Bush wanted Osama's head delivered in a box.

[El Fuego]

On dry ice. The story's a few weeks old, but I want to know, why wasn't this a bigger story? Recounting orders from the CIA chiefs, CIA agent Gary Schroen said:

"What he said (was), 'I would like to see the head of bin Laden delivered back to me in a heavy cardboard box filled with dry ice, and I will take that down and show the president. And the rest of the lieutenants, you can put their heads on pikes'."

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=729033

Doesn't it follow that bush had to have formally issued the order "Bring me his head!"? I hardly think the CIA would "surprise" the president of the United States with a disembodied head on their own.

Heads on pikes! Something you see on the History Channel in macabre paintings depicting ancient uncivilized people. bush is single-handedly leading us into a new dark ages, a new age of barbarism.

This is not the country I grew up in. I guess I always bought into the popular media-driven mythology that this was a great nation. But, it seems the Age of Enlightment was only brief blip.

And ironically, bible-toting bushie is just like a biblical ruler. He asks for the heads of his enemies, he wants to put his enemies' heads on pikes. He put the slaughtered bloody bodies of Hussein's two sons on display for the world to see.

Listen chimpy: If you want to have a so-called "culture of life," you should respect the dignity of the dead. Even that of your enemies.

So why didn't this story cause more outrage? Are we acclimated to the new era of primitive barbarity? This is yet another mile marker on the road to hell.

I think there should be a congressional investigation on this matter. If we fail to question this, we are just being complicit with the path this country is taking.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

1. Oh how biblical!

:eyes:

[DemBones DemBones]

8. How Roman! It was the Romans who beheaded John the Baptist,

crucified Jesus, and killed all the early martyrs, such as Sts. Stephen, Lawrence, Perpetua, Felicity, Sebastian.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

17. no it was King Herod

[DebJ]

2. Wubya wants it for a drinking glass (blood, that is). My hubby

just read that Wubya is related to Count Dracool (spelling?), the historical figure that turned into the Dracula legend...the guy that crucified people by the thousands (at a time)... This Count is related to the grandmother of Queen Elizabeth II

[ElsewheresDaughter]

3. like "bring me the head of John the Baptist" ...

i'm not comparing osama with the baptist ...just bush to herod

[Bluerthanblue]

20. to quote Robin Williams....

... in "Aladin"- "great minds think alike-great minds think for themselves"- i was posting same time as you, you put it far more succintly-:toast:

[bluestateguy]

4. For what? To be put on display at the ranch?

Who needs a moose head or a deer head when you can have Osama's head?

[El Fuego]

12. Now all the freeper Texans will want Al Qaeda heads!

The new status symbol.

[Vanje]

36. Styrofoam Osama heads

mounted on the radio antennas of Flag-stickered, yellow-ribboned Hummers in Texas.

[paineinthearse]

5. Check freeperland

I would, but am heading out.

Bet this gets OVERWHELMING support over there!

[El Fuego]

9. LOL, I will!

[Southsideirish]

6. Like MacDuff!

[wtmusic]

7. "Another marker on the road to hell"

One thing everyone has to admit about Junior: he brings out our best prose

[El Fuego]

14. At least we can say there is never a dull moment with chimpy

[ooglymoogly]

10. hasn't he got enough

he must have a pretty big pile in his basement

[El Fuego]

13. He can put it in the closet with the rest of his skeletons.

[LuPeRcALiO]

11. Doubtful.

The only box Shrub wants Osama delivered in is a box at the opera (private).

[sleipnir]

15. It's for Skull and Bones...Bushie broke the Geronimo skull...soooo.....

His brothers put in him office just to get a replacement skull of some well known non-white person so they can drink out of it on initiation nights.

It's a hootinay in New Haven if Bush ever gets back with a new skull. But then he also said he'd come back with another case of beer on the night Oct. 15, 1967 and damn if he did just come back with a shiteating grin and no beer.

[Bluerthanblue]

16. "BRING ME THE HEAD OF JOHN THE BAPTIST"

our 'religious' christian- "Jesus changed my heart" president is mimicing the EVIL and scandalous behaviour of the wife of king Herrod- whose wife demanded that very same 'reward' for her daughter dancing for the king.--- AND King Herrod gave her what she wanted-

i CAN"T for the life of me see how people who accept bush's 'religious' talk as genuine aren't jumping all over this-

It is a comment and an action SO far removed from what a person who confessed to 'Love the Lord Jesus' and have had a "heart change" as a result of coming to "know HIM (Jesus)" would say, think, or desire-

sorry for the shouting, but i feel like a voice screaming in the wilderness among professing 'christ'ians- and it's got me incredibly frustrated-!!!

