DETERMINED, STEADY KUCINICH QUADRUPLES SUPPORT

[babylonsister]

DETERMINED, STEADY KUCINICH QUADRUPLES SUPPORT
Submitted by davidswanson on Wed, 2007-12-05 19:49. Elections

By Joe Shea and Ted Manna, American Reporter


BRADENTON, Fla., Dec. 5, 2007 -- It's been a long time coming. Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-OH, 10th), the former mayor of Cleveland who is serving his fifth term in the House of Representatives has quadrupled his standing in the polls, according to the current USA Today/Gallup Poll.

The poll of Democrats and those leaning toward the Democrats in the 2008 presidential election shows Kucinich tied with Sen. Joe Biden (D-DE), the well-known chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, and New Mexico's Gov. Bill Richardson; he is far ahead of second-generation Conn. Democrat Sen. Chris Dodd.

Rep. Dennis Kucinich has started emerging from the margins and polls show his popularity up sharply as voters respond to a populist message aimed at working Americans.

Among progressives, according to a presidential straw poll released today of 15,000 members of the grassroots Progressive Democrats of America (PDA), Kucinich is far stronger than the rest of the Democratic field. Kucinich placed first in the poll with 41 percent of the vote; his nearest competitor was former Sen. John Edwards, with 26 percent. Among other candidates, only Barak Obama, with 13 percent, scored double digits in the poll.

These improvements come as Kucinich's message of competence, integrity and foresight is reaching a wider audience through the multiple debates sponsored by the parties, CNN, YouTube and the major television networks. He has also had to fight off ridicule after NBC debate host Tim Russert asked him if he had seen a UFO.

Kucinich, like President Jimmy Carter and orbiting NASA astronauts, admitted that he had - during a visit to the home of Shirley Maclaine - and precipitated a wave of late-night jokes aimed at his supposed gullibility.

But Russert didn't ask Kucinich why he had stood alone in the House in opposition to the initial resolution empowering the President to start the Iraq War, or his singular opposition to the PATRIOT Act - matters that have far more import - but despite the distraction, Kucinich has finally gained parity with the top "second-tier" candidates and is determined to move up again.

more...

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/?q=node/29157

[tekisui]

1. KnR.

And

Go, Dennis!

[eleny]

2. good news!

[TheWraith]

3. I love DK, but going from 0.5 to 2% does not a President make. NT

[DurShar]

8. It was 1% to 4% n/t

[dmallind]

10. Oh that's a big difference - what was MOE? ;)

I think I'll buy 4 Powerball tickets and quadruple my chance of winning too!

[MonkeyFunk]

25. the MOE was

+/- 5%

[kenfrequed]

30. uhm

I think you need to go back to school and study statistics.

[dmallind]

31. why? NT

nt

[kenfrequed]

32. Well

A lottery has a one in a hundred million chance usually.

Are you suggesting that the odds are that ridiculously stacked?

[bobthedrummer]

4. k&r

[DurShar]

5. Nobody but Dennis in 2008. n/t

[Dhalgren]

6. Reckick! Go Dennis!

[demnan]

7. Impeach them now

and vote for Dennis!

[truedelphi]

9. This is so true. I support Kucinich 400% more than I did

A month ago.

ANd the others even less (except occasionally Edwards and Dodd)

[sakabatou]

11. Woo-hoo!

:woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:

[BeHereNow]

12. As the saying goes, "It aint over till the fat lady sings..."

America is sick to death of the corporate democrats.
Slowly, Dennis is overcoming the MSM because he IS electable
in the eyes of a public disgusted with both democrats and republicans
who serve corporate interests rather than those of the people.

BHN

[hayu_lol]

13. And in the midst of all this whoopee about Dennis's metoric rise...

in the polls, he announces that he will run to fill his seat in the House again.

This guy really has a sense of timing.

[knitter4democracy]

37. So did Kerry.

So did Lieberman. :shrug:

[blm]

56. Kerry was re-elected in 2002 with about 80% of the vote.

.

[TayTay]

57. Senator Kerry was re-elected in 2002 in Massachusetts.

He is a Class II Senator (A real term in Senate-world, btw.) He is up for re-election next year, as are all the other Class II Senators.

Class I up in 2012
Class II up in 2008
Class III up in 2010.

The Us Senate site lets you sort Senators by what election cycle they are in. http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm?Class=2

[knitter4democracy]

60. My point is that he was still in the Senate in case he lost.

He didn't step down or anything, so why shouldn't Kucinich keep his foot in the House if he can?

