Hillary just put out a statement that al Maliki should resign!

[jenmito]

I disagree with her. They're a "sovereign govt." now...right?

[ruiner4u]

1. Yes!

Another hillary pig pile in the making!

:popcorn:

[jenmito]

2. I love that popcorn thing...

and I'll be interested to see what people think about her statement.

[ronnykmarshall]

8. GD Politics should be changed to the Hillary bash forum.

[babylonsister]

10. I know you like her, but if she screws up, don't you think she should

be called on it? Really. No one's supposed to say a word, even if it's deserving? And that applies to all the candidates.

[jenmito]

12. How is it bashing her to say she put out a statement?

She said Maliki should resign. Do you agree with her or not? That's not a bash.

[ronnykmarshall]

21. ruiner4u said it best ...

'another Hillary pile on'.

Doesn't matter what she says, what she does, the same people pile on day in and day out.

[jenmito]

58. "Piling on" things she actually says or implies is fair play.

There are "pile ons" with other candidates, if you haven't noticed.

[Stephanie]

13. yes because if you disagree with Hillary you are bashing her, poor girl!

And if you disagree with Bush, you are unpatriotic! Rove's Rules live on.

[ronnykmarshall]

19. Take a look at how many threads attacking her there are.

But then again, you're probably in everyone of them.

[HeraldSquare212]

22. but that's only because

there are so many threads loudly and proudly proclaiming her every burp, like the fact that she wishes victims of a hurricane well.

[HeraldSquare212]

23. but that's only because

there are so many threads loudly and proudly proclaiming her every burp, like the fact that she wishes victims of a hurricane well.

[Stephanie]

27. THIS is an attack? "Hillary just put out a statement that al Maliki should resign!"

HOW, on what planet, is that an attack? Hillary said it, did she not? Did she not want people to KNOW she said it? Was it a secret? What is there in the OP that you construe as an attack?? It's sort of Bushian. Do not report the facts! They will make us look bad!

[JeffR]

32. It's just typical of the smears, the trashing, the bashing

"Hillary just put out a statement that al Maliki should resign!"

I can hardly bear to read it. It's a rank example of misogyny. Oh, and jealousy. And hating.

Did I leave out anything?

[Stephanie]

33. You didn't say bashing enough times.

And you should do that eye rolly thingy, and call the poster some names. Thanks.

[JeffR]

35. Sorry!

:blush:

[Blue_In_AK]

49. Excellent response, JeffR.

:applause:

[JNelson6563]

44. I see everyone getting bashed

Though I realize when one is a strong supporter of a primary candidate it can seem like your candidate is the only one.

Just my .0125

Julie

[jenmito]

51. I see some having their positions being posted here...

and others either agree or disagree with them. I don't consider it a bash to quote somebody.

[JNelson6563]

87. I agree with you.

Sadly not all hold such a rational view. :toast:

Julie

[jenmito]

94. Thanks, Julie...

:hi:

[SOS]

100. Hillary has done this before

Nothing new here. It's not bashing Hillary, it's simply observing her patterns.

Wednesday, February 23, 2005
Jaafari slams Hillary Clinton

' Last week Hillary Clinton, the New York Senator, visiting Baghdad, said that there were “grounds both for concern and for vigilance” about Dr. al-Jaafari’s Iranian connections. Clearly irritated, the candidate brushed aside the remark yesterday. “Hillary Clinton, as far as I know, does not represent the American Administration and I don’t know why she said this. She knows nothing about the Iraqi situation.”

The US engineered Jafaari's ouster in 2006.
Apparently the morons in Washington haven't figured out that Iraq is 60% Shiite and that, in a democracy, a Shiite will always win.
And of course a Shiite PM will be friendly with Iran.
How many Shiite PM's does the US have to force out? 2, 3, 10, 20?

The Bush administration (and those in Congress who authorized the use of military force) should have anticipated this.

[jenmito]

103. THANKS for pointing that out!

And of COURSE they're going to elect someone who's a Shiite. Hillary should've realized this before voting to give Bush the power to invade Iraq!

[Dr.Phool]

3. Soveriegn Nation?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


And when pigs fly, we can sell the recipe for Bush's Baked Beans.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Just buzz by the window a few times, and we'll be a sovereign nation. And after we pass a few oil laws you wrote for us.

