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BobcatJH Donating Member (504 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 11:32 AM
Original message
Our dumb president
You know, every time the president's intelligence comes up for debate, the right wing is quick to tell everyone that, in fact, President Bush isn't an ignorant moron. What's more, not only is he not an ignorant moron, but he's also not an arrogant boor, his behavior on the world stage not a cause for embarrassment. He's a Yale man, after all, with a Harvard MBA to boot! Well today, I'm calling "bullshit" on the right wing. The president is all of those things ... and more.

The ignorance, the boorishness, the embarrassing behavior were all on display at this year's G8 Summit, which concluded Monday. Between the president's stuffing a roll in his mouth to his use of "shit" in an exchange with Tony Blair to his witless banter with world leaders to his more-than-awkward surprise "massage" of German Chancellor Angela Merkel, our dumb president has never been dumber or more embarrassing. Or, for that matter, more AWOL when the world needs our leadership most. But that's alright, his defenders will say, he's just being himself, being authentic. Great. Our president is an authentic jackass.

It was the "shit" heard 'round the world. In fact, it drew top billing with many news outlets at a time when the world appears to be unravelling as we speak. Bush, who, like Blair, didn't know their conversation was being recorded, called the British prime minister over at the luncheon that closed the summit. "Blair," Bush asked, "what are you doing? You leaving?" When Blair shifted the conversation to trade negotiations, Bush shifted it back, thanking Blair for a sweater he gave the president as a gift, most likely for his recent birthday. Then, the conversation shifted to the Middle East. After a brief exchange, and while continuing to talk with his mouth full of what appeared to be a roll, the president said, "See, the irony is what they need to do is get Syria to get Hezbollah to stop doing this shit, and it's over."

While using profanity and speaking with your mouth full are by no means nothing new - just ask my girlfriend, who could tell you both have been a part of my daily repertoire for years - I'm not the president. I'm not this nation's top ambassador to the rest of the planet. I'm not the public face of the United States of America. I'm just an average American and a blogger. I write things about people ranging from morons like Brad Stine and Ann Coulter to role models like Edward R. Murrow and Al Gore. I don't have my finger on the nuclear (or the "nucular") trigger. I don't travel in Air Force One, nor do I have a Secret Service detail. And I don't attend summits where I'm expected to, at the bare minimum, act like I've been there before. But Bush is all of these things; I'd just love to be able to dress him up and take him out without him embarrassing himself - or us.

So the president said "shit" and couldn't hold a conversation without stuffing his face. We've all done it. But what's as concerning to me, if not more, was the manner by which the president spoke with his fellow world leaders in an unguarded moment caught on tape. Hint: Like an idiot. When asked by someone, most likely an aide, something about whether or not the president wanted a prepared statement to close the meeting, Bush replied, "No. Just gonna make it up. I'm not going to talk too damn long like the rest of them. Some of these guys talk too long." Then, the president shifted his conversation to, quite likely though the exchange wasn't on camera, Chinese President Hu Jintao. "Gotta go home," Bush said. "Got something to do tonight. Go to the airport, get on the airplane and go home. How about you? Where are you going? Home?" Continuing, Bush added, "This is your neighborhood. It doesn't take you long to get home. How long does it take you to get home?"

Though the reply was inaudible, Bush then said, "Eight hours? Me too. Russia's a big country and you're a big country." As the Washington Post indicates, it's at this point that the president apparently brought someone else into the exchange. "It takes him eight hours to fly home," Bush said, telling a server that he wanted a Diet Coke. "It takes him eight hours to fly home. Eight hours. Russia's big and so is China." Russia's big and so is China? Just gonna make it up? Is he, as Cenk Uygur said, a third grader? Do you feel a lot safer knowing that you voted for a man whose idea of tableside conversation is asking world leaders how long their ride home is and marveling at the size of their countries?

