30 Year Plan

[erpowers]

If the idea that Kerry lost the last Presidential election because it was stolen is valid what does that say about the Republican 30 year plan? Would that mean that the major part of the 30 year plan did not work?

[applegrove]

1. Exactly. What we really face is the 30 year plan. Very hard to deal

with long term manipulation of your country or your life. That is a much bigger issue the diebold. Why is diebold is proven to have happened then the President gets impeached and it is over.

The 30 year plan is much, much harder to fight against. When legislation is put in place to divide the country into haves and have-nots ... and the truth is purposely throw away in favor of myths... the country and the repukes are really, really sick. That is a much longer and bigger battle.

The harder way is to look at the elections and say: we democrats need to change the way we do everything to win back seats.

Our lives have been diminished. And it is not a casual thing that will be fixed in a few years. Utopia neocons will be running around for years. They totally ignore their own dam policy failures like Saddam Hussein in the 1980s and this War in Iraq (why Rumsfield has not been fired I do not know). They just create new myths to get away from having to deal with the truth: that the world is a whole lot more complicated than their theories allowed and that they are essentially a bunch of adolescents.

[applegrove]

2. I meant if diebold were proven to have happened (and I'm sure not)

Sorry. SP.

[Selatius]

3. I think there is a solution to beating the 30 year plan

Present an alternative message, a message that working people of America know and understand very well. I'm talking about economic populism. If the Democratic Party had true progressives like, for instance, Bernie Sanders or Dennis Kucinich at its core, then the 30 year plan could be killed simply by retaking government power from them, and ripping the plan to pieces.

The Democratic Party has grown too corporate, too reliant on wealthy donors. It whitewashes its message to please the money-lenders because it doesn't want to bite the hand that feeds it, but it's losing the support of ordinary voters because it's not talking about issues that affect ordinary people, at least not in a way that would wake up the people and invigorate them.

[applegrove]

4. Neocons and Rovbots are trying to portray the Dems as a marginal

group of people. They honestly think they can have the vote of anyone who owns any stock. That would happen over 100 Million cold dead hands.

The neocons & GOP are the biggest hypocrites the world has ever seen. Very important that they are portrayed as the liars that they are. And incidentally - keeping bases in the ME so that oil doesn't fall into the hands of Islamist terrorists is one thing. But if you do it, and pressure democracies to be open to your American corporations with no regulations..you are in fact going against open market. Why shouldn't the Iranians sell to China? Why not a pipeline? why shouldn't universal health care be the norm around the world - it does a good job of keeping costs down (much better than the private system the US has).

They are hypocrites. A big military is big government. It is also a subsidized program for military industry. All over the place the neocons are hypocrites. We Dems need to keep our big tent as the party with a conscience and willing to take on great ideas and reform. For sure government cannot be as big as it was in the past and programs have to show their efficiency.

Transparency too is the way to talk about markets & corporations. Who they donate to electorally, how they cannot skew the markets or the power of any democracy.

All these things are areas where the Dems should be. As well as all the stuff they have been known for in the past. The tried & true plans that encourage savings above SS but do not act as a tax shelter but tax deferment.

Frankly. Unless world wide norms can be set of capital flight and health care and allowing poorer countries to go & nationalize things as they gear up (so that a good transfer of wealth takes place from a countries resources to the institutional building & the poor) to join the West in trade - unless there are standards and norms across the board - everyone knows the neocons will just bully one country after another.

At least they seem wise to it these days. Brazil, Kenya & now the OAS seem to be much more wary of neocon intention. Thank god for them!