[jenmito]

5. Of course they're not REALLY a sovereign nation...

but that's what Bush calls it and I have yet to see anyone disagreeing with him. If Hillary wants Maliki to resign, she'll have to say she does NOT consider them sovereign. But will she be able to SAY that?

[flpoljunkie]

4. Guess the overnight polling showed Hil blew it yesterday by implying the surge worked, so it's time

to tack left today.

[jenmito]

6. That must be it...

she's so calculating it's ridiculous.

[Captain_Nemo]

48. she never said the surge was working. Google it. Don't repeat what the right wingers say.

[jenmito]

55. Just like Bush never said the words "Iraq was involved in 9/11."

we're saying that what she DID say was referring to the surge, even though she strategically didn't USE the word "surge."

[Captain_Nemo]

98. Using republican tactics hurts all of us. From Media Matters on Clinton's statement:

MSNBC, NY Post, Drudge falsely claimed Clinton said "surge" is "working"
Summary: In articles on Sen. Hillary Clinton's speech to the Veterans of Foreign Wars, several media outlets reported that Clinton said the Bush administration's so-called "surge" policy is "working." Clinton actually said: "We've begun to change tactics in Iraq, and in some areas -- particularly in Al Anbar Province -- it's working. We're just years too late changing our tactics."

"We've begun to change tactics in Iraq, and in some areas, particularly in Al Anbar Province, it's working. ... We're just years too late changing our tactics. We can't ever let that happen again." The Times also reported that "ides to Mrs. Clinton said her remarks that military tactics in Iraq are 'working' referred specifically to reports of increased cooperation from Sunnis leading to greater success against insurgents in Al Anbar Province." Several other media outlets, however, have claimed that Clinton said the Bush administration's so-called "surge" policy is "working":

http://mediamatters.org/items/200708210008?f=i_latest

[jenmito]

104. Who's using repub. tactics???

I quoted Media Matters myself-not Drudge. Just as I said, Bush never said the WORDS "Saddam was involved with 9/11" but that CLEARLY has been his implication. Just as Hillary didn't use the WORD "surge" but was clearly talking about it. :eyes:

[AtomicKitten]

7. if this means sovereign --

[Gloria]

9. OK, then what??

[jenmito]

15. Ask Hillary...

:shrug:

[Alamom]

11. Link?

[jenmito]

14. No link yet-a congressional reporter just read her statement on CNN

under "Just In."

[William769]

16. A better question is why should he stay in office?

He only gives Bush what he wants.

[jenmito]

18. So we should tell him to resign?

THEN what? Al Sadr will probably step in.

[William769]

20. Can't be any worse.

[jenmito]

24. Sure it can.

The Iraqis will get rid of him if they wsnt to.

[Jack Rabbit]

17. While she's probably right, she shouldn't say anything about this

First Levin and now HRC. I am very uncomfortable with any US Senator, from either side of the aisle, or any other US official, telling the Iraq government who should or shouldn't be the PM.

Of course, Bush could send in an army and depose the political leader in Iraq. He seems to think he has the right to do that. Of course, he also thinks he has the right to spy on us, to throw any one he wants in the slammer without legal recourse, to torture "enemy combatants" and to withhold documents from Congress.

My own view is also that Maliki is a failure. Were I an Iraqi, I quite likely would also express the view that he should step down in favor of someone who could unite the nation. On the other hand, were I an Iraqi, I probably couldn't lift my head from ducking bullets long enough to express any view.

[Totally Committed]

26. Don't worry, once she sees how pissed off the latest focus group is about it,

she'll issue another opinion (probably the opposite) tomorrow.

TC

[Jack Rabbit]

28. Rimshot!

!!

[emilyg]

46. Pardon me - you s**k

[frogcycle]

85. perhaps you should wait to see what happens before sticking your neck out

[Totally Committed]

106. Wow, that's sorta personally harsh.

Are we supposed to say things like that to fellow DU-ers? ;)

Just kidding. I understand.

TC

[ieoeja]

25. Hmm... undermining an ally? Why does this sound familiar?

Seems I recall a couple weeks ago Clinton's supporters on DU ranting against another candidate doing very much the same thing.

