I'm not really sure I'm comfortable with Kerry getting the nomination

[Frangible]

I'll admit it. I'm not fully comfortable with Kerry getting the dem nomination.

I mean sure, he's the current "winner". He's doing great. His military career was something to respect and he's put in his time as a Senator.

But I just don't like the guy. The reason is, almost everything I dislike Bush for, Kerry voted for.

Man, I want a change in the whitehouse in '04. I think Dean had a point in his attacks on Kerry, and they were true.

I don't really want a president who thought the patriot act and war against iraq were good ideas.

I want a president who will stand up for our civil liberties and denounce the patriot act, is committed to peace and not bombing random countries, and will rebuild our economy with good job opportunities for the middle class and protect our jobs from being lost overseas.

I don't know, maybe that's unreasonable, but looking over Kerry's voting record I just think he's more like Bush than my ideal candidate who will turn this country around.

I know he says a few things differently now, but if actions speak louder than words, shouldn't his voting record speak the loudest?

[Jack_Dawson]

1. If Clark and Dean combine forces, there will be no Kerry victory

Edited: OK that was harsh but I mean really, what is Dean DOING right now? He's going to make his real stand - in two weeks? All I'm saying is the "outsider" thing is quickly becoming a joke. Clark, who is actually competing for votes these days, could be bolstered by a lot of the same anger that used to propel Dean.

[Democrats unite]

5. That remark was totally uncalled for

And to see Clark's avatar by it saddens me.

[Eloriel]

9. ROTFL -- oh, so now you NEED Dean

Wasn't that long ago we heard from the Clark camp not to look in that direction for any help with Dean's resume -- Clark himself said he wasn't going to be Dean's "Dick Cheney," in one of the most multiply insulting statements I've ever heard from anyone in politics.

[Democrats unite]

2. I couldn't agree with you more.

[ixion]

3. I agree

Any Dem that supported the unPATRIOTic Act, and Bush's ugly vendetta has lost a great amount of my respect.

Still, my thinking is ABB.

[library_max]

34. Every single senator except Feingold voted for the PATRIOT ACT.

Including Paul Wellstone and a whole bunch of other liberal icons.

[ixion]

44. IMO, that doesn't make it okay

eom

[corporatewhore]

4. iam not comfortable because of NAFTA/GATT/WTO/IWR/fast track to

FTAA (which i rsked arrest and bodily injury to protest) PATRiIOT ACT

[twilight]

6. Kerry is NOT the nominee!

and the election is FAR from being over! Remember that and have hope!

I'm not thrilled with Kerry either, but he beats the * out of *!



:dem: :kick:

[DenverDem]

7. I'm not comfortable with Clark's approval of DU weapons.

Non discretionary killers that linger for generations.

[Taeger]

14. Depleted Uranium Shell Issue

The Depleted Uranium shell issue is the same as the Silicone Breast Implant issue. Oh yeah, and the power line leukemia issue. There is nothing but anecdotal evidence supporting it. You can find anecdotal evidence for almost everything.

Still, I would like to see some studies done on the effects of any lingering radiation on exploded shell pieces. If they cannot detect radiation after the thing blows up, it's not an issue.

[DenverDem]

28. How about the rate of birth defects in Iraq since BushWarI.

Gulf War Syndrome.

Elevated radiation readings all over Iraq.

Man, living in denial about war crimes is some serious denial.

[w4rma]

31. Radiation causes cancer: proven. Not all DU is depleted: proven.

Non-depleted uranium is uranium. Uranium radiates radiation: proven. Non-depleted uranium radiates radiation: proven. Some ammo called DU is non-depleted and therefore radiates radiation which has been proven to cause cancer.

[corporatewhore]

17. or his wanting to continuation of bombing of vieques

[XanaDUer]

8. Don't sweat it...

I was way uncomfortable with Dean getting the nomination.

