industry—whose plan was derided as “Hillary-care”—become so popular in these parts?

For starters, it’s a matter of realpolitik. As the leading Democratic contender running at a time of sagging GOP popularity, she’s a good bet to win the White House. Health-care companies naturally want a seat at the winner’s table, regardless of who it is. “These kinds of contributions in general follow power and influence, and these groups recognize that Sen. Clinton is a serious candidate to be the next president,” says Fred Wertheimer, president of Democracy 21, a campaign-finance watchdog group. “They are interested in gaining access to people in power of all ideologies in both parties.”

But Clinton has worked to change her unyielding ways. Her effort in the early 1990s was doomed in part by her rigid, aggressive approach; she now says she’s learned from that experience. She frequently talks about how she now understands that change must be incremental and that cooperation is the only way to get anything done. People in the industry have noticed the difference. “In 1993 we had meetings with Ira Magaziner, but he turned his hearing aid off. There was no negotiation, no give and take,” says Kahn. But she has a more open approach now. She’s doing all the right things. She’s talking to people, listening to people. She says, ‘I’ve learned a lot.’ All one can do is take her at her word.”

She has also worked hard to win her former critics over—soliciting their views and taking their advice. In July she invited several prominent health-care-industry officials to meet with her and members of her campaign and legislative staff, says Dr. Bruce Bagley of the American Academy of Family Physicians, who was one of the attendees. Bagley noted how different things seemed. “Back in ’93 it was a fairly closed process. It seemed like this big black box that finally came up with a plan,” he says. This time she asked the group what her health-care quality message should be—and spent two hours listening to their ideas, key elements of which ended up in a health-care speech she subsequently delivered in New Hampshire. “For the most part, it was consistent with what we were trying to promote,” he says of the speech. After the meeting Bagley got a personally signed thank-you note from the senator. And after the speech he got a hand-written note on her own stationery thanking him for having vetted her remarks beforehand. “As you know, improving the quality of health care that patients receive is fundamental to a reformed healthcare system, and I am committed to ensuring it as part of my agenda for covering all Americans,” Clinton wrote. Bagley says hasn’t heard from any of the other presidential candidates.

The American Medical Association also reports a warming trend. The group was frustrated by how she handled the process in ’93 but now finds her staff regularly reaching out to consult. In a speech she gave to the AMA in early 2006, the group was pleasantly surprised to hear her give voice to many of its top priorities. “Physicians should have a payment …” she said, before being interrupted by thundering applause. “Physicians should have a payment structure that doesn’t result in year after year of significant and unsustainable cuts when we all know health-care costs are increasing.” Fighting cuts in Medicare payments was a priority for the AMA in 2006 and remains so today.

But Clinton isn’t just talking the talk. Health-care groups say they have been encouraged by her work in the Senate—where she’s taken a more restrained and incremental approach. In the ’90s she thought she could elbow past members of Congress. But since becoming one herself, she has made a point of joining forces with Republicans on health-care issues. Together they’ve worked to expand coverage for veterans and children, as well as to modernize the system with electronic, rather than paper, medical records. Her former foes in the industry have taken note. “Since becoming a senator, she’s been focused on quality improvement, safety improvement, comparative effective analysis. We support all of that,” says Karen Ignagni, CEO of American Health Insurance Plans, the health-insurance industry trade group. This year AHIP, whose lobbyists are in constant contact with Clinton’s staff, put forward its own plan for universal coverage, which Ignagni says got a positive response from the senator’s office.

She’s made nice with the pharmaceutical industry, too. Big Pharma’s lobbyists are constantly engaged with her staff, as they are with other members of Congress. “Hillary recognizes the important role of employer-provided health insurance and the important role of private markets in insuring the people in the country,” says Billy Tauzin, the president of PhRMA (the Pharmaceutical Research and Manufacturers of America, a trade group for the industry), who voted against her first plan when he was a member of Congress. “I take comfort in that.”

