Howard's Road - William Rivers Pitt

[Khephra]

Howard's Road
By William Rivers Pitt
t r u t h o u t | Perspective

Wednesday 24 December 2003

They say that confession is good for the soul, so here’s mine: Howard Dean was not my first choice of candidates to face George W. Bush in the 2004 election. He is not as liberal as I am – and yes, conservative media pundits, calling Dean a far-left liberal is far from an accurate portrayal of the man’s record – and as this is primary season, I was afforded the opportunity to choose among a broad field of contenders. Had I been given my druthers, I would have seen either Dennis Kucinich or John Kerry run away and hide with the nomination.

Which brings us to the old folk saying: “If you want to make God laugh, tell Him your plans.” In all electoral likelihood, it will be the former Governor of Vermont who will run away and hide with the nomination. No votes have been cast yet, and the official score in the primary race is still zero to zero to zero to zero to zero to zero to zero to zero. But if polling numbers in Iowa and New Hampshire are any indication, the front-loaded primary season designed by the folks at the DNC to pick a nominee as quickly as possible will be catapulting Dean into the driver’s seat well before pitchers and catchers report in for spring training.

Dean’s campaign has been, for my money, one of the most remarkable electoral phenomena in recent memory. He has forever changed the face of American political campaigning with his use of Al Gore’s internet. His fundraising abilities have been second to none. He has captured the hearts of the ultra-liberal base, and pulled more than a few Greens along in his wake, while being a centrist budget hawk with a 100% approval rating from the NRA. Figure that one out and you’ve got a stellar dissertation for your Political Science PhD.

Or maybe not. At the end of the day, there is one reason Howard Dean stands ready to grasp the brass ring in Boston. He stood up before the die-hard base of the Democratic Party before, and in the aftermath, of an unnecessary, criminal war. He stood up after two years of hide-the-ball from Bush and the boys regarding September 11. He stood up after that base had endured one of the most ruthless anti-liberal propaganda campaigns since Joe McCarthy held a key to the Congressional washroom. He stood up after this country got lied to again and again and again. He stood up within the confines of a mainstream news media structure that has done more to cover Bush’s backside than anyone could have possibly imagined. He stood up when too many of the other Democratic candidates sat on their hands and played it safe.

He stood up and roared, “I want my country back!”

more..............

http://truthout.org/docs_03/122403A.shtml

[Zynx]

1. Good stuff!

:)

[Padraig18]

2. Thank you, Will!

Awesome article! And thank YOU, khepra, for posting it.:)

[calimary]

120. Thank you Khephra and Thank you Will!

Khephra - I was inclined to post this too, but wasn't sure if that was proper. I'm glad you did. After that craziness with Truthout, I was really hoping he might come back and post this for everyone to see. It's definitely worth reading.

Truly, if I were a supporter of another candidate, and even felt strongly about that candidate as opposed to Dean, I'd find myself reassessing it, considering the apparent juggernaut that's shaped up for Dean. I happen to support Dean, so I'm obviously pleased about this one. But if I weren't, I KNOW I'd be reconsidering my preferences, because it just looks like the current is moving faster, and it's mainly carrying one guy's boat at this point. You sorta start reading the handwriting on the wall...

That said, I reiterate my vow: I WILL support WHOEVER or WHOMEVER is our standard-bearer this coming year, Dean or not. I'll get behind whichever person is left standing when the smoke clears. Yes, even Lieberman.

[Eric J in MN]

3. I wouldn't call his fundraising second to none

Bush has raised four times as much as Dean.

[Zynx]

7. Dean has done it with a deeply divided field.

That's what's amazing.

[Liberal Veteran]

9. Yes, but consider where Dean's money is coming from vs. Bush.

I think it makes some difference.

[CWebster]

12. no comparison

Dean collected nickles and dimes from everday folk. Bush got payoffs for catering to the corporate class.

[Insurance_Analyst]

18. I've heard more and more that Dean is attracting big donors!

[mandyky]

69. You heard..? Got links to this rumor?

Maybe you have Dean confused with some of the other candidates...

[Lisa0825]

107. Hi, Insurance_Analyst! Welcome to DU!!!

:bounce: :hi:

[liberalnurse]

66. Absolutely!

You speak eloquently......It is simply amazing the power of the "little people."

[liberalnurse]

62. Oh, is that a needle going into the balloon?

Just wait, we have only just begun........

[Scott Lee]

4. I must say, this is RICH

Coming from the very guy who spent inumerable man hours and research skills in digging up increasingly shrill hit pieces on Howard Dean lately.

If Mr. Pitt were here right now, I'd have to leap to my feet and say "Sir, without a doubt, this one deserves an Oscar!"

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

13. and some apologies

not that I will hold my breath.

[Liberal Veteran]

15. My thoughts exactly.

Thank you for expressing that.

[Liberal Veteran]

14. Hmmmm....

What an interesting statement.

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[QC]

22. That's not fair!

He's also very good at posting "POOP"!

[Scott Lee]

26. Poop is as poop does.

goes along with the box of choc-lits....ya know.

[Scott Lee]

May I ask how long you've been on DU?

I haven't been on that long, but long enough to see the increasing volume and bile of Mr. Pitt's pieces on Howard Dean.

Have you been reading a different DemocraticUnderground, by chance?

[Jackpine Radical]

39. How long has Khephra been on DU?

Since before it existed, I think.

