Clinton Supporters downplay ties to Anti Gay ministers

[illinoisprogressive]

ust one week after criticizing Sen. Barack Obama’s ties to an “ex-gay” minister, supporters of Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (N.Y.) are downplaying her connection to anti-gay figures.

Obama was assailed last week for allowing gospel singer Donnie McClurkin to appear at a South Carolina campaign event, but the endorsement of Clinton by at least two anti-gay black ministers has so far not generated similar outrage.

“I don’t know if that’s the same as, ‘Here’s a microphone — you can speak for my campaign,’” said Ryan Wilson of the South Carolina Gay & Lesbian Pride Movement.

Some of Clinton’s gay supporters, along with unaligned gays such as Wilson, said they’re generally unconcerned that anti-gay ministers Bishop Eddie Long and Rev. Harold Mayberry are supporting the campaign.

Long’s New Birth Missionary Baptist Church in suburban Atlanta once marched against gay marriage and hosts an “ex-gay” ministry. Mayberry has preached against homosexuality to his First African Methodist Episcopal Church in Oakland, Calif.

In interviews this week, Wilson and others said they were not concerned that Clinton had accepted a $1,000 donation from Long or that she recently thanked Mayberry for “fighting for civil rights and equality,” because she has not allowed either minister to speak for the campaign.

for more:
http://washblade.com/2007/11-2/news/national/11496.cfm

[pnwmom]

1. HRC hasn't had any anti-gay figures giving speeches from her platform.

There's a huge difference between taking a donation from someone who doesn't agree with all your positions and giving a bigot a platform on your stage.

[wndycty]

4. But she has anti-gay S.C. legislators as chairpersons of her campaign in that state. . .

. . .let's be consistent.

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MethuenProgressive]

108. Obama's support of anti-gay bigotry is OK, because there's a bigot somewhere else?

What a load of horse shit.

[MethuenProgressive]

109. This ignorance *helps* Obama?

:puke:

[KittyWampus]

54. Sorry, but the Big Picture and actual Issue is pandering to Homophobes. THAT'S the commonality

[pnwmom]

74. The degree of the damage is hugely different though.

HRC didn't give any homophobe a platform and an audience for spouting out thirty minutes of bigotry.

[maddiejoan]

2. How many Gay Pride parades has Mr. Obama marched in?

I'm curious.

[wndycty]

7. He has had a presence in the Chicago Pride parade for years. . .

. . .looking for links now.

[terrya]

112. Not this year

Neither was Governor Blagojevich marching in the Pride Parade this year.

[Skip Intro]

3. The South Carolina Gay & Lesbian Pride Movement says its not the same - its right there in your post

Its not the same as what Obama did.




wow.

[msongs]

5. obama endorsed mcclurkin and gave him a live show to promote his views nt

[babylonsister]

6. How terribly astute of you!

:eyes: Do you have anything else to add, besides slamming Obama? How about addressing what's in the OP? Why don't you ever respond? You post and run. Not very democratic of you.

[wndycty]

9. Those who hate Obama bury their heads when it comes to other candidates or. . .

. . .Obama's deeds on behalf of the LGBT community.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sniffa]

18. of course he won't

that's his steeze.

but since he can't see this i might as weLL post this again:



http://news.lavenderliberal.com/2007/10/23/mr-sniffa-goes-to-boston/

[undercoverduer]

19. This should be good. . .your head is about to explode?

I bet you are one of the many wndycty has put on the "i" list. LOL

[Sapphocrat]

24. And where were YOU, Mr. Obama apologist?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3678121

[alteredstate]

44. Where's post #13?

[babylonsister]

28. Why are you so goddamn angry? Who do you support?

Please, you're milking this.

[Name removed]

34. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[babylonsister]

40. YOU knock it off. Who is shitting on the GLBT community?

Because I will defend your rights and right to say whatever you want, but ad nauseum? Not! As for being hiLLbots, that's another story! THAT'S an insult!

