Ralph Nader to Wes Clark via MySpace Message: Nader/Clark '08?

[Totally Committed]

Ralph Nader (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=78344574) has asked Wes Clark to consider running with him on a Nader/Clark ticket for the Green Party!


"Mr. Clark, what are you doing with the Republicrats? I've heard you speak and I'm impressed. However, myself and others have noticed that you don't quite fit in with other Liberals. Have you ever considered the Green Party? Imagine the talk in Washington and the world if there was a Nader-Clark ticket. I think we'd actually have a shot."

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=24556409 (scroll down a couple of messages)

*********************************************************************************

Unbelieveable!

Check it out! Frankly, I am stunned... and a little nauseous.

TC

[Vickers]

1. Let me be the first to say it:

Fuck you, Ralph.

[Totally Committed]

4. I know!

Aside from asking Wes to be on his ticket.... HE'S RUNNING AGAIN!

I'll say it again -- UNBELIEVEABLE!

TC

[Tiggeroshii]

5. Hey now, Nader's running for president isn't the best of his traits

but keep in mind that without him, you would certainly have a much greater likelihood of smashing through your windshield whenever you get into a car. He is probably the key figure in getting seatbelts in most mass produced vehicles.

[Minnesota Libra]

10. So why didn't he stick to consumer advocacy? nt

[Tiggeroshii]

26. Cause he ran for president?

Yes I know. His one mistake. You can't say he didn't do a great thing though...

[Minnesota Libra]

31. Yes he did a great thing - helped rob us of ...................

....our rightful President. I'd still like to meet Nader just once and slap him straight across the face and tell him to go to hell and tell him to go back to his neocon/fundie checkbooks.

[Lefty-Taylor]

34. I find it amusing that people still blame Ralph

for Gore's failure as a candidate and the Democratic Party failure to differentiate itself from the Republicans during the 2000 campaign. It's simplistic and dead wrong to blame Nader's small percentage of vote for W's election -- which we should remember was stolen. If Gore had run a proper campaign and appealed to liberals, the neocons couldn't have stolen it. But then Gore, who has thankfully come around in recent years, was quite conservative in 2000.

Nader's done more for this country than 99 percent of today's politicians. Those of who are truly progressive should embrace him and bring him into the fold and then elect a progressive Democrat in 2008.

Ok go ahead and spew nonsensical venom at me. (And please no sarcastic "welcome to DU" notes. I've been here for several years, posting under a different name.)

[Totally Committed]

37. This isn't about you, so you can relax.

That having been said... I can't believe you still defend him!

The 2000 election was a Judicial Coup d'Etat aided and abetted by Ralph. It would not have been possible without him. It's sort of still viscerally felt by a lot of us.

TC

[Lefty-Taylor]

40. I'm chuckling as it seems I'm not the one who needs to relax

given the vitriol on this board. If you look at the facts, you can easily see that Nader did not cost Gore the election. But I know this is hard for many people to realize. Oh well.

[Totally Committed]

42. Can you understand that people do feel that way, though?

It's all in how one sees it. I, and many others, see it differently than you do. It's been a 6-year-long shit sandwich for us and every day is a new bite -- and every day, we feel like Nader helped them do this to us, our families, and our country.

TC

[Lefty-Taylor]

45. TC, I understand that people are still angry but it's not based in reason.

I don't want Nader to run again, either. But Bush's election wasn't his fault. (And remember, when many Dems supported the Iraq War, Gore included, Nader opposed it and has been highly critical of Bush, even during the post-911 period when many Democrats rolled over for W, the Man Without A Brain.) Anyway, take a deep breath as I seriously doubt this note to Clark is real. It's not Nader's language nor his venue. So carry on. Peace.

[Vickers]

50. Those of "us" who are truly progressive should join the Democratic Party

:eyes:

Oh, and welcome to DU yadda yadda yadda...

[Lefty-Taylor]

52. Many of us are registered Democrats and wish that a true progressive would

step forward. Personally, I'll save my ire for the DLC. Please, Hillary and your pro-war positions, go away.

Thanks for the welcome and "yadda yadda." LOL

[Vickers]

55. I'm talking about your hero Nader. If you think I like war you're an

idiot.

If you think "LOL" hurts me, you need to adjust your fucking panties for more comfort.

[Lefty-Taylor]

56. Whoa. You seem to be misconstruing my sentiments.

First, I wrote "LOL" because I took your teasing of me with a polite chuckle. Second, I never said you "like war" and where you inferred that is beyond me and beyond logic. Third, I never said Nader was my "hero." Again, beware of making silly inferences. It only demeans you. Now about my "panties being in a bunch" -- try to avoid cliches. Again, I'll end with this: Peace.

[Vickers]

59. With such a short yet shoddy response I *had* to infer.

My apologies if I inadvertently hit the mark so completely.

[Lefty-Taylor]

60. No. You missed.

But it doesn't surprise that you think you "hit the mark" (there you go again with the cliches). Re-read this back-and-forth dialogue sometime when you're not so out of sorts. Maybe, just maybe, you'll see what I've clearly stated. Bye for now and a long time.

[imlost]

53. Clark is that progressive leader. I agree with you.

I'm not at all someone who wanted or wants Nader to run, but Nader is not the reason why Gore lost.

As much as I love Gore today they ran a terrible campaign.

Besides, I still believe Gore won. The putcome was decided by a conservative Supreme Court.

Nader is a great man, but he should stay out of politics. I can't blame him for approaching the General.
General Clark is an amazing and extraordinary leader. He is my top choice for 08.
He has my support, time, money and anything else. I believe in him.

[Lefty-Taylor]

58. You make good sense and as you see we're in agreement; Gore lost it him-

self, And I'd support Clark in a second.

[LoZoccolo]

64. One mistake?

He did it again!

I wouldn't be surprised if he ran in 2008 either!

[Vickers]

11. Yeah, I was a better person in the fucking 60s, also.

:eyes:

[Tiggeroshii]

28. Did you get seatbelts to be a requirement for all mass produced cars?

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Kahuna]

41. Thank you Vickers!!!! You put that so eloquently, I wish I had

said it myself. :pals:

[Lefty-Taylor]

61. And it's a shame

you aren't now a better person.

[mcscajun]

15. Oh, thank you. SOMEBODY had to say it.

but even though you already did, let me join you.

FUCK YOU, RALPH.

Take your poison pill candidacy over to the Republicans, TYVM.

I'd vote for Clark on a ticket with almost any Democrat, but this pairing would just KILL a Clark candidacy.

Fortunately for us all, I believe Clark to be smarter than Nader Thinks He Is.

:patriot: Much, MUCH Smarter. :patriot:

[LoZoccolo]

18. Yes, Clark was a general.

Which means, he knows about things like strategy and achieving objectives that Nader doesn't seem to!

[blondeatlast]

62. All the good stuff happens while I'm at work.

Nonetheless, let me just say to your statement:

:applause:

[Tiggeroshii]

2. Clark wants the Dem nomination.

I'm certain. All this would do is split up the Dem vote and keep us from winning. That is of course if the conservatives don't start another major party(as I saw here is a small possibililty that's been hanging around) and split up the conservative vote. It'd be a four way race with a plurality necessity. Should be interesting huh

[union_maid]

13. Clark can do math, too

He probably gets what dividing the left/liberal vote would do. And he's probably not softheaded enough to be convinced otherwise.

[LoZoccolo]

3. Republicrats? Did Nader return his Republican donations?

I think he was accusing the Democrats on points of where they got their money from.

[Totally Committed]

6. Good point!

And I doubt Wes would EVER go against the Democratic Party that way. Ever.

TC

[union_maid]

May Ralph Nader

Rot in hell. He's used up all his political capital. Outing the Corvair just doesn't begin to equal the damage he's helped to do. What's amazing is how none of these people - whether it's Nader or Rumsfeld or Bush ever seem to feel any shame at all.

[LisaM]

7. New Yorker last week said Ralph was scooping up GOP contact info

it was in "The Talk of the Town".

[Minnesota Libra]

8. Here we go again, hope the neocons have their checkbooks ready nt

[Mz Pip]

9. I have no words

Well, I do but will be polite and not use profanity.

It's amazing to me that Nader still takes himself seriously enough to throw something like this out there. No Ralph, you would not have a shot. Not even close.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[Minnesota Libra]

16. Oh yes Nader has a chance because there are still...............

....some liberals who continue to believe - even after all the neocon/fundie hell we've endured - that as Nader said, "Democrats deserve to loose". Don't ever underestimate a traitor.

[KC21304]

22. And don't forget, there was no difference between

Bush and Gore. I hope he is reminded of this every time he opens his mouth, if he runs.

[Minnesota Libra]

30. I'd like to remind Nader of that and then slap him across the face. nt

[Mark E. Smith]

12. Fuck Nader

... and the Republican money he rode in on.

[Stinky The Clown]

14. That's the most audacious pile of crap I've seen for at least an hour

Fuck you, Ralphie ..... you were good when you were young.

Now ..... y'ain't shit to me.

Republicrat? What's that make Ralph, with his stealth donors .... a Republigreen?

[Dogmudgeon]

17. I'm not a big fan of Candidate Nader

Seriously, he's a political pipsqueak. I like his investigative work, but his politicking has all the influence of a grain of sand in a bottle of petroleum jelly.

If he wants to further humiliate himself and the more leftward left, let him. He's done all the damage he can do, and he isn't worth the anger and/or anxiety.

--p!

[primative1]

19. (grin)

lol

[BrklynLiberal]

20. How do I put a {puke} into this line?

[gully]

21. Actually Nader hasn't considered the Green Party, he's not a registered

member. I remain unshocked at his latest antics.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

24. Oh G-d, no.

[11cents]

23. Ah - I bet Ralph says that to *all* the candidates.

He's such a scamp.

[Totally Committed]

27. ROTFLMAO!

:rofl:

TC

[blondeatlast]

63. LOL! I needed that!

:rofl:

[Pithy Cherub]

25. The Green Party still wants Nader? A Green Party contested

primary would be interesting. Nader's wants Clark and that's just plain delusional by Nader's over ripe imagination. Clark is a proud Democrat and is helping 2006 Democratic candidates.

[mcscajun]

29. Sez Ralphie. I doubt the Green Party wants him as their candidate

again.

Ralphie's offering what is not Ralphie's TO Offer.

[windbreeze]

33. Nader can forget it....

Gen.Clark believes in a TWO party system..end of story...I would imagine that Nader's overtures might have sounded somewhat like an insult...
We all know that Nader does what Nader wants...and his running is NOT for the good of the country...it's for HIS own good...period!! blasted egomaniac!!...
windbreeze

[MH1]

39. Um...interesting point.

Much as I concur with the majority sentiment expressed on this thread to Nadir's ridiculous suggestion...saying Wes Clark "believes in a TWO party system..end of story" is not the best advertisement for him.

The two party system sucks.

Running third party presidential candidates under the current system is a "cure" that is worse than the disease, but that doesn't mean we should adore the two-party system. I would much prefer an instant run-off or similar system that gives people more room to vote for who they really want, without the spoiler effect. That will take a lot of work from the bottom up - starting with local races. THAT's what opponents of the two-party system need to be doing.

But, I just shudder to hear someone say that they "believe" in the two-party system as it is today. Please, Wes, say it ain't so!

[Adelante]

57. It isn't so

He does say we are supposed to have a two-party system, but not as it pertains to third parties. He says the government has been co-opted by ONE party. That's his objection.

[MH1]

65. Good - Has he ever said anything about IRV or other systems,

or getting rid of the electoral college, or other fundamental system reforms? (not talking about trustworthy voting systems here, of course he's for that I'm sure!)

[McCamy Taylor]

35. Nader at the head of a ticket? ROFLMAO

[TheCowsCameHome]

36. Like Groundhog Day, only this guy comes rolling out every 4 years

Ralph, let me say it politely- One, twice, a thousand times -NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Lefty-Taylor]

38. I doubt this is true ...

as it doesn't sound like the language nor the venue Nader would use. But it sure is enough to get people hateful.

[msanthrope]

43. Fuck You , Ralph--To Paraphrase

Bela Lugosi in "Ed Wood", you don't deserve to smell Wesley Clark's fecal matter.....

[Kahuna]

44. Why does Ralph hate America?

If there was ever any doubt, this is proof positive that Ralph is out to aid and abet the repukes and ruin America.

[janx]

46. T.C.--

I understand your concern (I can't stand Ralph), but since when has anyone considered a page on MySpace a credible source of anything? :shrug:

[Totally Committed]

48. I sourced it. I never vouched for it's veracity.

I left it up for to each who reads it.

Wes has a site at MySpace. It has his Clarkcast, and personal phots and a pretty accurate CV. I'm pretty sure he doesn't run it himself, but I'm pretty sure that some on his staff do. It is up to each person to go check it out.

I happen to believe it IS Ralph or someone on his staff. If you go check out the Ralph Nader Page, it doesn't seem a spoofer, but like I said, iti's for each to judge. I left links and I have my own concerns... and I am sharing them with DU for thougtful consideration.

TC

[Orangepeel]

47. How do you know that's Nader's page?

Like many, I lost all respect for Nader in 2000, after a childhood of worshiping him. And, I have no doubt that his ego is big enough to think that he'd be doing Wes Clark a favor instead of the other way around.

But, this page doesn't smell real to me.

[Totally Committed]

49. See message #48...

I answer this there.

TC

[Lefty-Taylor]

51. That's my thought, too. This is bogus and so many fell for it.

[Totally Committed]

54. Why wouldn't this be real?

I read it, considered the source, but thought it sounded an awful lot like Ralph... who ALWAYS called General Clark "Mr. Clark" -- I know because the disrespect grated on my last good nerve every time he said it... and I shared it. It is linked. I happen to think Ralph is a big enough ego-maniacal wahoo to have written this. If you don't think it's real, then you don't.

TC

Edited to add: Look at it, his page even has one of his stupid polls on it, fercripessake. If it's a spoof, it's a damned good spoof. It's "sounds" and "looks" just like something ralph would do.

[Name removed]

66. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ncrainbowgrrl]

67. Locking.

Sorry to break up the flamefest.