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EV_Ares Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 06:28 PM
Original message
Naomi Wolf: America's Fascist Coup Owes to Bush's Nazi Grandfather
Author of "10 steps" speaks publicly for the first time about legacy of modern-day tyranny

Author Naomi Wolf, who made headlines earlier this year after she identified the ten steps to fascism that were being followed to a tee by the Bush administration, spoke publicly for the first time yesterday about the origins of what we see unfolding today, Prescott Bush's attempt to launch a Nazi coup in 1930's America.

Speaking on the Alex Jones Show, Wolf said that she was first alerted to begin researching America's slide into fascism when her friend, the daughter of a Holocaust survivor, warned her that the same events that laid the foundations for the rise of the Third Reich in early 1930's Germany, when it was still a Parliamentary democracy, were being mirrored in modern-day America.

"A small group of people began very systematically to use the law and dismantle the Constitution and put pressure on citizens to subvert the law - and that opened the door for everything that followed," said Wolf.

"When I started reading, not only are tactics and strategy being reproduced exactly right now by the Bush administration - but actual sound bytes and language and images and scenarios are being reproduced," she added.

Wolf's essay, Fascist America, In 10 Easy Steps , has received plaudits for how it succinctly describes the ways in which dictatorships the world over thro ughout the 20th century have evolved by following the exact same blueprint for tyranny that we see unfolding in America today.

"Everybody that wants to close down a Democracy does the exact same ten things, the same classic steps and unfortunately we're starting to see these ten steps being put in place in the United States," said Wolf.

For the first time publicly, Wolf traced the origins of contemporary developments back to President Bush's Nazi grandfather, Prescott Bush, and his plan to launch a fascist coup in the 1930's.

"There was a scheme in the 30's and Prescott Bush was one of the leaders of this scheme, an industrialist who admired fascism and thought that was a good idea - to have a coup in the United States along the lines of the coup they saw taking place in Italy and Germany," said Wolf, referring to the testimony of Marine Corps Maj.-Gen. Smedley Butler, who was approached by a wealthy and secretive group of industrialists and bankers, including Prescott Bush - the current President's grandfather, who asked him to command a 500,000 strong rogue army of veterans that would help stage a coup to topple then President Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

A recent BBC radio report confirmed that there was an attempted coup led by Prescott Bush.

"Smedley Butler had been involved with violent regime change throughout his career, but he was approached by these conspirators, including Prescott Bush, and he outed them and he testified to Congress that they were planning a coup in the United States - it's in the Congressional record," said Wolf, adding that the coup was being bankrolled by German industrialist and one of Hitler's chief financiers Fritz Thyssen.

"What is amazing to me and resonant to me is that when the Nuremberg trials were finally put in place, these Nazi industrialists, some of whom had colluded with Americans including IBM, were about to be brought to trial and sent to prison - there was a moment at which they were going to look into turning the spotlight on their American partners," said Wolf.

The author added that laws such as the Military Commissions Act of 2006 were consciously designed to protect current President Bush and his co-conspirators from being indicted for war crimes, harking back to Prescott Bush's history.

"The family history is that you can make so much money uniting corporate interests with a fascist state that violently represses people, that's why when I saw the recycling of so much Nazi language, Nazi tactics, Nazi strategies, Nazi imagery in the Bush White House and then finally belatedly people brought to me this history of Prescott Bush's attempted coup and Smedley Butler's revelations - it gives me absolute chills," said Wolf.

The fact that Bush's grandfather was a Nazi cannot be presented alone as proof that President Bush is carrying on the legacy, but his policies and rhetoric, which in her essay Wolf clearly documents are borrowed from the Nazi playbook, and in particular the recent move to smear administration critics as potential terrorists, are evidence that George W. Bush is the figurehead for a modern-day fascist coup in America led by the Neo-Cons.

Wolf concluded that history shows the only safe course for preserving freedom in such a climate is to prosecute and jail the protagonists of the coup as early as possible, a process many would argue should have been enacted several years ago.

Link: http://www.infowars.com/articles/bush/fascist_coup_owes_to_bush_nazi_grandfather_wolf.htm
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DCKit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 06:30 PM
Response to Original message
1. What, is BushCo suing for residuals? A percentage? n/t
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 06:32 PM
Response to Original message
2. So every time I've called GW a fuckin' Nazi I was right??
Scary stuff ~ thanks for the post.
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. You were ahead of the learning curve. So what are you thinking
we should know at this point. Keep us posted.
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Lol
I think we'd better impeach Cheney ASAP ~ before he leaves office prematurely and moves into some new digs in Dubai.
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RFKJrNews Donating Member (760 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #6
59. Thanks for sharing the Smedley Butler story
Gotta love that guy. A true patriot, a great General, a loyal American.

And the lesson of history should teach us something: not just the lessons of how fascism grew in Europe during the 1930s, but also right here in the States...and how close we really came to going the way of Nazi Germany.

This was stopped only because the conspirators were publicly outed before they had the chance to implement the coup. Unfortunately, we didn't see it coming in 2000...and now, look where we are.

Impeach now, before the bastards flee to safe havens in other countries where we will have no jurisdiction. (Y'know, we're STILL looking for several Nazi war criminals in South/Central America who escaped prosecution at Nuremburg...they've been living there quite comfortably for the last 60 years.)

And Henry Kissinger is still on the loose. They still haven't been able to get a straitjacket on him yet, either.
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #4
26. I have always wondered where the grandfather's of the other
masterminds in this administration stood on fascism/hitler: Cheney, Rummy, Rover? It would be interesting to be able to research that question. If they were also involved in such activities then we have a conspiracy to destroy our government covering 3-4 generations of bushies.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. Cheney's grandfather was a railroad cook, so he's not part of the '34 cabal
http://usconservatives.about.com/od/profiles/p/cheney.htm
Cheney was born in Lincoln, Nebraska on January 30, 1941 - President Franklin Delano Roosevelt's 59th birthday. Cheney's grandfather, a cook for the Union Pacific Railroad, told the baby's parents that they should send the President a birth announcement.
"he modesty of his circumstances didn't stop him from thinking that President Roosevelt should know about my arrival," Dick Cheney noted at the 2004 Republican Convention. "My grandfather believed deeply in the promise of America, and had the highest hopes for his family."
High Hopes Realized: In the six years after young Richard Bruce Cheney graduated high school, he was employed as an electrical worker, building power lines. Through the years, Dick Cheney worked to go from electrical worker to political assistant to Chief of Staff to Secretary of Defense to Vice President of the United States.
Family: Cheney's father, Richard Herbert Cheney a registered Democrat, worked as a soil conservation agent for the U.S. Department of Agriculture. Dick Cheney has a brother, Bob, and a sister, Susan. Dick met his future wife, Lynne Vincent, in high school at the age of 14. They were married in 1964 and now have two adult daughters, Elizabeth and Mary, and four grandchildren.
Education: Dick Cheney attended public schools in Casper, Wyoming through the twelfth grade. He was elected his senior class president at Natrona County High School and played halfback on the football team. He earned an academic scholarship and attended Yale for a total of four semesters, but poor grades and homesickness eventually sent him back home to Wyoming. He received straight A's from the University of Wyoming, where he graduated with a B.A. in 1965 and an M.A. in political science in 1966.
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. Every time every one of us called him a fuckin' Nazi we were right
And yet, even at this late date, 99% of the American People see nothing.
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 07:29 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. They refuse to believe it...
Just the way many abused children hang on to the idea that their parents are good people.
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GuvWurld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 03:11 AM
Response to Reply #11
17. No way it is 99% who see nothing
There are way more of us who are awake than we give ourselves credit for. It is not really a quantifiable figure. We each have a sense of it, and I suspect that for most of us it can even vary over time, influenced by circumstances. So for example, someone feeling cut off from like-minded people wanting change, or someone who is burned out from activism that hasn't produced change, or someone who goes to a new community and experiences an intense disconnect with people; any of these situations could understandably tilt a person a little towards the pessimistic side.

On the other hand, today Peter B. Collins did his syndicated talk radio show live in my town (.mp3 archive). I work with a group called the Voter Confidence Committee and we had a table in the lobby of the theater. Two of us were guests on the show for the whole final hour. Afterwards, I drove to the community center in the next town and the Peace and Justice Center was having its annual holiday dinner. It was held for the first time this year in an enormous gymnasium, having outgrown the venue of the past several years. I'm buzzing so hard from the good vibes of today. That might tilt me a little towards the optimistic, but I won't claim there is 99% of us who are awake and ready for the revolution.

For whatever it is worth, I think we have passed the turning point and the numbers are on our side. Our challenge, all of us in this country, is to learn to be better community organizers. Think global, act local. This is how we build the peaceful revolution.
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #17
25. You're right. That is a bit of an exaggeration.
What I mean to say is that 99%, whether they are uneasy, want change, whatever, all the way up to deeply concerned but sure just electing Democrats in 2008 is going to fix everything, still have no idea what we face, which is no less that a threat which is deeply psychologically similar to Authoritarian Regimes, such as Marcos, Pinochet, and yes, I'll say it, the Nazis.