Clinton has also benefited from a growing public appetite for reform. There are now 47 million people without health insurance in America, compared to 40 million in 1993. Those who are covered have seen their insurance premiums double. Voters are now much more anxious—and better informed—about health care, making it a potent issue in the coming election. “In the 1990s, when Hillary first came out with the plan, the average Joe thought, ‘I’ll always get health care.’ Right now there’s scarcity,” says Mary Kate Scott, of Scott & Co., which does health-care consulting. “We actually feel the pain.”

The industry does too. In the last decade and a half, its own costs have ballooned, and the legions of uninsured people are an ever-increasing burden on the system. Health-care groups say they’re now looking for solutions, and ready to talk. “The sun and moon have aligned,” says Kahn. Adds Mike Bromberg, a lobbyist who helped kill the Clinton plan in the early 1990s: “There’s a shift in the health community. There are more people in health care who don’t seem as concerned about government program expansion anymore. When they’re facing bad debts and all the uninsured patients, they’d rather have something than nothing.”

But there’s a downside to her careful courtship of the industry. Her chief rivals for the Democratic nomination, Barack Obama and John Edwards, have repeatedly blasted her for accepting contributions from federal lobbyists. (On the GOP side, Rudy Giuliani and Fred Thompson have tried a different tack, sounding the “socialized medicine” bell, in a not-so-veiled attempt to scare voters about Hillary’s intentions.) She’s raised more money directly from lobbyists—including those representing health-care interests—and their families than any other presidential candidate, according to the Center for Responsive Politics. While she’s been challenged by Edwards not to accept lobbyist cash, she’s attended fund-raisers hosted by lobbyists themselves, including a $1,000-a-plate event last month in Chicago, according to ABC News. Clinton defended herself at this summers YearlyKos convention, where liberal bloggers both applauded and booed her. “A lot of those lobbyists, whether you like it or not, represent real Americans,” she said. “The idea that somehow a contribution is going to influence you—I just ask you to look at my record.”

But some consumer groups aren’t convinced. They look at the healthy contributions she’s received from health-care groups and wonder how far into the industry’s pocket she’s climbed. “There’s nobody in this race with her knowledge to make health care available to every American at a cheaper cost, but it would take going after the insurance industry that’s funding her candidacy,” say Jamie Court, president of consumerwatchdog.org. “I don’t know if there was a smoky back room, but her positions are certainly not threatening her cash stream, and their cash stream is helping her maintain her position as a front runner. In politics there aren’t too many coincidences.” Phil Singer, a spokesman for the Clinton campaign responds: “Reaching out, talking to and listening to the stakeholders is how you make change. Americans from all walks have a stake in seeing a better health-care system.”

The nurses’ union is equally glum about the chances for real reform. “Given how much money she’s gotten from the industry, the room for innovation is very limited,” says Michael Lighty, director of public policy for the California Nurses Association/National Nurses Organizing Committee, whose research arm conducted the health-care-donations study. “You either have to take on the stakeholders or you have to accommodate them. She is likely to accommodate all the major ones, certainly all the ones with deep pockets.” That’s a charge Harry and Louise would never have seen coming.

With Karen Springen, Eleanor Clift, Richard Wolffe, and Roya Wolverson

www.HealthNewsDigest.com

© Copyright by HealthNewsDigest.com
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 12:31 AM
Response to Original message
1. I don't understand what "mandatory participation" is...
I wish someone could explain it better to me.

I mean, how can you mandate that poor people--who don't have enough money for food or heating
bills--spend money to get into a health-care plan?

You can say you have a plan to put a new Lexus in every driveway, and make it mandatory.
However, that doesn't mean that a family of four at the poverty level is going to have
the means to purchase that Lexus.

What happens if you can can't afford the mandatory insurance, and you're hurt and you
go to the hospital. Does the doctor not treat you, or do they call the police?