When he wasn't showing his grasp of global geography, the president was busy doing things that would normally trigger a workplace sexual harassment workshop. Cameras captured the president walking behind Merkel and giving her an impromptu shoulder massage. Her look, which mirrors the look of any unsuspecting female in a bar when a drunk gets touchy-feely, was priceless. Bush's look, coincidentally, matched the look of that drunk. I mean, what the fuck? Somehow, I don't see former presidents Bush or Clinton doing this with Helmut Kohl. Nor, also, do I see either Bush or Clinton asking their secretary of state for permission to use the restroom, as this president has in the past. But a massage? Seriously? I know these summits can be tiring, tedious affairs, but does that fact warrant our president acting like the office letch? I doubt it.

Let's face facts: Our president is dumb. He doesn't know what he's talking about. He doesn't know how to act in public. And it's always been that way. It's been more than 70 years since "... the only thing we have to fear is fear itself". More than 40 since "... ask not what your country can do for you - ask what you can do for your country." And, in that time, we've gone from the measured words of true statesmen to "Russia's big and so is China." Let me be the latest to ask: What the hell happened? When did flipping pancakes, taking hunting trips or throwing a football become more important for our presidential candidates than knowing what the hell they were doing? More specifically, when did we, as Americans, decide that that was what we wanted out of our presidents?

I'd sure like to know, because, as I've said before, "Isn't it a tad insane that we care more about whether we can have a beer with our president than whether we think he can save us from a fucking disaster or actually knows the difference between his asshole and a hole in the ground when it comes to foreign policy?" Who cares if the president would be a great guy to have a drink with? Hell, this one isn't even supposed to have a drink. Or, maybe he's not supposed to but he has, which would go a long way to explaining Bush's behavior at the G8 Summit. Either way, he was an embarrassment. And he always has been.
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Lindacooks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
1. Fabulous. Right on and exactly correct.
Thank you for summing it up so well.
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Freedomofspeech Donating Member (622 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 12:42 PM
Response to Original message
2. Well said. Thank you....
Is it just me or does he become more ignorant everyday? He must be on some serious stuff. Whatever it is, I don't want any. I'm betting Harvard and Yale are pretty embarrassed. I have an undergrad from Slippery Rock University, and I know I could run the country a hell of a lot better than him. I'm lots of fun to drink wine with, too.
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ejbr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
45. I bet you could...
Edited on Tue Jul-18-06 07:19 PM by ejbr
I have a friend who didn't even GO to college who could do a better job than this idiot, I kid you not!

"Some of these guys talk too long." Really George? Do they talk too long about how we can make the world a better place? Maybe they talk too long because you already have a preset agenda where everyone else has no say whatsoever. He's a complete clod and slime and anyone who still supports him can eat shit.:thumbsdown:

Oh, excellent rant Bob.
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LibDemAlways Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
3. Excellent post. And you are absolutely
correct in pointing out that as bad as the eating/expletive incident was, his inane comments to world leaders about their trips home and the size of their countries was worse. Can you imagine what Putin was thinking, what he and the others must be saying about chimpy behind his back - and , by extension, about the American people who would vote for such an obvious imbecile?

It never ceases to amaze me that people I know are so willing to give Bush a pass. The media obviously has a lot to do with it. Don't inform people, and they won't know. When I try to relay some outrage, it's generally met with skepticism because if it's not on "the news" along with the latest missing blonde, they think I'm making it up.

As for what the expectations of the American people will be for the next President, that depends on who the media wants to tout. With the chimp, they had nothing more to latch onto than his folksy ordinary guy demeanor. If they decide McCain's their man in 08, expect them to proclaim that Americans are looking for the kind of tough, seasoned, mature (their likely characterizations - not mine) leadership they will assure us McCain can provide.
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reichstag911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
4. K&R.
In an ongoing debate I have with a formerly friendly acquaintance, whenever I refer to Bush's stupidity, he cites his Yale and Harvard pedigree. On the other hand, he likes to tell me that my Wharton degree is a sign that I've been brainwashed by the Eastern liberal elite. How fucking stupid can the backwash be, you ask? There is no llimit...and they don't care, because they believe in Bush.
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reichstag911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:24 PM
Response to Original message
5. PS Watch yourself;...
...you said you'd like to "take him out." Remember, Agent Mike is listening!