Don't believe it? There are two links in my signatur line below. One is to a 200+ page e-book. The other to a 47-minute lecture.

It is not hyperbole. Please look, if not at the book, than at the video-lecture which did the research and further flesh out why this is not hyberole inthe least, to say one sees the Nazis in the Bushies.

I hope you are right about the peaceful revolution thing. I am concerned because you can only have those things in free nations. In Bushie countries throught history, authoritarian dictatorships be they feuidal, monarchial, communist or facsits, Various Bushies throughout history have not hesitated to violently crush peaceful attempts at dissent.

You can see the same thing ramping up here in the Empire. Not that I am advocating violence, but that we should expect to be brutalized if masses of us ever dare to try and speak out with one voice against Bushie corruption, such as a peaceful National Strike, if that were even possible.

Anyway, before you dismiss me as :tinfoilhat:, please at least click on the YouTube linkNaomi Wolf presentation.

Peace.
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #25
35. I watched the video last weekend - really good...
So glad she came out with the book ~ there have been people on message boards talking about fascism in American for years already, but the general public is just beginning to catch on. This will help.
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GuvWurld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #25
51. Wolf is great. I've been documenting her work
On Thursday I posted this to my blog:

http://wedonotconsent.blogspot.com/2007/11/some-things-ive-been-meaning-to-tell.html

In particular, you may be interested in visiting that link because I have included many links to writings and speeches of Naomi Wolf, including this link to a book review of End of America that I had published in one of my local papers.
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Fridays Child Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 06:37 PM
Response to Original message
3. k/r
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 06:40 PM
Response to Original message
5. Sad It's Gonna Take Too Long
for folks to realize what our country is being run by? Did they think fascists and nazis all looked like a little man with a small mustache?
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
7. K&R! nt
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lunatica Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 07:01 PM
Response to Original message
8. I wonder what Poppy Bush's childhood was like
growing up with a man who hated Franklyn Rooservelt enough to plot a coup to overthrow him and take over. What kind of person was Prescott in everyday life? What kind of husband and especially what kind of father. He was in Skull and Bones in Yale and his son (Poppy) went there too.

It's also interesting that Skull and Bones only taps half a dozen people a year. That means that if 6 people were tapped each year of the 20th Century that would only be 600 people. Plenty small enough to keep the secrets, and plenty big enough to put all the members in very important positions. There are just enough of them (including their wives) to fill a large catering hall.

:scared:
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pokercat999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 05:10 AM
Response to Reply #8
20. It's also very interesting that Kerry was S&B and had no
problem with Bush stealing the 2nd election in a row.

Look'n in the closet for my tin hat now, I have the gold plated model. Actually, it's just painted gold I couldn't afford real gold plate, although I did see a really neat gold leaf one but alas, still too many $$ for me.

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Aviation Pro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #8
58. Prescott Bush....
...was a liar, a thief and a member of the "stolen valor" corps. He openly wore a Croix de Guerre although he never served during WWI and when he was called on it, he laughed it off as a joke. His motherfucking grandson, the non-pilot pilot who was pencil whipped through flight school, learned well at the old male-rhymes-with-hunt's knee.
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Diclotican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-02-07 06:44 AM
Response to Reply #8
65. lunatica
Edited on Sun Dec-02-07 06:48 AM by Diclotican
lunatica

Hello

The intersting about many of the most horrible murderes in the 20 century, was that they often was kind family members. Many of the most terible nazi-killers in the death camps, was fathers who really cared about their own family and their own children. And often write long letter home, to tell who mutch they care for their familiy and promished that they was home soon to celebrate familiy hollydays, or birthsday.. Even as they was sending others to their death in gas shambers..

One of the leaders, Heinrich Heydrich was a acomplished violin handler, and was in "world class" if he had going that way.. And many of the other killers was artistians who could have managed to painted it to the big league down the road..

But, they was killers, murderes, and have a lot of blood on their hands when the war ended in 1945. Many of them was arrested, but many of them was been running for their life, both from the russians and from the french, brititsh and american forces in the daying days of Nazi-Germany.. For the most part they ended up in South America where for the most part they have lived out their natural life..

I dont know how it is to grown up with a family who hate some pepole.. But I know to grown up in a family who was paying the price for the nazi-wars.. My foster-father was so "angry", maybee scared about the germans, that he dosent take a germans hand, before in 1989.. over 40 year after the war ended..

Nazis, is just extremenists, anyway you see it.. And Mr Bush Administration have been clear to be extreme.. Even to the horrible.. And if Mr Bush are not stoped somehow, he would manage to start a nazi-regime there in US.. Maybee not the same way as the old nazi was doing it, with tortour, and murder in a grand scale.. But the forces of "evil" as I call it is there to all to see.. You dosent need to know alot of history to understand that mr Bush are a dangrous man.. But that the forces back mr Bush, in the dark as I see it, is maybee even more dangrous.. They would send pepole to their death, or to "education camps" as they are kalled.. In fact the first Konzentration camps was all called "re-education camps" but when the system was up and living, then their current name. Konzentration lager was the norm... And in fact, even in the Konsentration camps it was diferent camps for diferent type of pepole.. Everyone should known about the name GESTAPO. The german secred Police.. Wel for East Preussa in fact.. But soon for ALL Germany, and then for the rest of occupied Europa.. Everyone who was living there, rembember the dark uniform of Gestapo... In Norway under the war, we do have some konzentration camps. It was one in the north of Norway. And one outside Trondheim in the middle of Norway.. But the biggest camp. Grini was not exactly a Consentration camps. Legaly it was a police camp, but under the juristiction of Gestapo.. The german secred police.. And from the consentration camps, and from the police camps, many brave norwigian should either been send to Akershus Fortress to be shoot. To the Trandum Woods also to be shoot.. Or to german Konzentration camps or to Poland. Over 20.000 was been send to Germany from 1940 to 1945... And many of them was been dead long before they was liberated... And even then, we was pretty lucky, compared to many other nations who many houndreds of thousands was been killed.. outside of inside the camps

Yes, the regime of Mr Bush is scary.. But I really really hope that US can send this regime, and its law where it belong, into prison.. I hope, even then it looks dark that US can manage what everyone dont.. Stop it before it is to late.. If they just want to understand what the rest of the world have learned the hard way before

Diclotican

Sorry my bad engelish, not my native language
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TAGGLINES Donating Member (36 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-02-07 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #8
66. AND PULL A " DIRTY DOZEN" TYPE OF LOCK UP AND IMMOLATION....UUUHHHH,
Edited on Sun Dec-02-07 07:37 AM by TAGGLINES
Does anyone on this site realize that we are in locked a very serious war of ideologies here in the good 'ol US of A ??? We must pick up the flag, and the mantle of our forefathers and shake the control from these heartless Fascist dogs that have nearly ruined us. Fuck 'em...read 'em and weep boys. Time fish or cut bait. Hell, Saddam might have been the quintessential asshole, but he kept the "insurgency" at bay, eh?? So, all that hyperbole about good or bad is MOOT. What's more...we're all chained and hypnotized with our avarice, greed, sloth, and fucking apathy...Get yer asses out on the tiles and make some REAL noise, before the Fuhrer seizes what's left of our Constitution and our courts.

Put down the remote, and get on the phone, volunteer at the Dem regional office...and get to work.

RIGHTEOUS INDIGNATION !!! PEACEFUL CIVIL DISOBEDIENCE. DO NOT BE AFRAID OF JAIL...OR WORSE.
THIS COUNTRY IS WORTH SAVING...I KNOW, I'VE BEEN DOING THIS SHIT FOR NEARLY 40 YEARS, SO WAKE THE FUCK UP LADIES AND GENTS

TAGGLINE
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Hieronymus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-02-07 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #8
72. A very weird life indeed .. you know his marriage to Barbara had to be
arranged .. a merger of money and family names.
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 07:11 PM
Response to Original message
9. Listen to the audio of Naomi Wolf's interview at this link. Really. nt
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 07:20 PM
Response to Original message
10. If Prescott Bush had been hanged for treason (as he rightfully should have),
we wouldn't have had to suffer under either Bush 41 or Bush 43. Sigh.

Talk about a lost golden opportunity.......
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. Or Nixon!
See when ol Prescott dodged the bullet after the WW2 shit went down, he escaped with only assets seized, he started over in the Senate. Found a nice boy from California named Nixon to bring along. Eventually Nixon did the same for Poppy, Rumsferatu, and Cheney.