[Politicub]

22. And is Condi playing the role Salome?

I relate to your frustration. My partner and I are watching a documentary on FSTV about how the US has utterly destoyed Iraq. It is hell there. Many of the US soldiers are just 20 year old kids.

They showed the clip of Bush saying, "Bring it on." How craven and evil of him to use such bravado as our children were dying.

[Bluerthanblue]

24. maybe

it is Lynne Cheney.... what bush isn't remembering if he knows his bible at all, is how remorseful Herod was after 'giving his oath'- and how it was only to 'save face' that he actually had JTB killed-

i'd like to believe bush has even a tiny bit of the 'empathy' or 'conscience' that Herod is reported to have had- but (i hate to admit my 'jaded-ness') i don't think he 'feels' for anyone deeply other than himself-

not a very 'christian' attitude- but his actions speak so much louder than his 'words' and 'crocodile tears'-

[Vanje]

37. A lot of Church-goers...

....are real sick fucks. Bush's most sadistic megalomanic babblings fit right into their vision of whats "Godly".

" CAN"T for the life of me see how people who accept bush's 'religious' talk as genuine aren't jumping all over this-"

[Politicub]

18. A large part of Bush's base

loves the Rambo shit like this. It's like red meat to them.

Our president is a madman.

[earthboundmisfit]

19. And Karma CAN apply to groups/countries of people.

So why didn't this story cause more outrage? Are we acclimated to the new era of primitive barbarity? This is yet another mile marker on the road to hell.

I think there should be a congressional investigation on this matter. If we fail to question this, we are just being complicit with the path this country is taking.

I'v been told that Karma CAN & DOES apply to entire countries/groups of people, e.g. those who participate in genocide, are complicit in injustices done to other nations, etc. So it is wise to protest, indeed to take action whenever possible, so as NOT to be a Karmic accomplice to evil deeds.

[rhett o rick]

21. Speaking of heads, did anyone else here about Bill O Really wanting to

cut off the head of the LA Times editor? Plez correct me if i got it wrong.

[El Fuego]

23. Yep, I googled it.

He wante Michael Kinsley's head cut off. I guess decapitation is the hot new trend in right-wing land.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2005/5/25/141947.shtml

Said O'Reilly, "That’s like saying, 'Well, if we're nicer to the people who want to kill us, then the other people who want to kill us will like us more.'"

Then he fired off the big gun, saying the paper's editorial board will "never get it until they grab Michael Kinsley out of his little house and they cut his head off. And maybe when the blade sinks in, he'll go, 'Perhaps O'Reilly was right.'"

[rhett o rick]

49. Thanks for the response. I guess it wasn't a MSM kinda item n/t

[Clovis Sangrail]

25. "Doesn't it follow that bush.."

"... had to have formally issued the order "Bring me his head!"?"

No
...to me it just sounds like bravado, used to pump up the subordinates.

The next part of Shroen's statements support that idea:

"I don't think he meant that in detail … I think he meant to impress upon me and my deputy that this was very serious business and he wanted to get our adrenaline charged," Schroen added.

[El Fuego]

27. It's more than bravado if he is giving detailed technical instructions.

He gave him specifications about type box to be be used for transport, and also told him to make sure the head was packed in dry ice.

That is far more than just a rallying cry of "Bring us his head!"

[Clovis Sangrail]

32. really?

Does that mean a rugby coach telling his players to "shove that ball so far up their asses that it knocks out their teeth" is also a literal order?

Poor taste? yes
Giving "specifications"? yes
Grounds for not being a coach anymore? maybe

Literal? very doubtful


Besides, I still fail to see how it follows that Bush formally ordered anybody to bring him Osama's head.

I personally think Osama has been worth far more to Bushco. alive and missing than captured or dead; I'm guessing Bushco has felt this way as well since 9/12/01
(that's not to say Osama isn't actually already dead)

[El Fuego]

34. But...

Gary Schoen is 63 years old and has a 32 year old career with the CIA. He is an experienced professional in military operations, I don't think he needs to be "pumped up" with sophomoric rah rahs. Beside, I don't think any American needed to be revved up in the days following 9-11.

