What Happens When Bush Declares Martial Law?

[percussivemadness]

Think about it, what will happen? Congress will be suspended, Bush will take control of every State`s National Guard, the police force will be mobilized against the American people.

I am intrigued, what do you think will happen? Congress will be a mute point as they won`t exist any more. Will legal challenges be allowed, no, so goodbye ACLU and anyone who may possibly, under a normal scenario, be able to make a difference.

I hear lots of talk about Bush declaring martial law, but noone seems to take it seriously and acts as though it is pure tinfoil. The reality is, it isn`t.

I`m intrigued to know what people think will happen the day it is declared.

Peace

[Kagemusha]

Mass army defections?

That'd be the part that would matter.

[Popol Vuh]

25. The Hegelian Principle

Problem, Reaction, Solution.

Lots of people will go along with it willingly because preceding martial law will be an act making it appear necessary. That's the way its done. That's the way its always been done throughout history.

That's one of the reasons why I believe this Internet is so important to us all.

[CK_John]

38. First thing to go would be the internet, so how would we find out about? n/t

[cascadiance]

32. I'm hoping this Tillman executive privilege is an attempt to keep control of the military...

... and that it will fail if we can do some mass purges of the wingnut elements in the chain of command, and then help lead to a military rejection of such a move!

[tritsofme]

1. You will wake up from your dream

And realize that on January 20, 2009 there was a peaceful and orderly transfer of power just like we have every 4-8 years in this country.

[PoconoPragmatist]

13. Oh, Dear God I hope You Are Right - You Are More Optimistic Than I Am!!

I don't put shit past these Bush assholes anymore.

[tom_paine]

50. I, too, am trying to remember that is still the most likely outcome

Problem is...the bad and very bad outcomes have recently had their own probablilities rise from incoinsequential (<0.01%) to as much as 10-50% or more, depending on who you talk to.

This is and should be deeply disturbing.

What you say may be true, but the likelihood of other scenarios are at a high for my lifetime, by far.

[file83]

2. Chances are that he'll only declare martial law after some major terrorist attack.

I don't think most people have any idea of what they would do. Most would probably just try to go to work or school as they normally do. Curfews, checkpoints and such would be sold by the media as for our safety - to prevent the terrorists from striking us again.

Those of us that would try to practice civil disobedience would probably never be heard from again - carted off to prison camps. So most of us would be pissed off, but do nothing about it because who wants to go to prison, right?

In short, life would suck even worse than it does now.

Oh yeah, the DU would probably get shut down too.

[AndyTiedye]

30. Which They Can Arrange Whenever It Suits Them

“The process of transformation,” the plan said, “is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event—like a new Pearl Harbor.”

Rebuilding America's Defenses PNAC 2000.

[comtec]

33. It'll just be moved off shore

To Nigeria, or maybe somewhere here in Europe. Sweden has a healthy hacker population. Maybe Russia?
Point being, It's the internet! (^_^)

[cigsandcoffee]

3. RW goofballs said the same thing about Clinton.

They sounded like nuts, too.

[The Doctor.]

28. Except that Clinton did not meticulously install all the requisite powers

to make it happen.

There's more real cause for concern now than then.

They never did catch that Anthrax Killer, did they?

[cigsandcoffee]

84. Do you really think Bush is going to declare martial law...

...and suspend the elections in a world-history making power grab? You really, honestly think that?

[lvx35]

4. We'd all smile real pretty and say 'yes sir'.

And put our feces in jars to hurl at their tanks when they're not looking.

and we'd also regret the things we said we'd do online when they come knocking on our doors asking us to turn over the jarred feces.

[percussivemadness]

5. I`m not trying to be tinfoil

But I do think this is a very definite possibility. Clinton didn`t have the Warner Act to allow him to declare martial law without congress` approval.

I`m fascinated as to whether people have really entertained the idea, or just dismissed it as a conspiracy theory, whilst conveniently ignoring everything the Bush junta has done in the last 7 years.

Peace

[grasswire]

8. exactly

A regime does not seize power, make laws for its own use, and move toward tyranny with the objective of turning all of it over to anyone.

Such a regime has a larger plan. A more despotic plan.