:rofl:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:24 PM
Response to Original message
6. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
reichstag911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Nice of you to visit;...
...so long, you lowlife troll! :rofl:
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BobcatJH Donating Member (504 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. You are that screwup
Looks like you fit the mold I described here:
I've long held an opinion about a certain faction of Bush supporters. I think that, at the end of the day, they're little more than complete screwups. They've screwed up everything they've touched. They see the president, also a complete screwup, and just love how, no matter what happens, he gets out of the mess. Like a bad '80s movie protagonist, President Bush manages, more often than not, to embarrass the Dean, score the game-winning touchdown and get the girl. These people know that if they did half of what the president has gotten away with, they'd either be dead or in jail. But one screwup managed to fool 'em all. And they root for that screwup. They identify with that screwup. They are that screwup.
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LibDemAlways Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. "the President will always be mentioned in history books"
True....but when it comes time to write the chapters about Bush II, historians will not be kind, nor will they have any reason to be.
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Contrary1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. I would rather be remembered by a few as being
a kind, caring person than an asshole who who was responsible for thousands,
if not hundreds of thousands of deaths.

As far as reporting this little Bushlicker...let's keep him around a while for the
entertainment value.

Here ya go, HrdCorps...have another glass of whatever it is that makes you
the person you are. :beer:

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Freedomofspeech Donating Member (622 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. What do you "someone" like him....
I'm not jealous that an idiot like him could become president. I'm sick, disgusted, embarrassed and ashamed that the idiot became president. He has done damage to this world that will never be repaired. Who are you, the vice president?
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Mad_Dem_X Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. Oh, he'll be mentioned in the history book all right...
as being the worst President in the history of the United States.

Enjoy your (short) stay here. :popcorn:
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Uncle Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #6
16. Would you want a regular guy to give you brain surgery?
Bush is an impostor, a puppet and vastly under qualified for the demanding job of The Presidency. While he is capable of charming people like you with his regular language, the corporate kiss ass crowd under Cheney is robbing the nation (including you) blind, trashing the planet as if there were no tomorrow and sending our people off to a war in Iraq based on lies that only serves to weaken our nation's standing in the world.

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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. Sounds like a pretty smart plan to me.
Edited on Tue Jul-18-06 02:09 PM by ClassWarrior
Bush** charms the public while Cheney** robs it blind.

By the way, why does it have to be utter stupidity or brain surgery? Why can't you see that these guys are very clever criminals?

NGU.


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reichstag911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #18
23. A criminal doesn't have to be clever...
...if he controls the corrupt "law enforcement" machinery. They're no smarter than the guy who robs the corner convenience store, but they pay the ones that are supposed to arrest 'em.
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #23
30. You underestimate them at your own risk. Read Sun Tsu.
NGU.


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Uncle Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #18
25. To me the job of Presidency equates to brain surgery,
only the Presidency is more important as it effects many more lives. I also believe you can be evil and stupid at the same time.

Regarding the plan, I believe Cheney chose Bush, not the other way around. Cheney was the connection to the money people and Bush had the name and the incurious mind. This plan would not have worked had the MCM (Mass Corporate Media) not been bought and paid for and enabled them to power.
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. I never said he**'s up to the job. I said he's a smart criminal...
And when we go all third-grade and start giggling and calling him a dummy, we just help the RW lower expectations. A lesson they learned all too well with Reagan. Instead, let's point out the criminality of his administration**.

NGU.


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reichstag911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #29
33. Nah. Bush himself...
...is an utterly useless human being. He's nothing but a tool acting on Cheney and Rumsfeld's wet dream fascist ideology.
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. Doesn't matter. When you call HIM** stupid, people transfer it...
...to the misadministration**, making them look like a friendly bunch of bumblers instead of fascist criminals.

NGU.




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raccoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #25
58. Ding, ding, ding! We have a winner!
"I believe Cheney chose Bush, not the other way around. Cheney was the connection to the money people and Bush had the name and the incurious mind."
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Thoreau-Ly Donating Member (120 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #16
35. You are Exactly Right
It's shocking, still, and despite concrete factual evidence, that so many people are amazingly clueless as to the fact that Bush is not qualified and never was. And you are also right that they are nothing but liars and thieves. And murderers, obviously.