[karynnj]

84. The point is that he is simultaneously running for 2 things

Kerry did not run for Senate in 2004, because he was not up for election. Other than Dole, I cna't think of a Senator who did step down when he was not up for election. Kerry in 2008 is just running for Senate, but when he was considering running for President, many informed people from MA posted that MA does not allow running for 2 positions at the same time. He had to choose.

As to Kuchinich, he ran for both last time and is doing that again. It is obviously ok by Ohio law. So, I don't see the problem. Also, 4% is the highest he has ever registered. Time will tell if it is a surge or just a statistical fluke.

[LWolf]

22. I believe you are correct.

The more people learn about him, his platform, and his record, the more support he will gain.

[Occam Bandage]

26. Wouldn't that imply that he should be doing better now than in '04?

[LWolf]

27. Wouldn't WHAT imply?

The general population learned very little about DK in '04. People who got to hear him in person supported him, but people who were left with the meager and twisted offerings of the msm learned what the status quo WANTED them to learn.

If he is making progress this time, it's probably because more people are aware of the corrupt complicity that some Democrats have shown, and are paying attention to the candidates who offer a difference to that complicity.

He certainly gets more support at DU than he did in '04; of course, that doesn't necessarily reflect the rest of the population.

[Occam Bandage]

36. We're finishing the second campaign season in a row he's been involved in.

DK has been invited to every debate, and has had two seasons' worth of chances to raise money and advertise. He's gotten to speak to even more people. His supporters are spreading the word non-stop, as they were in '04.

And yet he's still polling at the same sub-5% mark he did in 2004. He's still fluctuating around the margin of error, as he was in 2004. So either:

1. Learning more about Kucinich does not change people's opinions on him, or
2. He is not a good campaigner.

[Michael101]

41. or 3

The Media does not inform people about the issues.

Did you hear all over the news when Dennis Kucinich read articles of impeachment. NO!?!

Well, I'm shocked. The same applies with Dennis Kucinich. He is is not given enough air time in the news and in the the debates.

I
Go Dennis Go!!!

[Occam Bandage]

43. Why isn't DK covered? Because he's thoroughly unpopular.

The media are not supposed to lead interest; they follow interest. They report on what people want to see. Clinton, by virtue of her name, was interesting to people. Obama, by virtue of his charisma, was interesting to people. Dodd, on the other hand, has been largely ignored. Why? Because nobody cares about Dodd. Biden has been largely ignored. Why? Because nobody cares about Biden (which is disappointing, but true.) Duncan Hunter and Tom Tancredo have been largely ignored. Why? Because nobody cares about them. Kucinich has been largely ignored. Why? Because nobody cares about Kucinich. Is that unfair? Sure, it makes it harder for the second tier to break through. But it's not the media's job to campaign on behalf of unpopular candidates. Now, don't get me wrong; it is indeed the media's job to provide a balanced look at the field. However, in this mini-list of "ignored" candidates, I'm not seeing any particular ideology being shunted aside. Rather, I'm seeing candidates with negative net image ratings and single-digit support being shunted aside, and that's expected.

DK has a favorable-image rating of only 24%, compared to 40% unfavorable. That's the worst in the Democratic party, excepting joke candidate Mike Gravel. On the Republican side, only Tancredo and Hunter have worse numbers. Sure, many people don't have an opinion on him. But those that do don't like what they've seen.

(DK's impeachment stunt was covered.)


http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/favorables/election_2008_democratic_candidates_running_in_2008_presidential_election

[Michael101]

44. The media are not supposed to lead interest; they follow interest...

Is that a joke! ah ha!

The question is how many people know about Dennis Kucinich.

By the way where did you get those numbers? Could they be from his own party. I'm shocked.

He has won many polls. See Democracy for America and Progressive Democrats of America.

(DK's impeachment stunt was covered.) A stunt?

All I'm going to say to you is look at his record because you don't know what you're talking about.

What are you going to tell me next that corporations aren't giving money to candidates for their own interest.

They are doing the public a favor by giving it to the candidates that are for regular working people.

[harmonicon]

47. lollipops, duh!

umm.... hate to burst your bubble, but the corporate "news" companies like GE only work for a profit to buy us all lollipops (you'll get them later). The government is too stupid to give people lollipops, and people are way too stupid to buy them for themselves, so GE has to give it's executives millions..... millions they can spend on us! THIS IS GOING TO BE THE BEST CHRISTMAS EVAR!!!11!!ONE1111!!

[Occam Bandage]

50. No, it's not a joke. That's the way the media should, and does, work.

Those numbers are from Rasmussen. Gallup shows him even worse.

The polls he has "won" are bogus online polls. The fact that you're even mentioning them shows how fundamentally ignorant you are.

