Kerry disses Guard

[AnnitaR]

http://www.gomemphis.com/mca/national_politics/article/0,1426,MCA_15116_2633365,00.html

Kerry disses Guard

John Kerry slipped in a shiv Tuesday night when asked about President Bush's service record. He seemed to lump those who joined the National Guard with those who didn't serve - and that could backfire with Guard vets.

"I would defend the President's choice with respect to going into the Guard," said Kerry, a decorated Vietnam veteran. "I've never made any judgments about any choice somebody made about avoiding the draft, about going to Canada, going to jail, being a conscientious objector, going into the National Guard. Those are choices people make."


-Gee, that wasn't the best way to phrase that answer. I think a lot of people are going to be surprised at how little vet support Kerry really has.

[BeatleBoot]

1. I would hope that if Kerry is the nominee

that Wes Clark would support him.

[krkaufman]

17. The article has nothing to do with Clark

The above article has nothing to do with Wes Clark; please don't infer (or imply) that it does. Kerry made a "gaffe" (shock!), and a potentially serious one at that. Does he actually *mean* what he said (i.e. the sentence that his word order produced)? Likely not. But it sure does sound bad; his words definitely imply a view of National Guardsmen as draft dodgers.

I've never made any judgments about any choice somebody made about avoiding the draft, ... going into the National Guard.

p.s. And I would hope, when the time comes, that Senator Kerry and his supporters will support Wes Clark against Bush in November, as well.

[Columbia]

2. Ugh

This whole 'who's more of a vet' pissing contest between Kerry and Clark is making them both look like asses.

[krkaufman]

16. Please NOTE

Please note that Clark has had precious little to say regarding Kerry's military record -- other than that he respects and honors Kerry's service -- and that this posting does not quote Wes Clark. It is an article about Kerry commenting on Bush's status during his TANG period of enlistment.

I've been impressed with the way that Clark has minimized talking about his "military" credentials or hero/soldier bona fides; rather, he emphasizes that his lengthy service and accension to 4-star general provided him with excellent executive leadership and political training, and that his tour as NATO Supreme Allied Commander afforded him enormous experience in foreign policy and diplomacy.

[Blayde Starrfyre]

3. Wait a minute

You're pretty much taking that out of context. Kerry is listing off all the other options other than military service. Some of those he cannot possibly be denigrating: for example we look at Muhammad Ali as a hero because he went to jail to protest the draft. Now I agree that he could have phrased it better. The message Democrats should just be pounding is "We don't have a problem because Bush served in the National Guard, we have a problem because he DIDN'T serve in the National Guard." However I think you're grasping at straws, I don't want to see the Clark campaign get negative, that will definitely give Edwards a big advantage over you guys.

[sandnsea]

4. Now is not Vietnam

Everybody knows it. This statement served its purpose exactly. Lumped Bush in with people who chose not to go to Vietnam, reminded people of his privilege, and put it in their heads that he couldn't even bother to show up after getting that privilege. People in the Guard either know it now or will vote for Bush anyway.

[isbister]

12. Bush has been wrapping himself falsely in the flag

Max Cleland said the other day. (http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/02/05/bushs_guard_service_what_the_record_shows/) and that is the point of this whole thing against bush. Its not his service in the Guard or anyone else's choice about serving or not serving at the time.

Let's not forget this phoney is also the one who loves the troops out of one side of his mouth and cuts benefits out of the other. I firmly believe he thinks of the military as only something, something to be used... something a little more than cannon fodder.

Would bush allow someone in today's Guard take an unaccounted year off? Would he apply his standard for service to those serving our country today?

I'm sure there are more than I few that could use a year off.

[MaineDem]

5. That was then; this is now

The Guard WAS an alternative to Vietnam back then.

Kerry even made that point yesterday. He said the Guard is a very different unit now. Now it's almost a guarantee of going to fight; back then it was a way out. I'm paraphrasing his words here.

[IndianaGreen]

6. The Guard and the Reserves have bore the brunt of the fighting in Iraq

People don't realize that when they are activated they are just like the regular military, taking the same risks and carrying the same missions.

Our Guard and Reserves have left their businesses, their jobs, and their families behind on a tour that seems to never end.

Kerry is living in the past, and he has been shamelessly milking it!

[CWebster]

7. Not only that -he tried to play both sides of that as well

When it was politically advantageous he protested the war. Kerry expressed outrage about Viet Nam in speeches made at Yale, prior to signing up to fight in what he knew then was an unjust war(He had to do his reinactment of the Kennedy thing). Then he came back and protested the war when it was politically correct and safe. Now he exploits his service as a greater measure of patriotism or something, and mocks others with an arrogant tone while he, himself, voted in support of another unjust war. Of course he has little he can actually hold against Bush since he dutifully skipped along behind him on most things he could now demand accountability for.

[isbister]

9. Kerry expressed outrage about

Viet Nam in speeches made at Yale, prior to signing up to fight in what he know what was an unjust war

Wow, I didn't know that... do you happen to have any of those speeches handy? I'd like to read them.

[CWebster]

18. Yep

"Your critics had suspected that your activities, both in the war, and in years following, were prompted, at least in part, to an intense political ambition, even as you addressed your Yale graduating class with an anti-Vietnam War speech shortly prior to enlisting in the U.S. Navy. Your career in the Senate has revealed your all-consuming ambition, but that is quite typical of politicians."


http://www.brianwillson.com/awolkerry.html

[MaineDem]

8. Ummmm

"Our Guard and Reserves have left their businesses, their jobs, and their families behind on a tour that seems to never end."

That's pretty much what Kerry said yesterday. He's not "milking" anything. See my previous post. He acknowledges that the Guard today is a much different unit than back in the Vietnam era.

There may be some things people can hang on John Kerry but this issue isn't going to have legs.

[bigtree]

10. I hadn't heard that it was an issue

until this rag claimed it was one.

[isbister]

11. Kerry disses Guard??

"I would defend the President's choice with respect to going into the Guard," said Kerry, a decorated Vietnam veteran. "I've never made any judgments about any choice somebody made about avoiding the draft, about going to Canada, going to jail, being a conscientious objector, going into the National Guard. Those are choices people make."

I'm not seeing it. This isn't dissing the Guard:

I would defend the President's choice with respect to going into the Guard

This isn't dissing the Guard, being a conscientious objector, going to jail, going to Canada, or avoiding the draft:

"I've never made any judgments about any choice somebody made about..."

This is the position he's held for a long time, I just don't see the dissing. Now, if you want to talk about bush's service record including taking a year off from the Guard... that's dissing the Guard.

[NNN0LHI]

13. I think it is called grasping at straws? n/t

[blm]

15. It's called twisting a story for narrow political advantage.

Not that it's going to work.

[blm]

14. No. He said the "choices made"...the Guard back then WAS a haven for rich

boys escaping Nam. BIG difference.

This is a FALSE charge to make and no doubt the journalist INTENDED it to be.

btw...Kerry has TONS more support in the military than ANY other candidate in the race, including Bush.

[IndianaGreen]

20. Most Guardsmen during the Vietnam era were from poor and working...

Most Guardsmen during the Vietnam era were from poor and working class families.

Kerry don't know shit about what he is talking about. He lives high on the city in the clouds, totally unconcerned about the miners that live and work on the ground below (to use a Star Trek analogy).

[markus]

19. What were the Guard mobilizations like for the Vietnam War

I've never heard that discussed before. I know there were Coast Guard mobilized into their combat role, but I've never heard of generalized NG mobilizations

Where there any? Where they significat? Or was going into the Guard as good as not going?