Kerry Detractors: What's your main beef with Kerry?

[Gringo]

Kerry Detractors: What's your main beef with Kerry?

[MaddogTerp]

1. it ain't a beef with him, its' a ketchup thing

hahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!

[Gringo]

2. I actually heard one of those twits on "Fox & Fiends" say:

"former frontrunner Howard Dean is desparately trying to catch up with John Kerry. Get it? Ketch-up? Get it? (Snicker)"

(Before the tuesday primaries)

Have I mentioned how much I HATE Fox News Channel?

[edzontar]

3. Kerry's IWR vote is almost impossible to forgive.

I hate him for this.

[newyawker99]

26. Hi Maddog Terp!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[democratreformed]

4. Other - I really have no beef with Kerry

I just happen to think there is a candidate who will be better for our country. Not that Kerry won't be good.

[LuminousX]

5. He is the past, not the future.

He is too much D.C., not enough America.

He is all politician - if he didn't work on politics, what would he do? Careerists scare me.

If he becomes President, we will protect the Supreme Court, we will engage in alternative energy research, and we will start down the road of universal healthcare - all with the approval of the appropriate corporations and special interests. Nothing will change except who is pulling the strings. So, while the White Hats win, they are still beholden to the Gray Hats. Same ol', same ol'.

[Armstead]

9. You expressed my feelings perfectly Luminous

Kerry's a good man, but he has been eroded by too much time in Washington.

I believe when that happens, anyone loses site of the realities beyond the Beltway.

They also get so worn down by the constant compromises and obstacles that they lose their sense of vision and enthusiasm....The balance between pragmatism and ideals tips too much to bloodless pragmatism and opportunism.

Kerry seems like a classic example of that.

[Taeger]

28. This is why Clark

This is why Clark would make such a good President. His integrity hasn't been eroded by years in Washington. He has the bull headedness and gentle temperament to push reason through over cynicism.

[Options Remain]

11. I will vote for him in november but not in the primary.

At one point I was a kerry volunteer. Then he soke out against gay marrage. Most likely reacting to the negative press on the subject her in masssachusetts. I recognised it as a poll driven dodge but he missed an opportunity. I even wrote him about it when I cut ties with the campaign.

However as far as all the current histeria about his legislative career and what he has or hasn't done and what he voted and why everyone needs to take a huge chill pill. To affect change you must work within the system. To go contrary to the system essentially kills any chance you have of creating real change. To change the system you need to have MASSIVE support and the divide and conquer aspects of politics have prevented that kind of pressure from occuring.

Kerry is someone who has done what he could within the system. The question "Is he someone to challenge the system once he is president?" Is another question entirely.

The only democrat who would -start- to do that is Kucinich IMO. But ultimately the president is only a minor part of the problem.

Which is why no matter which democrat we get in office this year we must not stop there. The moment we have a dem president is the moment we lynch the DLC and redirect america back to where is should be. Because in the end neither party is innocent in the mess we are in today. And neither party will push us back in the right direction unless we remain as engaged and driven as we are now.

nov 2004 is the beginning not the end of the battle. Any of our dem canidates will make a good president. We want more than that. We want to turn the boat around.

TearForger

[T Roosevelt]

13. You have summed it up well

He is not the person to revitalize and redirect the Democratic party. He is establishment by virtue of the fact that he is the entrenched DC insider, with no real vision to offer.

[dansolo]

6. His lack of vision and conviction

He is not a leader. He is a political windsock.

[Atlant]

7. OTHER--Kerry's stance is quite flexible depending on who's listening. (NT)

[lulu]

19. "Flexible" is too nice a word

A few weeks ago, I caught Kerry on a news show, Meet the Press or one of those, and he was asked about his IRW vote. I listened intently, really wanting to know what made him vote for it. What came out of his mouth was double-talking drivel. I couldn't believe it. He wound around and around the issue and never once gave any solid answer. By the time he had finished, I had no idea what he was talking about. I wanted to support him, but putting his hemming and hawing about IRW next to Dean's straightforwardness and unwavering stance on the war, Kerry looked pathetic.

