Biting our tongues and holding our tempers

[hyphenate]

There are quite a few people here who hate the DLC. There are just as many people here who are very radically to the left of almost everyone else. We are all on a scale somewhere, and except for the trolls and freepers, everyone is likely a few degrees (at the very least) to the left of the center mark.

However, and note this is a bone of contention with many, many people won't accept any candidate unless he is quite a distance from the center mark.

To me, there are two choices we have for the election in 2008 for president. We can either all agree to disagree and get at least SOMEONE in the white house, or we can keep moaning and groaning about the DLC and end up with NO DEMOCRAT in the white house at all.

The GOP is right about one thing, regardless of how much we want to deny it: the left is made up of a lot of smaller groups, each with its own agenda, and quite often these smaller groups clash on issues, making us more fractious than ever. The GOP doesn't have that kind of diversity, and, unfortunately, it shows. Their philosophies are pretty much the same, differing only ever so slightly on some issues. But because they are a "united" party, they are able to get vote committments.

It is December, 2005. The closest major election is now 11 months away, and could determine the course of American history--literally. There are opportunities for us here, and we should try to make the best of them regardless of who the candidates are. 2008 is still a long way off in comparison, and we need to concentrate on who is electable NOW.

Perhaps I am "preaching to the choir" but we need to show a united front. If, in your heart, you are a true Democrat, you will agree it is better to fill the seats immediately and then figure out who had tickets to begin with.

So this poll is about you--the Democrat, the voter, and the frustrated American. Are YOU willing to put your own desires aside temporarily and help elect Democrats, DLC or otherwise, to those seats we can grab for the 2006 election? Are you willing to compromise some of your own issues in order to fill chairs?

If we can't get exactly what we want, it's still better than having THEM in Congress, isn't it?

[TechBear_Seattle]

1. I don't care about a candidate's affiliation, DLC or otherwise.

I voted "other" because membership in the Democratic Leadership Council is irrelevant, as far as I'm concerned. I look at the candidate; if I feel that the candidate adequately represents my views and values, s/he will get my vote.

[BOSSHOG]

2. I have always and will continue to vote

straight party line for every democrat on the ballot regardless of position contested. If there is no democrat running, I will vote for any non republican running. The fewer republicans in office, from local, state and federal levels the better our country will be. We can hash out the degrees of goodness or badness of democrats but their badness pales when compared to republicans; of that I have no doubt.

[Ready4Change]

3. Other: I vote for who I think is best for the office, regardless.

If I'm not informed on an issue or race I usually leave it blank.

[Douglas Carpenter]

4. I don't like the DLC -- but they are still a hell of a lot better

Now don't get me wrong. I am no friend of the DLC. Nor am I a fan of Joe Lieberman. I particularly resent some of his resent absurd comments about the War in Iraq and Democrats who oppose Bush's war policy. And I am definitely NOT a Hillary in 2008 supporter. But, when some earnest people describe Joe and Hillary as being Republicans, I think that is just plain intellectually dishonest. But don't take my word for it. Compare their records on a broad range of other issues. Let's just compare the records of Lieberman, Clinton and Mr. Moderate Republican himself, John McCain

This is courtesy of project vote smart - link:

http://www.vote-smart.org/index.htm
_____________________

"2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the National Abortion Reproductive Rights Action League 100 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the National Abortion Reproductive Rights Action League 100 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the National Abortion Reproductive Rights Action League 0 percent in 2004.
__________________

2003-2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the American Civil Liberties Union 78 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the American Civil Liberties Union 83 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the American Civil Liberties Union 22 percent in 2003-2004.
_____________________________

2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the Americans for Democratic Action 95 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the Americans for Democratic Action 75 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the Americans for Democratic Action 35 percent in 2004.
__________________________

2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the AFL-CIO 100 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the AFL-CIO 83 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the AFL-CIO 33 percent in 2004.
_________________________

2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the United Auto Workers 110 percent in 2004

2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the United Auto Workers 92 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the United Auto Workers 9 percent in 2004.
__________________________

2003-2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the National Education Association 85 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the National Education Association 88 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the National Education Association 35 percent in 2003-2004.
______________________

2003-2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the Human Rights Campaign 88 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the Human Rights Campaign 88 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the Human Rights Campaign 25 percent in 2003-2004.
_____________________________________

2003-2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People 100 percent in 2003-2004

2001-2002 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People 94 percent in 2001-2002.(for some reason 2003-2004 was not available for Sen Lieberman)

2003-2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People 15 percent in 2003-2004.
___________________

2003-2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the Leadership Conference on Civil Rights 100 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the Leadership Conference on Civil Rights 95 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the Leadership Conference on Civil Rights 14 percent in 2003-2004.
_____________________________

2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the Arab American Institute 25 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the Arab American Institute 50 percent in 2004

2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the Arab American Institute 0 percent in 2004.
__________________________

2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the Family Research Council 0 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the Family Research Council 0 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the Family Research Council 67 percent in 2004.
____________________________

2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the Christian Coalition 0 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the Christian Coalition 0 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the Christian Coalition 83 percent in 2004.
_____________________________

2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the American Conservative Union 0 percent in 2004.