[harmonicon]

53. again, poor and educated

Lots of people don't have land-lines (like myself and almost all of my friends), so we can't be polled. Further, all of these polls are crap. I wish I could remember who first said it, but "public" polls are just polls of people too stupid to walk away when someone approaches them with a clipboard.

[Occam Bandage]

54. The no-land-line effect is a myth.

They can and do account for that; people with cell phones are no more likely to hold any political ideology than people with land lines who are of the same age, ethnicity, gender, income, and geographic location.

Telephone polls are extraordinarily accurate. They were spot-on in 2000, 2002, 2004, and 2006. If people who respond to them are stupid, well, they're stupid in the exact same proportion that the voting public is.

[harmonicon]

46. biggest lie I've ever read:

"The media are not supposed to lead interest; they follow interest." Who told you that? The media creates the "issues" and decides which candidates to cover. Obama's "charisma"? Where did anyone learn of that? Did he come to your house? The big media decided to cover him when he ran for senate, because being a high-profile black politician is a novelty (people love novelty... and shiny things!) and has kept him in the spotlight. How are people supposed to care about a candidate when they aren't covered? Your logic is completely circular and meaningless.

Part of the real problem: a lot Kucinich supporters are poor, but educated, like I am. We don't have money to give. We also don't watch ABC, NBC, etc., so they could give a fuck about us. The "news" has become entertainment. The networks create political stars just as they create tv stars of sitcoms and dramas. It's all about selling ads. Why would they cover candidates liked by people that won't watch their news shows and won't/can't buy the products they advertise?

If you think this isn't true, when was the last time you saw a good movie on one of these networks? There are good movies, and there are money-makers. There are good politicians, and there are money makers. When was the last time you saw any real left-wing perspective put forth on any network news show? When you've got an even-handed debate about the merits and faults of capitalism on a sunday morning show, shown with no ads, I'll believe you.

[Occam Bandage]

48. Obama's coverage came mostly from his

run as a Senator and his speech at the 2004 DNC. People picked up on his charisma, they liked it, and so he got some coverage. People responded to his coverage, so he got some more coverage. People responded to that coverage, and so he got even more coverage. The system of coverage is circular, but that doesn't mean my logic is.

It's not that Kucinich supporters are poor. It's that they're few.

[crawfish]

66. Oh yes, "charisma".

Life is so much better than when people were elected because of their experience and stance on the issues. :eyes:

[Occam Bandage]

68. Not defending the system. Only explaining it.

[crawfish]

71. Then you'll be happy as punch when Biden doesn't win.

:)

[elaineb]

55. Excellent post, harmonicon

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

And anyone who doesn't think that Kucinich's lack of coverage in the mainstream media is directly correlated to his standing in the polls has only to look at the way his support has grown on DU from his run in 2004 until now, which has grown hugely as his supporters on DU have spread the word about him.

[harmonicon]

51. I forgot to add this in my last post

Kucinich is so hated, that ABC was doing a public service by cropping his image from a picture of all of the candidates at their debate. Obviously ABC knew that all of their viewers watched every minute of the debate, and couldn't even stand the thought of seeing DK for one second longer. They also pulled down their online poll which showed DK as having won the debate, because people had voted for him in that poll out of a sense of irony - so much is the hatred of the masses against DK. Being in the news business, and not the entertainment or ironic pollster business, they we're doing what's best.

[crawfish]

65. Your big mistake...

is assuming that one is "popular" because their portfolio of issues appeals to the mainstream voter more than that of other candidates. That is patently untrue. Most Americans tend to be ignorant of most of the issues. They like candidates because:

a) they identify with the candidate personally: "she's a woman", "he's black", "he's from the south", etc.

b) they're impressed with the way the candidate presents him or herself in public (posture, smile, ease of manner, confidence).

c) The candidate supports the single topic that most defines the voter: abortion, race relations, gay rights, etc. Many times, if the candidate is "right" on this one issue it doesn't matter how many other issues they are "wrong" about.

d) Some person they respect - a celebrity, a clergyman, another political figure - gives their support to the candidate.

The point is - most Americans support candidates for reasons that are incredibly shallow. The way things are going, presidential elections in another twenty years will be done much like the Miss America pageant, only with the participants being slightly smarter.

[Occam Bandage]

67. I don't believe I ever referenced the issues. The issues are almost a nonentity.

In fact, I attempted to display that by picking a bunch of also-rans from across the political spectrum. The issues are only important insofar as they support a cohesive view of a candidate--that is, if a candidate's stances make them look "compassionate," "tough," "competent," and the like.