I got here in the spring of 2001, and Kef musta had 5000 posts by then.

[Scott Lee]

49. No, my question was to QC.

I was thinking perhaps that we were both reading two very different versions of DemocraticUnderground lately.

[QC]

67. No, your question was directed at the post above mine.

But since you're interested, I started hanging out here in Spring 2001.

How long have you been here?

[Scott Lee]

70. Thanks for answering.

I've only been here a few months, but long enough to see the manic swing of William Pitts posts about Howard Dean (including the last big rush to flame, and then whiplash-speed apologia).

I had to make sure we weren't viewing two different DU's.

[Cheswick2.0]

84. perhaps, but did you ever hear of positive reinforcement?

It was a good article. Give credit where creidt is due.

[Scott Lee]

88. Yes, and may it rub off on Dean opponents. Cheers.

[calimary]

121. Truly! It WAS a good article. I hope more folks will see the light.

Because we REALLY do need to start putting the hostilities behind us instead of deeper into us. They're FAR better directed toward the bushies than to our fellow Dems.

It kinda does look like Dean's about to run away with it, so I'm hoping like heck that the vitriol will start to fade here. If we eat ourselves up, there'll be nothing for the republi-CONS to do next fall but put the leftovers away. It should be THEM who get put away. I was really happy to see this from Will. Hey, Pitt, if you're reading this - good on you! This one, like so many of your others, makes so much sense.

[DancingBear]

23. I must say

what a silly comment, without merit, and mean to boot. Sorta like a trifecta.

Someday I hope you realize how much Will has done - for all of us.

Sadly, I fear I'm in for a long wait.

[Elidor]

32. I haven't read any of these 'shrill hit pieces,' but

I certainly won't begrudge him taking a frank and critical look at Dean. It's his job. Perhaps you have some links for me to look at.

[Hillsey]

124. Really? I didn't see it that way at all.

I, for one, appreciate the research and work he has provided covering all aspects of the various candidates.

I really don't have a dog in this fight. And apparently have not taken it as personally as you have. He said in his last post he was going to do a piece on Howard Dean and I assume this is it.

[Hoppin_Mad]

5. Thanks Will ! -eom-

[patricia92243]

6. We Democrats are soooo fortunate to have Howard Dean - God bless America

[Gin]

10. u go howard!

gin

[Zomby Woof]

43. speak for yourself

Howard Dean does NOT represent the Democratic Party, and I'd thank you for not quoting mindless Irving Berlin drivel about some Bronze Age deity granting special dispensations upon the faltering republic.

[edzontar]

102. If Dean wins the primaries, he WILL represent the party...

And I assume you will back up then, right?

So why not try to find a more positive outlook now?

[Zomby Woof]

116. maybe, maybe not

My vote isn't for sale. I may just not vote for the bastard when it comes time.

It would be like voting Republican, and I won't do that if I can help it.

[CWebster]

8. And a hard road it was.

filled with ruts, treacherous curves and unmarked detours into uncharted territory.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

11. Oh the irony

great article :D

[retyred]

24. What happens in November

and the ice melts?



retyred in fla
“good night paul, wherever you are”
So I read this book

[Insurance_Analyst]

16. I'm for Clark, but I will admit that Dean has gumption!

[Padraig18]

19. Howard has a brass 'set'

Say what else you will about him, he's got to have the biggest 'set' of anyone in this race. :P

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[liberalnurse]

25. What a pity.......

you insult a fine DU'er. I bet khephra was one of the first here to welcome you too.

[Scott Lee]

27. I think he was addressing Will Pitt, not khephra

[frustrated_lefty]

30. Thank you Scott Lee,

you were right.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

31. So that would make it OK? I think not

It is apparently clear that people jumped to conclusions regarding Will's article. He has been declared fair game by DU'ers in being called out in GD and the lounge and now all those who really ought to be choking on their own words can only grab at justifications because it is far beyond them to fall on their own dagger and apologize for being presumptuous...but keep grabbing...

The humorous thing is those that attack him don't have the courage to post using their own name, don't have the courage to believe in themselves and quit their day job, write a book, get fucked over by their publisher and keep going.

No wonder we starve for heroes...we kill them off at the first sign of courage.

[batman]

40. "No wonder we starve for heroes...we kill them off at the first sign of

courage"

howard dean comes to mind here

[Scott Lee]

59. your aim needs work...

As for those who "don't have the courage to post in their own name", what part of "Scott Lee" don't you get? Would you care to see a copy of my birth certificate?

No one can deny Will what is Will's due - his talent and resume with truthout and his book. What he is being called on is the obvious and nasty attempt to defame Dean because John Kerry's campaign is doing so poorly - only to make this Transformation on the Road to Damascus so fast it's giving many of us whiplash. Some of Will's adoring clutch buy this. I do not, and I'm so sorry if that upsets those "of the faith".

Time will tell how sincere this turnabout of his actually is.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

63. "those of faith" are simply friends..something people develop

concommittantly as their social skills increase.

[Scott Lee]

72. Hmmm, so not simply "me too" friends?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

86. Not at all. I disagree with him all the time without summarily dismissing

him...

Watch more closely

..and I have met him and seen him speak, answer questions off the cuff accurately with ease and get very average people questioning this admin.

Besides, if being glad he is doing that and making others aware of items not sufficiently covered in the mainstream news isn't worthy of a little "me too" ( in spite of his occasional arrogance, a bit of actually well earned ego, and sophomoric play at times..*gasp* the fucker's a human being :freak: ) please advise, what is?

