NEW GOP campaign slogan: "I don't know if we're winning in Iraq"

[Human Torch]

Is U.S. Winning in Iraq? Tony Snow Says, "I Don't Know"

By E&P Staff

Published: October 16, 2006 4:35 PM ET

NEW YORK At his daily briefing today at the White House, Press Secretary Tony Snow fielded a barrage of questions related to the recent upsurge in U.S. deaths in Iraq and worries that the Iraqi government is failing to stem the tide of violence. Suddenly one reporter put the issue squarely: “Sorry. Just the simple question: Are we winning?”

Snow punted.

“We're making progress,” he replied. “I don't know. How do you define ‘winning’? The fact is, in taking on the war on terror -- let me put it this way, the President has made it obvious, we're going to win. And that means, ultimately, providing an Iraq that is safe, secure, and an ally in the war on terror. And at any given time, as you've seen in previous wars, there are going to be spikes in violence. And it is natural for Americans who have -- really are probably the most empathetic people on the face of the earth, to feel deeply the loss of those who have given their lives in battle.”

Later, another reporter, speaking almost as directly, asked why the president had claimed for three years that the U.S. would “stand down” as the Iraqis “stood up” – but despite alleged Iraqi efforts to rise, the U.S. has not been able to withdraw at all. A lengthy exchange followed, with the reporter noting, “So they are standing up, but we're not standing down. So is that principle no longer operable?” Snow responded, “It seems to me that we're playing -- this is kind of a fun verbal game.”

http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003255289

[liberal N proud]

1. The White House preparing the republican base for a soft landing

as they have lost complete control in Iraq and know there is no hope. In the next few weeks they will increasingly tell less and less bright stories about their "progress" and eventually claim all is lost.

[vixengrl]

2. “I don't know. How do you define ‘winning’?"

Well, for the benefit of Mr. Snow, who presumably doesn't know any better (I'll give him the benefit of the doubt--perhaps he honestly *doesn't* know any better)the definition of "winning" isn't for the media to decide--why, that would be saying the the business of war was a matter of perception! It would be saying wars are won on a propaganda front and don't need identifiable, militarily, diplomatically, politically-derived goals. It seems that having committed our forces to war, the White House should've know what they intended to "win". (Eradicating the threat of WMDs? Weren't any. Liberating Iraq from Saddam? He's history. Ending terrorism? Uh oh.) Without a way of knowing what "winning" means, it does seem like a "verbal game"--but it's being played with people's lives. That isn't "fun."

[jimshoes]

3. It's one of those words the pretzeldent

has a little trouble defining. Much like the phrase "human dignity", ... he's not sure on that one either. Then there's "peeance freeance", which I have to admit, I'm a little fuzzy on too, and then there's sovereign. He plainly thinks he understands that one. I'm just not sure he does.

[Rageneau]

4. The soft bigotry of no expectations

[Greatwildbeast]

5. Send this invite to your Republican friends!!!

Here follows a crank e-mail I sent to a die hard Republican friend of mine.

Although this deserves a true topic of it's own on "humor" or something i thought it best to put it here.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Dear Fellow Republican

As Representative of the Southeastern Association of Conservative Voters (SAC) I am pleased to inform you of a reward we wish to bestow upon you.

Due to your unwavering and continued support of Conservative Family Values matters we would like to invite you to our post election celebration in New Orleans, LA on Saturday, November 11th, 2006. The confernece will take place at the recently opened

Louisiana Superdome Sugar Bowl Drive New Orleans, LA 70112


Your flight and travel plans will arrive shortly after your acceptance and reply to this mailer. This is a fully catered and lavish celebration. Bring your wife or a friend.

As you know we have very positive hopes and expectations of another GOP midterm victory! We merely wish to have you join us in the celebration.

I know you don't want to miss this celebration so please let us know immediately if you intend to attend. A once in a lifetime adventure!!!

At this exciting affair you will be surprised to meet some outstanding, major political leaders of the Republican Party! Gala list follows of celebrities and GOP leaders follows this e-mail.