Hate to be unkind, but I mean, really, come on, Bush is a total fraud. Fraudulent qualifications, fraudulent elections, fraudulent policies, fraud, fraud, fraud.

And such a bad actor.

http://dialogic.blogspot.com/2004/03/case-for-bush-hatred-mad-about-you-by.html
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durrrty libby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #6
21. Why do you fear intelligence?
One would think that the dummies would like an intelligent person in charge
and not another dummy like themselves.


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fuzzyball Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
13. When will this dufuss be impeached?
Along with Cheney ofcourse, cuz I could'nt tolerate
darth vader becoming commander-in-chief.
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onecent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #13
32. Welcome to DU fuzzyball! n/t
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fuzzyball Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 12:11 AM
Response to Reply #32
51. Well thank you onecent...
I sincerely appreciate your welcoming message!

Fuzzy.
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ejbr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #13
46. dufuss and darth vader in your first post?
I'm gonna like you!:P
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mimitabby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:53 PM
Response to Original message
14. thank you
you eloquently made the point I have been choking and sputtering about all day.
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Tin Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
15. Yep, our Cretin in Chief is a juggernaut of malapropisms
And because of him, the US has become both pariah and laughingstock.
Mission Accomplishitfucked.
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
17. Here we go again - even discussing his** intelligence hurts us...
It's not about how dumb or smart the guy is - it's about how ruthless and soulless his administration is:

Bush Is Not Incompetent

http://www.rockridgeinstitute.org/research/lakoff/incompetent

NGU.


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reichstag911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. Rock Ridge Institute?
Founded by Mel Brooks, Gene Wilder and Cleavon Little? :P
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. So maybe George Lakoff is a fan of screwball westerns?
Edited on Tue Jul-18-06 02:12 PM by ClassWarrior
:shrug:

NGU.


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reichstag911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. You mean...
...Blazing Saddles wasn't a serious drama?!? :wtf:
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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #17
27. it takes that quality...an appearance of looking past humanity to reach
what is ruthless
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karlrschneider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:14 PM
Response to Original message
22. I was flabbergasted to hear him bellow out "Yo, Blair..."
If someone hollered out "Yo, Bush" at him, the dumb shit would dissolve into apoplexy, you can bet.
:eyes:
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mwb970 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 06:16 AM
Response to Reply #22
53. At least he didn't say "Here, boy." (n/t)
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guidod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
26. Outstanding Post! Recommended for all, thanks
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:36 PM
Response to Original message
28. H. L. Mencken......
..." As democracy is perfected, the office represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. We move toward a lofty ideal. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron."

A 20th century Nostradamus I'll tell you what :)
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #28
38. I told you so. I told you so.
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Catherine Vincent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
31. He's not my president. Never was.
n/t
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Thoreau-Ly Donating Member (120 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #31
36. More Like a Presi-Dink
Besides, you need to actually win elections to be called the President.
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xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
37. It was raisin brain's imperious attitude -
that got 2 me. He would only turn 2 face blair when he spoke w/ that wad of whatever in his cheek - then turning his back 2 blair whenever tony started 2 speak - the arrogant attitude left me dumbstruck. blair was left leaning on the chair like a court jester waiting for the emperor 2 give him a signal 2 leave or speak. Incredible! just incredible. I'm surprised he didn't belch or pick up the hem of the tablecloth and wipe his mouth!
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npincus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 04:36 PM
Response to Original message
39. Donny Deutsch played the "China is big" sound bite last night
on his program, prefacing it with something like, "I'll let you be the judge if you think our president is up to the job..." or something like that. Funny, because I think years back his advertising agency had produced somne of the notorious, cutting commencials for his Dad (I could be wrong- have to check).
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ChipperbackDemocrat Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. Our President may not be the sharpest tool in the shed
But the people who put there certainly are.

Remember, Bush is the figurehead who could win the election.
The smart guys behind him wouldn't get a vote of their lives depended on it. So he was their road to power.

Besides if the President is really that dumb, what does that say for the 59 million who voted for him.