[Scott Lee]

89. Goodness me. A chink in the ol' armor.

Be still my beating heart.

[Jacobin]

60. F'ed over by their publisher?

Details. Do tell. I missed that. What happened?

[JNelson6563]

97. Well I know I have complained to Mr. Pitt

recently and I use my Real Name here and everywhere. That would be Julie Nelson.

While I appreciate this article on Dean I have to say that indeed ever since Mr. Pitt went to his star-studded event he was a changed man. I said my say to him. Of course he denied my charge of being starstruck but it was evident nonetheless.

Funny to see this article from him though as he has been Kerry's pit-bull since he sat with the Big Boys (who I suspect have better things to do than bully a bunch of nobodies on an obscure DB, ah I digress).

I think Will has written some good stuff, this article is one of them. I hope he continues to write these honest assessments of the whole process. If he is to be considered some sort of representative of the left he needs to remain mindful of this.

Just my .0125

Julie

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

111. If someone has a valid objection, rebuttal or complaint

they have every right to post it. This is a political bulletin board. My comments extends only to those personal slams that are over the top.

You do agree that Will has a right to promote the candidate of his choice just as you do? Correct?

[JNelson6563]

115. I encourage folks to promote their candidate

It is the smearing of other candidates I discourage.

:toast:

Julie

[frustrated_lefty]

29. My reply

was to Pitt. Khephra is, and remains, a sweetie. Will Pitt..I have other words for.

[liberalnurse]

21. Will's viewpoint has power and of course truth.

He always seems to look deep inside and pull from his political chakras and say out loud what we all have been feeling.

I like his message as it has the potiential for evoking democratic unity.

We must defeat *bush.......we can only do this together.

[shirlden]

28. Inspirational, Will !!!!!!!!

You just about made me into a Dean fan. But think I will stay firmly dedicated and committed to ABB. If anyone is looking for me, I am over at BBV.org, fighting the battle to make all our votes count for someone, anyone. Come join the battle there.......we need your passion.

:kick:

[Closer]

33. Very nice work.

Pitt's a talented writer, no doubt about that.

Unfortunately, however, the t r u t h remains, it's anyone's guess as to what next week's editorial will be like. Dean folks, get your gun, I'll bar the door.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

35. Wow " I WAS WRONG" is so hard to say, isn't it?

Please find me a TRUTHOUT article written by Will bashing Dean..the burden is on you...

BTW..that post wasn't advocating violence against another Du'er was it?

[Closer]

52. Why in the world would I say

"I was wrong." ?

I've never said Pitt wasn't a talented writer. In fact, I've always complimented him on that.

Being a trusted writer and dependable source, well, that's a whole different topic.

As to whether my post was advocating violence, I shouldn't bother even responding to such a stupid question. Perhaps you didn't read Pitt's piece in its entirety? I was playing off his words in my favorite part of his good write.

edit: Note, this isn't an attack, this is my PERSONAL opinion, since I was more or less pushed on the subject. "Trusted" and "dependable" are subjective terms, as opposed to "horrible" or "pathetic" which would be a personal attack.

[unfrigginreal]

64. Bullshit!

I'll tell you what is wrong, the hoards of Pitt loyalists that decided to ride his LAME whine piece as justification to attack Howard Dean and/or his supporters. Words like tyrant being bantied about by some "sensible" Democrats against those that they don't agree with.

Do you really think that it was necessary for Pitt to identify this "alleged" DUer as a Dean supporter? What purpose did it serve other than to insure more devisiveness on DU? He got his message out and it wasn't just that he had been "attacked" by a DUer to his boss, it was that A DEAN SUPPORTER did it. Those dastardly devils in the Democratic party.

Pitt made the decision to post on this board under his real name. He happily used the influence that this gave him to try to sway the opinions of many activists on DU. He'll have to accept the respercussions that come when any journalist shows a bias. And no, that doesn't just apply to their published works.

[JVS]

99. You're right

[Jackpine Radical]

44. Heyyy--Let's all go form a typical Democratic firing squad.

Everybody get your guns and come stand in a circle.

[chocolateeater]

34. I like that article, Thank you

:toast: :bounce: :yourock:

[markus]

36. And now we know why he was royally pissed

Will Pitt has once again proven himself to be a Great American.

Lets all hope that, should we wake up surprised after NH and IA, that the Dean supporters will be as gratious and willing to rally around the flag as Mr. Pitt has proven to be.

I have some choice words for the neo-Jacobins in grass roots the Dean campaign, but I think I'll save them for another time and place, less my kind thoughts for Mr. Pitt find themselves deleted.

[Democrats unite]

37. All I will say on the Subject is

I don't want to see Will Go! And If I ever am able to figure out who the... was that caused Will not to be posting here They will see the wrath of me and any of his or her supporters (& you know who you are). I could not think of a better reason to be banned from DU.

[WiseMen]

41. Great piece on Howard! Once having been mistaken for You, I am now a fan.

[Scott Lee]

61. um, popcorn, anyone?

[Jerseycoa]

38. I have to ask

Is anyone else dazed and confused?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

45. No...I'm not

The really HORRIBLE thing is that for the last few years, Will has ALWAYS run his articles by us here at DU prior to being published so we could critique, fact check when necessary or help him to tone things up or down.