Can someone explain the plan or direct us to a good site that may explain these things?
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 12:40 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. I don't think this works, the only way to do this is single payer, getting
insurance industry out. This is why they jumped on the Clinton band wagon so that they aren't left in the cold, seeing a tidal wave coming they are trying to save their cash cow.
But some would subsidize for the poor with taxes on hospitals or business(GOP will have a field day with that one).
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 12:33 AM
Response to Original message
2. Obama's "health care industry" contributions are quite large - but neither Hill or O is on the take
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 12:43 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. no one is saying they are, reading into this a bit. Accepting money from
the very group that will have to give up the golden egg is not a recipe for success for the patient. As a patient advocate I cannot stand by and watch the single greatest opportunity for single payer get thrown away.
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 12:46 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. In that case we need to get Hill/Edwards/Obama to put into writing and sign a guarantee that
they will never bargain away the "Medicare like policy option" that is in their plans.

Indeed that would let me sleep better! :-)
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. caligirl...I appreciate your opinion...
..and what you have to say.

I really need to read up on this issue.

I have a few key issues on which I made my choice of candidates, and I have to say
that health care isn't one issue that I've studied a great deal. However, I know
it's important and I want to learn more.

Can you tell me...is "single payer" the same type of universal coverage that most
nations have?

I do wonder about all of the money from insurance/health care/big pharma going to our
candidates. Either they're paying off candidates to keep the status quo or they want
to be in on the deals and make major bucks off of any changes in healthcare that may happen.

We all saw what big-pharma money to the candidates got them--a nice big payout from Bush's
medicaid bill. If I'm understanding correctly, part of this government plan was that
the govt couldn't negotiate lower drug prices. They had to take the prices that the
drug companies set. How that ever happened is just so....it's beyond words!

Again, I need to research this more...
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 01:01 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. yes its the same. single payer is what I call what European nations have.
Obama has a problem with his plan to. I am about to post an ad run in Iowa by the CNA that addresses Obama's insufficient plan.
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 01:11 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. Really...
I'm an Obama supporter and I am interested in what you have to say...

I have three hot issues that I was most concerned about, and I picked
Obama based on those issues.

It's my understanding that he would make health-care more affordable...decreasing
premiums significantly for low-income earners, but that all children are covered.

I do not like it at all when I see the healthcare-related monies going to candidates.
Nothing is free.

Again, thanks for your insight.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. This organization of Physicians for National Health program has a great critique of them all.
Edited on Sat Jan-05-08 02:26 AM by caligirl
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 01:37 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. So, which candidate do you believe...
...has the best plan?
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:07 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. I think there are problems with all of them, Hil's is the worst. I
like Edwards better but not 100%. I think he will do the best job toward covering everyone and getting private insurance industry interests out of the way. Obama and Hilary both have plans that allow them to remain in the problem. (and they have taken the most $$ from them).
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 07:17 AM
Response to Reply #7
18. European nations have a variety of plans
They aren't all Canadian style single payer. Some have monthly premiums. France's pays 70%. They're all different. I wish we could have an honest discussion about the different plans because I really don't know which is best. Canada doesn't cover prescription drugs and I am paying over $100 a month and most of them are $4 Walmart drugs. Englands prescriptions are very cheap though. So I'd like to get all the facts, but you never can around here.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 01:56 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. These videos helped me understand the issue a liitle more
and there is a second part you will see on the right side of the below link.

HR 676 Conyers/Kucinich bill would be closer to the Canadian system in that it will not allow private insurance companies to compete with the public system coverage.

Kucinich Health-Care Program Part-1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjA3CV95i4


On the mandates

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2007_11/012605.php

THE EDWARDS MANDATE....Both John Edwards and Hillary Clinton include "individual mandates" in their healthcare plans that require everyone in the country to sign up for coverage. But what if you refuse to sign up anyway? Today, John Edwards explained how his plan would deal with that:

Under the Edwards plan, when Americans file their income taxes, they would be required to submit a letter from an insurance provider confirming coverage for themselves and their dependents.