"Who is more the fool? The fool or the fool who follows him?" -- Obi Wan Kenobi.
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chelsea0011 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
41. "America's Got Talent"
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DUBYASCREWEDUS Donating Member (195 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 05:10 PM
Response to Original message
42. BEAUTIFUL!
You summed up everything I have said about this Moron since the debates with Al Gore. As a history major he makes my skin crawl when I watch or listen to him speak. As I tell my Reppublican co-workers/friends the barest minimum requirement for the President of the United States is that he be able to think and speak in complete sentences. This Moron cannot do either. Thank you for so eloquently stating what I have been thinking for 5 years!
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Vogon_Glory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 05:47 PM
Response to Original message
43. His Nibs Is Not An Idiot: He's Worse
His Nibs is not an idiot, he's something far worse and far more dangerous--he's a reckless fool. An idiot can't help being dumb, and most of them are fairly harmless. Dubya, on the other hand, has shown sufficient intelligence to portray an appealing political candidate and "war president" to nearly 50% of our electorate, and the determination to make disastrous decisions and stick with them regardless of the ghastly consequences.

I sometimes wonder what might have happened had Dubya been a genuine idiot. Then I think of Jeb Bush in the White House with Karl Rove at his side and start having the cold sweats.
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
44. Aren't you wondering if he's harrassed other women as well?
Its not likely that he just started doing stuff like this, you know...
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Prophet 451 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
47. What happened was...
At some point, your countrymen decided (or, more likely, were manipulated into deciding) that government should not be run by the best and brightest but by the most typical, Joe Six-Pack, the mediocre. Of course, the problem with that is that politics is a hugely complicated business. Vastly more complex than Joe Six-Pack has the brains or inclination to understand.

I'm not sure exactly when it started but Reagan was probably the first of the real "down-home" presidents. Bush Sr. couldn't do down-home and got booted because of it although his malapropisms didn't help (although I maintain that the one involving the checkout scanner was just an attempt to make polite small talk). Clinton was the best of both worlds, he could do down-home folksy but had a real intelligence underneath. Now, you've got this clown.

Incidently, as a Brit, I feel mildly insulted by his attitude toward our PM. I might not like Blair (actually, I can't stand the man) and I don't know how they do things in Crawford but here, you do not address a man purely by his surname unless you wish to insult him. "Mr. Blair" is probably overly formal but would "Tony" have been too much to ask? Wars have been started over less and his arrogant, dismissive attitude toward virtually his only ally on the world stage was infuriating.
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Felinity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 07:29 AM
Response to Reply #47
54. Prophet 451, perhaps you can explain
how Blair has managed to keep his job this long? His sweater-choosing-worthy best bud has done nothing but lead him down a very expensive and embarrassing path to abject failure in the Middle East. How many years of history has GB had to learn from?

I thought you Brits were supposed to be sharper than us? At least most Americans agree the accent makes you'all sound smarter!
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Prophet 451 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #54
63. He's lucky
Essentially Blair has had the amazing luck of having an opposition party that seemed determined to self-destruct. For most of his reign of error, the Tories have been almost at war with themselves.

The main problem is that we don't vote directly for the PM here. We vote for local MP's and the leader of whichever party gets the most MP's ("seats") becomes PM. What's happening is a lot of voters who really dislike Blair vote Labour because they like their local MP (there's a much stronger tie between the constituency and the MP here). In effect, Blair benefits from his collegue's good work. That said, support for him has dropped massively, he went from a 200-odd seat majority in 1997 to around 60 last election.

Personally, I've voted Liberal Party ever since I was old enough to vote. I was hoping Robin Cook would defect to teh Liberals. He was a Cabinet minister before the Iraq war and said, very publically, that if the UK went to war, he would resign from the Cabinet (as did Claire Short). Unlike Short, Cook really did resign the day after we invaded and used his resignation speech to rebuke Blair for ignoring international opinion. A Cabinet minister quitting over a matter of high moral principle, how often does that happen?
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Felinity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. Thanks, and another question
What would it take to unseat him as the leader of the Labour Party?
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Prophet 451 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #64
66. Couple of different options
Blair has already said he'll be retiring before the next election.