[K Gardner]

76. The MSM absolutely makes or breaks ANY candidate.. to think that they are reflective of true public

interest is absolute fallacy. The mainstream of the American populus will turn on the TV (news) for MAYBE 15-20 mins/day. They may pass by a TV at work that is tuned in to a 24 hr news channel and see a sound bite. If they have time to read a paper, that paper is again reflective of what MSM is reporting (i.e., what SELLS commercials). Remember the Dean Scream... the Swiftboaters for Truth.. Al Gore invented the internet. These things were propagated by the MSM, and pounded on day after day after day, until it becomes reality. One only has to watch to see the MSM is most surely not driven by anything but greed. They could make DK a "rock star" tomorrow.. if they wanted to.

[rAVES]

83. OMG are you seriously typing this with a straight face?

One of 2 things.. 1 the most disingenuous post Ive ever read, or 2 the most naive.

[alstephenson]

52. Invited to every debate, yes. But allowed to speak at the debates......

Not really. You go, Dennis. You've got my support through the primaries.

[LWolf]

63. Or 3.

3. The campaign waged against him by the msm and the party leadership has been successful.

[Occam Bandage]

70. There's no need to wage a campaign against him,

any more than there's a need to wage a campaign against Tom Tancredo. Kucinich is a blunt, outspoken ideological purist. These are attractive features for people who agree with his ideology; to people who agree with every word that leaves his mouth, he looks courageous, committed, and determined. These are horribly unattractive features to most people; to everyone not in his camp, he comes off as abrasive, self-congratulatory, and unserious. He is by his nature a niche candidate, in the same way Tancredo is. There is no need to marginalize someone who only appeals to the margins; they will marginalize themselves.

[LWolf]

73. I don't really consider myself "the margins." n/t

[Occam Bandage]

78. Nobody does.

Every culture's maps show them at the center of the Earth.

[LWolf]

80. I don't consider myself the center of ANYTHING, either.

I am one of 6+ billion of my species on this planet. I don't even consider my species to be the "center" of anything.

[jillan]

14. Wow! That's excellent!

[Faux pas]

15. !!

:bounce: :woohoo: :applause:

[Tejanocrat]

16. Go Dennis!

[Truth2Tell]

17. Rock on! K&R n/t

[Desertrose]

18. Good for Dennis....

and good for us.

[Kucinich4America]

19. Good news.

Maybe this country can finally wake up to realize the president this country needs is Dennis Kucinich. Not the whore media favorites.

[KaryninMiami]

20. I have a rule now. Every time he says the word Impeach -

radio, t.v., in a press release- wherever I see Dennis saying the "I" word-- I send the campaign another donation. National television gets more money- but it's beginning to add up.... Thank God for Dennis Kucinich. Even if it's true that he "cannot win" (which I don't believe or don't want to believe), having his voice and sending him support so that he'll keep talking-- loud and clear- is crucial.

[MrMickeysMom]

21. Admit it... have you ever seen the tenacity of MSM to ignore someone this good?

... Like Edwards, Kuchinich, who is my first choice candidate, must scare the hell out of corporation's interests. It only follows that the news readers and so called journalists would dance to that same tune for the suites in control. Meanwhile, Kucinich continues to tell the truth and make those gains.

Here's something I would not be proud of- the DLC candidates coming out with statements like Clinton did today. Did you catch it? There was barely any rebuttal to her idiotic lie. In case you missed it, she admitted there was a benefit in linking Iran as terrorists because this resulted in Iran "backing off" on some of their would be terrorist like activities.

It drives me fucking crazy.

[2beToby]

42. K&R Go Dennis!

Still crossing my fingers and spreading the word.

[MrMickeysMom]

58. Here's another way of spreading the word...

Vote for Dennis Kucinich in the IndependentPrimary.com Poll. The results of this poll will be watched by independent voters around the country, but particularly by those who will be voting in the nation's first primary in New Hampshire on Jan. 8, 2008 ... now voters all across the nation can affect the New Hampshire Primary.

Brought to you by-
The Kucinich for President Campaign

http://www.IndependentPrimary.com

[2beToby]

61. Voted

Hope it makes a difference this time! Thanks for the link.

-Toby

[MrMickeysMom]

72. You're welcomed, Toby!

I hope it makes a difference, too. Sick of the MSM's ignore button on DK. (Welcome to DU, BTW)
:hi:

[burrowowl]

23. K&R

Dennis is the man!

[Occam Bandage]

24. It tells you something when a candidate's "quadrupled support" is within the MOE.

[EstimatedProphet]

28. You know, if he went from 0% to 1% it would be an infinite increase in support

Would that make him completely unstoppable?

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

29. Cool!

Will the race go to the steady rather than the swift?