[sniffa]

46. you're obviousLy not defending

see your posts in this thread. if you're an aLLy, i'LL gLadLy take an enemy. at Least they're honest with themseLves

[babylonsister]

77. Yes, sniffa, I'm the enemy. Have at it, and think that. Good luck. nt

[NMMNG]

83. Where were YOU

And all of your "Hillary, blah blah Hillary" friends when I posted this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

ON FRIDAY??

It got hundreds of views, was on the Greatest Page, and I extended personal invitations to two of the instigators to join the thread and nobody cared to.

It just goes to show that none of the Obama worshippers really care about Hillary. They are just using her as a pawn to deflect attention away from Obama and his atrocious behavior.

I do not want to hear another peep about Hillary/hypocrisy in an Obama thread. You all had your chance and you blew it.

[Sapphocrat]

14. And where were YOU, bs?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3678121

[babylonsister]

16. Despite what you may think, I do not chip in on every thread. Actually,

I've tried to stay out of them. I was 'talking' to that particular DUer because she hits and runs, unlike yourself. I think healthy back and forth is good, not hits and runs. So sue me if you don't agree. I also don't have a 'favorite', only a most unfavorite. :D

[Sapphocrat]

21. Interesting...

..which threads you do choose to chime in on.

I have "known" you (in the DU sense) for many years, bs, so you, I believe at your word.

It just scrapes my hide raw to find attempt after attempt after attempt to dismiss the LGBT community as a bunch of "faux-outraged" "Hillbots" -- and then when a LGBT DUer finally finds something to prove we're not what they say we all are, it gets buried, sinks like a stone, is ignored for day and a half -- and then suddenly, abra-ca-fucking-dabra! -- an Obama supporter posts it, and all of a sudden it becomes worthy of comment.

I trust you do see it. You have always been most reasonable in my book -- and I apologize for my anger at you -- but do you see why, again, it appears there is a deliberate, wholesale attempt to make us LGBTs looks like a bunch of crackpots?

[babylonsister]

33. I don't see it. I think the LGBTs are so angry that they aren't getting

past anything. OK, Obama pissed off a lot of people. But come on! It's a done deal and he's been lambasted ad nauseum. I could mention a DUer or two who sounds suspiciously anti-AA, but I won't.

I am not a Clinton supporter. When you can talk to me without bringing up the rev. that Obama had singing, let's talk about the main issues of the candidates.

[sniffa]

37. i get it

you're an apoLogist. nothing more, nothing Less.

thank you for the fucking crumbs.

[babylonsister]

43. For who and why? WTF are you talking about? nt

[FredScuttle]

51. For this

"God delivered me from homosexuality"
-Donnie McClurkin 10/28/07

[FredScuttle]

38. LGBT AREN'T THE ONLY ONES PISSED OFF

I am a straight Democrat and I am horrified at Obama giving an "ex-gay" clown a microphone and a stage to spew his homophobic filth. And he continues to defend the indefensible insult to our LGBT brothers and sisters and Democrats everywhere who value civil rights for all.

Strange why you don't seem bothered by it.

[sniffa]

39. i'm Losing my fucking shit

i can't beLieve this is stiLL going on, and we stiLL have to expLain ad nauseum, and stiLL get marginaLized.

gee, why are you so angry? get over it. :puke:

[FredScuttle]

45. If the tone of Obama's apologists makes you hurl

just imagine the bubble of fantasy and disconnect Obama himself must be in.

[babylonsister]

52. I was bothered that he didn't pull this guy. But I can't think of

one candidate who hasn't pissed me off, or is the perfect 'one'. I also know why Obama did it, to garner more votes. That's what he's doing and everyone is. I'm very sorry for the gay community, but think about it this way. He'd be more agreeable to stand up for the gay community than some of the others. I just think people are shooting someone who might be very beneficial. He's getting lots of negative press, but is it only on DU?