Assuming we don't want to wait that long, he could be forced out by his collegues if they decide he's more liability than asset. Right now, he's retaining them mainly due to gratitude that he brought the Labour party out of an 18-year wilderness and made them electable again so a very, very slim majority of them support him because they're unsure if the voters allegiance is to the party or Bush personally but that could easily turn around if he screws-up again. The Commons has already rejected our version of the Patriot Act, surveilance and, while agreeing to modify the anti-terror laws slightly in the wake of the Tube bombings, rejected the draconian laws Blair wanted. He's on very thin ice in that quarter.

Secondly, he can be forced out if his government loses a vote of no confidence. The tradition holds that if the opposition, or a back-bench (i.e. not part of teh Cabinet) member of his own party feels that Blair is no longer fit to serve, he can enter a vote of no confidence in Blair as leader. The member would need to secure the backing of a certain number of his collegues (I can't recall how many off the top of my head) to force the vote to come to a reading but if Blair loses that, he's forced to resign. If Labour lose a vote of no confidence, the government falls and an election is called for the earliest opportunity. That would be the first time that had happened in about thirty years. Obviously, it becomes much easier if Labour slips into a minority government (as happened briefly to Major). Due to a technicality in the Parliament Acts, Labour would retain power even if they lost the Parlimentry majority due to by-elections but, if they fail to pass an important part of their plans during that minority government, a vote of no confidence is automatic.

Finally, Blair could be forced out by a leadership challenge (as happened to Thatcher in 1991). Blair as leader of the governing party is PM so long as his party retains a majority in Parliament but any member of his party who can gain the backing of (I think) ten of his collegues can force a leadership contest. Traditionally, leadership contests are declared in November. The party votes on any and all members standing as leader and any member needs a two-thirds majority to win. If no-one gets that majority, a second contest in held between the top two contenders which is won by straight majority.

At the moment, since Blair is retiring before the next election and Parliament have effectively removed much of his power (Parliament has rejected several of his proposals lately) AND he's currently under investigation in the cash-for-favours row (he will be automatically forced to resign if he's charged), most people seem content to let him coast to retirement but that's changing. Every day, he faces new questions about when he's resigning and who's taking over. Blair is effectively a lame duck now.
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Felinity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #66
67. Thanks again. n/t
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Prophet 451 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
48. Honest assessment
Bush is a wilful imbecile, surrounded and manipulated by the biggest collection of pure evil since the 2005 Serial Killers convention.
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Cobalt-60 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 10:25 PM
Response to Original message
49. Degree Mills
Did ypu ever think you would see the day when Harvard and Yale look would like degree mills?
I know I didn't.
But once again the Fuhrer has achieved the impossible.
Every time this strutting pigtard displays those sheepskins he shows just how easy it is to purchase credentials there.
I'd be pretty upset if I were an old school Alum' at one of them.
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ms liberty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-18-06 10:36 PM
Response to Original message
50. I have been mortified at his behaviour this past week...
Edited on Tue Jul-18-06 10:42 PM by ms liberty
it is beyond embarrassing that this person is representing me and my country. He was rude, gawd he was eating with his mouth open and talking at the same time - so disgusting! That's just ill-mannered. Then he harassed and insulted Chancellor Merkel!

Every time you think he can't get worse, he does.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 12:38 AM
Response to Original message
52. I am so tired of hearing about how dumb the blivet is, no offense,
BobcatJH or anyone else. Damn, I'm tired of the jokes, the faux pas that happen in our name, this embarrassment. I'm pooped.
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NicRic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 08:13 AM
Response to Original message
55. Those who voted for him.
Are certainly not the most intelligent bunch either ! However we have to remember our country did not elect this idiot ,he was a installed president put their by a corrupt court ! You know the more I think about each and everyone of those justices need to be held responsible for the mess this country is in,along with the bush gang .If the court would have allowed Florida's own system to continue it would have saved our country for a situation that will take years and many $ to correct. Do these Judges actualy sleep good at night ,perhaps someone needs to show them the images of war,and the inocent civilians who have had their lives completely destroyed ,all becasue they did not follow the law the way our founding fathers intended it to be enforced .Shame on them ,they where suppose to be the ones to protect us from exactly what took place in 2000 ! It makes me sick ,that at their level they would let politics dictate their decision on something so important !
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Cosmocat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 08:27 AM
Response to Original message
56. Conservatism happened ...
to answer your question ...