-Hoot
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leftist_not_liberal Donating Member (408 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #14
42. Nixon
"According to our sources in the intelligence community, the oil dispute was really a shakedown of the CIA by Mexican politicians. Hughes and Pauley were working for the CIA from time to time, while advancing their own financial interests in the lucrative Mexican oil fields. Pauley, say several of our sources, was the man who invented an intelligence money-laundering system in Mexico, which was later refined in the 1970s as part of Nixon's Watergate scandal. At one point CIA agents used Pemex, the Mexican government's oil monopoly, as a business cover at the same time Pemex was being used as a money laundry for Pauley's campaign contributions. As we shall see, the Mexican-CIA connection played an important part in the development of George Bush's political and intelligence career. . . .

"Pauley, say the 'old spies,' was the man who brought all the threads of the Mexican connection together. He was Bush's business associate, a front man for Dulles's CIA , and originator of the use of Mexican oil fronts to create a slush fund for Richard Nixon's various campaigns. . . .

"Although it is not widely known, Pauley, in fact, had been a committed, if 'secret,' Nixon supporter since 1960. It should be recalled that Nixon tried to conceal his Mexican slush fund during the Watergate affair by pressuring the CIA into a 'national security' cover-up. The CIA, to its credit, declined to participate. Unfortunately, others were so enmeshed in Pauley's work for Nixon that they could never extricate themselves. According to a number of our intelligence sources, the deals Bush cut with Pauley in Mexico catapulted him into political life. In 1960 Bush became a protege of Richard Nixon, who was then running for president of the United States. . . .

"The most intriguing of Bush's early connections was to Richard Nixon, who as vice president had supervised Allen Dulles's covert planning for the Bay of Pigs . For years it has been rumored that Dulles's client, George Bush's father, was one of the Republican leaders who recruited Nixon to run for Congress and later convinced Eisenhower to take him on as vice president. There is no doubt that the two families were close. George Bush described Nixon as his 'mentor.' Nixon was a Bush supporter in his very first tilt at politics, during his unsuccessful run for the Senate in 1964, and turned out again when he entered the House two years later.

"After Nixon's landslide victory in 1972, he ordered a general house cleaning on the basis of loyalty. 'Eliminate everyone,' he told John Ehrlichman about reappointments, 'except George Bush. Bush will do anything for our cause.' . . . According to Bush's account, the president told him that 'the place I really need you is over at the National Committee running things.' So, in 1972, Nixon appointed George Bush as head of the Republican National Committee.

"It was Bush who fulfilled Nixon's promise to make the 'ethnic' emigres a permanent part of Republican politics. In 1972 Nixon's State Department spokesman confirmed to his Australian counterpart that the ethnic groups were very useful to get out the vote in several key states. Bush's tenure as head of the Republican National Committee exactly coincided with Laszlo Pasztor's 1972 drive to transform the Heritage Groups Council into the party's official ethnic arm. The groups Pasztor chose as Bush's campaign allies were the emigre Fascists whom Dulles had brought to the United States. . . .

". . . Nearly twenty years later, and after expose's in several respectable newspapers, Bush continued to recruit most of the same ethnic Fascists, including Pasztor, for his own 1988 ethnic outreach program when he first ran for president.

"According to our sources in the intelligence community," state the authors, "it was Bush who told Nixon that the Watergate investigations might start uncovering the Fascist skeletons in the Republican party's closet. Bush himself acknowledges that he wrote Nixon a letter asking him to step down. The day after Bush did so, Nixon resigned.
http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:cCLTV94xn84J:www.john-loftus.com/bush_nazi_scandal.asp+loftus+bush+nazi&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

For the original reporting on the fascists in GHWB's '88 campaign, see:
http://www.skepticfiles.org/socialis/bushnazi.htm
http://www.skepticfiles.org/socialis/bushhoax.htm
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #42
49. So many chances to nip this in the bud
So many failures to recognize it.

-Hoot
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Vanje Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #10
37. I am against the death penalty
So I cant really advocate Prescotts having been hanged for treason.
But I sure wish he'd have been castrated for treason. I'd be all for that!
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-30-07 07:45 PM
Response to Original message
13. When some of us track these connections back thru the years we get moved to
hideaway forums.

IMO, those who can't stand back and see the big picture are not doing their jobs as responsible citizens.
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Beam Me Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. I agree. Censorship. Doesn't matter what medium it appears in or
under what banner. It has the same function: perception control.

Whoever controls your perception of reality controls you.
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file83 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 01:34 PM
Response to Reply #15
38. I'm actually surprised....
that this thread has made it to 50 Recommends with a link to infowars.net (Alex Jones) and still hasn't been carted off to the 9/11 dungeon.

Naomi Wolf apparently holds a lot of credit with the moderators, which I like to see.

Years ago if you had a link to anything Alex Jones, no matter what the reason or validity, the thread got locked down by moderators.

It appears as if people are finally realizing these "conspiracy theorists" are really just plain old fact finders.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-02-07 06:45 PM
Response to Reply #38
69. I'm hoping they real;ize that it DOES connect and none of BushInc's operations ever
occured in a vacuum - they were all connected because the goal never changed - IranContra, Iraqgate, BCCI and CIA drugrunning - everything you need to know about the global fascist agenda is in those reports and the documents that have been kept from public view by the last 3 presidents.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 02:21 AM
Response to Original message
16. HARPER'S (7/29/07): Prescott Bush was "key liaison" w/Nazis in 1934 "Plot Against America"
Edited on Sat Dec-01-07 02:59 AM by leveymg
http://www.harpers.org/archive/2007/07/hbc-90000651


TITLE 1934: The Plot Against America
DEPARTMENT No Comment
BY Scott Horton
PUBLISHED July 28, 2007

I’m back from the land of heather and thistles, not to mention wee drams and lukewarm ale, but on my way out a friend at the BBC alerted me to this, a not-to-miss program on the BBC this morning, accessible over the next several days by internet. It’s the story of the Plot Against America. I don’t mean the Philip Roth novel, nor even the Sinclair Lewis book, It Can’t Happen Here, but rather the historical events upon which these two works of fiction were based.

In November 1934, federal investigators uncovered an amazing plot involving some two dozen senior businessmen, a good many of them Wall Street financiers, to topple the government of the United States and install a fascist dictatorship. Roth’s novel is developed from several strands of this factual account; he assumed the plot is actually carried out, whereas in fact an alert FDR shut it down but stopped short of retaliatory measures against the plotters. A key element of the plot involved a retired prominent general who was to have raised a private army of 500,000 men from unemployed veterans and who blew the whistle when he learned more of what the plot entailed. The plot was heavily funded and well developed and had strong links with fascist forces abroad. A story in the New York Times and several other newspapers reported on it, and a special Congressional committee was created to conduct an investigation. The records of this committee were scrubbed and sealed away in the National Archives, where they have only recently been made available.

The Congressional committee kept the names of many of the participants under wraps and no criminal action was ever brought against them. But a few names have leaked out. And one is Prescott Bush, the grandfather of the incumbent president. Prescott Bush was of course deep into the business of the Hamburg-America Lines, and had tight relations throughout this period with the new Government that had come to power in Germany a year earlier under Chancellor Aldoph Hitler. It appears that Bush was to have formed a key liaison for the group with the new German government.

Prescott Bush, of course, went on to service as a U.S. Senator from Connecticut, and his son, George H.W. Bush emerged from World War II as a hero.

The Plot Against America portrayed in this episode of the BBC series “Document” gives fascinating insight into a dark and little known piece of American history in which the nation stood on the brink of betrayal. The role of the most powerful political dynastic family in the nation’s history in this whole affair is shocking.


Some of the other prominent figures in American finance and industry involved in this coup plot were "leading officers of the Morgan and Du Pont empires. This included some of America's richest and most famous names of the time:

Irenee Du Pont - Right-wing chemical industrialist and founder of the American Liberty League, the organization assigned to execute the plot.
Grayson Murphy - Director of Goodyear, Bethlehem Steel and a group of J.P. Morgan banks.
William Doyle - Former state commander of the American Legion and a central plotter of the coup.
John Davis - Former Democratic presidential candidate and a senior attorney for J.P. Morgan.
Al Smith - Roosevelt's bitter political foe from New York. Smith was a former governor of New York and a codirector of the American Liberty League.
John J. Raskob - A high-ranking Du Pont officer and a former chairman of the Democratic Party. In later decades, Raskob would become a "Knight of Malta," a Roman Catholic Religious Order with a high percentage of CIA spies, including CIA Directors William Casey, William Colby and John McCone.
Robert Clark - One of Wall Street's richest bankers and stockbrokers.
Gerald MacGuire - Bond salesman for Clark, and a former commander of the Connecticut American Legion. MacGuire was the key recruiter to General Butler."
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/2/27/112936/440 ; http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/Coup.htm

BOTTOM LINE: When you put together the new National Archives evidence contained in the BBC report referenced by Klein and Horton with the older material published about Gen. Butler, we now have solid sourcing to establish the following:

In 1934, Prescott Bush conspired with leading figures on Wall St. to form an alliance with Nazi Germany in an attempt to overthrow FDR.

