Hyper reality

[BL611]

Not to get all philosophical on Y'all, but I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on it. Hyper reality is a form of postmodernism that was developed by Jean Baudrillard, essentially it says that there is no way for us to understand reality since our views of reality are created by frames we see throughout the media and culture, instead of responding to reality we respond and react to artificial stimuli and create an artificial reality that brings us psychic satisfaction.

For example take a protest of the war in Iraq, the protesters are not actually protesting the war in iraq since they don't know what is actually going on in Iraq, they are protesting the artificial stimuli that they have accepted as their frame. The protest itself is also not seen by others as its reality, but through the artifical lenses of the media and culture, the reactions to the protest are seen the same way, etc., etc.

I once brought this theory up to a Marxist professor I had a while back and she went ape shit on me, which is interesting since Baudrillard is considered a post marxist. Full Disclosure: Making marxists go ape shit is one of my greatest joys in life.

[skids]

1. Perhaps not the best analogy.

The protestors aren't protesting the war in Iraq because of ANSWER.

But yeah, the philosophy has extended beyond that to the prospect touted by some quantum physicists that even physical laws might be enforced entirely by thought (human or otherwise.)

[BL611]

3. Not because of ANSWER

but because of the conception they see of the war and Iraq, and war in general through the media and the culture. Since they do not know the reality of what goes on on the ground in Iraq they protest the frame they accept, I realize it is a slightly crude analogy since it is a very difficult concept to explain, hopefully however people will get the jist...

[skids]

9. It was a joke...

...but obviously not so in your frame of perception.

[BL611]

10. Yes, I suppose it has now been proven beyond a doubt

excuse me while I jump off a brigde...

[Silent3]

2. This is one of those ideas which...

...is interesting to consider, and which might offer some useful insights, but if you take it too seriously and try to systematize it to the nth degree turns into nothing more than a whole lot of loopy mental masturbation.

[BL611]

4. Agreed

[C_U_L8R]

5. Pass the bong

I need to be high to really enjoy this

[BL611]

6. Damn hedonistic hippies

Get a Job!!!

[C_U_L8R]

8. i was just kidding ya

:-)

[BL611]

11. Yes as was I...

although in the words of the young sage Eric Cartman: "I hate hippies!!!"

[northamericancitizen]

7. No-Knowledge as an answer for conscientiousness?

[BL611]

12. Not so much knowledge itself

as much as knowledge of reality in the modern world.

[northamericancitizen]

13. Isn't the same?

Reality is Reality.

modern, post-modern or any other label.

[Chan790]

15. Disagree.

Reality is subjective, based upon the biases of the perceptor.

[BL611]

16. Not exactly

Knowledge does not have to be confined to knowledge of reality, it can be knowledge of hubris, for example a conspiracy nut may be very knowledgeable about his/hers accepted frame of reality. They are knowledgeable, but it is not a knowledge based on reality. The question is , is everyone else's view of the world just as debased as a conspiracy nut?

[Chan790]

14. Baudrillard

makes my head hurt. On some level he's correct, it's the same level upon which David Hume is correct...that we can only know of our universe through human (flawed) interpretation based upon senses that we cannot trust to predict results that do not exist yet within a framework of our own biases.

It's empiricism introduced into the realm of the social science.

He takes it to some absurd extremes though...like when he wrote that the Gulf War never happened, only our perceptions of it on TV did.

[BL611]

17. Not so much that the war never happened

But that only people who were though no what really happened the rest of us just accepted on of many conflicting frames, hence for people who were not there it never happened, only the artificial stimuli happened...

[Deja Q]

18. Makes you wonder just how 'real' peak oil is...