He has at times posted things that warranted criticism and took it, apologized when he KNEW he was wrong and done his best to rally when it looked like we were killing ourselves.

I have had my public disagreements with him and had my "high five" moments with him.

To think, his contribution will be lost at DU while all the petty asses who cannot admit they prejudged and were incorrect will continue to fill this board with their childish one liner idiotic posts until they finally do themselves in with their obstinance is really a drag.

I have never seen more unaccomplished people tell a guy how to BE A PUBLIC FIGURE in my entire life.

I suggest some of the people who cannot apologize to him need a crowbar to rescue their heads from their dark, smelly point of reference.

[Jerseycoa]

48. Yes, thank you

In complete agreement with all of that. Still dazed, still confused. Will he come back now, do you think? I hope he does.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

50. I don't know...depends on how much he likes people breaking the rules

to abuse him and being treated like shit by his own team. I knew you got it :D

[Jerseycoa]

54. Oh, well

;)

[TorchTheWitch]

58. thank you

very well said

[never cry wolf]

85. You are all over it NSMA!!

I, for one, pray Will reconsiders. I have always found him fair minded and trying to be a uniter for the most part. Yes, he does have a preference and does express that here, what the hell is so wrong with having a personal opinion?

That some here think that just because he writes for a living and has some reknown means he must be impartial is absolutely unfrikkin unreal. The op-ed pages are full of opinions, very few as well thought out, insightful, reasoned and balanced as Will's pieces. His published professional writings and talks ARE extremely unbiased, though the only reason for this is Will's own sense of integrity and duty towards the goal of ABB.

On this board he has been attacked for expressing his personal choice and backing him more eloquently than his opponents and it sickens me. People that are defending their particular tree against a perceived slight at the expense of missing the loggers of the RW clearcutting the rest of the forest. Will has never lost this perspective and maintains his eyes on the prize. I have NO DOUBT that once a candidate is selected, no one will work harder trying to bring down the regime, there is nothing more important than that, maybe in US history!

I hope he will reconsider, I have a feeling it will be hard for him to resist. He, and the other intelligent posters such as NSMA, are the reason I am here. Unfortunately their numbers are dwindling and the board is being hijacked by the narrow minded "my guy or the highway" types.

on edit: Great piece Will, thanks again!!

[batman]

42. nice article

your a dean supporter at heart will
i know you are

[WillyT]

46. Thanks Keph, Thanks Will... That Was Simply Beautiful !!!

Glad you're on our (Democrat) side!!!

:bounce::kick::bounce:

[cryofan]

47. This is sheer nonsense

Pitt writes:
"The moderates and the centrists are going to have to come on board after the nomination if Dean is to win this thing, and such talk will make it hard for them to do so with the necessary enthusiasm. "


huh!?? This implies that Dean is some sort of lefty who has alienated the "moderates and the centrists." But of course you are aware that Dean is no such thing. In your previous thread asking for data on Dean's Vermont reign, I offered you the following quotes:

>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"Throughout the 1990s, Dean’s cuts in state aid to education ($6 million), retirement funds for teachers and state employees ($7 million), health care ($4 million), welfare programs earmarked for the aged, blind and disabled ($2 million), Medicaid benefits ($1.2 million) and more, amounted to roughly $30 million. Dean claimed that the cuts were necessary because the state had no money and was burdened by a $60 million deficit.9
....
Most of the Democrats in the legislature rebelled against Dean over the budget cuts, and he ended up depending on Republican votes to pass most of his proposals. At the time, a local Vermont newspaper wrote, "The biggest items on Dean’s agenda for next year are likely to provoke more opposition from the Democrats than the Republicans. Nevertheless, Dean said he feels no particular pressure to deliver the goods to his party or to promote the Democratic agenda."15

In the mid-1990s, Dean even aligned himself with the likes of Republican Newt Gingrich on his stance on cutting Medicare. He opined at the time, "The way to balance the budget is for Congress to cut Social Security, move the retirement age to 70, cut defense, Medicare and veterans pensions, while the states cut everything else."16
....
The Rutland Herald described how one protestor, Henrietta Jordan of the Vermont Center for Independent Living, "said it would be much fairer to raise taxes on people with expensive homes and cars, children in private school and a housekeeper at home than to cut programs that helped the 66,000 Vermonters living with disabilities."17 Dean responded callously, brushing off the pleas of Vermont’s most vulnerable by saying, "This seems like sort of the last gasp of the left here."18"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


The rest of this article is here:
http://www.isreview.org/issues/32/dean.shtml


Now how on earth does the person who said these things noted above going to be described as some sort of left wing type???

Maybe Mr Will Pitt noticed that all of the major media outlets are playing along with the "Dean as raging leftwinger" canard, and he figured he would, too. And hey, maybe Mr Will Pitt will get himself a Real BigTime Media Job by toeing the standard Big Media line.:puke:

[diamondsoul]

78. Well, those of you here to bash Will

have managed to convince me. There appears to be some sort of bizarre aversion to freedom of expression when its William Rivers Pitt doing the expressing.

I think it's an allergic reaction to the sigfht of his name because I notice too that the people usually posting things like this-

Pitt writes:
"The moderates and the centrists are going to have to come on board after the nomination if Dean is to win this thing, and such talk will make it hard for them to do so with the necessary enthusiasm. "


huh!?? This implies that Dean is some sort of lefty who has alienated the "moderates and the centrists."