Treason.




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stubtoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #16
29. Fascinating. There's an eerie echo re: how they got away with it:
"...FDR shut it down but stopped short of retaliatory measures against the plotters."

Is that anything like how Congress is not pressing for investigations/inquires/impeachment proceedings?

Why does the BFEE continue to operate unscathed??

This just makes my head hurt.
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leftist_not_liberal Donating Member (408 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #29
46. Like the liberals in 19th century Russia,
liberals in the America of the compromise-with-socialists New Deal era and even unto today have their own bourgeois rackets to protect...same as it ever was from Alexander II to Bill Clinton.
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leftist_not_liberal Donating Member (408 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #16
45. And there is the slavery...
On March 19, 1934, Prescott Bush handed Averell Harriman a copy of that day's New York Times. The Polish government was applying to take over Consolidated Silesian Steel Corporation and Upper Silesian Coal and Steel Company from'"German and American interests" because of rampant "mismanagement, excessive borrowing, fictitious bookkeeping and gambling in securities." The Polish government required the owners of the company, which accounted for over 45% of Poland's steel production, to pay at least its full share of back taxes. Bush and Harriman would eventually hire attorney John Foster Dulles to help cover up any improprieties that might arise under investigative scrutiny.

Hitler's invasion of Poland in 1939 ended the debate about Consolidated Silesian Steel Corporation and Upper Silesian Coal and Steel Company. The Nazis knocked the Polish Government off Thyssen, Flick and Harriman's steel company and were planning to replace the paid workers. Originally Hitler promised Stalin they would share Poland and use Soviet prisoners as slaves in Polish factories. Hitler's promise never actually materialized and he eventually invaded Russia.

1940s: Business As Usual

Consolidated Silesian Steel Corporation was located near the Polish town of Oswiecim, one of Poland's richest mineral regions. That was where Hitler set up the Auschwitz concentration camp. When the plan to work Soviet prisoners fell through, the Nazis transferred Jews, communists, gypsies and other minority populations to the camp. The prisoners of Auschwitz who were able to work were shipped to 30 different companies. One of the companies was the vast Consolidated Silesian Steel Corporation.

"Nobody's made the connection before between Consolidated Silesian Steel Corporation, Auschwitz and Prescott Bush," John Loftus told Clamor.

"That was the reason why Auschwitz was built there. The coal deposits could be processed into either coal or additives for aviation gasoline."

Even though Thyssen and Flick's Consolidated Steel was in their possession, Hitler's invasions across Europe spooked them, bringing back memories of World War I. Thyssen and Flick sold Consolidated Steel to UBC. Under the complete control of Harriman and management of Bush, the company became Silesian American Corporation which became part of UBC and Harriman's portfolio of 15 corporations. Thyssen quickly moved to Switzerland and later France to hide from the terror about to be unleashed by the Nazi war machine he had helped build.

A portion of the slave labor force in Poland was "managed by Prescott Bush," according to a Dutch intelligence agent. In 1941, slave labor had become the lifeblood of the Nazi war machine. The resources of Poland's rich steel and coal field played an essential part in Hitler's invasion of Europe.
http://clamormagazine.org/issues/14/feature3-2.php
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Hieronymus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-02-07 09:14 PM
Response to Reply #16
70. Shameful, behavior by Prescott Bush and others. The father
plotting the overthrow of our government, while the son serves in the war. Sounds like "The Manchurian Candidate".
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 03:35 AM
Response to Original message
18. How long have some of these Bush family facts been known of?
How could we not have been alerted long before 2000?
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 04:18 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. They've been known since the 1934 Congressional hearings, but parts of the hearing
record detailing the role of major banking and industrial figures behind the plot was never publicly released. Apparently, the materials referenced by BBC mentioning Prescott Bush were part of those records sent to the National Archives, but not made part of the official hearing record. Also, the major media of the day downplayed and denegrated the story, and still continues to keep a lid on it. It's long been known that Prescott Bush and George Herbert Walker managed an American bank and several companies tied to Nazi Germany, but Prescott's role in the Wall St. plot to overthrow FDR is new information that just came out this summer.
See, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_Plot


Butler said he spoke for thirty minutes with Gerald MacGuire. MacGuire was a bond salesman for Robert Sterling Clark, an heir to the Singer Sewing Machine fortune, an art collector who lived mostly in Paris, and one of Wall Street's richest investors. MacGuire was a former commander of the Connecticut American Legion and had been an activist for the gold currency movement that Clark sponsored. <18>

In attempting to recruit Butler, MacGuire may have played on the general's loyalty toward his fellow veterans. Knowing of an upcoming bonus in 1935 for World War I veterans, Butler said MacGuire told him, "We want to see the soldiers' bonus paid in gold. We do not want the soldier to have rubber money or paper money." Such names as Al Smith, Roosevelt's political foe and former governor of New York, and Irénée du Pont, a chemical industrialist, were said to be the financial and organizational backbone of the plot. Butler stated that once the conspirators were in power, they would protect Roosevelt from other plotters.<10>

Given a successful coup, Butler said that the plan was for him to have held near-absolute power in the newly created position of "Secretary of General Affairs," while Roosevelt would have assumed a figurehead role.

Reaction to Butler's testimony by the media and business elite was dismissive or hostile. The majority of media outlets, including The New York Times, Philadelphia Post,<11> and Time Magazine ridiculed or downplayed his claims, saying they lacked evidence. After the committee concluded, The New York Times and Time Magazine downplayed the conclusions of the committee.<12>

The committee deleted extensive excerpts from the report relating to Wall Street financiers including J.P. Morgan & Co., the Du Pont interests, Remington Arms, and others allegedly involved in the plot attempt. As of 1975, a full transcript of the hearings had yet to be traced.<13>

Those accused of the plotting by Butler all denied any involvement. MacGuire was the only figure identified by Butler who testified before the committee. Others involved were actually called to appear to testify, though never were forced to testify.


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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #19
28. Interesting.
So this is still "news" to the world. I hope many people quickly learn of this generations-long, fascist plot. We need this to be a major media story. Is anyone making a documentary on it, I wonder?
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #28
30. Oiver Stone owns the rights to a script based on this, but hasn't found backers for the project
Again, it all comes down to money. The corporate Right has it, the rest of us don't -- so, don't expect to hear this story told fairly and fully in the major corporate-owned media. :-(
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Hieronymus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-02-07 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #30
71. Once we have a Democratic president and congress, perhaps the film
can be made.
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leftist_not_liberal Donating Member (408 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #19
47. Samuel Bush's Buckeye Casting Co.
stamped gun barrels for Remington Arms.

One big happy family.

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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #18
27. They are in the archives. I listed all the boxes where they can be found
when I first started posting here so they are in the DU archives. I do not know when these particular boxes in the US archives became open to the public or if they still are.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #27
31. Can you repost that information on this string, or PM me?
Edited on Sat Dec-01-07 12:51 PM by leveymg
I'm in the DC area and will go to the Archives. I particularly want to know the box-page numbers containing info on Prescott Bush and George Herbert Walker.

Sensitive materials are generally opened after 50 years, so these should have been available since the Reagan-Bush years. As to why this material wasn't unsealed in 1984, assuming it wasn't, is a very good question.

Thanks - Mark

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RFKJrNews Donating Member (760 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #31
61. It wasn't unsealed in 1984 because...
oh, just a wild guess, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say it might have been because George H.W. Bush was Vice President at the time?

The story certainly isn't new...it's been around since 1934 (although it was suppressed in the media), but I think it points to the inability of most Americans to imagine that a coup could ever happen here.

I hope Oliver Stone does make that movie. He has the power to shape opinion, and love or hate his "JFK" film, no one can argue the fact that his film played a tremendous part in getting the government to release more JFK assassination files in 1992 and forced Congress to re-open the case for closer inspection.

Because of Stone's film, more young Americans began to question whether 11-22-63 was an inside job. And because of Alex Jones' documentary films, increasing numbers of Americans are asking the same question about 9-11-01.

Truth really is stranger than fiction - you can't make this shit up! The 1934 attempted coup story is one of the greatest stories never told - and it NEEDS to be told - now more than ever. If a filmmaker did it right, the end result could be extremely powerful.



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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #18
39. It was all known. Americans are taught history by coaches, so history isn't cool.
We tend to forget stuff that happened two years ago.
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #18
62. Sadly no one was listening.....some were ringing the warning
bells but were being shut down..by the media and by other aggressive means...
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 08:16 AM
Response to Original message
21. "history shows the only safe course for preserving freedom in such a climate...
Edited on Sat Dec-01-07 08:23 AM by Seabiscuit
is to prosecute and jail the protagonists of the coup as early as possible, a process many would argue should have been enacted several years ago."

Exactly.

