How the Candidates Did on the 'Pakistan Test'

[wyldwolf]

Democrat John Edwards, passed with flying colors. Another, Republican Mike Huckabee, flunked abysmally. Democrat Hillary Clinton and Republican John McCain were serious and substantive; Republicans Mitt Romney and Rudy Giuliani were thin. And Barack Obama -- the Democratic candidate who claims to represent a new, more elevated brand of politics -- committed an ugly foul.

Let's start with Mr. Edwards, who managed not only to get Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf on the phone Thursday but also to deliver a strong message. The candidate said he had encouraged Mr. Musharraf "to continue on the path to democratization to allow international investigators to come in and determine what happened, what the facts were." Those are words the Pakistani president needs to hear from as many Americans as possible...

Ms. Clinton and Mr. McCain also endorsed Pakistan's continued democratization. Each cited an acquaintance with Ms. Bhutto or Mr. Musharraf and opportunistically trumpeted their foreign policy experience -- but both also offered some cogent analysis. Ms. Clinton rightly cited "the failure of the Musharraf regime either to deal with terrorism or to build democracy," adding that "it's time that the United States sided with civil society in Pakistan."

... Mr. Obama... began by offering bland condolences to Pakistanis and noting that "I've been saying for some time that we've got a very big problem there."

Then Mr. Obama committed his foul -- a far-fetched attempt to connect the killing of Ms. Bhutto with Ms. Clinton's vote on the war in Iraq. After the candidate made the debatable assertion that the Iraq invasion strengthened al-Qaeda in Pakistan, his spokesman, David Axelrod, said Ms. Clinton "was a strong supporter of the war in Iraq, which we would submit was one of the reasons why we were diverted from Afghanistan, Pakistan and al-Qaeda, who may have been players in the event today."

When questioned later about his spokesman's remarks, Mr. Obama stiffly defended them -- while still failing to offer any substantive response to the ongoing crisis. Is this Mr. Obama's way of rejecting "the same Washington game" he lambasted earlier in the day? If so, his game doesn't look very new, or attractive.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/12/28/AR2007122802445.html

[rodeodance]

1. score one for Edwards on foreign policy, clinton a half point, Obama=F

[wyldwolf]

2. Edwards, A+, Clinton A, Obama F

[DemocratSinceBirth]

5. Despicable

Obama and Axelrod suggested Hillary is responsible for the death of her friend...

Despicable...

[Tellurian]

15. Clinton A+ ..Edwards C- ..Obama (has not completed req for Dem presidents)

sorry..I'm a hard marker when digesting statements made by candidates running for the Dem Nominee..

Although Biden isn't in the Top Tier of candidates. I would give him an A++

[Clintonista2]

17. LOL!

[DemocratSinceBirth]

34. .

~

[Madam Mossfern]

22. Oh, you're just an Edwards hater.

:sarcasm:

[mrreowwr_kittty]

19. What's despicable is people like you spreading that lie.

Show me where Axelrod said Clinton is responsible for Bhutto's death.

You can't, so stop lying.

[Tellurian]

26. Shhhh! Obama has instructed his bots "not" to repeat the allegation

in public again...

However, just between us..this just came across Yahoo. Do look into the right hand corner of the site.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/12/28/clinton.obama/index.html?iref=newssearch#cnnSTCVideo

[rAVES]

3. I had no Idea that this incident was just a live fire exercise for the U.S presidential hopefuls..

Ms Bhutto's body is hardly cold yet. no fucking shame.

[Catchawave]

11. Guess your candidate didn't do so hot?

Everyday is a live fire exercise for a President. Look at Bush and Katrina, were those bodies cold enough for you?

[rAVES]

16. Well Clinton got an A for spewing some Bushian rubbish, I cant exactly take the results that serious

[ArkySue]

29. Bushian rubbish??

Got some quotes or links to back that up? Did you even listen to what she said? I did. Nothing "Bushian" about it.

[rAVES]

32. Political pap.. no quotes required.

[skipos]

4. BIDEN is the only one who gets an A, imo. nt

[MethuenProgressive]

6. WaPo ignores the BEST candidate response:

Richardson Says Pakistan's Future Depends on Renewed Commitment to Democracy
Discusses Pakistani crisis and other global threats, calls for new direction in American foreign policy
DES MOINES, IA-- Following the assassination of Pakistani Peoples Party leader and former Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto yesterday, New Mexico Governor and Democratic Presidential candidate Bill Richardson called for the United States to cut off all military aid to Pakistan not directly related to fighting terrorism until Pervez Musharraf resigns in a major policy speech today in Des Moines, Iowa.

"President Bush should immediately suspend non-terrorism related military aid to Pakistan until President Musharraf resigns," Richardson said. "Today, as a nation, I am calling on the Bush administration to stand firm for our ideals in the face of terrorism and in respect for the ideals that Benazir Bhutto stood for. Anything less would send a dangerous signal to the world that terrorism alters our resolve.