And I will bet everyone now, I'm very sorry I wrote this, and posted it.

[Sapphocrat]

53. No, it is NOT only on DU!

:banghead:

It's all over the MSM, and it's BEEN all over the gay press, online and off, since the beginning. (Although, I know, the "gay press" is considered inferior -- whoa! just like us uppity queers! -- by many on DU. Just think: "Univision" for homos.)

Don't be "sorry" for us, bs -- we don't want your pity. What we want is your UNDERSTANDING, and your SUPPORT, based on that understanding.

If you want to understand why we are so cut to the bone, don't TELL us -- ASK us. Just ASK us why. We're not impossible, we're not unapproachable, and we are NOT tunnel-visioned. It's just that precious few ever ASK, and even fewer ever LISTEN to us. And those who pretend to listen are just waiting to cut us down, AGAIN, and tell us we're just being "hypersensitive," and "unrealistic," and everything else ever used against ANY minority with a beef the majority does not WANT to hear.

But nobody ever fucking ASKS!!!

[sniffa]

55. be carefuL saph

this post wiLL be deLeted. :eyes:

[Sapphocrat]

59. Mine are getting deleted anyway...

One by one by one.

I think it's only a matter of hours, or less, before I'm tasting granite, darlin'.

Six and a half years down the drain. *sigh*

[Forkboy]

61. Nah...you won't get TS'ed

I've had entire subthreads deleted.You're safe.

But, if you did, this statement would be wrong...

Six and a half years down the drain.

I'm sure your words over the years have reached and affected many.That's hardly going "down the drain". Whether you're here in person or not, the words, and point of those words, remains. :thumbsup:

[Sapphocrat]

78. You're most kind, FB...

...and I love ya dearly, but it has all been a waste. A big, fucking waste. Just look at this thread. The only people who get it are the people who always got it, long before I came along.

I don't know why I bother. If I had half a brain, I'd stop bothering. (You know what they say about wresting with pigs?)

[babylonsister]

58. Damn! Sappho, great post, and thank you! We cannot

ask on DU, really. And you're a great person. And I'm not sorry for you, I MISS being in this kind of hot stuff company.

[Sapphocrat]

71. Why can't you ask?

No, no, really, I'm not being facetious at all. Why can't you ask on DU? There's no rule I know of... unless you mean it would just be be a bad idea to ask on DU -- in which case, oh, God! do I ever understand that.

I think you're a great person too -- and I think we're just having a major disconnect where there doesn't need to be one.

Look, I'm pretty much expecting to be banned tonight (after my umpteenth post has been deleted), but I would like very much to continue this convo, and figure out where we do agree (I suspect we're on the same page, but just missing signals), so if I'm "disappeared," hit my news blog and use the contact link.

(My ISP won't disappear me, as long as I pay them. LOL)

[Sapphocrat]

41. Aw, geez, bs!

It may be just another "issue" to you, but don't you see -- don't you really, truly see -- this is my LIFE everybody is fucking with, dismissing, passing off, "moving on" from!

My God, has everything I've posted in six and a half years been a complete waste of time?

You really, truly don't see it?

Jesus Christ, "done deal"? My "deal" isn't "done" for the rest of all the rotten days in this homophobic world of shit I have left to live in.

You really don't see it?

Goddamn. God-fucking-damn. Why, oh fucking WHY, can't any one of us explain it to any one of you in a way that will bring on that one "lightbulb moment"? :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[babylonsister]

56. Wow. I'm honestly sorry you think that way, and

if "I" have caused you any pain, I am sorry-really. I do think I 'get' it, but there are so many issues in this world, someone like myself has to pick and choose. I am sorry you think I'm a heathen; why?

[wndycty]

22. If someone is calling you out for that welcome to the club. . .

. . .it happens to me everytime. There are a ton of threads I don't see, actually I'm blocked from seeing.

[Sapphocrat]

25. Figures -- I must be on wndycty's ignore list too.

Just fucking figures. Run away and hide.