We have only one sure course: IMPEACHMENT, conviction, removal from office, then CRIMINAL INDICTMENT, TRIAL, CONVICTION AND IMPRISONMENT of the entire fascist neo-con Bush cartel.

A second course is to leave it to our Democratic leaders in Congress to help us win back the Presidency and a filibuster-proof majority of Democrats in both houses of Congress in 2008. This is not likely to happen, since that leadership doesn't have the guts or the integrity to pursue the first option which should have begun last January when we first had the opportunity and since voting machines are stealing our votes because this same leadership has never had the guts or the integrity to do anything about the election fraud being perpetrated on the American people since 2000. Of course, one can hope that if we at least win the White House and someone like Kucinich or Edwards is in charge of appointing an attorney general with backbone, they may be able to hunt down, indict, convict and imprison these neocon bastards some day.

The final course is to sit back and let the fascists continue play out their agenda from their fascist playbook, and within just a few years you or you or you or your relative, friend, or neighbor may be next person plucked from bed by Blackwater mercenaries and shipped off to a secret CIA torture prison in Egypt or Turkey or Syria or Iraq or Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia without anyone knowing what happened to you (beyond those responsible for the plucking). And your sons and daughters will grow up, if they're lucky to survive at all, never knowing there was something called the U.S. Constitution. And the shirts they will be allowed to wear, under penalty of "rendition", will only come in two colors: black and brown.

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SpiralHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 08:54 AM
Response to Original message
22. Thank you for your courage to speak the truth, Naomi
When all of the so-called journalists in America have failed repeatedly to summon the gumption to tell the citizens of this nation about the traitorous Nazi-supporting activities of the Bush famly.

Thank you.
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TheUnspeakable Donating Member (960 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 08:59 AM
Response to Original message
23. k&r
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. Watching Bill Moyer's Journal last night
and seeing him cover these type stories, I'm curious if he has covered this one. A lot of good people who are hypnotized by the media need to find out about this crucial information.
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L0oniX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
32. K&R
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leftist_not_liberal Donating Member (408 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #32
50. I prefer my t-shirt be a bit more specific
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Senator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 01:08 PM
Response to Original message
34. K&R&ImpeachToWin08
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glowing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
36. The real history of the Americas is absolutely fascinating from a
historical precedent, and insanly disgusting and frightening when you are subjected to living in the it. The history books and lessons taught in school are woefully neglected. I happened to have a history teacher who loved the Civil War and the Supreme Court. Had I been taught that Grandpa Bush had coercion with the Nazis and was implicated in a plot to overthrow the United States, then I doubt the family would be where it is today... certainly, the people would not have elected two of the heirs to its thrown.

History really is quite important. There's a lot of discussion on Cuba and its history and who's right and Castro and the CIA and JFK... Interesting to talk to people like my mom who remebers it very well and is a history buff in her own right. So, I decided to educate myself on the history of Cuba from the times of slavery and sugar/ rum running to present day. AND while Castro is not the shining exemplory leader, he's far from being the worst. I beleive he had a bit of that power bug when he was younger and he wanted to throw Corporate Business a monkey wrench.. Its the same with Cavez now. It seems to me he likes his power, not the nicest guy, but far from being as disgusting as George Bush (El Diablo). He is ruling as a socialist. He doesn't mind fair market trade, but insists that companies, if using natural resources from his country, pay those rights back to the people.. Hell, if we did that here in the USA, I bet we wouldn't have to pay taxes. Imagine if the oil Gods had to pay us user fees from extracting our resources out of our nation.. same with all mineral rights. Of course, the corporations don't like this.. And, in general, the world bodies don't like Chavez because they cannot control the country. The CIA coup didn't work and seems not to be working now (did anyone read the excerpt where they found the documents of the current scheme to propandize the current term limit vote?). Anyway, Chavez paid off the world bank. That country doesn't owe anyone a damn dime. They print their own money. They control their GDP. They are becoming a very rich nation. If this catches on with the rest of the South American country-people's, the whole banana republics would be a thing of the past. This is the reason our media makes Chavez the bad guy. If they had any sense of what Chavez is trying to do to make society more equal, then they might actually like that idea and insist on it for themselves. This would be bad for the neo-con agenda and fascist rule all together.
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mojowork_n Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
40. I read another account of that same coup, with
General Smedley ("War is a racket") Butler in the role of the man who exposed the whole thing.

Here it is, in extensive detail:

It started with the American Quisling, and the "prayer breakfast" group

Copied and pasted into a Word file, the whole thing goes 82 pages. I thought it was pretty interesting.

Although not completely unrelated, this is another great book that many people interested in the topic might also want a look at:

American Jew travels to Germany immediately after WWII, and on the down low, meets and befriends low-level, devoted Nazis...It's called "They Thought They Were Free: The Germans from 1933 -- 1945", by Milton Mayer

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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 02:31 PM
Response to Original message
41. The way to fight Fascism in the U.S. is to draw on American characteristics and virtues.
1. Americans tend to value rugged individualism more than group think or bandwagon action. Our icons are Shane, Gary Cooper from High Noon, Mr. Smith goes to Washington. Fascism subordinates the individual to the state or nationalism. American's individualism is why you see people cheer the moonshiners and the outlaws and the monsters in movies. It is one of the reasons why it will be very difficult for Italian or German style Fascism to ever get established here. Too many people will be too ready to stand up and proclaim "The Emperor Has No Clothes."

2. Americans are just as xenophobic as anyone on earth when it comes to the group or people in the abstract, but they are quick to identify with the individual (see #1 above) because of the way that they admire the individual. Since Fascism almost always gets started by identifying a group as "outsiders" to be feared so that the majority will give up their civil liberties and also their humanity, a key to fighting Fascism in the US is to put a human face on members of the targeted groups. John Steinbeck did this with The Grapes of Wrath when he created an entire novel about the so called Oakies, revealing that poverty was not slothful or dumb or criminal, it was human.

3. Appeal to pride in the American Revolution. All men ( and women ) are created equal. This country was founded to escape the tyranny of King George. Quote the Founders. Americans dislike monarchies and they value fairness, in large part because of the history of our founding.

4. Appeal to religion. Or to secular family/community values. Harper Lee shows this in To Kill a Mockingbird when Scout defuses a lynch mob by reminding the participants that they are also parents. Lots of people dis' religion on these boards, but non mainstream sects like Buddhism can be very useful is giving people the courage to stand up against Fascism. And Americans value freedom of religious expression (one of our Constitutional rights) and will sit down and listen to an argument if you say it comes from your religion in a way that they often won't if you say that it is economic.

5. Americans secretly fear the government a lot more than people in most countries(except maybe Australia). Hell, most of us are not far removed from our immigrant ancestors who came here from countries that we felt alienated from. We are not by nature good little soldiers of the state. If the government tells us to, we will start looking for reasons why we shouldn't.

6. We are diverse. It is going to be damn hard to create a racial or ethnic solidarity movement in this country that encompasses a majority, since there will be infighting.

These are some of the reasons why I believe that the KKK failed to do in the 1920s what Mussolini and the Nazis did, despite all that financial backing from Bush and the Melons and their like. That does not mean that we will not come up with our own uniquely American form of Fascism. Danger signs are when the authors of a Fascist movement attempt to negate any of these American strengths.

Let's see...

1. Television and mass culture has been trying to homogenize us for several decades. Has it worked? Depends upon which part of the country you live in. The South has always been a bastion of conformity, at least in small towns. West Texas has a lot of rugged individualism. Cities are individualist. Suburbs teach conformity.

2. Segregation is what makes the difference here. In cities , people interact with lots of different types of people. Suburbs and segregation make sure that people have no chance to see the humanity of other types of people.

3. Fail to teach history in schools or have coaches teach it in a boring way. Federalists rewrite it. Start eroding the Constitution and civil rights and show people that it does not hurt at all!

4. Co-opt religion. Make all religion that is not right wing Protestant, Catholic or Jewish suspect. Emphasis the Old Testament. Denounce left leaning religious groups. Make religion seem so onerous that liberal groups declare that only atheism is acceptable for liberals and leftists.

5. ----- (When they start making the government look benign or friendly, watch out. This is how you know that Dick Cheney is not a Fascist. If he was Fascist, he would act like W. all smiles and phony compassionate conservatism. His "Go fuck yourself" is the sign that he is an honest robber baron. On the other hand, W. is the very epitome of a Fascist leader.)

6. When they start clamping down in immigration and demand that we all speak English and want everything to be the same so that we will all be able to work together and get along in a a single nationalist movement.


Hmmm. Who would have guessed that Dick Cheney could be democracy's best friend, at least from a propaganda point of view?
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leftist_not_liberal Donating Member (408 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #41
43. Fascism is inevitable under capitalism
American mythology cannot and does not change that fact.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #43
52. Nothing is inevitable, except that "iron rules" turn to rust.
Present-day Russia is far closer to a Fascist state than the U.S. I doubt if 19th Century economic theory of any type -- Marxist or Classical -- can explain that.