[MonkeyFunk]

6. Nothing will happen, becuase it won't happen

he has no authority to disband congress, or to cancel elections. Any such attempt would probably end in his cabinet declaring him unfit to continue as President, and he'd be hauled off a military hospital

[AndyTiedye]

15. He Has No Authority To Do All that Wiretapping, Or Seize Assets Or Lots of Other Things He Is Doing

He gives the orders, it happens. Congress can't stop him. The Supreme Court won't stop him.

He has all the authority he needs to do anything he fucking wants.






"If this were a dictatorship, it would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I'm the dictator"

**, 18 December 2000, just days after being installed in the pResidency by the Supreme Court.

[aquart]

22. Whose assets has he seized?

[AndyTiedye]

26. Don't Know Yet

(Mods: I don't think **'s edicts are copyrighted, so the 4-paragaph limit should not apply)

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/07/20070717-3.html

Executive Order: Blocking Property of Certain Persons Who Threaten Stabilization Efforts in Iraq

White House News
Message to the Congress of the United States Regarding International Emergency Economic Powers Act

By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including the International Emergency Economic Powers Act, as amended (50 U.S.C. 1701 et seq.)(IEEPA), the National Emergencies Act (50 U.S.C. 1601 et seq.)(NEA), and section 301 of title 3, United States Code,

I, GEORGE W. BUSH, President of the United States of America, find that, due to the unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security and foreign policy of the United States posed by acts of violence threatening the peace and stability of Iraq and undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq and to provide humanitarian assistance to the Iraqi people, it is in the interests of the United States to take additional steps with respect to the national emergency declared in Executive Order 13303 of May 22, 2003, and expanded in Executive Order 13315 of August 28, 2003, and relied upon for additional steps taken in Executive Order 13350 of July 29, 2004, and Executive Order 13364 of November 29, 2004. I hereby order:

Section 1. (a) Except to the extent provided in section 203(b)(1), (3), and (4) of IEEPA (50 U.S.C. 1702(b)(1), (3), and (4)), or in regulations, orders, directives, or licenses that may be issued pursuant to this order, and notwithstanding any contract entered into or any license or permit granted prior to the date of this order, all property and interests in property of the following persons, that are in the United States, that hereafter come within the United States, or that are or hereafter come within the possession or control of United States persons, are blocked and may not be transferred, paid, exported, withdrawn, or otherwise dealt in: any person determined by the Secretary of the Treasury, in consultation with the Secretary of State and the Secretary of Defense,

(i) to have committed, or to pose a significant risk of committing, an act or acts of violence that have the purpose or effect of:

(A) threatening the peace or stability of Iraq or the Government of Iraq; or

(B) undermining efforts to promote economic reconstruction and political reform in Iraq or to provide humanitarian assistance to the Iraqi people;

(ii) to have materially assisted, sponsored, or provided financial, material, logistical, or technical support for, or goods or services in support of, such an act or acts of violence or any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order; or

(iii) to be owned or controlled by, or to have acted or purported to act for or on behalf of, directly or indirectly, any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order.

(b) The prohibitions in subsection (a) of this section include, but are not limited to, (i) the making of any contribution or provision of funds, goods, or services by, to, or for the benefit of any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order, and (ii) the receipt of any contribution or provision of funds, goods, or services from any such person.

Sec. 2. (a) Any transaction by a United States person or within the United States that evades or avoids, has the purpose of evading or avoiding, or attempts to violate any of the prohibitions set forth in this order is prohibited.

(b) Any conspiracy formed to violate any of the prohibitions set forth in this order is prohibited.

Sec. 3. For purposes of this order:

(a) the term "person" means an individual or entity;

(b) the term "entity" means a partnership, association, trust, joint venture, corporation, group, subgroup, or other organization; and

(c) the term "United States person" means any United States citizen, permanent resident alien, entity organized under the laws of the United States or any jurisdiction within the United States (including foreign branches), or any person in the United States.

Sec. 4. I hereby determine that the making of donations of the type specified in section 203(b)(2) of IEEPA (50 U.S.C. 1702(b)(2)) by, to, or for the benefit of, any person whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order would seriously impair my ability to deal with the national emergency declared in Executive Order 13303 and expanded in Executive Order 13315, and I hereby prohibit such donations as provided by section 1 of this order.

