Ask Clark to remain for the good of the party

[andym]

I think Kerry will win the nomination. That said I believe that Clark should stay in for the good of the party. He helps raise the level of political discourse and the continued primary election battle helps keep the press focused on the Democratic attacks against the GOP. Once the primary season is over, the press out of boredom will downplay attacks from the nominee.

Therefore I'm asking people to call or fax, asking Clark to reconsider.
http://writers.forclark.com/story/2004/2/11/35847/2104

[incapsulated]

1. Let's respect the General's decision

It sounds like it was a small war between his advisors and his own family before he came to his decision, so let's leave it be, for his sake.

The party didn't appreciate him, anyways. Their loss.

[AnnitaR]

3. LOL! We posted almost the exact same thing.

At the exact same time!

[incapsulated]

4. Great minds think alike! ;^) n/t

[AnnitaR]

2. This is Clark's decision.

I trust him to make the decision that is right for him and his family.

He owes the party nothing at this point, if you ask me.

[Leilani]

9. That's Right

He owes the party nothing!

[Jerseycoa]

14. I agree

But, you know, if he is asked to serve, he is going to serve. It's who he is.

[Crunchy Frog]

40. He may not owe the party anything

they treated him like garbage, nevertheless I believe he thinks the Democratic party is the best hope for this country and is committed to helping it as best he can. He truly does put the interests of his country above his own personal interests. He cares more about the country than his own feelings about how he has been treated. That's the kind of man he is and that's why I supported him so passionately.

[Dookus]

5. No...

there's no going back.

Clark made his decision, and I respect it. I'm heart-broken, but I'm realistic. The next step is defeating Bush. I expect Kerry will be the guy we choose to do that, and I hope he'll be smart enough to recognize that Clark would be a great running-mate. But even if he isn't, I'm ABB.

It's a tough night for us, but I really believe we haven't seen the last of Wes Clark.

[Jerseycoa]

7. Nice to see your ass again, Dookus

I'm hoping Kerry does not want him as VP. I think he'd be wasted in that job. If anything, Secretary of State.

[incapsulated]

8. You are right of course ;)

VP, yuck, no fucking way. That's for young Presidents in waiting and Puppetmasters like Cheney.

Sec. of State or nada.

[Dookus]

10. well...

personally, I'm sorry to have my ass back. I'd hoped my Clark sig would be here until November.

Nonetheless, I think Clark would be a great VP candidate for Kerry. A double war-hero team, north and south, insider and outsider, would be a killer team against the chickenhawk twins. Howzabout 8 years of Kerry followed by 8 years of Clark? I could get behind that.

[incapsulated]

11. He's too old to wait

And has too much stature to be a just a prop to help get Kerry elected.

[Dookus]

12. hey...

I think he'd make a helluva Secretary of State. But VP is a position with future electoral possibilities, SoS isn't.

He's 59 now. A 67 year old Presidential candidate wouldn't be outside the realm of possibility, especially one as fit and healthy as Clark.

And Clark would be a lot more than prop to help Kerry. He'd be a genuinely qualified, intelligent, articulate and principled candidate. Kerry/Clark is a killer team against the chickenhawk war-mongers.

[incapsulated]

15. 67 *is* too old

People see the Presidency as a younger man's job now, more like a CEO than anything else. Pushing 70 is, well, pushing it.

VP is a shit job, ask any former vp. Make work. Clark deserves a hell of a lot more than that, imho.

[Dookus]

18. I agree

it's old enough to be an issue. But Reagan was older. Dole was older. It's possible.

The VP position is whatever the president wants it to be. Witness the current administration, where Cheney is extremely powerful. Gore was very influential as well. The role of the vice-president has grown a lot in the last 20 years.

Clark, as VP, could be put in charge of security, pentagon reform, or be used as a good-will ambassador to undo the damage done by Bush. He has incredible talents, and a wise President would use them.

[Jerseycoa]

13. I doesn't work Kerry in other ways

As you say, as a running mate, it is a dream ticket, but once the running mate is in the job, it doesn't work so well. The VP really needs to work Congress and should also be able to bring in an important state or region. Somebody like Bill Richardson or Bob Graham or Gephardt. Somebody who knows where the bodies are buried. The first thing the new president is going to have to be doing is dealing with Iraq and terrorism, right off the bat. The VP needs to have heavy policy and legislative experience to carry the domestic ball at the beginning. Clark never worked except at the top of the ticket with a VP with domestic and legislative strength; ironically, Clark/Kerry was the perfect match. However, Clark could step straight into Secretary of State seat without batting an eye.

[Dookus]

16. I disagree...

The Vice-President has two jobs:

1) Break ties in the senate
2) Check to see if the President is still alive at least once a day

Beyond that, the job description is wide open. Remember, before Gore, it was in fact a thankless, useless job. "Not worth a pitcher of warm piss" was the description one former occupant said.

Nowadays, the job is whatever the President wants it to be. Gore and Cheney have shown that the job is really a senior political and advisory position. I think Clark would excel at ANY job he was given, and he would excel as VP.