Tend to overlook other pertinent points from his articles, like this-

"He is not as liberal as I am – and yes, conservative media pundits, calling Dean a far-left liberal is far from an accurate portrayal of the man’s record – and as this is primary season, I was afforded the opportunity to choose among a broad field of contenders."

From the very first paragraph. Read the whole thing maybe?

[Zomby Woof]

51. Good to see his words somehow

I strongly believe Will will post again here someday. He has been much fairer than I have, with good cause.

Edit: My original response was sincere in its pointedness at Dean, but Will deserves a better response. It was in no way directed at him, or his opinions expressed.

[Scott Lee]

55. Apparently quite a few!

as well as moderates, conservatives and even Reds like me. See, bud, humans are complex creatures that you can't easily pin down with a single dismissive description. Many things move them, and their motivations tend to be multitiered.

Now I petition my horned Northern European god of the hunt to wish you a pleasant Yule and a "bliadhna Bhath Ur".

[Triana]

53. excellent - goes really well with this:

..which I admittedly snarfed from DU and added the lettering to.

[seventhson]

56. For Once, Will, you have left me almost completely speechless. THANKS!!!

I will not look this gift horse in the mouth. Not right now.

I will accept it as truth and will look forward to William Rivers Pitt as my ally in the effort to beat Bush's ass at the Polls in 2004.

I do not think that there could be a much better or eloquent advocate for Dean, frankly, and so I am very pleased to read this article.

I think it should be spread far and wide.

Peace, Will!

and thank you.

Merry Christmas

[thinkahead]

57. thinkahead

eats crow

very nice article Will.

:pals:

[NashVegas]

65. "He Stood Up"

And in the end, to me, that's what it's all about, Will.

FWIW, the fat lady has not yet sung.

PS - nice Red Sox analogy.

[LizW]

68. Thanks, Will

Very inspiring.

:yourock:

[wyldwolf]

71. Though I agree with Will's "we've got to make the best of what we have..."

... sentiments, and I will also support Dean balls to the wall should he win the nomination, I have a sneaking suspicion Will was strongly "encouraged" to write this piece by the brass at truthout or that he for some reason felt obliged to.

I find it sad that an obviously obsessive representative from a group of Dean supporters (who are already thought by many to be somewhat fanatical) would resort to such a republican-like tactic.

"If you continue to "smear" our guy, we'll teach you a lesson!"

Nice piece, Will, as always.

I don't think you meant it, though.

I hope you're still among us posting under another name - which you probably should have been doing all along.

The next time someone accuses me of hiding behind my anonymity, I'll reply "I don't want to be Will Pitted!"

[SahaleArm]

73. Except that doesn't work too well with the for-profit media n/t

[Scott Lee]

74. Holy Peach Preserves - we agree!

"I have a sneaking suspicion Will was strongly "encouraged" to write this piece by the brass at truthout or that he for some reason felt obliged to."

Absolutely! At least we both agree it wasn't sincere.

[Closer]

79. Well whaddya know

"Nice piece, Will, as always.

I don't think you meant it, though."

First and only time I'll probably ever agree with WyldWolf :hi:

[ozone_man]

87. Still, it was a very well written piece.

It seems that Will has had a sudden Dean enlightenment of some kind, judging from the last few weeks, but I think journalists do not really get full freedom to speak their minds. I would prefer that they did, even if they don't agree with my opinions. Sort of why DU can be fun, most of the time.

[Name removed]

75. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[wyldwolf]

76. I don't have to do anything about it...

...someone else will.

See ya!

[A-Schwarzenegger]

77. So is this a conicidence or did the girlcott work?

Some people are asking if it's sincere but
I say who cares the more the merrier it's better
to have somebody leaping on the Dean Bandwagon against
their will and climbing in the window and pissing out
instead of herling spitballs from the bushes.

[WillyT]

80. Oh Please, Give Me A Fucking Break, Not You Will Or Keph, But...

the DU idiots who really think that Will was pressured into writing this piece because of some idiotic actions by some of our more moronic posters. My God, you accuse Will of being full of himself, he doesn't hold a candle to YOU GUYS!!!

People who kick a guy when THEY think he's down (he's not BTW) are truly reprehensibe. I don't believe in using the ignore feature, and will not, but I'd love ta throw a dozen lumps of coal your way!

Here's wishin you a crappy X-Mas!

:puke:

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

90. Who gives a fuck if he did..I couldn't write that piece under duress

Just proves he's good at what he does in spite of all his notorious character flaws ( as outlined along the way in this thread.) It seems most of our experts on character flaws and poor, unethical or misleading behavior arrived at their expertise via the experiential route.

[Duder]

81. Kudos... that's the spirit!

Kind of like Yogi Berra's:

"When you come to a fork in the road, take it!".

:)

[shivaji]

82. Dean tops the list of this INDEPENDENT voter

Over the past 32 voting years, I have voted both republican & democrat. In 2004, I will vote democratic if Dean is the nominee.
He impresses me more as time goes by. IMHO he displays the most common sense and believability in the dem field, and I tend to vote for persons who come across as some one in whom I can believe even if we may have differing positions on some issues.

[dfong63]

91. welcome aboard!

[hippiechick]

83. Way to go, Bro's ....

Glad you didn't make your Big Sis come out with a can of whupass on this one :) ....