Sec. 5. For those persons whose property and interests in property are blocked pursuant to this order who might have a constitutional presence in the United States, I find that, because of the ability to transfer funds or other assets instantaneously, prior notice to such persons of measures to be taken pursuant to this order would render these measures ineffectual. I therefore determine that for these measures to be effective in addressing the national emergency declared in Executive Order 13303 and expanded in Executive Order 13315, there need be no prior notice of a listing or determination made pursuant to section 1(a) of this order.

Sec. 6. The Secretary of the Treasury, in consultation with the Secretary of State and the Secretary of Defense, is hereby authorized to take such actions, including the promulgation of rules and regulations, and to employ all powers granted to the President by IEEPA as may be necessary to carry out the purposes of this order. The Secretary of the Treasury may redelegate any of these functions to other officers and agencies of the United States Government, consistent with applicable law. All agencies of the United States Government are hereby directed to take all appropriate measures within their authority to carry out the provisions of this order and, where appropriate, to advise the Secretary of the Treasury in a timely manner of the measures taken.

Sec. 7. Nothing in this order is intended to affect the continued effectiveness of any rules, regulations, orders, licenses, or other forms of administrative action issued, taken, or continued in effect heretofore or hereafter under 31 C.F.R. chapter V, except as expressly terminated, modified, or suspended by or pursuant to this order.

Sec. 8. This order is not intended to, and does not, create any right, benefit, or privilege, substantive or procedural, enforceable at law or in equity by any party against the United States, its departments, agencies, instrumentalities, or entities, its officers or employees, or any other person.

GEORGE W. BUSH

THE WHITE HOUSE,

July 17, 2007.

[MonkeyFunk]

37. Those issues are a lot less clear

The patriot act, other laws and executive orders gave a lot of wiggle room on the wiretapping. And there's no evidence at all that he wiretapped phone calls made entirely within the united states without a court order.

he can't cancel elections becuase the President has no control over elections. And nothing gives him the power to disband congress.

This is just another "let's see how ridiculous a scenario i can come up with to prove that I really really don't like Bush."

[tom_paine]

53. I no longer certain of that at all.

I hope you are correct with you steadfast belief that what are are living through is not analogous to the face-offs the early Caesers had with the Imperial Senate until they reduced it to an essentially decorative branch of government, or Hitler's escalating quarrels with the Reichstag prior to burning it on "German 9/11".

I hope you are correct that we DUers are just a bunch of Chicken Littles, but it makes me laugh that you think there is ANY circumstance, that would cause his handpicked loyalists to do any such thing.

Or that, even if he appeared on the steps of the White House with the severed head of Howard Dean (yes, I am exaggerating for effect, but only a tiny bit), anyone would dare to tell our Emperor backed up by the might of his many Praetorian Guards and Loyal Bushies, that he has no clothes.

He has already pushed and broken every barrier of Checks and Balances the Founders designed, either eliminated them or neutralized them, and no one has dared stand up.

Maybe the circumstances you describe ARE extreme enough to turn his Loyal Bushies against him, but there is a fair chance (30%) at least that, based on their previous hundreds of examples of Bushevik loyalty to Leader and Party over Country, they would fall right the fuck in line for these "temporary measures" to "root out disloyalty".

I hope you are correct, and I try to remind myself daily that there is a 50% and perhaps even as high as 70% likelihood it will be as you say.

However, at no time in my life prior to 12/12/2000 (the REAL day everything changed), did the probability of ANY range of totalitarian doom such as we read about in Farenheit 451 and 1984, raise above 2%.

But what IS clear is that the precursors are in place, the only question is will they be pushed to the next logical level, eventually, be it in 5, 10, or even 50 years, or will we return to basically what we were pre-2000, someday.

I hope you are right.

[zonmoy]

74. I do hope this evil will be reversed but I think that it is better to be

chicken little and be wrong then to not see trouble coming and be wrong.

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

77. The Congress already may have given Bush the authorization to declare martial law

Signed into law in October, 2006, it's called the John Warner Defense Authorization Act of 2007. Provision 1042 gives Bush the authority to send in both the US regular army and the National Guard without consent of any State's governor and without previous Congressional authorization in case of terorist attack or domestic violence, among other incidents:

Section 1042 -
"Revises federal provisions allowing the President to utilize the Armed Forces in connection with interference with federal and state law to allow the President to employ the Armed Forces and National Guard in federal service to restore public order in cases of natural disaster, epidemic or other public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident, or domestic violence. Requires the President to notify Congress within 14 days of the exercise of such authority. Authorizes the President, when exercising such authority, to direct the Secretary to provide supplies, services, and equipment to persons affected by the situation."