Mythology is more than mere superstructure. It defines the repeating patterns of social norms and belief systems that we call culture. American mythology is no more or less powerful than any other, but it very real.

American fascism wouldn't have the same flavor as the 20th Century Italian or German variety. The closest we came to it here was the 1924 Ku Klux Klan March on Washington. But, even that, was a transcient phenomenon, that drew on a generalized revulsion to the experience of World War One and white fears of Negro assimilation. 21st Century authoriarian rule in America wouldn't be overtly racist. It might be selectively xenophobic, but more imperial and inclusive, less defined by opposition to a racial or national Other.
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leftist_not_liberal Donating Member (408 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #52
55. Present-day Russia is also
mafia-driven capitalism. Nothing original about that.
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leftist_not_liberal Donating Member (408 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 03:07 PM
Response to Original message
44. Recommended
From an address to a joint session of the US Congress: President George W. Bush.

"Americans are asking ``Why do they hate us?'' They hate what they see right here in this chamber: a democratically elected government. Their leaders are self-appointed. They hate our freedoms: our freedom of religion, our freedom of speech, our freedom to vote and assemble and disagree with each other. " George W. Bush, 20 September, 2001

http://www.indystar.com/library/factfiles/crime/national/2001/sept11/transcripts/0921bush.html

From Goebbels' New Year address to Germany

They hate our people because it is decent, brave, industrious, hardworking and intelligent. They hate our views, our social policies, and our accomplishments. They hate us as a Reich and as a community. They have forced us into a struggle for life and death. We will defend ourselves accordingly. All is clear between us and our enemies. Dr. Paul Joseph Goebbels 31 December 1939

http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/goeb21.htm
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quiethm75 Donating Member (27 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
48. kicked
:kick:
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biermeister Donating Member (425 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #48
53. 10 steps by Naomi Wolf
Fascist America, in 10 easy steps


From Hitler to Pinochet and beyond, history shows there are certain steps that any would-be dictator must take to destroy constitutional freedoms. And, argues Naomi Wolf, George Bush and his administration seem to be taking them all

Tuesday April 24, 2007
The Guardian

Last autumn, there was a military coup in Thailand. The leaders of the coup took a number of steps, rather systematically, as if they had a shopping list. In a sense, they did. Within a matter of days, democracy had been closed down: the coup leaders declared martial law, sent armed soldiers into residential areas, took over radio and TV stations, issued restrictions on the press, tightened some limits on travel, and took certain activists into custody.



They were not figuring these things out as they went along. If you look at history, you can see that there is essentially a blueprint for turning an open society into a dictatorship. That blueprint has been used again and again in more and less bloody, more and less terrifying ways. But it is always effective. It is very difficult and arduous to create and sustain a democracy - but history shows that closing one down is much simpler. You simply have to be willing to take the 10 steps.

As difficult as this is to contemplate, it is clear, if you are willing to look, that each of these 10 steps has already been initiated today in the United States by the Bush administration.

Because Americans like me were born in freedom, we have a hard time even considering that it is possible for us to become as unfree - domestically - as many other nations. Because we no longer learn much about our rights or our system of government - the task of being aware of the constitution has been outsourced from citizens' ownership to being the domain of professionals such as lawyers and professors - we scarcely recognise the checks and balances that the founders put in place, even as they are being systematically dismantled. Because we don't learn much about European history, the setting up of a department of "homeland" security - remember who else was keen on the word "homeland" - didn't raise the alarm bells it might have.

It is my argument that, beneath our very noses, George Bush and his administration are using time-tested tactics to close down an open society. It is time for us to be willing to think the unthinkable - as the author and political journalist Joe Conason, has put it, that it can happen here. And that we are further along than we realise.

Conason eloquently warned of the danger of American authoritarianism. I am arguing that we need also to look at the lessons of European and other kinds of fascism to understand the potential seriousness of the events we see unfolding in the US.

1. Invoke a terrifying internal and external enemy

After we were hit on September 11 2001, we were in a state of national shock. Less than six weeks later, on October 26 2001, the USA Patriot Act was passed by a Congress that had little chance to debate it; many said that they scarcely had time to read it. We were told we were now on a "war footing"; we were in a "global war" against a "global caliphate" intending to "wipe out civilisation". There have been other times of crisis in which the US accepted limits on civil liberties, such as during the civil war, when Lincoln declared martial law, and the second world war, when thousands of Japanese-American citizens were interned. But this situation, as Bruce Fein of the American Freedom Agenda notes, is unprecedented: all our other wars had an endpoint, so the pendulum was able to swing back toward freedom; this war is defined as open-ended in time and without national boundaries in space - the globe itself is the battlefield. "This time," Fein says, "there will be no defined end."

Creating a terrifying threat - hydra-like, secretive, evil - is an old trick. It can, like Hitler's invocation of a communist threat to the nation's security, be based on actual events (one Wisconsin academic has faced calls for his dismissal because he noted, among other things, that the alleged communist arson, the Reichstag fire of February 1933, was swiftly followed in Nazi Germany by passage of the Enabling Act, which replaced constitutional law with an open-ended state of emergency). Or the terrifying threat can be based, like the National Socialist evocation of the "global conspiracy of world Jewry", on myth.

It is not that global Islamist terrorism is not a severe danger; of course it is. I am arguing rather that the language used to convey the nature of the threat is different in a country such as Spain - which has also suffered violent terrorist attacks - than it is in America. Spanish citizens know that they face a grave security threat; what we as American citizens believe is that we are potentially threatened with the end of civilisation as we know it. Of course, this makes us more willing to accept restrictions on our freedoms.

2. Create a gulag

Once you have got everyone scared, the next step is to create a prison system outside the rule of law (as Bush put it, he wanted the American detention centre at Guantánamo Bay to be situated in legal "outer space") - where torture takes place.

At first, the people who are sent there are seen by citizens as outsiders: troublemakers, spies, "enemies of the people" or "criminals". Initially, citizens tend to support the secret prison system; it makes them feel safer and they do not identify with the prisoners. But soon enough, civil society leaders - opposition members, labour activists, clergy and journalists - are arrested and sent there as well.

This process took place in fascist shifts or anti-democracy crackdowns ranging from Italy and Germany in the 1920s and 1930s to the Latin American coups of the 1970s and beyond. It is standard practice for closing down an open society or crushing a pro-democracy uprising.

With its jails in Iraq and Afghanistan, and, of course, Guantánamo in Cuba, where detainees are abused, and kept indefinitely without trial and without access to the due process of the law, America certainly has its gulag now. Bush and his allies in Congress recently announced they would issue no information about the secret CIA "black site" prisons throughout the world, which are used to incarcerate people who have been seized off the street.

Gulags in history tend to metastasise, becoming ever larger and more secretive, ever more deadly and formalised. We know from first-hand accounts, photographs, videos and government documents that people, innocent and guilty, have been tortured in the US-run prisons we are aware of and those we can't investigate adequately.

But Americans still assume this system and detainee abuses involve only scary brown people with whom they don't generally identify. It was brave of the conservative pundit William Safire to quote the anti-Nazi pastor Martin Niemöller, who had been seized as a political prisoner: "First they came for the Jews." Most Americans don't understand yet that the destruction of the rule of law at Guantánamo set a dangerous precedent for them, too.

By the way, the establishment of military tribunals that deny prisoners due process tends to come early on in a fascist shift. Mussolini and Stalin set up such tribunals. On April 24 1934, the Nazis, too, set up the People's Court, which also bypassed the judicial system: prisoners were held indefinitely, often in isolation, and tortured, without being charged with offences, and were subjected to show trials. Eventually, the Special Courts became a parallel system that put pressure on the regular courts to abandon the rule of law in favour of Nazi ideology when making decisions.

3. Develop a thug caste

When leaders who seek what I call a "fascist shift" want to close down an open society, they send paramilitary groups of scary young men out to terrorise citizens. The Blackshirts roamed the Italian countryside beating up communists; the Brownshirts staged violent rallies throughout Germany. This paramilitary force is especially important in a democracy: you need citizens to fear thug violence and so you need thugs who are free from prosecution.

The years following 9/11 have proved a bonanza for America's security contractors, with the Bush administration outsourcing areas of work that traditionally fell to the US military. In the process, contracts worth hundreds of millions of dollars have been issued for security work by mercenaries at home and abroad. In Iraq, some of these contract operatives have been accused of involvement in torturing prisoners, harassing journalists and firing on Iraqi civilians. Under Order 17, issued to regulate contractors in Iraq by the one-time US administrator in Baghdad, Paul Bremer, these contractors are immune from prosecution

Yes, but that is in Iraq, you could argue; however, after Hurricane Katrina, the Department of Homeland Security hired and deployed hundreds of armed private security guards in New Orleans. The investigative journalist Jeremy Scahill interviewed one unnamed guard who reported having fired on unarmed civilians in the city. It was a natural disaster that underlay that episode - but the administration's endless war on terror means ongoing scope for what are in effect privately contracted armies to take on crisis and emergency management at home in US cities.