2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the American Conservative Union 0 percent in 2004

2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the American Conservative Union 72 percent in 2004.
____________________________

2003-2004 Senator Clinton supported the interests of the Concerned Women for America 7 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator Lieberman supported the interests of the Concerned Women for America 8 percent in 2003-2004.

2003-2004 Senator McCain supported the interests of the Concerned Women for America 100 percent in 2003-2004."

______________________


Please allow me to end with a 1996 quote from Noam Chomsky on why he was voting for the reelection of President Clinton and not for Ralph Nader.

from: Understanding Power by Noam Chomsky page 337

"I mean, I'll vote for Clinton, holding my nose--but the reason has nothing at all to do with big policy issues; there I can't see too much difference. What it has to do with are things like who's going to get to appoint the judiciary happens to have a big effect on people's lives....
They may be small policy differences when you look at the big picture--but remember, there's a huge amount of power out there, and small policy differences implementing a huge amount of power can make a big difference in people's lives....Okay, that makes a lot of difference for people whose kids are hungry in downtown Boston"

Of course that was in 1996. Since the first administration of Bush jr. it is clear that Dr. Chomsky considers the current Republican Party with its fundamentalist base and its influence on domestic policy and neoconservative influence on foreign policy to represent a significant departure from what had been bi-partisan consensus into a whole new and much more dangerous direction thus increasing the differences between the two parties.

[mmonk]

5. Giving up on the constitution and Bill of Rights is not center,

its rightwing radical.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

6. Locally I vote for the person not the party

because the actual issues matter more to me. Rarely do I approve of the GOP stance, but I've voted for a GOP school super, etc.

Nationally, I would vote Republican if there was an absolutely amazing candidate but that just hasn't happened yet.

For US Legislature, straight party line even if they run Bozo the Clown.

[MrBenchley]

7. I vote Democratic

The only time in my life I haven't was the 1981 NYC election in which the mayoral choices were Ed Koch, Democrat, Ed Koch, Republican, Ed Koch, Liberal party or Ed Koch, Conservative party.

[zanne]

8. By voting in lockstep with the Republican Party...

The DLC Dems are, in my opinion, just as much at fault as the Republicans for the mess we find ourselves in today. I won't vote for someone with a track record of voting with Republicans on all the disastrous bills that have been passed. The "D" after their names means nothing if they act like "R"s.

[electropop]

9. I'll vote against DLC in the primaries,

but support any Democrat over any Puke in the general election.

[spooky3]

10. I'm sure you meant "candidate unless he OR SHE"

[welshTerrier2]

11. Other: i will not be voting for any fucking war supporter

i don't care about DLC affiliation ... the DLC is divisive in that it continually publishes anti-left hateful editorials on its website ... they seem more concerned about "appearing macho" than they do about peace ... and "centrism" is bullshit ... but the test of whether i would support a candidate is based on issues - not affiliation ... that goes for DLC members and it goes for Democrats too ...

from now on, i will vote only for progressive Democrats and, if none is running, for progressives of other parties ... none of the current war supporters will be getting my vote ... i also will not be sending money to the DSCC, the DCCC or the DNC ... my contributions will go directly to progressives Democrats only ...

[xchrom]

12. i can't help but think something very interesting is happening with these

threads re: the dlc and progressives.

progressives have been voting for moderate candidates all along -- so i wonder why the concern from moderates who come here and get upset at progressive ire for the dlc?

we don't like moderate candidates -- in fact we become down right insane when a politician falls in line with the corporate power structure -- but we voted for gore -- we voted for kerry, etc.

there's something interesting in people calling people political purists or liberal purists -- something frank luntz interesting about it.

the very choice of phrase -- fascinates me.

that being said -- i live in a very liberal part of the country -- don't much have to worry about moderates or conservatives at all...

i'll vote for demcratic cndidates up and down the ballot - - but if send to the election{out of the primaries} a candidate willing to compromise on gay marriage -- i'm not marking the box for president.

now here's the deal -- for liberals and progressive cadidates -- there is no such thing as a wedge issue that can beat you.
there is an unwillingness to use the sophisticated pollsters and language specialists that rip conservatives a new asshole.
what voters{i'm talking reasonable voters} will respect beyond all else is an aggressive authenticity.
a muscular belief in your convictions and a willingness to go to the mat for your beliefs.


the repukes used the techniques and were/are on to something -- excepting of course they don't believe them -- and it's time to go to war well prepared.

[mmonk]

13. Would Patrick Henry bite his tongue or hold his temper?

[MrBenchley]

14. Did Patrick Henry spend hours denouncing his fellow Americans

Seems to me that when he said "Give me liberty or give me death" he wasn't claiming that the Virginia House of Burgesses was oppressing him.

[mmonk]

15. The Virginia House of Burgess did not

promote the restrictions on the liberty of its citizens like the crown or those today that agree with restictions.