The Pentagon has also formulated CONPLAN 0500, with provides for the use of the regular military to take over from the civilian authority within the United States upon the order of the Commander in Chief in 15 different scenarios. Bush Administration lawyers have already indicated that they feel this is Constitutional under Article 2, in the case of national defense.

Patrick Leahy was one of the few Senators to show strong vocal opposition to the John Warner Defense Authorization Act of 2007, stating that it made it easier for Bush to declare martial law:

Leahy said it "subverts solid, longstanding posse comitatus statutes that limit the military's involvement in law enforcement, thereby making it easier for the President to declare martial law," that Article 1042 had been "slipped in" ... "as a rider with little study," while "other congressional committees with jurisdiction over these matters had no chance to comment, let alone hold hearings on, these proposals." Those are Leahy's words suggesting this makes it easier for Bush to declare martial law, not mine.

The law gives Bush 14 days in which he can basically do whatever he wants with the US military inside the United States, after which he is supposed to notify Congress.

[Webster Green]

7. Good, I can't wait..

Might as well bring this fucking mess to a conclusion, one way or the other. They will have their fascist little hands full when they get to me.

Bring it on mutherfuckers!

[Bullet1987]

9. Bush is not gonna declare martial law...only alarmists think that

[PoconoPragmatist]

14. I'm Not An Alarmist....I AM ALARMED!!

In fact, I am scared shitless!

I have NEVER lived in such complete, abject fear of my own government...as I do now.

[aquart]

20. Which is completely separate from martial law.

I suggest you add Vitamin B complex to your diet immediately.

[PoconoPragmatist]

44. What Does Vitamin B Have To Do With Anything??

The fact is, I am terrified of my government. I am definitely on their list of "undesireables" who will be the first to disappear once they grab dictatorial powers, and no one can stop them. And who the hell will speak up for the rights of a transgendered freak who gets carted off? I doubt even most here on DU would have my back.

Let's be realistic. Most would rather keep their heads down and pray no one notices them. How many do you thinjk would speak up for me when I get carted off? not many...considering that speaking up would be to risk being yourself carted off.

[KansDem]

76. "The fact is, I am terrified of my government."

This is freeperesque talk. As a Roosevelt Dem, I recognize that the government represents the people. The "government" is the people. Currently, we don't have a government. We have a criminal mob exploiting the power of government.

I refuse to think otherwise...

edited to correct adjective.

[PoconoPragmatist]

82. Nevertheless

I have reason to believe and feel that this government HAS NEVER REPRESENTED ME.

Be denied a livelihood, legally, because someone does not like your gender identity. Be denied basic human and civil liberties and dignity...and then see if you still think this government represents your interests or gives a shit about you!

This government will NOT stand up to the bigots who treat me like garbage and tell them that it is not okay to treat me that way.

As far as I am concerned, I have NEVER been represented by this government...or any government prior to this one, either!

And, whether they are the "legitimate" government or not is immaterial...they have the powers of government. And I'm terrified of them.

It's not freeperesque talk. I am scared to death of the freepers!

[AndyTiedye]

10. It's Been Nice Knowing You

[Chulanowa]

11. When? It's still a hefty "if"

But, if...

It would be futile. As a group we are as well-armed and resourceful as the people grinding our armed forces to a standstill in Iraq, and there is far more territory to cover. We are one of those lucky countries that, due to simple blessings of geography, are virtually impossible to occupy, even by our own forces.

I dare him.

[AndyTiedye]

16. Yeah, but Most of the Guns Are Held by the Wingnuts Who STILL SUPPORT Bush**

WE REALLY DON'T WANT TO GO THERE!

[Chulanowa]

24. Don't give them too much credit

Most of them can't shoot for shit. For them, these tools are penis extensions, complete with impotency and the occasional misfire into your hunting buddy's face. Half the people with a "W" sticker on the back of their SUV are so blind drunk that it would take a full box of ammo to chip the paint from the stop sign in their living room, while the other half are so blind drunk that they just plain forgot to scrape the sticker off.

And no, most guns are not owned by the wingnuts. Don't buy into that shit, it's an intimidation tactic they use. They're just the loudest about their ownership. I own a few guns. I hunted, I went to the shooting range with friends on boring days. I also walk my dog and tend a plot of heirloom peppers, you don't see me waxing poetic about the quality of my pooper-scooper or naming my trowel, do ya?