Please please reply TODAY!!!

Best Wishes and SEE YOU THERE!!!

Gloria Snockers, Secretary SAC.




Gala list of contributors in attendance:


Republican anti-abortion activist Howard Scott Heldreth is a convicted child rapist in Florida.

Republican County Commissioner David Swartz pleaded guilty to molesting two girls under the age of 11 and was sentenced to 8 years in prison.

Republican judge Mark Pazuhanich pleaded no contest to fondling a 10-year old girl and was sentenced to 10 years probation.

Republican anti-abortion activist Nicholas Morency pleaded guilty to possessing child pornography on his computer and offering a bounty to anybody who murders an abortion doctor.

Republican legislator Edison Misla Aldarondo was sentenced to 10 years in prison for raping his daughter between the ages of 9 and 17.

Republican Mayor Philip Giordano is serving a 37-year sentence in federal prison for sexually abusing 8- and 10-year old girls.

Republican campaign consultant Tom Shortridge was sentenced to three years probation for taking nude photographs of a 15-year old girl.

Republican racist pedophile and United States Senator Strom Thurmond had sex with a 15-year old black girl which produced a child.

Republican pastor Mike Hintz, whom George W. Bush commended during the 2004 presidential campaign, surrendered to police after admitting to a sexual affair with a female juvenile.

Republican legislator Peter Dibble pleaded no contest to having an inappropriate relationship with a 13-year-old girl.

Republican Congressman Donald "Buz" Lukens was found guilty of having sex with a female minor and sentenced to one month in jail.

Republican fundraiser Richard A. Delgaudio was found guilty of child porn charges and paying two teenage girls to pose for sexual photos.

Republican activist Mark A. Grethen convicted on six counts of sex crimes involving children.

Republican activist Randal David Ankeney pleaded guilty to attempted sexual assault on a child.

Republican Congressman Dan Crane had sex with a female minor working as a congressional page.

Republican activist and Christian Coalition leader Beverly Russell admitted to an incestuous relationship with his step daughter.

Republican congressman and anti-gay activist Robert Bauman was charged with having sex with a 16-year-old boy he picked up at a gay bar.

Republican Committee Chairman Jeffrey Patti was arrested for distributing a video clip of a 5-year-old girl being raped.

Republican activist Marty Glickman (a.k.a. "Republican Marty"), was taken into custody by Florida police on four counts of unlawful sexual activity with an underage girl and one count of delivering the drug LSD.

Republican legislative aide Howard L. Brooks was charged with molesting a 12-year old boy and possession of child pornography.

Republican Senate candidate John Hathaway was accused of having sex with his 12-year old baby sitter and withdrew his candidacy after the allegations were reported in the media.

Republican preacher Stephen White, who demanded a return to traditional values, was sentenced to jail after offering $20 to a 14-year-old boy for permission to perform oral sex on him.

Republican talk show host Jon Matthews pleaded guilty to exposing his genitals to an 11 year old girl.

Republican anti-gay activist Earl "Butch" Kimmerling was sentenced to 40 years in prison for molesting an 8-year old girl after he attempted to stop a gay couple from adopting her.

Republican Party leader Paul Ingram pleaded guilty to six counts of raping his daughters and served 14 years in federal prison.

Republican election board official Kevin Coan was sentenced to two years probation for soliciting sex over the internet from a 14-year old girl.

Republican politician Andrew Buhr was charged with two counts of first degree sodomy with a 13-year old boy.

Republican politician Keith Westmoreland was arrested on seven felony counts of lewd and lascivious exhibition to girls under the age of 16 (i.e. exposing himself to children).

Republican anti-abortion activist John Allen Burt was charged with sexual misconduct involving a 15-year old girl.

Republican County Councilman Keola Childs pleaded guilty to molesting a male child.

Republican activist John Butler was charged with criminal sexual assault on a teenage girl.

Republican candidate Richard Gardner admitted to molesting his two daughters.