[NOVA_Dem]

36. EXACTLY!! This is WORSE than what she accused Obama of doing to...

Musharaff. (sp)

[jenmito]

38. That's right...yet I haven't seen any coverage of this, or anyone calling her naive or irresponsible

:hi:

[jenmito]

47. Yeah, but she's not a rookie, so HER mistakes...

don't get covered. They don't fit the storyline the MSM is trying to paint.

[HuffleClaw]

29. parroting BushCo. hmmmmm

how accommodating of her !

[calteacherguy]

41. No, Bush is supporting Malaki (or however his name is spelled) nt

[jenmito]

43. He's supporting Maliki because Maliki didn't like what Bush said the day before...

that it's up to the IRAQIS whether Maliki should stay or not. (paraphrasing)

[Benhurst]

30. She ought to demand Bush's resignation.

[Stephanie]

31. Don't hold your breath.

Murdoch might ask for his money back.

[Cha]

45. Or IMPEACHMENT!

But, that would be doing something for us.

[Freddie Stubbs]

53. President Cheney would like that

Would you?

[jenmito]

54. We'd of course impeach Cheney, too...and FIRST IMO.

:)

[Benhurst]

65. Not if that criminal is impeached as well.

Oh, but I forget. We've got to keep our powder dry.

[Freddie Stubbs]

67. Impeaching him won't do much good without 17 Republican Senators voting to remove

[Benhurst]

92. Impeachment hearings would expose criminal activities on his part

so great the Republican senators would be trampling all over themselves trying to ditch the corrupt bastard. He does not have the support of the American people and the hearings haven't even started.

[Colobo]

34. Really, Hill?

[jenmito]

39. The media's lack of criticism is deafening...

if Obama said this, they'd be all over him, as would Hillary, saying he made an irresponsible and naive comment and shouldn't undercut our newest ally, etc. :eyes:

[Karmadillo]

37. Bush supports Maliki. Clinton undercuts both Bush and Maliki during wartime. This is dastardly.

Sure Maliki is a puppet and sure he's been unable to achieve much of anything and sure a better leader might lead to something better for the Iraqi people. Still, Hillary is out of line for daring to speak out against Bush's puppet because it's not right for any American leader to speak out against Bush's puppet Maliki. Surely her call for better leadership in Iraq is enough to disqualify her from the Democratic nomination and the Presidency.

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[calteacherguy]

40. No, they are not sovereign. Or were you just being sarcastic??? nt

[jenmito]

42. I was beiing sarcastic...but I wonder if Hillary would go so far as to SAY that...

I doubt she will, since she wants it both ways. She doesn't want to be too specific or she may be held to something she said. That's not a sign of leadership if you ask me.

[antiimperialist]

50. President Alan Garcia says George W. Bush should resign!

imagine how much we would laugh at such news?

[jenmito]

52. Yes, we WOULD laugh...

and Hillary shouldn't have said what SHE said, either. We overthrew Saddam and forced them to have elections. We didn't like the results, Jafarri-remember?-so we had them put Maliki in there. How many times are we going to "over-rule" a supposedly (in Bush's opinion) sovereign nation?

[jmp]

56. We're a sovereign nation, and Bush should resign.

What's your point?

[jenmito]

57. My point is that we just overthrew their govt. and had them vote and it's not our place

to tell Iraq that Maliki should resign. How many puppets are we going to tell to resign?

[jmp]

59. This is America ...

Land of the free ... home of the brave ... and a few neo-cons.

If she thinks that it's in our interest that he resign, she not only has the right to call on him to resign ... she has the obligation to do it.

[jenmito]

61. So if she thinks it's in OUR interest he resign she should call for it?

Who is SHE to tell a PM to resign just because we don't like the job he's doing?

[jmp]

72. "Who is SHE to tell a PM to resign...?"

An American.

[jenmito]

75. She does not have the right to call on a leader to resign...

especially an ally that WE caused to come into power in the first place.

[jmp]

78. Of course she does.

We have certain inalienable rights.

[jenmito]

81. She can SAY it, but IMO she has no right to "call for" his resignation.

What has he done to US?

[zulchzulu]

60. What next... tell the Iraqis they can't vote in Sadr...?

I guess this is the foreign policy experience to brag about.

Give a chickenhawk neocon murderer the keys to go into a country and kills thousands and stir up an already boiling powderkeg and then, after the Iraqis have voted, tell the Iraqis that they voted for the wrong guy.

Yeah, that's leadership "for a change"... Should the slogan be "Change For The Worse"? Sounds more appropriate.