Honestly? If "The revolution" were to hit, I sadly feel most Americans would just sit on their ass bitching back at the TV about it before switching over to "Charmed" or "Law and Order," which are apparently the only shows any cable network are allowed to play these days.

[AndyTiedye]

29. You Own a Few Guns. They Own a LOT of Guns

Most of them can't shoot for shit.

I figured that's why they were all so fond of automatic weapons.
I suppose if we survived the first six months, they'd all be out of ammo.

And no, most guns are not owned by the wingnuts.

I'd like to believe that, but how can this be?

Excluding those owned by street gangs and drug cartels anyway.

[sandnsea]

12. A journalist was threatened by NPS cops today

Wouldn't it do more good to draw attention to things that are already happening than stir up hysteria with these hyperbolic spceculations.

[rabidchickens]

18. Ridicious

This is still America. Dont forget that. And there are lots of patrots in Government, even some people with some sense of decency (though misguided policies) within the Bush administration.

Don't be alarmed, if it happens then you'll see real revolt and then a quick collapse of the administration.

[Prophet 451]

64. Yes because American is special and immune

*headdesk*

Look up "American Exceptionalism" and you'll find a description of that attitude.

[aquart]

21. Yes.

[Blue-Jay]

17. Oh, ffs.

:eyes:

[AnotherGreenWorld]

73. Ha ha. Nice Gould quote btw.

[aquart]

19. Weekend hysteria. Are Dementors among us?

No one takes Bush declaring martial law seriously because of the "martial" part. Or do you think he can wave a wand and make an army appear?

[PoconoPragmatist]

48. Do You Not Learn From History??

He will stage another "terrorist attack." then, when everyone's good and scared of those swarthy-skinned radical Muslims coming to kill the men, rape the women, enslave the children and pillage the village...peiople will gladly acquiesce to martial law, because they will believe it is the only thing that can keep them safe from the scary brown people!

[leftofthedial]

23. violent resistance

[LibertyorDeath]

27. Hi percussive good question.. Welcome to DU

The Hard Chill Begins to Bite

By Chris Floyd

It won't come with jackboots and book burnings, with mass rallies and fevered harangues. It won't come with "black helicopters" or tanks on the street. It won't come like a storm – but like a break in the weather, that sudden change of season you might feel when the wind shifts on an October evening: everything is the same, but everything has changed. Something has gone, departed from the world, and a new reality has taken its place.

As in Rome, all the old forms will still be there; legislatures, elections, campaigns – plenty of bread and circuses for the folks. But the "consent of the governed" will no longer apply; actual control of the state will have passed to a small group of nobles who rule largely for the benefit of their wealthy peers and corporate patrons.

To be sure, there will be factional conflicts among this elite, and a degree of free debate will be permitted, within limits; but no one outside the privileged circle will be allowed to govern or influence state policy. Dissidents will be marginalized – usually by "the people" themselves. Deprived of historical knowledge by an impoverished educational system designed to produce complacent consumers, not thoughtful citizens, and left ignorant of current events by a media devoted solely to profit, many will internalize the force-fed values of the ruling elite, and act accordingly. There will be little need for overt methods of control.

Chris Floyd wrote this on Nov. 9, 2001 http://www.chris-floyd.com/index.php?option=com_content...

A very prophetic warning in my view

This is the part many do not get "There will be little need for overt methods of control."


The people in this thread who think it can't happen here need to

step back and look at the big picture IMO

[DemBones DemBones]

42. Things have changed a lot since November 2001.

The war and * are very unpopular now. People are outraged. That is part of the big picture.

[glowing]

31. I don't think Bush's handlers can prop him up for eternal rule. I think

he's putting these powers into play for Presidents to come.

[Perry Logan]

34. This thread has a strong "tin-hat" tinge to it.

It's all debunked here, you know:
http://www.911myths.com/
http://www.debunking911.com/
http://wtc7lies.googlepages.com/home

[no_hypocrisy]

35. Can martial law be ignored or not recognized?

What if Congress refuses to be suspended?

What if the National Guard, police, etc. do not execute their orders?

What if people go out after curfew and nothing happens?

What if they gave a martial law and nobody came?