And why-his voting record. Pro-big business, anti-environment, taking money from special interests, pro Biden-Lugar although he claims he is anti-war, cutting monies from the elderly and disabled to "balance the budget", he's a DINO:

The influence of out-of-state donations: "Outside money is one of Howard Dean's specialties. Of the $ 312,290 the governor raised for his 1996 election, 65 percent came from out-of-state contributors: labor unions, Washington lawyer-lobbyists, the health care industry, to name a few of the special interests." n13 For the 1994 election "Dean, for example, received more money from major pharmaceutical manufacturers during the reporting period ($ 11,000) thin he did from people and companies located in Burlington ($ 10,460)." n14 One editorial said, "it's no mystery why out-of-state contributors pumped hundreds of thousands of dollars into Vermont campaigns. ... They're trying to buy influence. But the cost is public trust." n15


http://www.brookingsinstitution.org/dybdocroot/gs/cf/headlines/cases/LandellvSorrell.DOC

[twilight]

13. same here

These were my exact reasons for not supporting Howard Dean, not that it has anything to do with this thread. Biggest problem with this DOCTOR is that he doesn't seem to give a damn about the disabled and the poor. Must be nice. Being a doctor does that to a person.

Oh well, Dean appears to be out of the picture anyway. I prefer Kerry to Dean any day of the week.

Still a Kucinich supporter until the brutal end no matter what.



:dem: :kick:

[corporatewhore]

19. to be fair kerry is far worse on environment/probusiness his support of

nafta gatt wto and bushs fat track to ftaa (anti environmentalism/probussiness hundred times worse on a global scale)

[asjr]

10. I am uneasy about

Kerry, but I can't pinpoint what it is. I feel he is getting votes because some people think he can beat Bush. I feel also ABB is the mantra with many Dems these days. If Kerry can beat Bush, more power to him. I still like Dean, but I will support the nominee if it isn't Dean.

[PAMod]

20. I truly believe that the ONLY reason Kerry is doing well is "electability"

The bitterest of ironies, if you ask me.

[mlawson]

45. Perfectly put!

IMO, he is the least electable of the final four. By far.

And on 1/20/05, what else will matter?

[mac2]

11. Kerry the one?

I agree with you that great change is needed. A Progressive change.

In my opinion, the only candidate that I accept for change in the pre-emptive war, corporate crime, food safety, stop the privitizaion of our government, WTO (which is stealing our democracy for World Order) etc. has been Kucinich.

Kucinich is being denied public funding ($2Million owned him). They say..they ran out. The press, and even his own party deny him his right to run for office.

Sharpton and Dean both say...they were the only ones who protested the Iraqi war. This is not true. Kucinich was on it a long time ago. We don't know who the terrorists really were do we? Why aren't they asking the obvious?

I refuse to elect a liar (about the war) to office..when we already know where that took us in the past.

The DNC and the media choose our candidates in every election. This has to stop.

[newyawker99]

29. Hi mac2!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[lancdem]

12. How about looking at his voting record prior to 2001?

He's been in the Senate for a lot longer than 3 years. If you consider his entire record rather than a few recent votes you don't like you might be a little more at ease.

[lastliberalintexas]

38. Why should I have to look to pre-Shrub?

Why has he caved in the last 3 years? Other elected officials held on to *their* backbone, you know.

This reminds me of the Blue Dog Dems who aided and abetted Reagan post-assassination attempt when he had high poll numbers. I despised my Congressmen for doing it then, and I don't have any love lost for Kerry for doing it now.

[Nicholas_J]

15. Too bad

It is a likelihood, that Kerry will be the nominee.

ANd given Deans absolutrel nastiness towards Clark and everyone else. It is extrememly unlikly that anyone will join with Dean.

It is and extreme unlikliness that Dean will accept VP, and I am sure that he will expect the Presidential slot in such and arrangement, and crttainy Clark after actually WINNING a primary will not offer that up to Dean who is barely getting out of single digits in most states. The Doctors ego is too big to allow it. ANd none of the others are going to give up their chances while they have a small hop of winning. So Kerry it is.

[peacetalksforall]

16. I KNOW I'm uncomfortable with Kerry

What I don't understand is why Kennedy supports him.

If he voted like Kennedy....
If he spoke up like Kennedy....
If he fought for the same things as Kennedy....

If he didn't support the right wing on so many issues...
If he had only voted against the killing...
If he hadn't joined the Skull & Bones and if only he would tell us that there are no obligations to anyone as a result of his association and promises to resign immediately if he is lying.