Republican Councilman and former Marine Jack W. Gardner was convicted of molesting a 13-year old girl.

Republican County Commissioner Merrill Robert Barter pleaded guilty to unlawful sexual contact and assault on a teenage boy.

Republican City Councilman Fred C. Smeltzer, Jr. pleaded no contest to raping a 15 year-old girl and served 6-months in prison.

Republican activist Parker J. Bena pleaded guilty to possession of child pornography on his home computer and was sentenced to 30 months in federal prison and fined $18,000.

Republican parole board officer and former Colorado state representative, Larry Jack Schwarz, was fired after child pornography was found in his possession.

Republican strategist and Citadel Military College graduate Robin Vanderwall was convicted in Virginia on five counts of soliciting sex from boys and girls over the internet.

Republican city councilman Mark Harris, who is described as a "good military man" and "church goer," was convicted of repeatedly having sex with an 11-year-old girl and sentenced to 12 years in prison.

Republican businessman Jon Grunseth withdrew his candidacy for Minnesota governor after allegations surfaced that he went swimming in the nude with four underage girls, including his daughter.

Republican director of the "Young Republican Federation" Nicholas Elizondo molested his 6-year old daughter and was sentenced to six years in prison.

Republican benefactor of conservative Christian groups, Richard A. Dasen Sr., was charged with rape for allegedly paying a 15-year old girl for sex. Dasen, 62, who is married with grown children and several grandchildren, has allegedly told police that over the past decade he paid more than $1 million to have sex with a large number of young women

[calimary]

6. Wicked!

Welcome to DU!

[Greatwildbeast]

7. Thank you calimary

I still can't start a topic of my own yet and it pisses me off frigin ROYALLY!!!

No respect I tell you. None at all.

Shoot back in '64 at age nine I was pulling Goldwater stickers off the bumpers of cars. Ditto Nixon decals in '68 & '72.

Then between 1978 and 1981 I diverted over two hundred grand AWAY from the GOP coffers.

Later in the mid 1980's I helped push the California Desert Protection Act through Congress with my volunteer activism.

And these A - Holes here STILL here won't let me start a topic!

No frigin respect at all.

[calimary]

8. Aw, just hang in there a little longer, and keep on a'postin'...

You will get there. And sooner than you realize.

I mouthed off awhile, too. But then, I tend to do that anyway. :D

Glad you're here. Your pedigree is noted and appreciated! I started with the Student Coalition for Humphrey/Muskie, and not-yet L.A. Mayor Tom Bradley's first campaign against Sam "Los Angle-lees" Yorty. We worked on the "Power 18" campaign in college, and actually broke that tune on college radio for the sake of changing the law so 18-year-olds could vote, which was kind of exciting, too. This is a great place for activism. People are really on fire here. It's my oasis on many a politically stormy day. You'll fit in fine. In fact, we need you.

Cheers!

:toast:

[calimary]

9. Hey, Greatwildbeast -

did you see this one?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=2888413&mesg_id=2888413

I'd love your feedback.

[Greatwildbeast]

10. She's not alone

She's not alone Calimary. There are a lot of Liberal/Progressive people of religion. Even many whom one might easily label as devout. They just don't wear their belief in God on their sleeves as do many from the so-called "Christian Right".

Who'd ever have thought that the political upsurge and strength of Conservative Fundamentalists would make the Roman Catholic Church appear reasonable? Even "Liberal"???

AND: All this coming on the heels of the Catholic Priests/Kiddie sexual abuse disaster?

If I were a Catholic Bishop or a Cardinal I'd thank GOD for the GOP screwing up so badly thus allowing the fractured clergy from Rome on down to Massachusetts a chance to avoid negative publicity and close some serious wounds.

But that is exactly what has happened. Back when i was a teen and on through my twenties we used to poke fun of our overly repressed Catholic friends. Later in life most of these friends grew out of their former devout Catholic origins. Finally even declaring themselves "Atheists or Agnostics".

The common word they used was "Recovered Catholic". And from then on we could see eye to eye with them (Finally!). This was because our friends had moved beyond the dogma.