[Donald Ian Rankin]

36. We all escape by flying pig.

The reality is that this kind of speculation is pure tinfoil, and shouldn't be taken seriously.

Bad as he is, Bush is not going to try and declare martial law. In answer to your "what would happen if", I imagine that the first things that would happen if he were to be possessed by aliens or similar and try to do so would include the generals refusing to obey the order, and Congress and the Senate rushing through legislation to replace him as president. Bush knows that full well, and short of being possessed by aliens he isn't going to do so.

Not to mention the fact that it is possible to massively exaggerate the extent to which even Bush is unprincipled. Just because there are things that he shouldn't do that he does, doesn't mean that there aren't things he doesn't do. Failure to recognise this is one of the primary weaknesses of DU, I think.

To try and oppose someone effectively, it is necessary first to understand them. If the left in America didn't indulge in this kind of ridiculous exaggeration it would be able to achieve far more.

[The Inquisitive]

85. But it's so much fun to pretend

without making it seem we are in a constant state of emergency in which all that was once good in this country will become tainted and foul this game just isn't as much fun.

[Harry Monroe]

39. I think if he even tried it, it would finally be the tipping point.

It would finally wake America up from it's TV reality show addled comas and there would be such an outrage that Bush would be arrested and tried for treason. In order to do this, he would have to have the backing of the military, the same military which took an oath to the Constitution and not the President. I believe they would choose the Constitution over the President. As for the National Guard, he would have to have the consent of all 50 state governors to take control of the Guard, something which would be very hard to achieve. I say let him try it; it would finally wake up this country to how fucked up he actually is and we'd finally be rid of this shithead.

[gasperc]

40. hell breaks loose, economy freezes

[Fly by night]

41. Plan X will take effect -- the weird will turn pro.

[Bake]

43. Martial law would be impossible to enforce in a country this large

There aren't enough troops to occupy it all.

Bake

[CJCRANE]

59. As per below

Bushco would come up with some pseudo-legal reason they could onto power and just go ahead and do it. Then they would deny it was martial law or unconstitutional.

[LoZoccolo]

45. We'll skip the light fandango and turn cartwheels across the floor. n/t

[percussivemadness]

49. They`ve got the gunes but we`ve got the numbers :)

name that tune

[Lilith Velkor]

79. Never again is what you swore the time before

(5 to 1.)

[percussivemadness]

46. again why tinfoil?

I never thought i would see the day the wtc were leveled by apparently 19 blokes using nothing more than box cutters to hijack 4 planes.

I never thought I would see the day the US govt reclused itself from the Geneva Conv.

I never thought I would see the day when despite overwhelming evidence, a politician was allowed to steal the presidency twice and the American people would do nothing.

I never thought I would see the day when black bodies floated in an american city whilst the president ate cake and played a guitar.

This is not a tinfoil question, it is a honest attempt to see if people have really considered something that is a distinct possibility.

I pray to God it doesn`t happen,I really do, but the fact that it hasn`t happened before in American history, doesn`t mean it won`t happen in the future, after all 19 men with box cutters had never hijacked 4 planes before September 10 2001, and had I asked the same question then, some of you would have called me "tinfoil". However, had the possibility been discussed, maybe people would have reacted differently.

Peace

[Doctor_J]

47. Depends - will American Idol still be on?

If so, not much.

[ronnykmarshall]

51. We can go to the moon and get free cheese.

[RFKJrNews]

52. What happens when Bush declares martial law?

Simply put:

"Bend over, put your head between your knees, and kiss your ass goodbye!"

Think he wouldn't try it? His actions over the past 7 years prove beyond any doubt that G.W. Bush is insane. Crazy enough to try damn near anything he thinks he can get away with...and wow, just look at what he's gotten away with so far. Only enhances his arrogance.

Next thing ya know, he'll pull a Napoleon and declare himself Emperor!



SIGN THE PETITION to Draft Robert F. Kennedy Jr. for President in 2008:
http://RFKin2008.com

[Hydra]

54. Of course he'll do it

And when he does, I'm going to sit back in my chair, light up a smoke, and laugh at all the people who let it happen and said it couldn't happen here in the "land of the free."

After I do that, I'm going to size up the situation, find the quietest corner of the world, and go hide there. I'm going to mix with the local populous, adopt their culture, and I'm going to forget about being an American, because like the Germans, it won't be safe to be seen as one anymore.