[jenmito]

62. Exactly! The next guy they vote in could very well BE al Sadr...

and if Iraq is really a "democracy" there ain't a thing we could or should do about it. Hillary should've thought of this before voting to allow Bush to invade Iraq, knowing the Shiites are in the majority. But hey-she didn't read the intel. reports as she said.

[jmp]

69. and if Iraq is really a "democracy"

I've always found this line of thought amusing. A country is free to pursue any direction or policy it likes ... with the constraint being the possible consequences of their choices.

That is the law of the jungle, and it governs relations between all nations.

Every country has the right to act against US interests if they so choose. They do NOT have the right to do it with impunity. Democracy or not.

[jenmito]

73. Huh? So now "democracy" only counts when it's one we approve of???

Please.

[jmp]

77. "Democracy" stops at your border.

People that don't have a right to vote don't have an obligation to go along with the "will of the people". You might recognize the concept.

[jenmito]

79. What are you talking about???

"People that don't have a right to vote"?

[jmp]

82. I mean exactly that.

They don't give us a vote, so we aren't bound by the outcome of their votes.

[jenmito]

95. What rules do you go by that we should have a vote in another country's govt.? n/t

[jmp]

63. Do Pakistanis have a say ...

In our breaching their borders in pursuit of terrorists? :eyes:

[jenmito]

66. No. Not if we know bin Laden is there and Musharraf won't cooperate to get him.

It's our policy right NOW! We have the right to strike within a sovereign nation to get someone who declared war on us if their leader doesn't cooperate. Biden said so in the 2nd to last debate.

[jmp]

71. It's our policy right NOW!

So you are embracing Bush administration policy?

[jenmito]

74. Yes-that we have the right to get bin Laden-who we should've stayed after instead of invading Iraq

Don't you agree???

[jmp]

88. Do I agree???

lol! Let me put it this way ... no one here would EVER vote for me. :rofl:

[jenmito]

93. So what are you-a neocon? A member of the PNAC?

You sure have some strange ideas...

[jmp]

99. I am not a neo-con...

Neo-cons pursue a policy of global domination under the guise of do-gooding. I am interested in neither. In fact I'm a heck of a lot closer to full blown isolationist than to neo-con.

[jenmito]

101. So you're a libertarian?

You're against us going after bin Laden?

[hedgehog]

64. What happened to not telegraphing our thoughts and intentions

to all them foreigners?

[jenmito]

68. That was then. This is a couple weeks later...

She's very inconsistent.

[jmp]

70. Huh? What was telegraphed? (nm)

...

[jenmito]

76. Read the very first post. n/t

[jmp]

80. I did ...

"Hillary just put out a statement that al Maliki should resign!

I disagree with her. They're a "sovereign govt." now...right?"

And I'm still not seeing what was "telegraphed".

[jenmito]

83. That she thinks al Maliki should resign. She scolded Obama for saying out loud

that we should strike within Pakistan to get bin Laden if Musharraf won't cooperate.

[jmp]

89. The intent to strike ...

At some point in the future is something that can be telegraphed. I'm somewhat dumbstruck as to how a call for a PM's resignation can be telegraphed ... unless you believe it was revealed prematurely.

[hedgehog]

84. That Hillary thinks Maliki should go.

Kind of gives permission to any generals (theirs or OURS) who have similar thoughts.

[frogcycle]

86. Let's see...

to agree up front that you will meet with someone is wrong; to state up front that a purported ally is persona non gratis is just fine

[jmp]

90. Obviously she doesn't view him as an ally.

Don't you think?

These people are only our "ally" because Bush says so.

[jenmito]

96. I think you're wrong...

she just sees him as "weak." By invading a country with a Shia majority, and claiming we want them to have a democracy, they get to choose their leaders whether we them or not. Don't you think?

[sniffa]

91. how naive of her

[jenmito]

97. Exactly! Funny how I haven't heard that in the MSM at ALL...

like I would've heard it if Obama had said it.

[ck4829]

102. I agree with her

The guy's just another Mike Brown.

[jenmito]

105. It's not her place to call for his resignation...

Mike Brown was Bush's choice. Whether Maliki was our choice or really the Iraqis' choice, we have no right to replace him. Whomever they replace him with will be a Shiite, since they are the majority of the country. What if they replace him with al Sadr???