Thugs in America? Groups of angry young Republican men, dressed in identical shirts and trousers, menaced poll workers counting the votes in Florida in 2000. If you are reading history, you can imagine that there can be a need for "public order" on the next election day. Say there are protests, or a threat, on the day of an election; history would not rule out the presence of a private security firm at a polling station "to restore public order".

4. Set up an internal surveillance system

In Mussolini's Italy, in Nazi Germany, in communist East Germany, in communist China - in every closed society - secret police spy on ordinary people and encourage neighbours to spy on neighbours. The Stasi needed to keep only a minority of East Germans under surveillance to convince a majority that they themselves were being watched.

In 2005 and 2006, when James Risen and Eric Lichtblau wrote in the New York Times about a secret state programme to wiretap citizens' phones, read their emails and follow international financial transactions, it became clear to ordinary Americans that they, too, could be under state scrutiny.

In closed societies, this surveillance is cast as being about "national security"; the true function is to keep citizens docile and inhibit their activism and dissent.

5. Harass citizens' groups

The fifth thing you do is related to step four - you infiltrate and harass citizens' groups. It can be trivial: a church in Pasadena, whose minister preached that Jesus was in favour of peace, found itself being investigated by the Internal Revenue Service, while churches that got Republicans out to vote, which is equally illegal under US tax law, have been left alone.

Other harassment is more serious: the American Civil Liberties Union reports that thousands of ordinary American anti-war, environmental and other groups have been infiltrated by agents: a secret Pentagon database includes more than four dozen peaceful anti-war meetings, rallies or marches by American citizens in its category of 1,500 "suspicious incidents". The equally secret Counterintelligence Field Activity (Cifa) agency of the Department of Defense has been gathering information about domestic organisations engaged in peaceful political activities: Cifa is supposed to track "potential terrorist threats" as it watches ordinary US citizen activists. A little-noticed new law has redefined activism such as animal rights protests as "terrorism". So the definition of "terrorist" slowly expands to include the opposition.

6. Engage in arbitrary detention and release

This scares people. It is a kind of cat-and-mouse game. Nicholas D Kristof and Sheryl WuDunn, the investigative reporters who wrote China Wakes: the Struggle for the Soul of a Rising Power, describe pro-democracy activists in China, such as Wei Jingsheng, being arrested and released many times. In a closing or closed society there is a "list" of dissidents and opposition leaders: you are targeted in this way once you are on the list, and it is hard to get off the list.

In 2004, America's Transportation Security Administration confirmed that it had a list of passengers who were targeted for security searches or worse if they tried to fly. People who have found themselves on the list? Two middle-aged women peace activists in San Francisco; liberal Senator Edward Kennedy; a member of Venezuela's government - after Venezuela's president had criticised Bush; and thousands of ordinary US citizens.

Professor Walter F Murphy is emeritus of Princeton University; he is one of the foremost constitutional scholars in the nation and author of the classic Constitutional Democracy. Murphy is also a decorated former marine, and he is not even especially politically liberal. But on March 1 this year, he was denied a boarding pass at Newark, "because I was on the Terrorist Watch list".

"Have you been in any peace marches? We ban a lot of people from flying because of that," asked the airline employee.

"I explained," said Murphy, "that I had not so marched but had, in September 2006, given a lecture at Princeton, televised and put on the web, highly critical of George Bush for his many violations of the constitution."

"That'll do it," the man said.

Anti-war marcher? Potential terrorist. Support the constitution? Potential terrorist. History shows that the categories of "enemy of the people" tend to expand ever deeper into civil life.

James Yee, a US citizen, was the Muslim chaplain at Guantánamo who was accused of mishandling classified documents. He was harassed by the US military before the charges against him were dropped. Yee has been detained and released several times. He is still of interest.

Brandon Mayfield, a US citizen and lawyer in Oregon, was mistakenly identified as a possible terrorist. His house was secretly broken into and his computer seized. Though he is innocent of the accusation against him, he is still on the list.

It is a standard practice of fascist societies that once you are on the list, you can't get off.

7. Target key individuals

Threaten civil servants, artists and academics with job loss if they don't toe the line. Mussolini went after the rectors of state universities who did not conform to the fascist line; so did Joseph Goebbels, who purged academics who were not pro-Nazi; so did Chile's Augusto Pinochet; so does the Chinese communist Politburo in punishing pro-democracy students and professors.

Academe is a tinderbox of activism, so those seeking a fascist shift punish academics and students with professional loss if they do not "coordinate", in Goebbels' term, ideologically. Since civil servants are the sector of society most vulnerable to being fired by a given regime, they are also a group that fascists typically "coordinate" early on: the Reich Law for the Re-establishment of a Professional Civil Service was passed on April 7 1933.

Bush supporters in state legislatures in several states put pressure on regents at state universities to penalise or fire academics who have been critical of the administration. As for civil servants, the Bush administration has derailed the career of one military lawyer who spoke up for fair trials for detainees, while an administration official publicly intimidated the law firms that represent detainees pro bono by threatening to call for their major corporate clients to boycott them.

Elsewhere, a CIA contract worker who said in a closed blog that "waterboarding is torture" was stripped of the security clearance she needed in order to do her job.

Most recently, the administration purged eight US attorneys for what looks like insufficient political loyalty. When Goebbels purged the civil service in April 1933, attorneys were "coordinated" too, a step that eased the way of the increasingly brutal laws to follow.

8. Control the press

Italy in the 1920s, Germany in the 30s, East Germany in the 50s, Czechoslovakia in the 60s, the Latin American dictatorships in the 70s, China in the 80s and 90s - all dictatorships and would-be dictators target newspapers and journalists. They threaten and harass them in more open societies that they are seeking to close, and they arrest them and worse in societies that have been closed already.

The Committee to Protect Journalists says arrests of US journalists are at an all-time high: Josh Wolf (no relation), a blogger in San Francisco, has been put in jail for a year for refusing to turn over video of an anti-war demonstration; Homeland Security brought a criminal complaint against reporter Greg Palast, claiming he threatened "critical infrastructure" when he and a TV producer were filming victims of Hurricane Katrina in Louisiana. Palast had written a bestseller critical of the Bush administration.

Other reporters and writers have been punished in other ways. Joseph C Wilson accused Bush, in a New York Times op-ed, of leading the country to war on the basis of a false charge that Saddam Hussein had acquired yellowcake uranium in Niger. His wife, Valerie Plame, was outed as a CIA spy - a form of retaliation that ended her career.

Prosecution and job loss are nothing, though, compared with how the US is treating journalists seeking to cover the conflict in Iraq in an unbiased way. The Committee to Protect Journalists has documented multiple accounts of the US military in Iraq firing upon or threatening to fire upon unembedded (meaning independent) reporters and camera operators from organisations ranging from al-Jazeera to the BBC. While westerners may question the accounts by al-Jazeera, they should pay attention to the accounts of reporters such as the BBC's Kate Adie. In some cases reporters have been wounded or killed, including ITN's Terry Lloyd in 2003. Both CBS and the Associated Press in Iraq had staff members seized by the US military and taken to violent prisons; the news organisations were unable to see the evidence against their staffers.

Over time in closing societies, real news is supplanted by fake news and false documents. Pinochet showed Chilean citizens falsified documents to back up his claim that terrorists had been about to attack the nation. The yellowcake charge, too, was based on forged papers.

You won't have a shutdown of news in modern America - it is not possible. But you can have, as Frank Rich and Sidney Blumenthal have pointed out, a steady stream of lies polluting the news well. What you already have is a White House directing a stream of false information that is so relentless that it is increasingly hard to sort out truth from untruth. In a fascist system, it's not the lies that count but the muddying. When citizens can't tell real news from fake, they give up their demands for accountability bit by bit.

9. Dissent equals treason

Cast dissent as "treason" and criticism as "espionage'. Every closing society does this, just as it elaborates laws that increasingly criminalise certain kinds of speech and expand the definition of "spy" and "traitor". When Bill Keller, the publisher of the New York Times, ran the Lichtblau/Risen stories, Bush called the Times' leaking of classified information "disgraceful", while Republicans in Congress called for Keller to be charged with treason, and rightwing commentators and news outlets kept up the "treason" drumbeat. Some commentators, as Conason noted, reminded readers smugly that one penalty for violating the Espionage Act is execution.

Conason is right to note how serious a threat that attack represented. It is also important to recall that the 1938 Moscow show trial accused the editor of Izvestia, Nikolai Bukharin, of treason; Bukharin was, in fact, executed. And it is important to remind Americans that when the 1917 Espionage Act was last widely invoked, during the infamous 1919 Palmer Raids, leftist activists were arrested without warrants in sweeping roundups, kept in jail for up to five months, and "beaten, starved, suffocated, tortured and threatened with death", according to the historian Myra MacPherson. After that, dissent was muted in America for a decade.