Someone who STILL understands what's really going on, quote my question to him, will you? It's valid, and you all know it.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Sapphocrat]

30. You know what amazes me, sniffa?

None of the Obama fetishits who apparently have me on ignore have ever engaged me directly.

Now THAT is remarkable. And revolting.

Got any new cheezbuggah cat photos? 'Cause that's about all that's going to keep this thread alive.

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

49. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[NMMNG]

86. Ask, and ye shall receive

[FredScuttle]

42. You have all these posters on ignore

and then complain that there's a double standard and no one posts about another candidate's (read: Hillary) bigotry.

:eyes:

[JohnnyLib2]

8. Oh, good, I kinda missed this ruckus.

:popcorn:

[sniffa]

10. it's Like deja vu

or wiLLfuL ignorance or something.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3678121

[JackBeck]

11. All over again. n/t

[Sapphocrat]

31. "Willful ignorance"...

Isn't that basically the same thing as "cognitive dissonance"?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3678121

[Sapphocrat]

12. And where the fuck were YOU...

...on THIS thread, 28 hours ago, which has been linked, repeatedly, in other threads?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3678121

[Basileus Basileon]

17. The difference, yet again, is that a few homophobes endorsed Clinton, while

Obama endorsed a homophobe by handing him a microphone during a campaign event.

[undercoverduer]

20. What about the homophobes in charge of Clinton's campaign in SC?

Or do they not count?

[Sapphocrat]

27. Am I on your ignore list, too?

Or are you going to face the fact that one of us uppity queers posted that very article a whole fucking day and a half ago, and got NO response from the Obama supporters?

[pnwmom]

29. Those people aren't given 30 minute platforms on HRC's stage

to spout their bigotry.

[Sapphocrat]

32. Thank you, pnwmom.

Somebody who isn't on all the Obama apologists' ignore lists has to speak for the rest of us.

[alteredstate]

48. McClurkin spoke for 30 minutes? I don't think so,

[pnwmom]

57. Yes, he spoke for 30 minutes, on top of being Master of Ceremonies. Read and weep.

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/29/obamas-gospel-concert-tour/


SNIP

. . . The whole controversy might have been forgotten in the swell of gospel sound except Mr. McClurkin turned the final half hour of the three-hour concert into a revival meeting about the lightning rod he has become for the Obama campaign.

He approached the subject gingerly at first. Then, just when the concert had seemed to reach its pitch and about to end, Mr. McClurkin returned to it with a full-blown plea: “Don’t call me a bigot or anti-gay when I have suffered the same feelings,” he cried.

“God delivered me from homosexuality,” he added. He then told the audience to believe the Bible over the blogs: “God is the only way.” The crowd sang and clapped along in full support.

The political implications of his performance are not clear. The concert-goers we talked with afterward were generally more focused on making allowances for Mr. McClurkin’s past homosexuality than on anything about Mr. Obama.

The Obama campaign had appeared to be caught off guard by the reaction to inviting Mr. McClurkin in the first place, and it may have been surprised tonight by the degree to which the singer focused on himself.

SNIP

[FredScuttle]

60. Rev. McClosetCase hijacked the end of the concert, per the NY Times

"The whole controversy might have been forgotten in the swell of gospel sound except Mr. McClurkin turned the final half hour of the three-hour concert into a revival meeting about the lightning rod he has become for the Obama campaign."

“God delivered me from homosexuality,” he added. He then told the audience to believe the Bible over the blogs: “God is the only way.” The crowd sang and clapped along in full support.


http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/29/obamas-gospel-concert-tour/

[Bluebear]

63. Oh he certainly did. "I know I will get in trouble for this, but JAYZUZ saved me from the gay."

A half hour "saved from the gay" sermon to finish out the "Embrace the Change" tour.

Yeah, I think so.

[Sapphocrat]

80. What does what you "think"...

...have to do with the reality of what happened?