"When Musharraf declared martial law, we could have stood up. But we did not. When he suspended the Constitution, we could have stood up. But we did not. Now after yesterday's terrible murder, the United States must stand up."

To read Governor Richardson's speech, click here: http://www.richardsonforpresident.com/newsroom/speeches?
Richardson honored the memory of Bhutto and called for a return to principle in American foreign policy.

"Benazir Bhutto could have chosen to live a life of comfort in exile," Richardson said. "Instead, she risked her life for the things that she believed in. The principles of democracy. The dignity of human beings. These were her ideals. These are our ideals.

"We have subsidized oppression for too long and the costs have not only been paid in dollars. We have paid with our security. We have paid with the safety of American lives. Our principles are the backbone of our security. They give us direction. They bring us allies. They make us strong."

Richardson contrasted his extensive foreign policy experience with that of his opponents in the race.

"I have represented America around the world: in refugee camps, in prisons run by dictators, and in the midst of civil wars," Richardson said. "And I have learned that people often are sustained and moved by little more than an unshakeable belief in the principles of democracy and the dignity of human beings.

"Some of my Democratic opponents have misplaced faith in Musharraf. Like the Bush administration, they cling to a misguided notion that Musharraf can be trusted as an ally to fight terrorism or to change his despotic ways. Despite their faith, Musharraf has thumbed his nose at America again and again. How many times does the Washington conventional wisdom need to be proven tragically wrong before Washington insiders give up on it?

"Musharraf must step aside now and allow a multiparty caretaker coalition to lead the country until free and fair elections are held."
--------------
Bravo, Bill Richardson!

[JNelson6563]

25. Good statement

It really is a shame Richardson is so utterly ignored by the corporate media.

Julie

[dajoki]

30. Very good for Richardson...

He is not my choice, but kudos to him for a very well thought out and sincere response. If he happens to win the primary I will be happy to do what I can to help him get elected.

[Clark2008]

7. Edwards and foreign policy...

:rofl:

[Catchawave]

10. This op-ed is just killing you, isn't it ?

:eyes:

[dajoki]

31. What do you find so funny?

The assination of a foreign leader? Edwards' appropriate conversation with Musharef? Or just the entire election? :shrug:

[durrrty libby]

8. Obama exposed his newbie butt. No one was impressed

[Alamom]

12. "You, get an A +".

[Froward69]

9. Not to mention Joe Biden

who has been warning us for months... Joe Biden A++
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWZm_puicBQ first on Pakistan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9ZyZCsRJyM&feature=user early Dec on Pakistan

then acted the most statesman like of them all!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20w_km9lQCY Biden on Bhutto assassination
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRfAjxivRgM Pakistan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgjftzwvrKw Pakistan
on edit
and then theirs this from today...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/video/2007/12/28/VI2007122801823.html


all the rest are immatures...

[iamjoy]

13. Yeah, Obama Fumbled

The thing is, he has a point about the mess in Iraq taking our eye off of the ball. But doing it in such a crass way so soon after the tragic event was so obviously a political manipulation. This is a common mistake that Democrats make more than Republicans. They have a good point, but it's not the kind of thing that can be condensed into the sound bites that get play time. Rather than waiting for the right moment and forum to make that point, they bring it up at a time it is sure to be taken out of context.

Furthermore, singling out Clinton for blame when a lot of other people supported the IWR is completely unfair and only adds to the perception that Obama's remarks were for political gain. All of the presidential candidates who were senators at the time of the IWR voted for it. With the exception of Kucinich (in the House) none of the candidates voted against it. Oh sure, Richardson and Obama opposed it, but that's not the same thing.

[Tellurian]

14. Unfortunately, Barack Obama seems to be in crisis not only with his identity

as Kennedyesque, Lincolnesque, MLK, JFK and all the rest of the Obama dogma, but whether he is a Republican or a Democrat. Obama has again used the opportunity of Mrs. Bhutto's death to once again undermine Sen Clinton's position calling for an Independent investigation into the assassination of Mrs Bhutto.

Sen Clinton has outlined a solid proposal along the lines of what the United Nations has been doing with respect to the assassination of Prime Minister Hariri in Lebanon and advocates adding other independent International agencies such as Interpol and the use of our own FBI investigative powers to keep the US in the informational loop.

Obama announced, he does not share Sen Clinton's rational view of getting to the bottom of an investigation determining who committed the murder of Mrs Bhutto and/or provide questions relating to: Why was the Bush Administration's Condi Rice involved in arranging Mrs Bhuttos' return to Pakistan?

Instead, Obama said: “It is important to us to not give the idea that Pakistan is unable to handle its own affairs,” I ask you; How Bush-like is that statement? Does Obama ever offer concrete solution to problems relating to Domestic and Foreign affairs?