Well later still these former Catholics often migrated back to their original flocks because they saw some wisdom in the Roman Catholic church. They never quite became the devout types but certainly enjoyed the community.

I've often liked Catholic clergy and have learned some good stuff from them. Not the Anti Abortion crap but on other levels of humanity and education.

Jesuits TEACH kids well.

But as for the Rightwingnut Fundamentalists? You'll still find a fair bunch who have oddly caring ideas about the world. just so long as you can keep the topic AWAY from the political realm.

And it is exactly THOSE type who will find themselves the most depressed after the other shoe drops on the GOP. Expect widespread depression among the Christian Republicans. That followed by a positive activism more along the lines of progressive Liberalism.

They are S-L-O-W- L-E-A-R-N-E-R-S but eventually they do get headed in the proper direction.

Anyway thank you again for inviting my response. Hope you're not just requesting my reply because the DU board has put me on the shelf for being the "Gren Pea".

Hey I'll be honest with ya: I'm pissed at them. Damn angry actually.

Think it would take THIS long for me to get the privilege to post on a wingnut/"I Hate Liberals" website?

Hardly.

In fact this is one of the reasons for the success of Christian Fundamentalists: THEY WELCOME AND RESPECT NEW PEOPLE!!!

Of course so does Dracula, by my point is well taken i think.





Quotes:

By Mary Lyon, From The Left -- World News Trust

Oct. 16, 2006 -- The cynic in me has long suspected that conservative, indeed regressive, reactionary politicians have viewed people with strong religious convictions as just so many sheep. Sheep to be used and exploited for whatever might be taken from them. Sheep to be shorn at regular intervals, and to be herded off to market, either to sell wholesale, or to funnel into slaughterhouses to be bludgeoned, carved up, and consumed outright. I never saw the politicians involved as having much interest in any of the core beliefs that moved the legions of the faithful. It always seemed to me that you should get into politics to help people, to better the system, to serve the common good -- rather than to target large groups, carnivorously and ruthlessly, to be manipulated for the self-interest of greedy individuals.

The Bush Administration has brought out the cynic in me. And the beast in me. Not that I have a “666” tattoo on my skin (you may, however, find one on Dick Cheney’s chest above where a normal person’s heart would be, beneath one of Karl Rove’s double chins, or behind that signature shock of long blond hair pulled around to the front to conceal one side of Ann Coulter’s scrawny neck). I’ve never once felt any temptation to take anything from the Bush people at face value without suspecting some ulterior motive. They’ve always been alert for crowds of easy marks that can be fleeced for political advantage. Not very Christian, at least as far as I’ve always understood it.

I’m 53 years old now, which means I’ve been a Catholic for 53 years. I did more than my share of time in Catholic school, from preschool through my high school graduation day. My youth was thoroughly marinated in Christian thought, study, and on good days, deeds. And if you’ve steeped in it for that long, the flavorings tend to stay with you -– perhaps even for a lifetime if your superiors have done their jobs.

Part of what stuck with me, besides the cyclical observances of Christ-centered special events, was an overriding belief system –- belief in stuff that still seems rather pure and legitimate, genuinely good. You were supposed to be a humble believer. God was supposed to use you –- it wasn’t the other way around. You didn’t swagger and strut down the center aisle at church to make sure everybody’d see the pile of money you were about to dump into the collection plate. Heaven forbid anyone be encouraged to worship you or anoint you as God’s Chosen. You weren’t supposed to be in it for power or show. Heck, the Gospel of Matthew, Chapter 6, even said you’re supposed to go pray in the closet (good Lord, what would the “religious” “right” make of THAT?). While I don’t presume to know the mind of God, it strikes me that Jesus would have cringed over the wealth, power, and media razzmatazz of the Falwell or Swaggert ministries, the “700 Club,” and the “Focus on the Pharisees” machinery. St. Paul once dissed such Barnums & Baileys while writing to the Corinthians about the evils of noisy gongs and clanging cymbals.