If only
If only

Why do we have to suffer Kerry as a candidate - a not true Democrat or should I say not as in touch with the citizens through his votes.

Compare his voting record to Zell Miller.
Compare his voting record to Paul Wellstone.

It's very obvious.

Why Ted? Why?

[twilight]

18. Why Ted? Why?

Ted said early on, before the race even got going that he endorses Kerry. Why? Ted said it was because John Kerry is his longtime friend. I'm sure Ted Kennedy has other longtime 'friends' too. I'd like to know more myself.

Perhaps, just perhaps, Ted Kennedy is the man behind the iron curtain. If this is the case, I strongly support Kerry. I'd like nothing more than to see Kennedy as the nominee but I realize that this is not a possibility.

If we knew :wtf: the reality behind Ted Kennedy's endorsement really is, maybe it would be for the good of the Democratic party!

Just more questions with no answers it seems to me. Very frustrating!

:dem: :kick:

[mlawson]

47. I suspect that

Ted's endorsement of Kerry is loyalty to MA, his long time friendship, and the likely feeling among the Dem establishment that "it's Kerry' turn". And no, none of these reasons are good enough for me. I sincerely doubt that Ted thinks that Kerry has the best chance of beating bush; he is far too savvy for that.

[bornskeptic]

21. So why do you support Clark?

Clark said he probably would have voted for the Iraq Resolution, and you can't believe he wouldn't have voted for the Patriot Act when even Paul Wellstone voted for it, can you?

FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. -- Retired Army General Wesley K. Clark said yesterday that he probably would have voted for the congressional resolution that authorized President Bush to wage war in Iraq, taking a position on a key campaign issue closer to that of Senator John F. Kerry than Howard Dean's strong antiwar stance.

"On balance, I probably would have voted for it," Clark said. "The simple truth is this: When the president of the United States comes to you and makes the linkages and lays the power of the office on you, and you're in a crisis, the balance of the judgment probably goes to the president of the United States."

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/president/clark/articles/2003/09/19/clark_says_he_probably_would_have_voted_for_war/

[Uzybone]

26. Shhh

dont disturb people with the facts.

[annxburns]

22. I can live with Kerry ...

... his isn't my favorite but he seems like a good Dem. The media seems to like him okay which will help him (Man, what did Clark do to piss them off - they seem to HATE him). The media also seems to like Edwards so a Kerry/Edwards ticket could be good. I know, I know - who give a cr%& what the media thinks, right? But I still feel we are going to need every possible edge in this race with Bush and his evil minions.

Anyway - I'm not excited - but I can live with it. I AM real excited about getting Bush out of the WH.

[pippin]

23. Are we looking at his voting record?

he voted for the war in Iraq

he voted for the the patriot act


he abstained from the medicare bill--this alone should give any body who qualifies as a senior some pause.

I am still trying to track down his voting track record for the last couple of years and wpoiuld certainly appreciate any help.

does a candidate's record on office matter any more? or have the elections become another form of rah-rahing for my team against yours, my man versus your man, brand name X against brand name Y?

[library_max]

36. Here you go.

Here's a link on Kerry's voting record.

http://forum.johnkerry.com//index.php?s=5344f11361da6351da2408d137a63331&showtopic=215

[TexasSissy]

24. Yes. But it's the majority of voters who count, and they have spoken.

Including hispanics, African Americans, seniors, midwesterners, nor'easterners, southwesterners.

I support Clark, as you do, but it's hard to argue with a huge majority. If what we want is someone who appeals to a majority, including independents, and across the country, I think we must listen to the voters. They have spoken....quite loudly. There is no squeaking by here.

[redqueen]

27. Actually only the voters from not even 1/5th of the states have spoken

No majority has had a chance to form on the national level.

I wouldn't get too worked up just yet.

[AntiCoup2K4]

41. Do you know what "majority" means?

I realize it must be hard knowing what the word really means, living in a state that produced Bush Jr and Tom Delay - neither of whom care what the majority wants - but I would have thought Texas Dems had at least figured out.....

10% of the delegates isn't a "majority" Hell, it barely qualifies as a minority. More like a small fraction.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

25. Kerry voted for the bankruptcy bill and to halt overtime pay?

Kerry voted for the energy bill? Kerry voted for the PBA ban? The medicare bill?

Look..on taxes and education, the Repubs FRAMED the debate with the media....the PUBLIC WANTED something to pass, the Repubs stole these issues as populist etc.

I think I trust a Democrat to do the VERY NECESSARY cleaning up of all these messes better than I trust Bush.

Right now, Kerry seems to be getting a plurality of the votes...the only way to change that is to have another guy get them.

The only way to change that is to back away from your computer and go out and do everything you can to change that.

[YNGW]

30. Like This.

>I think I trust a Democrat to do the VERY NECESSARY cleaning up of all these messes (taxes and education) better than I trust Bush.

Like Clinton promised to "clean up" the Welform Reform Law if he won a second term?

I understand your desires, I just have no reason to believe they'll be reversed.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

32. Yes it all occurred in a vacuum

He didn't have the Monica Lewinsky story break during that seconds term. He didn't ahve 80 million dollars being spent to investigate his penis versus 3 million spent on 9/11. He had a democratic congress to help him accomplish that right?

I think some people are so jaded in their assessments of the past that they forget they weren't exactly doing a fucking thing to change things either.

I hear more about welfare reform NOW than I heard at the time when those of us who have ALWAYS been politically active were bringing it up.

[AntiCoup2K4]

33. 90 % of the delegates are still up for grabs

Kerry hasn't won shit yet. Don't let them get away with this, :grr:

[Ugnmoose]

35. My sentiments completely

As I have previously stated in another post, I feel that Kerry brings with him alot of baggage that The Bushistas can and will exploit to brand him as a hypocrite. Neither of the other major candidates have such baggage.

[quaker bill]

37. I would be uncomfortable with anyone getting the nomination

on the grounds of "electability". This is the thinnest and least sustainable ground to base a candidacy on. The first serious whiff of scandal and 'electability' evaporates. This is because it is just an image or a vaguely defined assessment of someone's potential future prospects.

Most of the exit polling has indicated on "agrees with me on the issues" and "caring about people like me" dimensions other candidates are polling much higher than the current front runner. This should be a cause of substantial concern.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

40. yeah I want someone who cares about surfing, jewish lesbian issues

that's how a president should be chosen

[AntiCoup2K4]

42. I'd vote for you, but how do you balance that ticket?

Who would a Jewish surfer Lesbian pick for a running mate?

[quaker bill]

49. "electability" is a fantasy

The term has no actual dependable definition. It describes a vague feeling that this candidate may do better than the others against Bush*.

If Clinton had been running on 'electability' Jennifer Flowers would have ended his run just a surely as 'Monkey Business' did in Gary Hart's years earlier.

It was exactly his "un-electability" combined with his victory at the polls that drove the repugs nuts for 8 years.

People liked Clinton's stands on policy. It was the only thing that kept him politically viable once the attacks began.

This, if nothing else, should have been the take home lesson of the 90's. Apparently it wasn't.

[LynneSin]

39. I'm KNOW I'm not comfortable with another 4 years of Bush

makes it easy for when I go to vote on Election day

:shrug:

[hippiegranny]

43. comfort? COMFORT?

do we have the luxury of comfort here? no, we damn well do not.
BUSH HAS GOT TO GO. ABB. if it turns out to be kerry, so be it. sometimes i think some people on these boards would welcome another four years of this insanity just so they can come here to bitch and moan about it every day. c'mon people, let's remember who the real target is here. hint - he's not a democrat. let's stop eating our own. the candidates themselves are going after bush instead of each other, maybe that would be a good example to follow here. yeah, it's not over yet, but my god, this forum is ridiculous today.

[D G]

48. It drives me nuts too

Come on, people -- work for your own preferred candidate(s) until the bitter end, but please do not cultivate the notion that Election 2004 is about your personal comfort level with the nominee.

And if you think Kerry is on the same page as Bush as far as the issues go, you're not looking at his record. Please keep in mind that the context of Kerry's votes in the last three years has been a Republican-dominated executive and legislative branch, as well as other pressures. Look beyond votes at the bigger picture.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

46. ABB Baby.....

NT