In the article he said:

"Other than in paramilitary operations, I have never in 32 years heard of an order to kill anyone."

It wasn't "coaching," it was an ORDER in the military sense. If you're given an order in that context, you can't say, "he must have been joking, I'm going to ignore it."

He just published a book, it will be interesting to see if there are more details about this incident.

Some people say the administration would rather have OBL dead than in a U.S. jail, because that make the extremists even more crazy. I don't know.

[Bluerthanblue]

26. "Lord of the flies" is

more than a classic- seems like it's being played out right here, right now-

Wonder if bush ever actually read it?

[Dark]

28. Osama's head being in a box doesn't really bother me. n/t

[Bluerthanblue]

29. that's sad, cause

it's just that kind of attitude that the people flying planes full of civillians devoloped- kill those who you have chosen to hate- no trial, no questions, let the last person standing rejoice-

We hate OBL why? exactly why? because of what we have been TOLD 'he did'? or ordered? or believes?- because we have heard the words from his own mouth, unedited, unscripted, uncensored????

trust- i have none left-

Don't believe what you have been LED to believe- believe what you KNOW to be truth-

(when we don't care 'who' dies, or 'how' they are killed, we may as well be dead ourselves)

[agincourt]

30. I think it's a planted story

It's something to pump up bush with his macho freeper base. They would never actually kill bin Laden, secretly they are glad he gave pigboy politics hegemony in this country. Never underestimate the connections between neocons and wahabbists.

[thebigidea]

31. me too, I don't believe it - its to distract from his forgetting about OBL

if he wanted his head in a box, why no mention of his name for years, why say stupid shit like "I don't really think about him much..." or whatever it was...

[El Fuego]

33. But Gary Schoen just published a book with the account.

Entitled: First In: An Insider's Account of How the CIA Spearheaded the War on Terror in Afghanistan

Clearly, the timing of the disclosure and press interviews was to for the author to sell books ($$$$$$). It doesn't seem like it has anything directly to do with bush propaganda.

[Guaranteed]

35. That's right.

This actually makes too much sense. I halfway agree with him. Just sounds a little brutal and bloody is all.

In any case, the Chimp doesn't care about our national security.

[fujiyama]

38. Exactly

This administration didn't give two shits about terrorism before or after 9/11.

Why the hell did we end up invading fucking Iraq then?

Bullshit "macho man" story. Bush talks his usual tough cowboy talk, but since when has he delivered on anything?

[El Fuego]

40. Yet another thing he failed at.

[kiki]

39. What a load of "horse apples"...

...if you delivered him Osama's hand, he'd shake it.

[tblue37]

41. Isn't one of the great criticisms

against the Iraqi anti-American fighters that they are barbaric for cutting off people's heads?

[truthisfreedom]

42. have some class, chimpy. ask for a wooden box, or an ATA-approved flight

case.

[dandrhesse]

43. ohh please, class from him, you must be kidding. Of course you are!

If this man had one shred of class, dignity, self-respect, conscience or any other good vibe he wouldn't be who he is!

[nashbridges]

44. Didn't anyone read the story?

There's no mention of an official order. The agent whose boss told him to "bring the head" admits he didn't think the order was meant to be taken literally.

This entire thread is based on "doesn't it follow" logic. Well, no, it DOESN'T follow. You've provided no proof otherwise.

[LuPeRcALiO]

45. anybody who believes this is living on fantasy island

next door to Iraq's WMD and Saddam's mass graves. Total baloney because the Binladens are part of the BFEE and Junior would never talk trash about a kissing cousin. He was raised better than that!

[Inland]

46. I read it, and it doesn't resemble your conclusions

The agent doesn't say the order wasn't meant to be taken literally. What the order was:
"What he said (was), 'I would like to see the head of bin Laden delivered back to me in a heavy cardboard box filled with dry ice, and I will take that down and show the president. And the rest of the lieutenants, you can put their heads on pikes'," Schroen told Reuters in an interview."

Was it an official order? No, I'm sure it wasn't in writing. I bet none of the mission was "official". And I am sure that the entire dry ice thing was only an "if possible" option, and they would be satisfied with a rotted head or no head, as available.

But our people are a weird lot. That's the bottom line.

[newyawker99]

47. Hi nashbridges!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Darkhawk32]

48. He was overcompensating!! n/t