In Stalin's Soviet Union, dissidents were "enemies of the people". National Socialists called those who supported Weimar democracy "November traitors".

And here is where the circle closes: most Americans do not realise that since September of last year - when Congress wrongly, foolishly, passed the Military Commissions Act of 2006 - the president has the power to call any US citizen an "enemy combatant". He has the power to define what "enemy combatant" means. The president can also delegate to anyone he chooses in the executive branch the right to define "enemy combatant" any way he or she wants and then seize Americans accordingly.

Even if you or I are American citizens, even if we turn out to be completely innocent of what he has accused us of doing, he has the power to have us seized as we are changing planes at Newark tomorrow, or have us taken with a knock on the door; ship you or me to a navy brig; and keep you or me in isolation, possibly for months, while awaiting trial. (Prolonged isolation, as psychiatrists know, triggers psychosis in otherwise mentally healthy prisoners. That is why Stalin's gulag had an isolation cell, like Guantánamo's, in every satellite prison. Camp 6, the newest, most brutal facility at Guantánamo, is all isolation cells.)

We US citizens will get a trial eventually - for now. But legal rights activists at the Center for Constitutional Rights say that the Bush administration is trying increasingly aggressively to find ways to get around giving even US citizens fair trials. "Enemy combatant" is a status offence - it is not even something you have to have done. "We have absolutely moved over into a preventive detention model - you look like you could do something bad, you might do something bad, so we're going to hold you," says a spokeswoman of the CCR.

Most Americans surely do not get this yet. No wonder: it is hard to believe, even though it is true. In every closing society, at a certain point there are some high-profile arrests - usually of opposition leaders, clergy and journalists. Then everything goes quiet. After those arrests, there are still newspapers, courts, TV and radio, and the facades of a civil society. There just isn't real dissent. There just isn't freedom. If you look at history, just before those arrests is where we are now.

10. Suspend the rule of law

The John Warner Defense Authorization Act of 2007 gave the president new powers over the national guard. This means that in a national emergency - which the president now has enhanced powers to declare - he can send Michigan's militia to enforce a state of emergency that he has declared in Oregon, over the objections of the state's governor and its citizens.

Even as Americans were focused on Britney Spears's meltdown and the question of who fathered Anna Nicole's baby, the New York Times editorialised about this shift: "A disturbing recent phenomenon in Washington is that laws that strike to the heart of American democracy have been passed in the dead of night ... Beyond actual insurrection, the president may now use military troops as a domestic police force in response to a natural disaster, a disease outbreak, terrorist attack or any 'other condition'."

Critics see this as a clear violation of the Posse Comitatus Act - which was meant to restrain the federal government from using the military for domestic law enforcement. The Democratic senator Patrick Leahy says the bill encourages a president to declare federal martial law. It also violates the very reason the founders set up our system of government as they did: having seen citizens bullied by a monarch's soldiers, the founders were terrified of exactly this kind of concentration of militias' power over American people in the hands of an oppressive executive or faction.

Of course, the United States is not vulnerable to the violent, total closing-down of the system that followed Mussolini's march on Rome or Hitler's roundup of political prisoners. Our democratic habits are too resilient, and our military and judiciary too independent, for any kind of scenario like that.

Rather, as other critics are noting, our experiment in democracy could be closed down by a process of erosion.

It is a mistake to think that early in a fascist shift you see the profile of barbed wire against the sky. In the early days, things look normal on the surface; peasants were celebrating harvest festivals in Calabria in 1922; people were shopping and going to the movies in Berlin in 1931. Early on, as WH Auden put it, the horror is always elsewhere - while someone is being tortured, children are skating, ships are sailing: "dogs go on with their doggy life ... How everything turns away/ Quite leisurely from the disaster."

As Americans turn away quite leisurely, keeping tuned to internet shopping and American Idol, the foundations of democracy are being fatally corroded. Something has changed profoundly that weakens us unprecedentedly: our democratic traditions, independent judiciary and free press do their work today in a context in which we are "at war" in a "long war" - a war without end, on a battlefield described as the globe, in a context that gives the president - without US citizens realising it yet - the power over US citizens of freedom or long solitary incarceration, on his say-so alone.

That means a hollowness has been expanding under the foundation of all these still- free-looking institutions - and this foundation can give way under certain kinds of pressure. To prevent such an outcome, we have to think about the "what ifs".

What if, in a year and a half, there is another attack - say, God forbid, a dirty bomb? The executive can declare a state of emergency. History shows that any leader, of any party, will be tempted to maintain emergency powers after the crisis has passed. With the gutting of traditional checks and balances, we are no less endangered by a President Hillary than by a President Giuliani - because any executive will be tempted to enforce his or her will through edict rather than the arduous, uncertain process of democratic negotiation and compromise.

What if the publisher of a major US newspaper were charged with treason or espionage, as a rightwing effort seemed to threaten Keller with last year? What if he or she got 10 years in jail? What would the newspapers look like the next day? Judging from history, they would not cease publishing; but they would suddenly be very polite.

Right now, only a handful of patriots are trying to hold back the tide of tyranny for the rest of us - staff at the Center for Constitutional Rights, who faced death threats for representing the detainees yet persisted all the way to the Supreme Court; activists at the American Civil Liberties Union; and prominent conservatives trying to roll back the corrosive new laws, under the banner of a new group called the American Freedom Agenda. This small, disparate collection of people needs everybody's help, including that of Europeans and others internationally who are willing to put pressure on the administration because they can see what a US unrestrained by real democracy at home can mean for the rest of the world.

We need to look at history and face the "what ifs". For if we keep going down this road, the "end of America" could come for each of us in a different way, at a different moment; each of us might have a different moment when we feel forced to look back and think: that is how it was before - and this is the way it is now.

"The accumulation of all powers, legislative, executive, and judiciary, in the same hands ... is the definition of tyranny," wrote James Madison. We still have the choice to stop going down this road; we can stand our ground and fight for our nation, and take up the banner the founders asked us to carry.

· Naomi Wolf's The End of America: A Letter of Warning to a Young Patriot will be published by Chelsea Green in September.
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Ricki Donating Member (51 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #48
54. K&R
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nikto Donating Member (414 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 06:15 PM
Response to Original message
56. This is exactly...
...what the Death penalty should be used for.


Bottom line, when you really face the facts, is that the
deeds done have involved the DEATHS of thousands of Americans
and far more foreigners, to achieve the aim of STEALING billion$
of dollars of taxpayer money, controlling overseas resources
for crony corporations, and privatizing public institutions (the military,
public schools, etc). And this has been done via a policy of LYING and
using an unprecedented level of entirely
un-American secrecy in order to protect their lies.

They have selfishly turned against and HURT this country,
very very deeply, and perhaps even permanently, for nothing more
than their own selfish and criminal purposes.

Bu$hCo and its Big Biz cronies and supporters in the
Corporate Media have proven themselves to be thugs, gangsters and
CRIMINALS of the highest order.

What, and WHO the hell else is The Death penalty FOR, for Godssake!!!!!!!!!!
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #56
63. Agreed...I often say when I read about Italy's Mussolini
solution it makes sense. The citizens would not tolerate the selling out of their countries soul to the Nazi's.....
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dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 06:21 PM
Response to Original message
57. Funny how the other Naomi gets all the ink.
Just one of those strange little coincidences I guess.
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fadedrose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-01-07 09:44 PM
Response to Original message
60. Kick (nm)
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L0oniX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-02-07 01:09 AM
Response to Original message
64. dupe delete
Edited on Sun Dec-02-07 01:10 AM by L0oniX
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HuffleClaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-02-07 08:04 AM
Response to Original message
67. a creeping horror
which goes unnoticed by the 'real' media...
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pat_k Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-02-07 05:53 PM
Response to Original message
68. + failure of 100th Democratic Congress to impeach Poppi and Reagan. . .
Edited on Sun Dec-02-07 05:59 PM by pat_k
May 11, 2006
http://www.commondreams.org/cgi-bin/print.cgi?file=/views06/0511-29.htm">Hey Democrats, Truth Matters!
by Robert Parry

--------------------------
Corrupt officials don't break the system of government. We designed the system to deal with them. It is ultimately the failure of the enforcers that destroys. As loathe as we may be to admit it, it is the failure of the Democratic Congress to impeach -- to enforce -- that has broken our government.

The 100th Congress was derelict. To date, the 110th has been derelict.

Tragically, Pelosi's "off the table" edict constitutes the most reprehensible of all "corrupt bargains" -- trading duty for personal/political gain.

But she, and other Members of the House and Senate, http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3084238&mesg_id=3085825">are not beyond redemption.




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