Iraq: "out now" and "set a date" types should be able to unite...

[European Socialist]

to get the job done. Like Murtha said--the public is way ahead on this one.

[katinmn]

1. I'm so disappointed that many Dems are distancing themselves from Murtha

More than disappointed. I'm sickened.

He speaks for the military. He knows the military inside and out. He has wide support from the American people. But both Repukes and Dems, thinking they might lose a couple pro-war votes, are hedging and continuing to look to Junior to miraculously come around and develop a plan and timeline. Why do they continue to give Junior so much credit?

Junior will never come up with a plan because he never intends to leave.

[European Socialist]

2. Democrats need to catch up with the public before some puke...

like Hagel steals the issue and runs with it.

[katinmn]

3. I agree. They aren't listening.

:shrug:

[welshTerrier2]

4. are there actually any "set a date" advocates??

it seems to me the dispute on Iraq within the Democratic Party is between positions of Senate Democrats (e.g. Levin, Kerry) and House members like Jim McGovern or Rep. Murtha ...

the Senate Dems generally have called for a series of benchmarks, that they have not defined and prefer to have bush specify, that would, when achieved, allow a phased withdrawal of troops ... while some of these proposals have suggested a timeframe in which they would like to see these benchmarks met, troop withdrawal would be 100% contingent on the meeting of each benchmark ... if the benchmarks are not met, troop withdrawal would not occur ... so, just to be clear, i don't see any calls for "setting a date" ...

as for "being able to unite", the goal is valid; the current process is not ... we cannot just call for unity; we have to achieve unity ...

Murtha hit the nail on the head, as did you, when he said the public is way ahead of the Congress on Iraq ... he's saying, and i agree, that those pushing plans to stay in Iraq another year or more are way out of touch with the American people and way, way out of touch with a strong majority of Democrats ...

the divisiveness, which i agree is harmful and must be resolved, is the direct result of the Senate Democrats' failure to represent the views held by their own constituents ... these Senators need to get back to their districts and hold regular, free, public forums on Iraq ... Dean, as Party Chair, needs to propose a process to heal the rift ... he has NOT done this ... he can't make Senators return to their districts and exchange their thoughts on Iraq with Democratic voters but he could call on them to do so ...

the Democratic Party is witnessing internal strife because voters have very strong feelings about this very critical issue ... it's time for Party leaders to call for a real discussion with the American people instead of arrogantly and selfishly making decisions on their own ... the Democratic Party needs a large, healthy infusion of democracy ... i'm confident that "working through the issue" could lead to a negotiated resolution of our differences ... but we're just not seeing an intra-party process to lead us where we need to go ...

[European Socialist]

5. I'm thinking of a compromise that would set benchmarks, but have a ...

definite funding cut off date. The troops could leave earlier-but they would surely be leaving by some date.

[welshTerrier2]

6. a process towards unity ...

well, there you go ...

if the Democratic Party hopes to be united next year, and more importantly if they want to have the support of most Democrats and the American people as well, ideas like the one you proposed need to have a real forum for discussion ...

right now, i think those who supposedly speak for the Party are speaking out of political fear ...

i am very strongly in favor of immediate withdrawal ... if it were up to me, the troops would come home this weekend ...

nevertheless, you put a near-term "date certain" on the table, and i would be more than open to considering the specifics of your proposal ...

too many think that unity will be achieved by telling the anti-war crowd to shut up and just go along ... they expect unity to be achieved without negotiation ... it's nonsense and it isn't going to happen ... if Democrats want to go into next year as a unified party, they better "democratize" the intra-party discussion on Iraq ... if they don't, progress will not be made ... i can be every bit as stubborn as they're being ... it's not necessary and it will hurt all of us ...