I am into John Deans new book, which is lending some clarity and definition to what I already knew ...

A MESS of robotic and neurotic control freaks from different ideological areas united to form the "modern" conservative movement, and in the process work toward destroying our country ... A highly intelligent and decent man like Jimmy Carter is made out to be a complete moron, a complete moron like this guy is made out to be a "man of his principles" who is "like an average american" ... A competent and dedicated president like Clinton is pretty much revolted against, and barely makes it through his presidency, and a barely competent president like Reagan is made out to be one of the greatest presidents ever ...

They are NOT the majority, but the most assuredly ARE the squeeky wheel, they are meaner, they are far more aggressive, they have devolved to the point were they are one stop short of stopping, literally, at nothing to further their lock on our government ... The religious right, the neocons, the corporatists ...

With redistricting and electronic voting and other means of controlling the vote ... We are at a REAL crisis point in this country's existance ...
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 09:14 AM
Response to Original message
57. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Uncle Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #57
61. W saying shit is only a grain of sand on the vast beach of embarrassment,
his maladministration has created for our nation.

Yes you do have the right to have a B.J. in private without it being telecast and promoted around the world by the Mass Corporate Media and the pseudo moralists in the Republican Party in power that believe this is more embarrassing than screwing the people out of their right to have their votes counted in an honest and fair election.

Come back to the light NYREDS while there is still time.
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BrewAz Donating Member (147 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
59. Not to worry...He is just sick....
I posted some of this on another thread about the stem cell veto....but it also fits here.

I have come to the conclusion that the Shrub is a sick, sick man. He clearly is a linear thinker incapable of understanding (or completely disregarding) the implications and consistency of his thinking/actions. I used to think that he was just a moron.....a frat-boy grown up maintaining his Animal House view of the world. After 5+ years of this, I now realize it is a mental deficiency. Brain cells no longer capable of rational reasoning...a man who is still motivated by one of the fraternity bros who has an idea...and then tells Georgie to be the "decider" and act...all for an after prank joke over beers in the cellar.

Not to worry...he is just sick and needs our help. He needs to be in a home...a house if you will and not the White House. He should be back in an adult care home, for his sake lets call it a "frat house"...where his pranks and inane behavior can be monitored....or maybe he needs more meds. Should he be...is he on meds now? Can we blame all of this on drugs?

To think that this man is the president makes me ill...to think that some Americans still support him ...scares me.

BrewAz
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Joey Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 12:07 PM
Response to Original message
60. Bush is a giggling moron n.t
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arikara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 01:06 PM
Response to Original message
62. I watched that clip
of him yakking at Bliar. It was staged. He had the same swagger eating that roll and cursing about Syria as he did strutting onto that plane in his codpiece for Mission Accomplished. He knew he was being watched.
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donkeyotay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 02:26 PM
Response to Original message
65. The humiliation continues. Sure we get tired of talking about it
but every time you think it can't get worse, it does. He is a puppet, the front man for the gangsters who hijacked our country. They will destroy us and there's not a damned thing we can do about it. Too many will not wake up until it is too late, nd bush has put our fate into the hands of others. Just about anyone could kick off Armageddon at this point. Best case scenario, we will pay for this GOP folly for the rest of our lives. Worst case scenario, they won't be long. Chances that these treasonous gangsters will be held accountable, slim.
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a la izquierda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-19-06 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #65
68. Sure they can be held accountable...
they need to be elected OUT of office this November and in 2008. For those of you who aren't involved in politics, get a move on. I was so disheartened by Oklahoma's politics until I got involved. While the candidates aren't the California liberals I'd hoped to find, there are some people out there who work really hard to change things. Besides, I can't get up every morning thinking Armageddon is nigh-there are enough of those nutjobs that believe that around me.
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