[incapsulated]

17. For me what it come's down to is this

VP is like the Junior President. The idea of Clark being Kerry's Junior President literally makes me want to puke, and it's just wrong. He is too senior and too experienced to be playing that role.

[Dookus]

20. we disagree on this...

Vice President CAN be a very powerful position - check out Cheney.

After Clinton/Gore and Bush/Cheney, we seem to have placed a lot more importance on the political and policy role of the VP than we ever did before. And I think that's a good thing.

I agree Clark would be a great Secretary of State... I disagree that he would be a bad Vice-President. He'd be a great one, and could follow it up as a great President.

[Jerseycoa]

21. Look at the web of relationships

Clark already has internationally. He is respected and trusted in Europe and Latin America and the Middle East. Wouldn't it be a shame if he weren't in the position that would most utilize his talents and history in foreign relations?

[Dookus]

26. I don't think

being vice president would preclude that.

Clinton and Gore redefined the office. Bush/Cheney have further redefined it.

I see no reason why Clark couldn't be the ultimate ambassador-at-large for a Kerry administration. In fact, that would be a very wise use of his talents.

[incapsulated]

22. Clark is an Senior Alpha Male

I write it in caps because it's important.

He is used to being in command. He worked his whole career to get to that position. He retired after reaching great heights in command. He got in trouble with the Pentagon precisely because he didn't like being told what to do. He is the worst possible choice for a suboridinate role like VP.

Think Bush senior or LBJ. Not happy campers, I tell you what.

[Jerseycoa]

24. In command

Good point.

[Dookus]

30. ahh...

you forget he wasn't BORN a general. He spent the entirety of his career reporting to somebody else. Even as a 4-star General, he reported to somebody else.

I agree with you that he'd be a great SoS. But I think the Vice-Presidency is a more powerful position.

[incapsulated]

34. Everybody answers to somebody

Except the President.

But being the number two, in a Department, in an Army, or in the White House, is something else.

Being the Secretary means you are the head of that Department, not the second guy down. You have respect around the world, in your own right. It is probably the most visable cabinet position there is, and the most prestigious around the world, second only to the President.

Which is exactly why Clark might not even take that. I really get the sense that he is done taking orders a very long time ago.

[Jerseycoa]

23. I do like the thought

of a future President Clark, though.

It's time I tried to sleep again. Now I've stopped crying for the night, I feel a great weight on my chest, but I know it will pass. Thanks for the company, you two.

[incapsulated]

25. Hey, if we lose

We can start up the Draft Clark Campaign and put him through hell again because we love him so much, hehe.

:hug:

[Jerseycoa]

27. There, you got me to laugh, you wicked girl

:7

[incapsulated]

28. Good! :)

I'm happy now. ;)

[incapsulated]

19. Cheney is a puppet master

And Gore had a great boss.

[Crunchy Frog]

42. I agree with you Dookus

I think that Clark would be an ideal running mate for Kerry. It would not at all be the same sort of arrangement that a Dean/Clark ticket would have been.

I think he could do some fantastic things in the vice presidency, and he seems to be a slow enough ager that maybe he could still run 8 years from now. He is in pretty damn good physical condition.

I think he would be a much better running mate than Edwards, and Kerry would be a fool not to ask him. That is just my opinion.

[Jerseycoa]

6. Why are we still awake??

No. I can't do that. I'm waiting to hear from him tomorrow on what he intends to do and I'm going to go with whatever that is. I do believe I will still vote for Wes in the primary, though. Unless things get a lot closer between Kerry and Edwards, in which case my vote would make a difference in determining the nomination, I intend to vote for Clark just for the love of him.

[maddezmom]

29. We need to trust Wes' decision

it's for him to make, and I'll support him in his decision. (putting that aside, I look like I got hit with a Mac truck from all the damn tears)

[Dookus]

32. yup...

I've shed my share of tears tonight, too. I'm heart-broken that the best candidate in my lifetime didn't do better.

But I respect the voters, my fellow citizens. I still feel strongly that a Kerry/Clark ticket is extremely powerful.

[maddezmom]

33. I'd be happy with that ticket

it's up to the machine now. Whatever happens, I'm voting for the Dem. nominee.

[DU GrovelBot]

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[incapsulated]

35. Out damned bot!

[Dookus]

36. lol...

I've come to love grovelbot (or gravelbutt or gravybat or whatever we call him/her/it)

We should all have stars. And if you don't have one and need one, PM me.

[incapsulated]

37. It's like an annoying pet

That always jumps in your lap at the most inappropriate moment! :)

[maddezmom]

38. LOL~isn't it the truth

my new puppy like to burst in on my while I'm in the ladies room. :)

[Crunchy Frog]

39. I think Clark believes

that he can make a more important contribution to the party in other ways than by remaining a candidate. I respect his decision and believe that whatever he does it will be in the best interests of the party, the eventual nominee and the country.

[maddezmom]

41. crunchyfrog...ya hit the nail on the head

his focus is now on getting rid of bush* and will work with the dems to fulfill that goal. :)