"I don't think so." How condescending. How dismissive.

How fucking insulting. You think we're making this shit up?

[Lex]

95. Funny how they disappear when they are dead ass wrong, eh?

nt

[Basileus Basileon]

50. Depends. Did Clinton hand them a mic and give them the stage? nt

[NMMNG]

84. Where were you

And all of your "Hillary, blah blah Hillary" friends when I posted this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

ON FRIDAY??

It got hundreds of views, was on the Greatest Page, and I extended personal invitations to two of the instigators to join the thread and nobody cared to.

It just goes to show that none of the Obama worshippers really care about Hillary. They are just using her as a pawn to deflect attention away from Obama and his atrocious behavior.

I do not want to hear another peep about Hillary/hypocrisy in an Obama thread. You all had your chance and you blew it.

[ClarkUSA]

88. Another difference is that two homophobes made $1000 donations to Clinton, while

none endorsed or donated to Obama. To date, Clinton has not apologized or returned their
donations.

Richardson is the only candidate that made homophobic statements; he said, "homosexuality
is a choice" during the LGBT debate and said "maricon" (trans. "faggot") twice during a radio
interview.

I would support any of the candidates in the GE. Many of them have made/are making
mistakes but all of them have a strong record of supporting LGBT rights.

[Basileus Basileon]

90. But that doesn't change the fundamental difference .

The direction of support goes like this:

Homophobe -> Clinton
Obama -> Homophobe

The first is worrisome. The second is offensive.

[undercoverduer]

91. When one is tolerated or ignored while the other is blasted it distorts the issue. . .

. . .Obama should be held accountable for the McClurkin issue, but when Hillary gets a pass on the issue it sort of make it looks less like a civil rights issue and more about politics. The need to draw a distinction between the two, when there really is none, calls into question the motives of anyone who draws that distinction.

[Basileus Basileon]

94. There is a difference, and a profound one. Pretending there is no difference between

receiving an insignificantly small donation and offering half an hour of stage time during a campaign event is a duplicitous attempt to justify Obama's actions.

The fact that the majority of people offended at the McClurkin scandal here were not Clintonites ought tell you that it wasn't just politics.

[ClarkUSA]

92. Both are offensive. Both are worrisome.

You can not tell me that Obama's accepting a $1000 donation from McClurkin would be merely worrisome
and not offensive.

Most offensive are Richardson's direct comments, though.

[Basileus Basileon]

93. You're telling me you don't see a difference?

Let's try an analogy. Let's pretend Sen. Clinton took $1000 from evangelicals known to support white supremacists. Worrisome, but she's shown absolutely no signs of supporting their offensive ideas, so we'll just assume she took it as free money from religious people without looking too deep into it. Senator Obama, on the other hand, allows David Duke to speak for half an hour on his stage.

This is the difference between a nosebleed and a beheading. Sure, both are "bloody" and "harmful to the head." But they're still worlds apart.

(If Obama took money from him, I wouldn't really care. Whatever. Richardson's comments were offensive, though he did later attempt to "clarify" them. Doesn't really matter, as he's about as great an electoral threat as Dodd or Kucinich.)

[wndycty]

97. As a Black man I can tell you there is no difference

Hillary would be expected to give that money back. Both actions should be condemned. Dignity can't be nuanced.

[Basileus Basileon]

103. Without intending to cause offense,

I would ascribe your false equivalence more to your status as an Obama supporter.

[wndycty]

105. You did cause offense but I have thick skin so I will not cry about it because. . .

. . .I understand you are not looking for an objective discussion or any kind of understanding, you are out to score political points.

[Basileus Basileon]

111. That's an interesting take on it.

Looking that DU, it seems that answers to that and similar questions do not break apart along racial, ethnic, religious, or any other such lines. They break apart on candidate affiliation.

I don't particularly support or dislike any of the Dem candidates. I've posted good and bad things about all of the Big Three. I suppose it doesn't even enter into the mind of a fanatic that anyone else might not be driven by fanaticism.

