To those that support a Nader candidacy...

[slor]

I say support your candidate as much as you can...BUT, if it becomes clear on election day that he may not win, will you put your support toward the person that is most likely to beat chimpychimp? Thank You.

[VOX]

1. Voting for Nader is like masturbating to try to conceive a baby...

The idea is vaguely in the right general direction, but the methodology is lacking -- it won't be effective to achieve the end -- in this case, ousting * and his cronies.

Even if Nader only goes after * (which he won't, almost guaranteed), it will *not* help the Democratic cause. Think of it -- how many Republicans would actually vote for Nader? Nader sics his fangs into the neck of the Democratic Party, because he knows that's where his votes will come from.

Sorry Ralph, but thy name is vanity.

[slor]

2. I really got the impression...

from his interview on MTP that he wants to get the Dems back on track from their corporate influenced path. This is a good thing. Secondly, I also got the impression that he will drop out at the end if it appears * is headed for victory. Keep in mind that his will be another voice railing against the * machine, so let us at least salute his arrival for that. And finally, this is a thread meant to reach a common ground and formulate a tactical response to taking back the WH from a group of criminals, I ask that you not use it as a way to belittle the candidate of those seeking the same goal.

[Forkboy]

3. I must say

that this is one of the most intelligent responses to the Nader situation I've seen here.

It's nice to see someone not mocking the very positions they say they hold,and I think your approach,as oppossed to the guilt trips and browbeating,will be much more successful in helping the Dems come November.

Thanks for a positive post.

[joyautumn]

4. Issues and accountability, not candidates or parties

will determine my vote, as always.

All the evidence I see is that the DLC and its backroom-selected candidates (Clinton, Gore, Kerry, Edwards) has always had exactly the same interest in imperialist oil-grabbing for Halliburton and friends that Bushes I and II have had. Serbia was about oil pipelines, coal and other mineral reserves. As I just posted in another thread, Clinton and Blair bombed Iraq for several days in '98 claiming it was to destroy Saddam's WMD production capacity. Now that we know that Dubya lied about the intelligence on WMD, and his CIA chief just happens to be the same George Tenet that Clinton appointed to the post, it's obvious that Clinton told the same lie Bush did to justify the same imperialist war. I just have one word for it all: CONTINUITY.

All the evidence I see is that the Republican and Democratic parties have colluded to rig the elections since the Reagan era. This does not mean that the individuals responsible didn't have some good intentions in the mix. It does mean that the dirtiness of political reality, which the DLC trots out as its whip to herd the rank and file back in line whenever they show an actual small-d democratic impulse, has destroyed the efficacy of good intentions in a corporate-controlled system that simply must be repaired.

The fact is, between gerrymandering and the collusion of media, corporations, big unions and the two major parties to drastically limit debate on the issues in national and statewide elections, it is impossible for voters to interrogate candidates thoroughly, much less hold them accountable later. It has been a couple decades at least since voters have had even a modicum of real indication or say as to what the winning candidate will actually do once in office. And as I said, the CONTINUITY in the imperialist foreign policy from Bush to Clinton to Bush is the glaring clue that voters have been tricked into buying into empire under every other name.

I wish DLC candidate supporters would realize, or admit, that the election was rigged against Dean. Denying the obvious is just an insult to people's intelligence. The DLC candidate is going to take the hit for it one way or another, if not from defection from its ranks, then from Rove's onslaught. Better to come clean and take the medicine now than to Clintonize the situation right into the summer and fall.

And no, I am no Rove operative. I wouldn't be surprised, though, if one of those 163,000 volunteers mentioned in another posting does run across stuff written from points of view like mine, and starts to mimick and tweak it so as to sow more discord and make it impossible for people to hear the message, respond and debate to a depth sufficient to figure out what we might be able to do besides take yet another bite from whatever poisoned apple gets served up to us, whether it be a "wasted" vote for a third-party candidate with no impact, or a "wasted" vote for a major-party candidate predetermined either to lose the election or be told once in office he's to resume the corporate imperialist policies of the previous administration while tossing wedge-crumbs to the "winning" contituencies, or tragically die in office and be replaced by the prince or stooge that was annointed VP.

[CWebster]

5. Nice post.

And they blame it on Nader's ego?