Instead Obama is falling back on his previous statement of proudly advocating a public policy of an attack on Pakistan by U.S. armed forces to root out “terrorists” if President Musharraf “won’t act”. But Obama opposes an investigation of Bhutto’s assassination. I take Obama's statements as saying, we shouldn't ask any questions, just sit back and let the Pakistani's work it out. If that is the case, why would Obama advocate militery action against Musharref without know ALL the facts?

"Let’s repeat: Obama is advocating a public policy of military attack on Pakistan, but an “independent, international investigation into Bhutto’s death” Obama perceives as somehow unfair to Pakistan.

This is sounding more and more like Obama is aiding and abetting a cover up for an implied indirect or direct involvement of the Bush Administration into Mrs Bhutto's death. And as I said before, is Obama in another crisis protecting the Neocons when in fact he's running for president as a Democrat but is intentionally denigrating democrats and progressives?

[Tellurian]

20. Hillary's applied pressure to the Bush Administration for an investigation..

Has the Bush Administration scampering for answers..


Hillary Clinton wants international probe into Bhutto's assassination

Saturday December 29, 2009

Islamabad, Dec 29 (ANI): US democratic presidential hopeful, Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton, has said that the US should call for an independent investigation into Benazir Bhutto's assassination.

"I don't think the Pakistani government at this time under Musharraf has any credibility at all," she told CNN in an interview.

Hillary suggested that an investigation along the lines of the ongoing international inquiry into the assassination of the former Lebanese prime minister Rafik Hariri.

President Pervez Musharraf and his supporters in the Bush Administration were coming under heavy pressure, inside and outside Pakistan, for an independent investigation into Benazir Bhutto's assassination.

Meanwhile, US State Department officials have said that they had no plans for the moment to join the investigation.

The New York Times quoted a senior Bush Administration official as saying that, "There's a growing sense that we're going to have to work on the investigation in some way, that it can't just be a Pakistani investigation."

Speaking on the condition of anonymity, he said that the Bush Administration officials were concerned that "there's so much distrust" of the Musharraf regime among Pakistanis that outside nations may have to join the investigation to give the findings any credibility.

A second US official said the idea of an independent international investigation had been proposed by "a number of people, and is certainly something that hasn't been ruled out."

The distrust of Pakistan's Government among Bhutto's supporters runs strong and they may not readily accept the government's effort to place responsibility for the assassination on al Qaeda-linked militants.

http://in.news.yahoo.com/071229/139/6ozim.html

***********

No mention yet of Barack Obama's opposition to an investigation...Interesting time to compare and contrast presidential hopefuls ideas of how we want the next president to run the country. Do we want to just "change" faces? Or do we want an "agent of Change" that really will do things differently?

[mrreowwr_kittty]

18. Funny, I thought it was the tragic murder of a world leader. I had no idea it was a test.

Thanks WaPo, for offering further proof of your irrelevance.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

21. Is WAPO Irrelevant?

WAPO and the NYT can still drive the media agenda... Many people attribute Rudi's decline in the nat'l polls to their exposes of his perfidy as mayor...

[mrreowwr_kittty]

23. Relevant in terms of driving agendas, yes.

Relevant in terms of journalistic accuracy and integrity, no.

[CyberPieHole]

24. Obama proved himself a failure...he is not ready for Prime Time...

he needs to go back to his job and take that seriously, before he attempts any larger tasks. If Obama can't be counted on to vote on legislation, and he stutters and stammers when he is asked a question, what makes anyone think he is fit to be President? Obama boggles the mind.

:kick: and recommend for Hillary Clinton

[Beacool]

27. I don't care if I have to repeat it like a mantra until next November: Experience DOES count!!!

Please note who among the candidates gave the best response when faced with an unforeseen international crisis. They were the ones with actual foreign policy experience under their belt: Biden, McCain, Clinton, Richardson, Dodd and even Edwards.

Huckabee's response was abysmal and Obama's was inadequate.

Pakistan has a very long history of political upheaval and assassinations that predate the Iraqi war by many years. Axelrod, instead of rising above the fray in his response to the reporter's question, politicized the moment. Obama's defense of his hack was bland and ineffective.

The unforeseen events that every president will inevitably confront is when they show their true mettle. In my opinion, Obama barely deserves a passing grade.

I observed how Hillary handled the hostage situation in NH and now Ms. Bhutto's assassination, and I have liked her response both times: she was substantive, calm and acted presidential.

[Pawel K]

28. Experiance counts?

So why in the hell are you a Clinton supporter? What "experiance" does she have in this field? You want experiance in foreign policy? There are much better choices you can pick from, some of them you named above.

[jillan]

33. Interesting how the 2 candidates that have been working with Pakistan for years, who were trying to

get Musharraf to provide Bhutto with extra protection since her return to Pakistan, were left out of this article.
The two that have repeated over and over and over again that we need to do all we can to keep things calm over there.
The two that get it.

Biden and Dodd.
The Chairman, and the next in line to be Chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

amazing!