[rinsd]

113. The gospel concert was a fundraiser. It would appear Obama collected money from MANY bigots.

Judging by the applause McLCurkin anti-gay speech got.

[MzShellG]

23. Hmmmm....

I can hardly distinguish between who dislikes Senator Obama the most. The GOP/Racist or the GLBT community. Odd. Even though I was familiar with McClurklin's music, I was not aware of his personal experience or his views on homosexuality until I read it here. I find it hard to believe Obama figured that would even be an issue in his campaign. I dont think it reflects his personal beliefs but I'll probably be flamed for that opinion....Just my 2 cents.

[babylonsister]

36. There are many GLBTpeople on this board, but

I do believe there are racists also. Actually, I know it.

[pnwmom]

69. That's true. And wouldn't you object if one of the white candidates

let a racist act as master of ceremonies and make a 30 minute speech on his or her stage?

Okay, so Obama realized his mistake and tried to counter it. But why the heck didn't he put a lid on McClurkin? He could have let him sing without giving him the chance to spout his bigotry for thirty minutes at the close of the event.

[babylonsister]

75. He really spouted bigotry for 30 minutes at the end of the night? I

will write Senator Obama if that happened. Please prove that; that's untenable.

[Bluebear]

65. >>>>

He approached the subject gingerly at first. Then, just when the concert had seemed to reach its pitch and about to end, Mr. McClurkin returned to it with a full-blown plea: “Don’t call me a bigot or anti-gay when I have suffered the same feelings,” he cried.

“God delivered me from homosexuality,” he added. He then told the audience to believe the Bible over the blogs: “God is the only way.” The crowd sang and clapped along in full support.

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/29/obamas-gospel-concert-tour/

[babylonsister]

70. OK, I get your drift, my friend. But do you think he's incapable of leading,

or learning? That, to me, would be beautiful.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x318532

[Bluebear]

72. Well, first, will you be writing his campaign? :)

[babylonsister]

76. Not even. I'm an uninterested bystander. :o)

I just want the best person to win, really. And I'm leaning towards Edwards or Obama, not Clinton. Sorry, she rubs me wrong for a lot of reasons.
Rep. Dennis Kucinich would be the best president in our times. I just have doubts he's going anywhere.

[pnwmom]

66. Here's a link to the NYTimes article.

Unfortunately, I can't find a text of the whole thirty minute speech.

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/29/obamas-gospel-concert-tour/

At Barack Obama’s gospel concert here last night, more than 2,000 black evangelicals were singing, waving their hands and cramming the aisles — most enthusiastically when Donnie McClurkin, the superstar black gospel singer, decried the criticism he has generated because of his views that homosexuality is a choice.

SNIP

. . . The whole controversy might have been forgotten in the swell of gospel sound except Mr. McClurkin turned the final half hour of the three-hour concert into a revival meeting about the lightning rod he has become for the Obama campaign.

He approached the subject gingerly at first. Then, just when the concert had seemed to reach its pitch and about to end, Mr. McClurkin returned to it with a full-blown plea: “Don’t call me a bigot or anti-gay when I have suffered the same feelings,” he cried.

“God delivered me from homosexuality,” he added. . . .

The political implications of his performance are not clear. The concert-goers we talked with afterward were generally more focused on making allowances for Mr. McClurkin’s past homosexuality than on anything about Mr. Obama.

The Obama campaign had appeared to be caught off guard by the reaction to inviting Mr. McClurkin in the first place, and it may have been surprised tonight by the degree to which the singer focused on himself. The other speakers and singers had avoided referencing the controversy. Even an openly gay minister whom Mr. Obama had invited after the fact to try to appease his gay and lesbian critics spoke so early that few people heard him.

SNIP

[FredScuttle]

47. Obama was only warned, oh about 10 times before the concert

He even was lobbied on the phone by the head of the Human Rights Campaign not to include this bigot in his concert. And he went ahead and did it anyway.