I refuse to stay here when they decide to start locking people up in work camps for not saluting your local police force convincingly enough. I refuse to stay here when they have more than conventional weapons to use on us. I refuse to stay here when they start coming door to door looking for "subversives," and they start picking people at random.

As stated on a previous post, "will he declare himself emperor?"

The sad part is, he already has.

"The Decider"
"Unitary Executive"
"Imperial Presidency"

Sound familiar? The sad part is that he isn't just posturing.

Also stated earlier, they don't HAVE to do this to us to control us. They already do. It just isn't enough for them. They must proclaim it as it is, rather than getting what they want while we have the polite fiction of freedom and opportunity. Wonderful people, aren't they? :sarcasm:

[PoconoPragmatist]

55. May I Please Stow Away In Your Luggage??

I'm dead serious. I'm gonna be one of the first to disappear when this happens, as I am a transgender freak...and I doubt many here on DU will "have my back" or raise any outcry when I am disappered. No, I think they will keep their heads down and mouths shut...praying no one notices them because, to speak up would be to risk sharing my fate, and I don't believe most people, regardless of what they claim here...are selfless enough to risk sharing the fate of a useless transgender freak.

PLEASE, if this happens, and you leabve the country...stuff me in your suitcase?? I'm begging you, because I don't even want to be an American anymore. I'm ashamed to be an American anymore, because of what it has come to mean to be an american...thanks to Bush and his evil cronies.

[Hydra]

66. Sure

I'm planning an running an underground railroad out of this place, but I can't find the appropriate exit. I suspect it will present itself in the chaos of the crackdown. There won't be any point in staying here: there will be nothing left worth coming back to if they win, and if another country has to come in and do a "regime change," don't expect for any mercy from them.

I'm not a good german, but I'm not a fool either.

[PoconoPragmatist]

68. I Dig That Idea!!

May I help you run this Underground Railroad??

If I am to die at the hands of fascists, at least I want it to be for a good reason!!

And for me, helping as many as possible escape them...THAT is good reason.

[Hydra]

70. find some locals

I've found more than a few people that are thinking things are a tad too hot here, they're just scared to say something or they think it's impossible to get away. I don't do impossible. If we can work together in small groups, I'm sure we can get the people out that want to leave. The problem is money- most countries aren't going to give us asylum. We need a way to get out and get re-set up someplace else.

[Efilroft Sul]

56. Two things have to happen for Bush to succeed in grabbing total power.

1. A terrorist attack of truly horrific proportions has to happen again on our soil. Right now, neocon ideologues are masturbating furiously to dark gods under their rocks, watching "Red Dawn" on AMC, and hoping and praying innocent people will die to justify the president "taking charge." In their little minds they believe such an event might be the only thing that can save this presidency and the Republican Party. However, most people would end up blaming Bush and the Republicans for not following through on the 9/11 Committee's recommendations, and I think another terror strike will backfire on Bush and any declaration of nationwide martial law. (And no, I don't underestimate the power of the media doing his bidding; I just don't think their cheerleading and justifications will hold water with most of the American people.)

2. Where's the national guard at to do Bush's bidding? How about the Army? In Iraq. By bringing home massive amounts of troops to pacify America, Bush will have to admit to his failure in the Middle East. ("We're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them here.") Ain't gonna happen.

Bush can't even secure our border with Mexico's. You think he's going to quell a pissed-off Middle America with all those good ol' boys owning guns and ammo? They were the first to support Bush and they'll be the last to abandon him, but when he betrays them for the last time with a declaration of martial law that's ultimately for his political benefit, they're going to be his worst nightmare.

In short, I don't think Bush will dare to be that stupid.

[Hydra]

67. I thought about these things too

1. Nuclear strike on American soil. They've been dropping hints that "Al-Quida" has nukes and wants to use them on us. I think such an event would be so horrifying that no one will believe that * ordered it...even some of us here who know better. I can just see how martial law would be the only sane looking choice at that point- who knows where the next bomb will go off?

2. The Army and National Guard have been pushed to the breaking point both in personal and equipt(regular troops). Recall the twisters in Kansas? The National Guard didn't have enough of their heavy equipment at the time. No, Blackwater and various "elite" forces will be used along with local law enforcement, and they will be happy to do it to keep order after the nuke.