Since that time, however, Kerry has improved. He tries to answer in a clear, concise manner, and I've been impressed with his performances during the debates. But, my fear is that, when faced with the hurricane opposition that will erupt from the media and from Bush's campaign if/when Kerry's the nominee, I'm still afraid that he will go back to his waffling ways and look like a fool.

[John_H]

8. You forgot the big one: he might not be able to beat chimp

[LuminousX]

15. Bush is unelectable - Kerry would beat him easily.

As would Edwards, Dean, et. al.

[mermaid]

34. Don't Be So Sure Of That!!

There are many people dulled and gulled by Bush, and Fox News Channel! The last thing we need now is to become complacent!! If a lot of people think Bush won't win, many of our supporters may stay home, and thus, give Bush the election!

DO NOT BE COMPLACENT IN NOVEMBER!! We have the momentum, we need to maintain it, and not get complacent, despite Bush's popularity numbers dropping!

[PAMod]

36. Agreed. We could squander our chance to kick Bush out of the WH.

The fact that Kerry is the front runner ENTIRELY on the basis of his electability, is the bitterest irony.

He is the Democratic Bob Dole. It is truly astounding how this nomination process has gone awry.

I wanna laugh because it is SO damn ironic and I wanna cry because our country is in such big trouble.

I also want to cry for the Kerry defenders because his name will go down in history as an epithet, joining Dukakis, Mondale and McGovern - all decent men & great Americans, but presidential candidates misplaced in time.

Some poor candidate in the future will be derided as "another Kerry".

Unless he wins of course, in which case we will universally revere him and call him things like "big daddy". I'm hoping this tendency to throw away the thoughtfulness of the process to fall in line behind the most famous candidate is a harbinger of unprecedented Democratic Party unity.

That might be the silver lining in this dark cloud.

[pintobean]

10. Boring

Check out his responses here:
http://64.177.207.201/pages/8_470.html

[IrateCitizen]

20. Did you notice the difference with Kucinich's answers

All the others looked at each question individually. Kucinich is the only one who, on each question, looked beyond the simple question at the underlying causes and effects, connecting the dots to support his answers.

Of course, the American People quickly grow tired of such long-winded analyses, and like their policy answers in 10-second soundbites -- or less.

[pintobean]

29. I agree.

It's a good look at how they think. Kerry's soundbites are less than 1 second.

[MercutioATC]

12. IWR, NCLB, Patriot Act votes...he has no ammunition to attack Bush.

I can just see Bush smiling and thanking Kerry for his support "in these difficult times".

[Snivi Yllom]

14. this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=269640

AP Exclusive: Kerry Blocked Law, Drew Cash
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=536&e=1&u=/ap/20040204/ap_on_el_pr/kerry_big_dig

[AP]

16. Too similar to Bush (class), not enough conviction (of the right kind)

and really doesn't speak to precisely the historical problems we're having in America right now.

But mostly, he's just not the best person running. Edwards is, for the reasons mentioned above.

[IrateCitizen]

17. I don't have a "beef" with Kerry, but he doesn't excite me, either

I just see him as another politician, too willing to sell out on principle in order to further his own political ambition. I'm certain that he feels he was doing the right thing, based on the "greater good" he could accomplish with a big win (as many others obviously do).

I guess I'm just the kind of person who believes that once you start down the slippery slope of sacrificing your principles, you're really not left with much in the end. He doesn't excite me as someone who would really be a leader, but would continue to twist in the winds of public opinion a la Clinton -- talking about great things but not ever willing to put the personal political capital on the line necessary to achieve them.

[SeattleRob]

18. I think he's probably a good guy...

But my beef with him is that he seems to have sold out his core beliefs over the years.

Supporters say that he took on the BFEE when he did his Iran Contra, CIA Drug Smuggling Investigation. What were the results of this? Not much. The BFEE came back with a vengance and we are now in our current mess.