Obama '08: We Need The Votes...By Any Means Necessary

[Forkboy]

62. I don't think it reflects his beliefs either, which is why he should have stood up to it.

But he didn't, and he deserves all the heat that comes his way over it.

[FredScuttle]

68. Well said

I don't believe that Obama himself is a homophobe, but what does it say about him when he welcomes, then defends an "ex-gay" homophobe clown who hijacks his fundraiser to spew homophobic filth?

[Forkboy]

73. Sadly, it's the next best thing to being one.

The fact that he doesn't get that has said a lot about him, to me anyways.Of course I wasn't too enamored of him to start with, but he had been growing in my eyes a bit leading up to that event.I think his response was shameful.

[Bluebear]

64. What's odd is you comparing GLBT people to GOP and racists. "Hmmmm."

Disgraceful.

[pnwmom]

67. What you don't seem to understand is that many people in the GLBT

community were supporters of Obama. But for Obama to give someone like McClurkin a platform felt like a slap in the face.

[MzShellG]

107. Well I'm sure some see it that way...

However I do know of some who still supports his music. Maybe they have a similar lifestyle and identifyto him. Sorry if it seems like I am making excuses. It's just my observation. I dont really know his story but it sounds as if he is confused and is reacting to the way society treated him. McClurkin doesnt sound like he was preaching hate, unless you take it out of context. Or perhaps I may be wrong.

[Touchdown]

114. It was wrong, and you don't get it.

There is no "way out" of being gay, Jesus or otherwise. McClurkin is still gay, he's just modified his behavior.

And..."Lifestyle"??? Of all the condescending bullshit....oh' nevermind.:puke:

[Catherine Vincent]

79. Dupe!

:)

[William769]

81. Thats actually a positive article for Hillary, I'm surprised you posted it illinoisprogressive.

But then again I'm pretty sure you didn't know what you were posting! :rofl:

[NMMNG]

82. Where the hell were YOU

And all of your "Hillary, blah blah Hillary" friends when I posted this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3678121

ON FRIDAY??

It got hundreds of views, was on the Greatest Page, and I extended personal invitations to two of the instigators to join the thread and nobody cared to.

It just goes to show that none of the Obama worshippers really care about Hillary. They are just using her as a pawn to deflect attention away from Obama and his atrocious behavior.

I do not want to hear another peep about Hillary/hypocrisy in an Obama thread. You all had your chance and you blew it.

[undercoverduer]

85. This BS of complaining that somebody did not comment on another thread is just silly. . .

. . .how old are we? For a ton of reasons people do not comment on other threads. The FAKE ASS outrage that certain individuals (including myself) did not comment on this thread and demanding to know why is just absolute BULLSHIT. What are you trying to imply? That someone is homophobic because they didn't comment on the thread? That they are ignorant because they did not comment on a the thread? That they are Republican because the didn't comment on the thread? What is it? And why the anger?

It seems that a legitimate issue, the McClurkin issue, has become a rallying crying for anger for angers sake.

[NMMNG]

87. It's not BS

Because every time one of us starts a thread on Obama, or replies to a thread on Obama, a certain group of individuals spams it repeatedly with "What about Hillary and her two co-chairs? What about Hillary and Darrell Jackson? Why haven't you said anything about Hillaryyyyyyy?!?!" :cry:

So I post a thread about Hillary that gets hundreds of views and goes to the Greatest Page, and not one of them cares to reply. All of those people who kept screeching about double standards, hypocrisy and all of that were dead silent. Even when I sent the link to the thread directly to them I got nothing. So it's their outrage that nobody is paying attention to Hillary that is fake. Because I paid attention to Hillary, as did a great number of the other people who have been denouncing Obama, and they didn't give a damn.

[undercoverduer]

89. To assign nefarious intentions to those who didn't comment on your thread is . . .

. . .deliberately deceptive, sort of like accusing Obama of being a homophobe. I didn't see the original thread, but I know that you will try to to assign a nefarious intention to that to justify your anger on a non issue.