:kick:

MKJ

[pberq]

33. Kick & Nominated - Go Dennis!!

[lovuian]

34. Woohoo

:woohoo:

[salib]

35. Yeah. Just what I said.

Even with the "inevitable" candidates receiving nearly ubiquitous coverage, Dennis is climbing.

Remember the funding bomb on the 15th of Dec!

[socretes73]

38. Dennis, Dennis, Dennis

He's got MY Vote!!

[rockybelt]

39. Go Dennis!

The closer we get to the primaries, the harder people will look at the candidates. Until now the whole field has been looked at with polling numbers changing every day. Keep watching the polls as they will start to drift to the most likely candidate now.
Dennis, keep up the good work and let's keep supporting Dennis both financially and by talking him up and educating people as to who he is.

He is the man!

[cyclezealot]

40. Thank you Cleveland.

Clevelanders should be proud to give us someone with integrity and backbone.

[riqster]

77. We are

Kooch is a good example of Clevelanders. He gets spit on and keeps on working regardless.

[cyclezealot]

79. Most midwesterners

feel your pain, riqster.

[redqueen]

45. Refreshing... I hope it continues. (nt)

[Highway61]

49. This is awesome news

Go Dennis

[datavg]

59. Sure, Whatever...

Did you see the reaction on Wolf Blitzer's face when Kucinich had another one of his infamous grand mal seizures about impeachment?

If something weird happens and Kucinich wins one of the caucuses or primaries, it'll be a sign that the party is coming apart. That's what happened in 1972. That's how the party ended up with McGovern and then Nixon carried forty nine states.

Is this some kind of disease?

Did you know Kucinich sent a letter to Jimmy Dimora (defacto head of the Democratic party in NE Ohio) telling him he planned to run again for his seat in Congress? This presidential run is all bullshit. It was always bullshit. It's all about riling the waters and raising his profile to keep the Congressional seat that he never deserved.

Pelosi and Hoyer need to do something about this.

[Perry Logan]

62. The specter of Ron Paul hangs over his campaign.

[Yurovsky]

74. That's not really fair...

Ron Paul is a loon.

DK is perhaps eccentric, but he's right on virtually every issue that is important to progressives. With the Dems very likely to win in November, it would be great if we could actually nominate one of our own instead of simply settling for someone who has told us that she's inevitable (so get on board or else).

[crawfish]

64. I suspect...

That if he didn't look like a cute little elf he'd be taken far more seriously.

He upholds the core values of the Democratic party far stronger than any other candidate. He has the best sense of humor of any of the candidates - a healthy dose of taking the issues seriously but not himself. He has the courage to stand up for his convictions despite the fact that they might not be popular, and they might hurt him politically. He has the integrity to say what he means, and to mean what he says.

And he's got a hot wife, for what that's worth.

If a good-looking guy like John Edwards had Kucinich's attributes, he'd be the board favorite BY FAR.

His huge negative ratings make me sad for the Democratic party.

[Highway61]

69. Great news

K & R!

[Yurovsky]

75. SEAN PENN ENDORSES KUCINICH!!!!

This is AWESOME! Great article about a great American actor & intellectual, Sean Penn, who has formally endorsed the PROGRESSIVE choice for President in 2008.

http://www.nbc11.com/news/14800673/detail.html

GO DENNIS!!!

[FlyingSquirrel]

81. DECEMBER 15 2007.COM

DECEMBER 15, 2007 is the date on which we can begin to take back our country. It is also the date in 1791 upon which our Bill of Rights took effect.

On December 15, 2007, Dennis Kucinich will attempt to shatter Ron Paul's recent $4.2 million single day fund raising record, and collect a mind-boggling $10 million in one day.

This can only happen with your help. The website is December152007.com. Spread the word! Money is what makes the media sit up and take notice. Without it you are a fringe candidate worthy of little respect or news coverage and no speaking time in the debates - if you are even invited to them. A candidate who can raise $10 million in a single day can no longer be ignored by the mainstream media.

Please go to December152007.com and pledge to contribute on December 15 by signing up on the email list. You must actually contribute on the 15th on Dennis Kucinich's official website; a reminder email will be sent on that day.

Please also promote this event in any way you possibly can. Put a sign over the freeway. Put a large sign on your vehicle and park it somewhere legal where a lot of traffic goes by. (I did, I move it twice a day to make sure someone doesn't try to get it towed). Call a friend, email family and friends....... Now is the time to take action, not just sit on the sidelines and carp.

And by all means put your money where your mouth is - as one bumper sticker on my pickup truck says, "Talk is cheap... Make a donation!"

[Czolgosz]

82. Thanks for posting this