3. Mexico's border is open for a reason. We could make it look like the Berlin wall if we wanted to, AND we could send all of the illegals home tomorrow if we wanted. Where I live, they won't hire above $7.50 an hour, no matter how desperate they are for workers.

Would the right wingers really turn on him? I'd like to think so too, but I see the super-false flag as fooling most people. All of this will be done "temporarily" for the "safety of all concerned"...but it will stay that way. Speaking out will be illegal, as will gathering for meetings and the purchase of weapons. Curfews, random searches and interrogation...all for our "safety"

Feh!

[CJCRANE]

57. * won't call it "martial law".

It will be called the "Peace in the Homeland" intiative (or something like that).

[Jack Rabbit]

58. What will happen?

I don't know about you, but I'm going to find an automatic weapon and go hide in the hills.

Edited to add:

Hi, Agent Mike. How's Mrs. Mike and all the little Mikes?

[onenote]

60. hard to say, since I'll be ducking the flying pigs

I noticed the op doesn't what will happen "if", but rather "when". Sure sign of tinfoil poisoning.

[LanternWaste]

61. Not much, I expect....

Not much, I expect. President Clinton/Obama/Edwards/Kucinich will laugh at him, and maybe send him a few packs of smokes so he can get along with his friends in the yard better.

[MindPilot]

62. I will carry a sign that says "I Told You So"

Until I get shot for violating curfew and resisting arrest.

[zulchzulu]

63. Simply put, there would be a coup d'etat in a matter of days

There are plenty of people in the intelligence community and the military that have been burned by the neocons and they'd love to have a "crisis" like martial law to um... well...



Ceausescu's fate comes to mind...

[MrSlayer]

65. Christ, not this again.

Chimp is not going to declare martial law, ever. There is no way to enforce it nor does he have the inclination to do it. He wants out of this job so bad he can taste it. They just want to run out the clock, walk away with the loot and leave the mess for the next administration to clean up. This is just ridiculous panic mongering.

[PoconoPragmatist]

69. Well, I'm Good And Scared!!

In fact, I am FUCKING PETRIFIED of these Bush people. I really believe they would do something like this in order to carry out the full Religious Right agenda...including, as Pat robertson advocated in his 1988 book..."The summary rounding up and execution of all gays" (by extension, I'm sure lesbians, bisexuals, and transgenders like me won't survive this "sexuality cleansing."

Then, next to go will be them "uppity liberals" and workers who refuse to "know their place." (in other words, work like a slave, take home a pittance, and like it.)

I can see it in this country. Oh, yes...I can. The vast majority of Americans would comply, keep their heads down and mouths shut, hoping and praying to not get noticed. I do not believe that most of my countrymen would be willing to risk their necks for anyone but their own damned selves.

[Hydra]

71. they won't risk their necks either

Most people I know wouldn't so much as raise a hand as someone shot them. A sorry state from our ancestors, that fought to survive in a world much worse than this, often with their own oppressors.

But I suppose that's the rub- only a few of them managed to do it. We are the children of those survivors. Will we survive, or will we wait for the whisper of the reaper's scythe?

[MrSlayer]

72. Well take a chill pill.

These guys are gone in 18 months, a Democrat will most likely be elected to the White House and things will go back to the less shitty way they were before these clowns got into office. You are not going to be rounded up and exterminated and these guys don't give a fuck about religion. They just use those people as lemmings to put more money in their pockets. Calm down, have a drink or ten.

[PoconoPragmatist]

81. If I Had A Job, and Money...I Could Afford The Drink!!

I just wish I had your optimism. I've been walking thru a personal shitstorm for so long now all I can see ahead is more shit.

[NoPasaran]

75. Pigs will drive SUVs

The streets will run with ice cream.

[tammywammy]

80. Ohhh, that's be fun "the streets will run with ice cream"

I hope it's Ben & Jerry's Chunky Monkey.

[tammywammy]

78. Since it's not going to happen, I wouldn't worry too much anyways

[FogerRox]

83. The military tells Bush it blow it out his ass.

or we live in a police state.

Even a ass kissing Bush lickin hack of a general will think about the options before acting. The powers that be, have gone to great lengths to maintain the veneer of a democracy, I doubt they will throw away all that effort for one crazy MFin SOB.

[Singular73]

86. Chill out

There was buzz about this during the 04 election.

Want to know a little secret?

Bush doesn't want the job anymore.