If someone did not submit proof of coverage, the Internal Revenue Service would notify a newly established regional or state-based health-care agency would enroll the individual into the lowest cost health-care plan available in that area....The newly covered individual would not only have access to health benefits but would also be responsible for making monthly payments with the help of a tax credit.

....If a person did not meet his or her monthly financial obligation for a set period of time (perhaps a year, perhaps longer) the Edwards plan would empower the federal government to garnish an individual's wages for purposes of collecting "back premiums with interest and collection costs."


http://www.johnedwards.com/news/press-releases/20071128-health-care-mandate/

"...Families who lose coverage will be expected to enroll in another plan or be assigned one. For the few people who refuse to pay, the government will help collect back premiums with interest and collection costs by using tools like the ones it uses for student loans and taxes, including collection agencies and wage garnishment."






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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:02 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. I don't like this either. What i did think I liked about Edwards was that
he would put the private insurance companies in the position of having to compete for business against the public ones, with the aim of driving the private ones out of business.
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cynthia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. The way Edwards explained to one woman in the audience is
that everyone would be covered by their employer - that is what is required. If you are unemployed, you would get Medicare. Everyone would get to choose the government program or the private health insurance, and that is where the private companies would have to compete with the government program.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:20 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. thanks.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:35 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. There are so many pieces to the Edwards and Clinton plans
that I feel they would be hard to implement and pass through Congress, there are just too many moving parts. And I do not want to see my tax dollars, in the form of tax credits to some people, being spent to buy private insurance. That might be something I would urge my representatives not to support.

:shrug:

Although I would be happy to see more of my tax dollars go to a single-payer system where the insurance companies are not making a profit and everyone had equal access.



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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 03:35 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. I would support that as well. Why aren't they getting it?
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. I do not know, there are probably a variety of reasons and
excuses.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 07:19 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. You would rather I lose my health care
then see an insurance company get money?
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Why should my tax dollars be used to prop up the bottom line
of insurance companies? There is a possibility that I might not support a plan if it appeared that too much money would be channeled into insurance company profits.

I would like to see everyone covered under a single-payer system and that is one reason I am supporting the candidate who would work towards that goal.

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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. And if that never happens, then what?
Republicans have a hissy fit if a poor person gets a dime too much. The left has a hissy fit if an insurance company gets a dime, but seems to forget all the other business entities in the health care delivery chain. In the mean time, people die. Good job.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. It will never happen if we do not have someone who will be a
true advocate for a single-payer system. So while we play around with trying to keep the insurance companies in the system people will die :(
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:48 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. There are advocates for single payer
People reject it. Repeatedly. I would really like to lay all the dead people at the feet of the left and make you guys take just as much responsibility as you put on Repubicans. It's just fucking money. Who cares where it goes. If people get to see the doctor and get treatment, that's all that matters. If subsidized insurance will pass, then for chrissake pass it.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Or you could back a candidate who would use bully pulpit to
Edited on Sat Jan-05-08 03:33 PM by slipslidingaway
advocate for a single-payer system.


"...It's just fucking money. Who cares where it goes. If people get to see the doctor and get treatment, that's all that matters."


Money does not come easy in my family so I care where it goes. If you do not mind paying extra to keep the insurance companies in the system that can be your choice, it does not have to be mine.


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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Do you think people don't know what single payer is?
Do you seriously think that's the problem? How long are you going to make people wait until the brainwashing of Reaganism is erased? That's what you're talking about. Making people wait years, maybe decades, while the entire premise of capitalism and free enterprise is fought.

What difference does it make if your money is going to an insurance company or GE for an MRI machine or a multi-millionaire doctor? They are all part of the 1%. We're never going to get rid of them. They'll just find another way to pick your pocket.