[NMMNG]

96. I'm not assigning nefarious intention, really

I'm just saying they're full of crap when they claim we who are denouncing Obama are "hypocritical" and what not because we allegedly don't pay attention to Hillary. For when we do, they pay no attention whatsoever.

[wndycty]

98. I actually do believe there is a distinction between those criticizing Obama on principle and those

. . .for criticizing him for politics. When someone tries to say their is a difference between McClurkin and Hillary's homophobic supporters its hard to believe there is not an agenda involved.

Those who criticize both and don't think there is difference are acting on principle.

I have never once excused the McClurkin incident and have been vocal about the fact that as an Obama supporter I expect him to do a better job. Whenever I raise the issue of the Clinton campaign's association with homophobes its not meant to excuse Obama, its to ask that everyone be consistent.

I have also said anyone who chooses not to support Obama as a result of the McClurkin issue has everyone right to to withhold his or her support, I have taken exception with the claim that Obama is a bigot however.

[NMMNG]

99. I've already made it clear

why I consider Obama's actions worse than Hillary's. And I'm not the only one as evidenced not only by other posts on DU, but by the very article I posted (which was utterly ignored by the people who claimed we're all ignoring Hillary). Disagree with the reasons if you like, but it's been explained numerous times and it is not an "agenda". And as I've said before I do not support Hillary so it is not a love of Hillary either.


You want principles? Here's some principles. You don't claim over and over to be for LGBT rights, then throw LGBT people to the dogs in order to make money and win votes. You don't twice demand the firing of people who make racist statements then hand a microphone to a homophobe so he can give a sermon against gay people on behalf of your campaign. That's hypocrisy of the worst order.

[wndycty]

101. It seems you want a fight and I'm not going to play that game. . .

. . .the fact that I will agree with you that both are wrong its not enough. You want me to accept your distinctions which I won't do. Its seems you have a perfectly willing ally in me, but that is not good enough you want a damn enemy. I'm not your enemy or the enemy of LGBT movement.

[NMMNG]

102. I don't "want a fight"

What I'm tired of is every time an Obama thread comes up there's a group of people screaming "What about Hillary?" ad nauseum. The reason that many of us (and again, it's not just DUers) see a difference between Hillary and Obama has been explained repeatedly and yet again and again the "What about Hillary?" question comes up. How many times do we have to answer it?

[wndycty]

104. "What about Hillary" is not and should not be a defense. . .

. . .to me its a request that those condemning Obama be consistent. I'm disappointed that McClurkin was associated with the Obama campaign, and I will never try to defend it.

[NMMNG]

106. And as I've stated

We're not being inconsistent. We recognize what Hillary has done, but we believe that what Obama has done is worse. You're free to disagree, of course, but that doesn't change our opinions.

[FredScuttle]

100. Why would we criticize Obama on principle?

He's shown he's willing to jettison principle in a New York minute if he can nab some of those sweet, sweet South Carolina primary votes.

And what does consistentcy have to do with anything? If you're guy welcomes a bigot into his campaign with open arms, all of a sudden it's supposed to be a level playing field because "other guys (and girls) court bigots too"? I'm glad you think that you "expect him to do a better job"...I have a little higher expectation from someone who said he represented the "audacity of hope" and that he was not going to be the same kind of pandering, centrist candidate. Well, that's over and done with...

If you're sensitive about your guy being called a bigot, your issue should be with your guy welcoming bigots into his campaign with open arms, giving them a microphone and an audience to spew their homophobic filth. I don't believe Obama is a bigot, but what does it say about the man that he brought this "ex-gay" clown into his event after countless warnings, let the clown spew his filth, and then defends him afterwards?

[MethuenProgressive]

110. Typical Obama supporter bullshit. "Our Bigot is better than your Bigot!"

More Obama :puke: