I absolutely HATE these treasonous traitors. I really do.

[fooj]

Silly me. I truly believed that at a certain point...even the Republicans would find it difficult to "look the other way". I mean, Christ, we are ALL American's right? I honestly believed that even the tainted Republicans would rise up to defend the U.S. Constitution. Sadly, I have come to the conclusion that I have been wrong. Horribly wrong.

What has this country come to? Where are all the decent, law-abiding citizens who care deeply about preserving and protecting our beloved Constitution? Don't these fucking windbags take an oath of office?

Look. The NSA wiretapping is simple. What the President is doing doesn't just violate Federal Law...it violates the U.S. Constitution. It is a FELONY. WTF is so CONFUSING about that? It's a grievous offense committed against the rights and liberties of the American people. Geez...

I guess what I'm trying to say is where are all of the leaders in this country? Have they all jumped ship? Am I supposed to believe that every single patriotic American has decided the laws that our country was founded upon are obsolete and no longer relevant? Doesn't anyone else find this pill hard to swallow?

I feel a sense of profound sadness today. I'm at a loss. I don't know what else we can do to stop these madmen. Does anyone else feel the same way?

Peace.

[BOSSHOG]

1. Party above country

A classic display by republicans today of "conservative" values. They have no decency but they do have an ignorant base who believe they are patriotic for no apparent reason except to scold those who claim constitutional law trumps politics. The hate by Americans of the republican party today is not irrational.

[NativeTexan]

44. Idiocy above EVERYTHING else...

.....and they make Nixon look like a choirboy!

[gunsaximbo]

2. of course

he belongs in jail.

[GreenPartyVoter]

3. Me too. Every so often I am just about emotionally paralyzed by rage

at these cretins. And I am almost as mad at my fellow citizens who either don't have a clue what's going on, or worse, approve of it.

[fooj]

4. I hear you. It's beyond maddening.

What scares me the most is our democracy is very young, relatively speaking. Very, very young.

Peace.

[GreenPartyVoter]

7. Yes, many other Empires have lasted much longer but I believe that

the speed in our rise and fall is directly related to our level of technology.

[LiberalPartisan]

13. And education, or lack thereof

As a society we're less educated than the previous 2 generations and that really plays in to the right wingers hand. It takes a lot of stupid people to elect these traitorous slimeballs.

[Proud_Lefty]

5. ditto

These dog and pony shows are outrageous. The Republicans covering the criminal acts should also be brought up on aiding serious crimes.

[lyonn]

12. dog and pony show, yup

I watch these proceedings and get all haired up and briefly think, now people will get it. Yet this never really gets out to the people who are busy with their daily lives because the evening news barely mentions what is really happening. With Clinton we heard ever tiny bit of detail. Where is the detail now?

[specimenfred1984]

6. Repubs Won't Rise to Any Moral Standard

or patriotic standard, did it really take this to see that?

The U.S. needs to get dems elected so we can impeach these people and hold them accountable, otherwise democracy is a goner.

[fooj]

8. They are slowly and methodically destroying our voting rights...

how do you propose we get our Dems elected when we have been stripped of all our voting rights?

Peace.

[Bake]

9. I guess the Constitution is obsolete too.

You know, when Clinton was caught with his pants down (so to speak), there were principled Democrats who called him on it, along with the Pukes who screamed at the top of their lungs about "rule of law."

Not a single Repuke is willing to tell the truth about King George's disregard for the law. We know they couldn't care LESS about the "rule of law." NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THEM.

May they all rot in hell.

Bake

[Raffi Ella]

10. Yeah.I do feel that way.

I try and be rational about it.Tell myself well,when Clinton was in power the Republicans probably felt that the country was on the wrong track,that abortion should be outlawed,that the government was handing out too much money to welfare etc.That it's no fun being the second party-especially the second party without even a majority in the house or Senate...

BUT.It's NOT the same.


Clinton was not appointed by the Supreme Court.Nor was he elected by Diebold machines in his second term.

He did not break the law and then brazenly go on national TV and say "Yep!I did.And I'm gonna keep on doin' it too!!Whatcha' gonna do about it bitches??"

He did not lie to take us to War.
He is not responsible for thousands of U.S. soldiers and countless Iraqi's dying in battle for a lie.He is not responsible for needlessly stretching our Military so thin that when a real threat or crisis occurs as in Iran/Katrina that we can't do anything about it.

Clintons administration wasn't involved in the outing of C.I.A Agent because his administration didn't like what someone was saying about a war.

Clinton did not try and obliterate separation of Church and state!He didn't gut the infrastructure of the middle class and tax the poor while making the rich richer...


This is different than being "no fun" not being in power.This is war on the constitution/on hard working everyday Americans we're talking about here.A criminally corrupt President and administration.

The Ukrainians went out by the millions in the sub below freezing temperature to protest a stolen election.THEY did not stand for it.But Americans are so coddled and relatively comfortable that they don't realize what they are losing.

But we are Losing it.We are losing the very thing we take for granted every day;Freedom.

Without transparent elections,without separation of church and state,without character and integrity in the highest offices of the land and the highest respect for the Constitution we have nothing.

Right now we have nothing.And it is only getting worse.

I am horrified by my Government officials and fellow Americans that are letting this happen to our great country.I want to do something about it and I try every day to contribute something to fight against it but nothing seems to help.Nothing.So here I sit;angry,frightened and in disbelief that this is happening in America.


Atleast I have this place to come to in this nightmare time we are living in.Thank God for D.U.

[distantearlywarning]

11. The (R) party has become simply a cult of personality

It used to stand for ideals, some good and some bad. Now it only stands for a person. That's all. Whatever Bush says goes. He could sacrifice unborn fetuses to Satan on the lawn of the White House this afternoon and the Bushies would fall all over themselves tomorrow in their rush to be the first to state that asking the Dark Lord for help is perfectly ok when you are fighting terra and how he wouldn't have killed a fetus if it wasn't for Bill Clinton's bad example first, and why do the liberals hate America so much anyway?

There is nothing this man can do that will ever be bad in their eyes. And anyone who opposes him is a traitor. And that's just completely freakin' scary. It's so obvious that he wants to be a dictator more than anything. Thus all of the pushing on the limits of presidential power and all of the erosion of freedom we see.

I know nobody is allowed to call Repukes Nazis these days because it will hurt their little feelings or something, but this is exactly what happened in Germany. It wasn't about the Jews then, just like it isn't about terrorists or liberals or Muslims or any other group today. It's about one man, his pathological ambition, and the sheeple who worship him.

[petgoat]

40. "cult of personality" is an interesting point

I've never heard the phrase used except in the context of discussions of
Chinese and Soviet Communism, but it's exactly right.

In comparing the Repubs to Nazis it's important to recognize that Bush has only
been in power for five years. Hitler in 1937 was not what he would become after
the invasion of Poland.

[w8liftinglady]

14. Maybe the politicians won't-but I am seeing some change

...in the regular conservatives that have been calling in to cspan,and also in my neocon area.Maybe,if we produce a moderate candidate,we can bring some of the thinking republicans to our side.

[Cosmocat]

25. Even at that ...

Don't fall for it ... The pride of party factor WILL rule ... Unless someone completely flips over, they WILL go party ...

They will obliviously neglect the fact that not only was it a petulant child and evil neocons at 1600 PA, but that it took the COMPLETE support of BOTH sides of congress, both of which made up of good ole "conservative" republicans, to get things where they are today ...

It will be, Bushco was NOT REALLY a conservative, we need to get a REAL conservative in there, ignoring 6 plus years of TOTAL republican reign that was an unmitigated DISASTER ... And, they will vote George Allen, Rick Santorum, Tom Delay ...

[halwesten]

15. NSA wiretaps illegal? go easy on me, I'm new in the sandbox

I am really confused about this because on one hand we have people stating that what the NSA did was illegal. I'm still trying to figure out whether or not they were according to the law. I mean in most people's eyes they are, but where is the legal wording that says so? That's what I want to see. I want to see the actual law, not a layman's interpretation of it. On the other hand we have people stating that there is an exception to the rule. This is one reason I hate the way our laws are written. The legal mumbo jumbo is too hard to get through if you're not a lawyer!

I'm all for holding our government responsible, but can't we wait until the facts come out before we start screaming "foul!"? I want the truth out as much as anyone, but I also don't count my chickens before they hatch. The EFF has a good FAQ on this and it really makes sense. If the administration did what is claimed to be illegal, they're no better than the Nixon administration.

"The NSA wiretapping is simple. What the President is doing doesn't just violate Federal Law...it violates the U.S. Constitution. It is a FELONY. WTF is so CONFUSING about that?"

[annabanana]

17. pretty simple, pretty basic...

FOURTH AMENDMENT - 'The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.'



i.e. no warrant? no spying... we are American citizens!

on edit: welcome to DU...and duck!

[halwesten]

18. we're not being told the truth about the callers in question?

I understand and absolutely agree with the 4th ammendment, but what I heard was the person here was associated with AlQaeda and the other person was in the Middle East, also an associate which makes it FISA qualified. Was this not true? If we're being lied to I'm going to be really pissed.

Thanks for the welcome. :)

[fooj]

19. Of course we are being lied to.

Do you really think that Gonzales is telling the truth? He's a proven liar. Guess that's why they didn't swear him in today. How sad is that?

Here's a good way to look at things...if Little Lord Pissypants has thwarted sooooo many attempts at attacks on the US---where are the charges? The convictions? Take a guess as to how many "terrorists" this administration has indicted? How many have been found guilty?


This is about the RULE OF LAW! Either we are Americans and follow the rule of law...or we don't. Period.

BTW- Welcome to DU!

Peace.

[halwesten]

20. charges

Yes, I would love to see the charges and/or convictions of the people that were supposedly trying to attack us again. Why aren't we hearing who those people are? I have to admit I'm a trusting person but doggone it, I want to know the facts if our government is doing something wrong.

I'm going to watch this one carefully. I don't like being lied to if in fact that's what happened. I guess I'm also suspicious of a lot of things most people in our government do. Paranoid maybe? I love this country but I hate what's happening to it.

Thanks for the welcome. :)

[Donailin]

24. Are we being lied to?

well, yeah. But the truth will always out, but not always in our lifetimes.

[endarkenment]

37. Just stop and think about that.

They know the numbers on the other side that al qaeda is using? Great! They just walk right over to the FISA court and get a damn warrant.

So why didn't they?

[halwesten]

38. overseas phone numbers?

That's what I want to know. If the computers and such that they confiscated in Iraq/Afghanistan told them who was in the USA, wouldn't that have been the time to get the warrant? If they thought there wasn't going to be time at that moment, once the taps started would it have been that hard to get the warrant signed?

[endarkenment]

39. FISA allows 72hours.

You can start the tap now and get over to the FISA court within three days and still be within the law. Heck they could be late, days late, and still get off with a 'don't do that again' even from me. They had years to get the warrants.

It is a pack of fucking lies. They have no suspects. They are monitoring all of us.

[halwesten]

45. monitoring all of us? it's not possible

Whoa, wait a sec. There are almost 300 million people in the USA now. Do you really believe they're monitoring all of us? Given the record of the CIA and FBI I have no doubt that a lot of people are being monitored, but it sounds like you're being a bit paranoid about this.

[endarkenment]

46. You need to google echelon.

Here is a basic summary. The NSA developed a monitoring system that has been deployed since the 90's that monitors ALL international communciations. It does this by intercepting electronic communications at various strategic switches (satellites, telephone, internet, cell phone, etc.). All international communications pass through the set of switches that the NSA monitors. The data from these intercepts is pre-analyzed for source/destination date and time and keywords and that information is then fed into a huge back end database. Huge systems - the NSA has long been at the forefront of super computer use. The database can then be analyzed for all sorts of interesting information at the NSA's leisure.

The NSA is barred (but that bar has been breached) from monitoring the communications of "US persons". A US person is anyone legally inside the territory of the United States. The NSA gets around this barrier for international communications by sharing its monitoring system with the UK, Australia, and New Zealand. Each of those countries also has a prohibition against domestic monitoring and so we monitor their nationals communicating internationally and they monitor ours. All of our international communications have passed through the NSA monitoring systems for quite some time.

The Bush administration has most likely turned echelon on for domestic communications. And yes, it monitors everyone.

Google echelon.

[NoFederales]

16. How would you feel about guerilla-style civil disobediance? Are we there

yet? Many like to say what is it going to take, well............?

NoFederales

[Patsy Stone]

21. I do, fooj.

I do. As I listened to some of them explaining away the Constitution, I was deeply sad. The reality of party above country hit hard. I hear ya.

K&R.

[fooj]

28. What the hell are we gonna do, Patsy?

:banghead: I don't know what else to do.

Peace.

[DinahMoeHum]

36. there's one other thing we can do, as a last resort. . .

but it's not fit to be mentioned here.

:evilfrown:

[Patsy Stone]

42. Support local candidates

Strengthen voting rights and work to end election fraud. It's an uphill battle, but it's the most important thing we can do. I'm looking into Verified Voting and local fair elections activities to decide how to do the most with the limited time I have to give.

[EFerrari]

22. I hear you. It's so sad to see the Senate flailing over this thing

that they should all be very clear on.

[Donailin]

23. sure do,

I cried this morning when the rollcall for swearing in Gonzalez fell along party lines.

That was the last straw for me.

We are on our own.

[samhsarah]

26. everyday and twice on sundays.

:cry:

[caligirl]

27. Rove's black mailing them,. What Repug on that committeehas a soul?

[Pachamama]

32. Well, Jeff Gannon-Guckert attended the mtgs today-he was probably there to

remind all the Rethugs of the photos of them with him or other friends....:spank:

Seriously...when it was pointed out that Gannon-Guckert/male prostitute was at the hearings, I could only think that why else was he there....its not like he's "really" a journalist, although he plays one when not being a male prostitute...

[Laurab]

29. I do

I've never in my life felt such hate for people I don't even know, but I HATE, and it bothers me. I try to be hopeful and optimistic, but NOTHING seems to touch this administration - they just keep on doing what they do, and they don't answer for any of it.

I keep waiting for a "leader" and I catch glimpses here and there, but they all seem powerless to effect any real change. The wiretapping SHOULD be simple, so should the illegal war, so should a LOT of the things this administration has done, yet they keep on doing them. People get promoted instead of fired, we are SO fucked.

Watching Gonzalass answer questions in his condescending way sickened me, I CAN'T watch the pResident - just seeing him sickens me.

Yet somewhere, in the back of my mind, I still think truth will overcome. I hope I'm right.

[gauguin57]

30. Russ Feingold won't let this drop.

He's a leader. Get on the Russ-bus!

[samhsarah]

31. I don't doubt that Feingold will give it a real good try.....

but he has no supboena power and the fuckers aren't under oath. There's nothing Russ can do about that as long as he has a D in front of his name.:banghead:

[kiteinthewind]

34. Already there!!

Feingold 2008 :dem:

[Pachamama]

33. I'm with you Fooj! I had a really hard day today & felt sick to my stomach

and was upset all afternoon after watching the hearings....First that they didn't swear in Gonzales and voted along party lines, and then the questioning. I got chills when he refused to answer some of Feinsteins' questions about whether they were opening US Mail, and also related to questions on entering people's homes without warrant and also on the scope of what powers they think they have. I grew up in a Republican family and one of the most important emphasis (aside from fiscal conservatism) was about the right of privacy, civil liberties and keeping the gov't out of our private lives. Where are all the "REAL" Republicans? How can they sit there like Jeff Sessions and Cornyn and be basically kissing the ass of Gonzales and justifying what they are doing. I walked around today like a zombie in disbelief and also absolute disgust, sadness and fear. I seriously, seriously am afraid for our country. I feel so alone and feeling like other than the few sane voices on DU and some other friends of mine, that atleast 90% of the public is clueless and unaware of what is happening. I found myself crying today. Crying for my country and wondering don't people even remember what our founders believed and tried to protect us from and how we have just let these criminals shit all over our constitution.

[endarkenment]

35. The Republicans I understand.

To upset the cart now would be to destroy their hold on power, their 70 year march back from the destruction that FDR's 1932 victory rendered on the Republican Party. And the few remaining Republicans with any dignity realize that the malfeasance of the administration is so deep and so widespread that any bipartisan challenge will bring not only the administration down, but the entire system of control that they have developed with it. Regime change at this point is going to mean revolution, peaceful or otherwise.

The non-DINO Democrats I don't understand. There are a few, our 25 Senators who stood up and voted no on cloture, John Conyers and the Black Caucus and friends over in the house, some of the governors and Howard Dean, Al Gore, Jimmy Carter, but for the most part Democratic leaders are either moronically ignorant of what is going on or are facilitating traitors. The outright DINOs: joementum et al are just Republicans, are just part of the Ruling Party, them I get, although their benefits and access to power would be greater were they just to switch parties.

[JohnWxy]

41. Well, you can register your disgust with representatives or send an

email to news organizations, etc.

congress.org

to your representatives in Government.

[Auntie Bush]

43. I'm with you! Viva la Constitution! n/t