Happy Holidays at bothofya' .... :grouphug:


:hippie:

[PBinOregon]

92. For God's Sake!

The one thing that Will Pitt has attempted to do, over and over and over again, is to write the truth as he sees it. The people who attack him on DU amaze me. It's one thing to disagree with the argument a writer makes, but to make the leap and accuse him of flip flopping or somehow not being honest in his writing is too much to endure.

In the battles that have gone on, and in the battles that are to come, I would rather have one Will Pitt at my side than a thousand of his accusers. I challenge ANY of you who call his character into question to do even 1% of what Pitt has done to fight the Bush agenda.

Disagree with his take on things any time you want. He is more than capable of holding his own. Attack him with petty accusations and character assasination and you only show yourself to be unworthy of consideration.

Keep your eyes on the prize, please. That's what Will Pitt has done and continues to do. Anything you do to damage a colleague in this fight--and for God's sake, we are all colleagues in this fight against Bush, Inc.--is absolutely unacceptable.

[opihimoimoi]

93. It takes a village, err, it takes many villages, many cities, to get

back on track, get the psuedo prez outta there.

The Pubs, they ain;t got nuthing, they can only bullshit. These Pub guys, they are schoolyard bullies, ignorant and selfish.

[Paragon]

94. God, I hate it when I'm right.

To anyone who just reads truthout, that's damn inspiring.

To anyone who's been reading DU, it's nauseatingly insincere.

And I really would have liked to have read that and been inspired. Would've been nice.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

114. All it would take is a change of attitude on your part, but I guess that's

Will's responsibility too, eh?

[Paragon]

118. Nah

I can watch Dean speak to a crowd on C-SPAN and get plenty fired up. I'll take the general instead of the reluctant warrior any day.

With all due respect, I'm done with the situation. Can't say I miss Will's confused allegiances. I have little or no pull on DU, and write for no one but myself -- I was still smart enough not to bash candidates. (Or if I did, it was always in response to a Pitt rant.)

I've seen enough cliched goodbyes on DU to know that they don't last very long. Dr. J had the class to retire just once. I'm guessing Pitt will be more like Dennis Rodman.

[hackwriter]

95. Will, you are a glassy guy

Thank you for this wonderful column, Will. I knot you're a Kerry guy, but I want to thank you for reminding those who would snipe and backstab that we're all in this together.

[Name removed]

96. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Skwmom]

98. Sorry that I can't agree with you.

Dean’s campaign has been, for my money, one of the most remarkable electoral phenomena in recent memory. (I think the main reason it has been so "phenomenal" is because the Republican machine has allowed it to be and has done everything they can to hand the nomination to Dean. Yes Dean has tapped into the anger of the 2000 election - as he said he could - however, anger can also blind one to reason and become an extremely self destructive force.)

His fundraising abilities have been second to none. (When you add in the contributions from Bush supporters - and money from those who know that Dean will play ball (can we say energy deregulation), I'm not surprised that he's been so successful. However, I can't stop thinking you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. No amount of money will save Dean in the general election.

He has captured the hearts of the ultra-liberal base, and pulled more than a few Greens along in his wake, while being a centrist budget hawk with a 100% approval rating from the NRA. Figure that one out and you’ve got a stellar dissertation for your Political Science PhD. (Sadly, it's not only Republican's who can be blinded by their hatred for members of the opposing party. This is like watching the 2000 election all over again except for the sad fact that the "Bush" candidate is now a Democrat. The 2000 primary election will make a fascinating read once it is dissected and subject to a thorough analysis. I think your articles should definitely be included in such an analysis.)

He stood up before the die-hard base of the Democratic Party before, and in the aftermath, of an unnecessary, criminal war. He stood up after two years of hide-the-ball from Bush and the boys regarding September 11.... (Dean's inconsistency on these very issues screams political opportunism.)

This anti-Dean movement has spawned some of the most virulent and self-destructive behavior to be seen within the Democratic party since the Copperheads went to Canada to try and overthrow Lincoln’s government. (Self destructive behavior because people would rather have the truth about Howard Dean exposed in the primary election rather than the general election? That Iowa attack ad was nothing. Once Dean's multiple positions on any one issue get exposed, his willingness to pander and say anything to get elected is driven home, and footage of Dean ranting and raving are repeated again and again and again Dean will not only suffer a humiliating defeat, he will drag the Democratic party down with him. People will either think that he is a 1)liar OR 2) an unstable individual who can't keep his story straight one day from the next. Burying your head in the sand about Howard Dean is NOT going to keep the truth from coming out. If he is the nominee, he and the Democratic Party will be buried by the TRUTH in the general election. In addition, the credibility of anyone associated with Dean will be called in to question. I can hear it now - the organization "TruthOut" is running attack ads against our president. If they are so concerned about the truth they should start with their own candidate. Once Howard Dean is thoroughly discredited (and he will be), anyone closely associated with him will be tarnished by association (and any truth they hope to expose will be seriously called into question).

Just today, some within the party are saying Howard Dean is using his dead brother, the one they pulled out of a shallow grave in Laos, for political gain. Cowards can be brave in their anonymity, it seems. (I think some people believe in calling it like they see it. What else would you call his response to the military question?)

I am certainly not one to say that the other candidates should run up the white flag and surrender their campaigns before any votes have been cast. At bottom, this would be a disservice to democracy, that messy system crafted by the Founders to ensure a healthy, vigorous, bare-knuckled debate. (Not only would it be a disservice to democracy, it would be a disservice to the TRUTH. We diss the Democrats because the don't have enough backbone to stand up and call a spade a spade, to speak the truth. I would stand up and cheer for any Democrat that has the guts to stand up in the next debate and in clear cut and unequivocal language take on Howard Dean. It would not be destroying the Democratic party, it would be saving it.)