I just want every person to be able to see the doctor as quickly as possible.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Yes, I think many people do not understand HR 676 and the
system that is being proposed.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. When the military went to Tricare
And closed many small clinics, did you hear an outcry? Or were most in the military quite happy because they didn't have to deal with military hospitals anymore? Have you ever had to deal with some of the larger military hospitals where you're nothing more than a piece of meat shoved through the system? A lot of people have and after they go through that, or a VA hospital, they don't want anything to do with government being involved in health care. That's what you're up against. You are never going to get this country to give up what they have for the risk of that kind of system. It's just not going to happen.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. I have, Tripler army Hospital Hawaii, lost my blood work three times. I did
Edited on Sat Jan-05-08 06:12 PM by caligirl
get champused out to deliver both my babies on the windward side of the island. I just couldn't imagine being in full labor and trying to drive the Pali or Likelike hwy to Tripler. Single payer insurance is not government clinics.Not like Tripler. The providers are as they are now. In the case of rural areas that have great difficulty in getting medical care at all, if you had to choose between no care and a government clinic what would they choose then? This is more like Kaiser than Balboa Naval Hospital. They are talking about this being more like Medicare not the VA system. If 90% of patients have medicare, don't they have to accept it? Tricare may be similar in reimbursements to medicare, point being that if you like Tricare and its run alot like Medicare then your going to like single payer health care.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #32
35. A govt clinic over nothing isn't the choice for 90%
It's the risk of that kind of health care that people worry about if all payment and approval is run through the government. It's the gradual eroding of care.

Oregon has govt administrated health districts. There is one care provider in my town in order to cut costs associated with duplication of x-rays, labs, etc. Larger cities have a little bit of choice, I really don't. In order to change doctors, I have to go through a committee. I am really not the one to try to convince that there will be limited govt interference as we transitional to universal coverage because I know better.

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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. If all the doctors(outside the one you can see)are on the same plan then
Edited on Sat Jan-05-08 09:19 PM by caligirl
you can see any of them. don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Look at Sweden and France. why do Sweden's people live much longer than we do? They are happy with the program they have. Its on a huge scale compared to what the system is on that your unhappy with. The system your dealing with is not adequately funded from the sound of it. If an entire state is on say the Edwards plan they have to have more providers available. If I had the HMO(pacificare is one I use to have)I would have similar problems like what you have described. As it is I have Aetna ppo and last year we were hit with heavy copays due to unexpected surgery and emergency transport costs to say nothing of costs for diabetic needs of my child. Even with the good income we earn in Silicon Valley we found ourselves floored at the bills we paid even with very good coverage. I would happily give up some of my options to know I have the security I felt was threatened last year. Especially as we feel we must always be on guard for our childs health costs(several hundred a month maintenance for juvenile diabetes supplies) for a very long time to come. We may be looking at this again soon as I go for more tests next week. Ugh I hate getting older.(Turned 50 last year and I seem to be breaking apart in places)

I think I understand your perspective and its based on some bad experiences. I don't think it should be dismissed. I think it should be shared so we avoid the pitfalls Oregon is having. I don't think it will be like this though.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #30
33. But a single-payer system does not mean that the hospitals
will be run by the government. Is that what you are saying here when speaking of military and VA hospitals???
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 07:48 PM
Response to Reply #33
36. But that's the concern people have
That's why they don't want a system that's 100% dependent on govt administration.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #36
38. I do not understand why you speak of a single-payer system
and government run hospitals, that is not what is being proposed in HR 676.
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K Gardner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
21. As an RN and a member of CNA/NNOC, I heartily agree. Thanks for posting this !
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #21
34. Your very welcome, I was a member when I worked at Kaiser. Love
Edited on Sat Jan-05-08 06:26 PM by caligirl
the new CheneyCare campaign, its the best!
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THUNDER HANDS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 03:34 PM
Response to Original message
27. my mom is an RN
nurses rock!
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-05-08 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #27
31. If a nurse is anything, he/she is the strongest patient advocate and the one
with no agenda outside of safe patient care and the health needs of people. I am not sure I see Hilary talking to them and this worries me greatly. They should have a seat at the table, it appears they don't.
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