What we need is fundamental change of the entire system. Kerry seems
more concerned with poll numbers than principles. If he is the nominee, I will vote for him. I pray he will defeat Bush. But if he does make it to the whitehouse, I don't think much will change. Of course he will be better than the Chimp and things will get a little better. However, the system of monied intersts controlling our discourse will continue (unbridled globalization, Insurance and Pharmaceutical companies controlling healthcare, etc... )and the stage will be set for similar looneys like Bush and Co. to ascend to power and fuck things up really worse. (There are still more Bushes waiting in the wings. (Jeb in 08? :puke: )


I hope I am wrong.

[revcarol]

21. Other:

NAFTA, GATT, WTO, FAST TRACK,.....WAY TOO FOND OF LETTING CORPORATIONS RULE AMERICA AND THE WORLD...Wants to stay in Iraq...
Out of touch with the average struggling American...

:argh: I used to respect him.

[Ravy]

22. My take...

I would certainly support Kerry, and in some respects would have a 180 degree turnaround in the direction of the country.

But, the issue I see is that Kerry would be just as polarizing as *. We may have the MAJORITY on our side this time, but I don't think that Kerry is really the best one to UNITE the country and bring us all together for the common good.

I guess what I am trying to say is that I prefer someone who would inspire and unite America, and bring out the best in all of us. I see Kerry pushing a liberal agenda (which I am for) but facing 4 or 8 years of constant sniping by the large conservative minority.

I plan to vote strategically when my state has its primary. I prefer Clark, Dean, and Edwards above Kerry and will support those three until someone locks up the nomination. Then I will wholly support our nominee.

Ravy

[IrateCitizen]

24. I actually see the "liberal agenda" 180 degrees opposite

You said: I see Kerry pushing a liberal agenda (which I am for) but facing 4 or 8 years of constant sniping by the large conservative minority.

My greatest fear is that I see Kerry as becoming another Clinton -- in the sense that he may push for some liberal or even progressive issues off the bat, but once the conservatives start yelling and screaming, he'll just read the polls and back off rather than actually risking some personal political capital and taking his message to the masses and hitting it over and over again.

The end result will just be a slightly less conservative compromise than if the Republicans held every branch of government -- and the Democrats will stand no shot at retaking the House or Senate, because they will be seen as tepid, pointy-headed liberals rather than champions of the working and middle class.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

23. Not beef. Bodies. About 20,000 in Iraq.

Other than those 20,000 reasons, I would support Kerry in the GE. Too bad so many here are willing to write them off in the name of ABB.

[Myra]

25. How many times do we have to say the same thing?

-He put politics over principal and ambition over honor by voting for IWR. He knew what he was doing. He was not fooled by the bastard who stole the white house; he was going along to get along.
He's a friggen war criminal.

-He put politics over principal and ambition over honor by voting for the Patriot Act. He admits there are "bad things in it." Oh? Does that mean he didn't bother to read it before agreeing to it? Is that what we want in a president? I wouldn't want that in a senator let alone a president. Again, he made it clear that he cares nothing for his constituents or for our civil rights.

He's a rich insider who is owned by special interests and who is in the "club" - aka Skull & Bones - with the other elites. He's a two faced pol, born into privilege, insulated in his life of privilege,
and representing only his peer group: corporations.

He's a dirty campaigner, a hypocrite, and a coward.
He lets others raise the real issues: the Iraq war travesty,
Bush's AWOL status, etc. He refuses to speak out about these
issues and lets the real leaders: Dean, Clark, Kucinich take the
heat. He then sweeps in cloaked in his populist haloween costume
and tries to take credit for the progress made due to the courage
of others.

He's a coward and a fraud and the ultimate insider.
He's the personification of business as usual.
He's the problem.
Clark & Kuchinich - they're the solution.

Does that answer your question?

[pintobean]

27. Bingo! Very well put. eom

[Snivi Yllom]

32. bravo

:yourock:

[LSdemocrat]

33. Agreed and,

I generally find him pompous and arrogant. He clearly thinks he's the greatest thing this country has ever seen.

[texas is the reason]

35. wow!!! nailed right out of the park......

i would add dean and edwards to the solutions too, though. but what irkes me most about kerry, is that i fear that once the heat of the primaries os over, kerry will lack the fight to attack bush like the others have and will be unable to sway or inspire the intelligent voter, and he most CERTAINLY does not have the looks and charisma to sway the superficial ones. For a democrat to WIN, he must be good looking, relaxed, appear honest and heartfelt, and above all,have a silver tongue. the apolitical voter (most voters out there) need to be wooed by a smooth, charming candidate. this is the ONLY reason bush v. gore was even close-and guess what-kerry is just as boring as gore was. we need a guy like kennedy, like clinton, like... john edwards.

[corporatewhore]

39. DITTO!!!!!!!!

[abburdlen]

40. Ding!

That sums it up nicely

[Gringo]

41. "He's a friggen war criminal"

There are those who would fling the same accusation at your esteemed General Clark.

I wouldn't be so quick to throw those wordds around.

I personally disagree with that vote, same for Hillary doing the same thing - and Bill Clinton constantly trying to bolster the case for war has not been helpful either.

The fact is, a huge number of dems, whether out of fear, or out of actually being fooled on the WMD issu, voted yes on the IWR.

I cut Kerry a little slack, because unlike Gephardt, he didn't make a point of running out to the White House lawn and shaking Dumbya's hand, grinning like an idiot when he signed it.

[BootinUp]

30. Actually two things: Liberal label, and Un-inspiring speaker

[mermaid]

31. Other - His Stance on transgender inclusion in ENDA

Of all the candidates, he is the only one who OPPOSES including protections against workplace discrimination for transgender people in the proposed Employment Non-Discrimination Act.

As a transgender person who has faced employment discrimination, I view this stance as a direct slap in my face, telling me I am not worthy of the same right to earn a livelihood as my fellow Americans.

by his stance on this very important issue, Kerry has said he does not support me. So why should I support him?

He claims adding transgender inclusion would be "too controversial." Well, excuse me, Mr. Kerry, but since when was ANY civil rights measure not "controversial?" Since when did the Democratic Party abandon it's principles to stick up for the little huy, for the oppressed masses, in order to avoid "controversy?" At what point did our "leaders" make the decision to send some of us to the back of the civil rights bus, in order to avoid "controversy?"

And now, this man is asking for support from one he sent to the back of the bus?? I THINK NOT!!
My dislike of Kerry is outweighed only by my hatred of Bush. Should Kery get the nomination, I will hold my nose and vote for Kerry, but let there be no mistake..this will NOT be a vote FOR KERRY....it will be a vote AGAINST BUSH!!

Kerry will NEVER get my active support until he changes his wrong-headed stance on ENDA. Till then, he gets passive support ONLY from me, and only because my hatred of Bush is so large. I can tell you that if Kerry were the noominee, and anybody other than W was occupying the White House, I'd be voting third party in 2004.

And if Kerry wins in '04, you can bet on my casting a vote third-party in '08. I WILL NOT SUPPORT JOHN KERRY - HE DOES NOT SUPPORT ME...WHY SHOULD I SUPPORT HIM?? :grr:

[corporatewhore]

37. Hes A Raw Deal

he voted for our jobs to go to CHILD SLAVES
he voted the theft and rape of indigenous peoples lands (like my grandmther)
Hevoted for abill of rights for corporations(while sending ours throughthe shedder)
he voted for Geneticly modified foods
He voted for public services to be privatised
When he voted forpermenant trade relations w/china NAFTA/GATT/WTO bushes fast track for the Ftaa
(he did try to get an amendment tha required human rights but it didnt work out and voted for it any way w/o it)
He gave bush permission to SEND MY FATHER TO SERVE IN AN UNJUST WAR
He handed bush the shredder he used to destroy the Bill of Rights with the PATRIOT ACT
He doesnt think i should have equeal rights becuase i am queer

[elias49]

38. Which Kerry??

These things bother me:

http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/17337.htm

[MrSlayer]

42. Other. See post 25.