If the Democratic party eats itself over the nomination of Howard Dean, it will cease to exist as a viable force in America, and deservedly so. Memo to the DLC and DNC: You have been warned. (So they should quietly step aside and let Dean take down the Democratic party with him. Memo to DLC and DNC - get some backbone and stop this insanity).

As for the aforementioned electability factor, the argument at this point is coming closer each day to being moot. The other candidates claim Dean cannot win as they lose to him in poll after poll. (Polls that show him being trounced by George Bush, polls that use very questionable polling methodology, polls of people who when you get right down to it include many people who have yet to be introduced to the real Howard Dean - if the Democrats can't make that happen in the primary election (though with the media propping him up it makes it very difficult to say the least), don't worry, Rove will set the record straight in the general election.

If Dean wins the nomination, and the other candidates along with the party apparatus get on the bus, the only thing left to do is to figure out a way to describe the abominable record of George W. Bush to the electorate in a way they can understand. That shouldn’t be too hard, I think. (The old George Bush's record is so terrible, it will be easy to beat him meme ignoring all of the many weaknesses of Howard Dean).

A lot of people within the GOP, Karl Rove and Tom DeLay most recently, are making gleeful noises at the prospect of facing Howard Dean in the general election. If they get that chance, they will be facing a candidate who has already overcome enormous odds (the candidate they hand selected and who they helped overcome "enormous odds.") They will be facing a candidate whose instant reaction message team has not missed a beat (don't forget the corporate press who cheered Dean on every step of the way and gave him a pass - as even the ABC Note pointed out). They will be facing a candidate whose seeming deficiencies are well-matched by his incredible strengths. (How do you overcome such deficiencies as shooting from the hip, talking out of both sides of your mouth, etc.?)

They will be facing an army of people who want their country back, an army riding on the words of Victor Hugo: “There is nothing more powerful than an idea whose time has come.” The idea here, simply, is that George W. Bush must go. (Once the truth about Howard Dean is exposed, I think you are going to see a lot of disillusioned supporters in that "army of people." As someone said to me the other day - to know Howard Dean is not to like him unless a dishonest pandering politicians suits your taste.)

In other words, they will be facing another old folk saying. Be careful what you wish for. You just might get it. (The Dean's campaign trite reply to very valid and serious concerns regarding Dean as the nominee.)

[helleborient]

106. History is so easily forgotten...

Republicans were gleeful to face JFK because he was Catholic.

They were gleeful to face Jimmy Carter because he was an unknown peanut farmer.

They were gleeful to face Bill Clinton because of bimbo eruptions.

There were screams of irreparable divisions in the party in all of these races.

Those who don't remember history are doomed to not have a clue what is really going on in the present.

[Larkspur]

100. Nice article, Will

This is the main reason why I supported Howard Dean:

At the end of the day, there is one reason Howard Dean stands ready to grasp the brass ring in Boston. He stood up before the die-hard base of the Democratic Party before, and in the aftermath, of an unnecessary, criminal war. He stood up after two years of hide-the-ball from Bush and the boys regarding September 11. He stood up after that base had endured one of the most ruthless anti-liberal propaganda campaigns since Joe McCarthy held a key to the Congressional washroom. He stood up after this country got lied to again and again and again. He stood up within the confines of a mainstream news media structure that has done more to cover Bush’s backside than anyone could have possibly imagined. He stood up when too many of the other Democratic candidates sat on their hands and played it safe.

He stood up and roared, “I want my country back!”

[Patriot_Spear]

101. Interesting timing. n/t

[Scoopie]

103. Well, actually

known Republicans who are still supporting Bush have given to Dean.
If you don't believe me, go to the FEC's website.
I can't post a direct link because you have to look it up yourself, but I suggest a search of Halliburton board member Robert Randall first.

[unfrigginreal]

104. Big Deal

Known boosters of this administration are running for the Democratic nomination.

[denverbill]

108. First, learn his name.

It's Robert CRANDALL, not Randall.

Second, look at his record.

He gave to McCain, Pat Schroeder, Bill Clinton, Bob Graham, Bob Kerrey, and dozens of other candidates, Republican and Democrat.

Since you are making the implied suggestion that he's donating to Dean because he thinks Dean will lose to Bush, perhaps you can tell me why he donated to Pat Schroeder, Bob Kerrey, Byron Dorgan, and Bob Graham.

[helleborient]

105. Yes, Virginia, the press are human beings...

To me, reading Will Pitt's admittedly well-written article and something to cheer for Dean supporters is abundant proof that journalists are simply human beings...as I've stated multiple times here in opposition to the "press conspiracy" threads.

Two days after concern about an e-mail sent to truthout threatening to quit sending personal contributions, and after rumors of a number of Dean supporters expressing concern to truthout, a very very positive article by William Rivers Pitt shows up on truthout, and gets immediate play on the Dean blog.

Coming from any other journalist who had previously shown strong support for Kerry, and open scorn for Dean...I would suspect many here would scream "sellout." The screaming is very very muted in this case.

I make no argument whether Will is selling out, or this is simply a true change of point-of-view for him. What it does seem to point out to me is that Will, like most other journalists, pay attention to the private communication they, and their publications, receive.

If anyone here believes pressure from Dean supporters at least in part brought this about...it is abundant proof the media can be moved and can respond. Hand-wringing about corporate media gets us nowhere. Direct contact with individuals in the media does have the potential for positive results...we, as Democrats, should concede nothing.

[Patriot_Spear]

109. You're right, it's big of Pitt to 'apologize' in this manner.

Subtle- but it's clearly a peace offering. I'm glad he's finally on board.

[windansea]

110. sheesh

You must of gagged when you wrote this line

" But the ad in Iowa, the nonsense about Hussein’s capture, and these most recent smears about Dean’s brother, are a cancer. It smacks of bitterness, of candidates who thought it was their turn and now feel thwarted by this doctor who came out of nowhere"

I haven't seen proof that the other candidates supported the Osama ad and the controversy over what Dean said about his brother was in a couple of newspaper articles and hasn't been used by other campaigns...kind of a smear job on your part Will

I guess 1 out of three is good enough for truthout!

[Rose Siding]

113. Wilgoren in the NYT attributes "a rival campaign"

for distributing the original op-ed about the "survey" to the press.

snip>
The editorial was circulated to a handful of reporters on Monday by a rival campaign.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/23/politics/campaigns/23DEAN.html

[windansea]

122. attribute = smear

name names please...

[mrgorth]

112. THANK YOU!!!

Great article Will.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

117. Kick

[Booberdawg]

119. Excellent piece as usual

I'm only sorry Wills couldn't have posted it himself.

Thanks for posting it for us Keph.

[Hillsey]

123. It's certainly a shame that the author of this article

is no longer a contributing member of this forum. I have been mostly reading and lurking for quite some time now and I considered him one of the more well informed and valuable contributors.

Frankly I do not understand how one private DU member who threatened to withhold contributions got to be so powerful in the minds of so many people. Surely people threaten that all the time with businesses that have to operate on donations. I can understand why Mr. Pitt would take it personally - it was a rotten and very personal thing to do.

Nor do I understand how Mr. Pitt's personal choice of candidate got to be so powerful in the minds of people who disagreed with his choice, and particularly in the mind of a certain Dean supporter. I have never seen such ugliness as I have seen with this primary.

Why isn't he entitled to his opinion and his say, whether you agree with it or not?

Why must I even ask the question???

I do hope you reconsider, Mr. Pitt. If not for your contributions, for just because it's a bad precendent to set.

[slinkerwink]

125. kick

[silverweb]

126. Thank you, Will.

:hi:

[Booberdawg]

127. God Dammit. I have a rant.

I made a small contribution to Truthout but I can’t make a big contribution because I am unemployed. I’ll make it up later but the more I think about this situation the more it pisses me off. I’m also not as smart, or well informed, and on top of things political as many people here are, YET, but I’m also a lot better that most. I just choose to keep my mouth shut and not get into flame wars, personal attacks, and pissing contests and lose my sense of self and body parts over my obsession with politics on a bulletin board. It’s JUST a fucking message board.

But some things do need to be said.

Why can’t Wills post his own drafts and pre-edited versions of his articles here like he used to? I admit I didn’t always contribute to that exercise but I always read them. And why, for God’s sakes, is he not entitled to his personal opinion of his choice of candidate? Why did it come to this? Because one person complained to his boss? And said that they would withhold donations? Are you serious? Fuck that! Does any one person control that place? I doubt it. In fact, I’m sure not.

This primary candidate bashing pissing contest that has turned Democrats into evil nasty monsters has left me baffled. I found months ago that I don’t like and cannot tolerate many of the people within my own Party before I’ve ever met them by their behavior in this primary alone. I don’t know why I am even wasting my breath saying this. This has been said so many times by so many others here on DU. It’s an obvious phenomenon noticed and said by many others.

There does seem to be an inordinate number of people willing to pile on Wills along with the person who felt it necessary to hit him below the belt in his place of livelihood. They gleefully jumped on this bandwagon. Yes indeed. That is unfortunate, and it seems to be part of this nasty unforgiving paranoid pro and anti candidate bullshit that some people take so goddamed personally. This phenomenon is making me sick. You folks are making me sick. You know who you are. I will be so fucking glad when this primary is over. And guess what? You are not going to like the outcome.

What is the matter with you people? I am serious?

I am anxious to see this conversation a year from now, but I am not optimistic or hopeful about it.

So, with someone like William Pitt gone, where does that leave people like me that are still listening and want to hear more? Where does that leave those of us that are still learning? Where does that leave those of us that hear the messages and want to hear and learn more? And beyond that, where does that leave those of us that simply want to hear another well informed, considered, and researched opinion?

I’m done ranting now. And I’m prepared ready for the consequences. I’m just so disgusted on so many levels with this.

Linda

[Hillsey]

128. Booberdawg. You won’t get any severe consequences from me for your rant.

I may not have the same things to say, but I can’t say that I disagree with anything you said. I’m impressed with your concern for those who are going to lose in the end. You and I know who that’s going to be.

Edit: nevermind – check your PM

I hope you can consider my comments. :hi:

Thank you for speaking up and voicing your rant on this issue. You made some points I didn’t consider.

PS
BTW, you are one of the voices I followed while lurking in GD. Where did you go anyway? Nevertheless, I’m glad you came back.

[Booberdawg]

129. Thanks for the note and

Welcome to DU Hillsey!
:toast: