Southern strategy for Feingold

[MollyStark]

Montgomery, Ala. - What is Russ Feingold doing deep in the heart of Bush Country?

Running for president?

"I really don't know, and I'm not going to worry about it," Feingold told the Montgomery Advertiser on Tuesday when the newspaper asked him about 2008. Sen. Russ Feingold (right) discusses local history while he and his wife Mary Feingold tour historic downtown Montgomery, Ala.,

Sen. Russ Feingold (right) discusses local history while he and his wife Mary Feingold tour historic downtown Montgomery, Ala., Tuesday on a bus. There’s a real concern the (national) Democratic Party doesn’t get it when it comes to how to communicate and even sort of identify the right priorities.

<snip>

"The Democratic Party hasn't been doing too well. Maybe we ought to listen to people in other states," Feingold said at a "listening session" he held Tuesday in - of all places - George W. Bush's top congressional district in the country, the Alabama 6th. (The president got 78% of the vote there.)

Wisconsin's junior senator spent Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday driving around this politically forbidding "red state," meeting with liberal and conservative Democrats, Bush voters, local dignitaries and a curious Alabama media, enjoying the improbability of it all.

"When was the last time some Democrat from another part of the country went into Greenville, Alabama, and just said, 'What's the deal here?' " Feingold said before his trip.


http://www.jsonline.com/news/state/mar05/314080.asp

[stray cat]

1. What a concept: talking to the locals

I will be interested in hearing what his perceptions are when he gets back.

[MollyStark]

3. It seems like such a no brainer

Why didn't we do this years ago?

[stray cat]

4. I think Dean has been doing some of the same things.

However, it is really good to see. It is hard for the radical right to demonize democrats if they are out talking with people in public and more importantly - listening. I bet Dean and Feingold don't have people signing loyalty oaths before they show up either.

[MollyStark]

9. I can't see a single democrat pulling that loyalty oath stunt.

I can't even see Lieberman doing it.

[sharonking21]

2. Congratulations Molly

A much better way to handle it than the way bobthedrummer did.

[MollyStark]

5. Handle what?

[sharonking21]

22. See the other one you have been posting on

I think you know exactly what I mean.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1715688

And I wasn't being sarcastic--your thread is the right way to have discussion about someone you like.

[bobthedrummer]

7. I had a poll hijacked by Clark supporters in which Russ Feingold did

quite well. But no more going off topic, don't you like the fact that Feingold addresse Democratic Party weaknesses publicly? I like that candor.

[sharonking21]

27. If you don't want us to

show up and "hijack" :sarcasm: your thread, don't put Clark in it.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1708711&mesg_id=1708711

[saltpoint]

6. Good for Russ and Mary.

I think Senator Feingold is going to be a force to be reckoned with in the primaries.

[MollyStark]

8. It is hard to tell this far out, but I wouldn't be displeased

I think he might do very well also.

[saltpoint]

10. He's a fresh face with new energy and solid ideas.

He just can't be counted out.

[leyton]

39. *Cough* John Edwards *cough*

I think he may steal Edwards' campaign style - persistent, honest, populist campaigning among rural voters - and meld it with his idea of listening to the people. He may be quite successful with that - if you ask me, had it not been for the fact that we were facing a wartime incumbent, Edwards would have been nominated easily.

[Avalux]

11. I doubt a southerner from Alabama or any other southern red state

will vote for a Democrat named Feingold. If he can manage to convince them otherwise - great. Maybe his idea of reaching out will work.

[stray cat]

12. I think Arkansas could get into play and Missouri

I also think he could appeal to the midwest.

[bobthedrummer]

13. Yet they voted for a Democrat named Roosevelt time after time.

I like the sound of President Feingold.

[stray cat]

14. It does have an awfully nice ring to it.

[Clark2008]

15. Roosevelt isn't a Jewish-sounding name

Personally, I don't care, but I live here, so I know what the folks say.

[bobthedrummer]

18. Well neither was Kennedy yet Wes Clark is Jewish, isn't he?

Clark doesn't sound Jewish either-whatever that means to you, Clark2008.

We own our own perceptions only.

[FourStarDemocrat]

58. born to a Jewish father, raised a Christian n/t

[stray cat]

24. What state and are you in an urban or rural part?

I think it really depends on the state and the ratio of urban to rural voters. There are certainly some areas he wouldn't be able to swing but a democrat would just have to be able to pick off a few new states to win.

[MollyStark]

16. Are you saying all southerners are anti semetic bigots?

.... and we should pander to that unsubstantiated slur I suppose.
But we don't need to worry about the south if we win some western states.

[Avalux]

19. Oh please -

I did't say ALL southerners are anti-semetic bigots. Don't put words in my mouth. I won't even address the slur part.
We are talking about the bible belt, and to say my statement isn't valid is being combative just for the hell of it.
I have nothing against Feingold - I admire his determination.

[MollyStark]

20. "I doubt a southerner from Alabama or any other southern red state.......

will vote for a Democrat named Feingold."

How am I putting words in your mouth? You might not know that you made a slur but you did. You slurred southerners and you act as if we should cater to bigotry.

[Clark2008]

23. Sparosnare... Molly and Bob are simply trying to pit

Clark supporters against Feingold supporters.

I'm, personally, not responding to Molly anymore because she either doesn't read what people wrote or she's not understanding it. She fails to see what folks - like you and I who have been discussing Southern strategies for months on this board - are trying to say when we sum up things in a few words.

I like Feingold, too, but I don't like people trying to pit him against Clark. It's flamebait.

[stray cat]

26. I support Clark and Feingold.

I think they are both good men and would be interesting candidates who potentially could have broad appeal. It is good to see both men vocal and reaching out to voters outside of the normal democrat constituents. They are both good adverising for the democratic party. I suspect if either were nominated most of us would get behind them. I sure would.

[Avalux]

28. well said

And I agree it seems there are a few trying (already) to pit Clark against Feingold. I guess if Clark isn't a valid opponent, then there's no point in their efforts, right? I like Feingold too. :hi:

[leyton]

40. I live in the bible belt, and I strongly disagree with you.

Clearly, the article quoted enough evidence to show that if Feingold gives Alabamans a serious look, they will give him the same courtesy. I'll add a conversation I've had with my grandmother, a conservative SC Republican who typifies the bible belt: I asked her what she thought of our primary candidates back in 2004 or 2003, and she said the only one she cared for was Lieberman. Her reason was that he was a nice man who was not as hostile to GW Bush as the rest of the candidates.

In short, she said she like the man with the Jewish-sounding name because he seemed like the most rational, thoughtful guy to her. Now, Feingold is not the centrist that Lieberman is, and that may turn off some conservatives, but he is a progressive who cares about the people. I have faith that if he can convey that, he will get respect in the South.

[QC]

31. Yes, that's exactly what he/she/it is saying,

though I'm sure we'll get an elaborate and implausible explanation for why those words mean something other than their very clear, plain sense.

[tsuki]

17. I just watched him on CSpan with torture Gonzales. He is HOT!

Very impressive.

[politicasista]

21. I will bet the media and AAR will be nice to him unlike Kerry/Edwards

[adwon]

25. It's about damn time

I'm damn happy to see Dean and Feingold coming South and showing that we matter, too. For too long, the Democratic party has been primarily a regional party and not a national party. Seeing this just increases the respect I have for Russ. It's nice to see that people are realizing that both to win presidencies and to build a congressional majority, poaching GOP votes in the South is essential.

[MollyStark]

29. Unlike some people here I think he would do fine in the south

I don't think his Jewish sounding last name is that big an issue anymore. Southerners aren't backwards.

[adwon]

38. Treating us like we're human

goes a long way down here. I have my doubts about Democrats carrying Alabama anytime soon but most of the South is up for grabs, whether or not the GOP realizes it. All the same, it's good to see prominent senators taking a trip down here to get acquainted.

[wyldwolf]

30. Cheswick, this is great!

lately progressives want to write off the south. I can't count the times these types of posts get "fuck the south!" replies!

Russ sounds like the real deal!

[politicasista]

32. The media and Hollywood will be good to him

They won't tear him apart unlike the last nominee.

[Radical Activist]

33. Put Feingold on a ticket with a progressive Southerner

and we win. A couple months ago I said I liked the idea of Feingold and Edwards on a ticket together and the more time goes by the more I think that's a good idea.

[ArtVandaley]

34. Feingold/Warner

perhaps

[Radical Activist]

36. I think we need a progressive southerner

in order to have a ticket that has national appeal. Warner is too conservative.

[leyton]

41. Is Bredesen a progressive?

I'm afraid we have very few options, unless with pick someone out of the House, and if it comes to that we might do better to pick a more prominent Midwesterner or Southwesterner.

[Radical Activist]

42. I don't believe so.

But, he is popular. I haven't followed him closely for the last two years, so I'm not sure how conservative he is. He's definitely worth looking at though.

Of course, I would love to see Congressman John Lewis get chosen. I think that would have a huge positive impact on the election and help in many states. One reason I like Edwards is that progressives who get elected statewide in the South aren't very common, so he's one of the few choices.

[jfern]

51. I think Warner is the best option

He's definitely no liberal, but he did give a great speech called "Why I am a Democrat".

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/8/03116/3996

[Radical Activist]

35. Feingold voted against renewing the assault weapons ban?

I generally like him but I didn't know about that. What's up with that? That issue is a no-brainer.

[Clarkie1]

43. He did. Read it and weep.

http://www.csgv.org/research/votes/keyvotes108/108_awb_senatevote.cfm

"In a four-year period, one in five police officers killed in the line of duty was shot to death by an assault weapon, says the Violence Policy Center. It also noted that the Washington, D.C. snipers used a post-ban assault weapon to kill 10 and injure three in October 2002. Feingold should have worked to strengthen the 1994 ban instead of doing an election-year cave-in to gun-loving extremists."

"Feingold Joins the Firing Squad," Wisconsin State Journal, March 4, 2004

http://www.banassaultweapons.org/press_center/editorials.cfm

"People who like assault weapons should join the United States Army, we have them."
-Wes Clark

I don't want to get into discussion over 08', because as I just posted on another thread I think that is pointless. However, it occurs to me here that this is a good example of how getting a message across depends so much on the messenger. It's the old "only Nixon could go to China" thing. Someone like Clark can stand up to the gun lobby because he has the credentials to do so, whereas Feingold doing the same thing fears he may be perceived as "weak on guns."

Of course, this phenomenon can be generalized to a lot of other liberal, progressive issues.

Just a flash of political insight I had. I like Feingold, but also am disappointed he caved on this.

[Radical Activist]

44. I'm disappointed in Feingold for that.

But, I know that if Clark had been in office for a long while he would have taken some votes I disagree with. The fact that he has no voting record I can judge him on doesn't make Clark better, it just makes him a wild card. I don't like that.

[Clarkie1]

46. Clark did say he would uphold the assault weapons ban.

I take him at his word. He's more honest than any career politician, which makes him less of a "wild card" than any of them.

We are all entitled to our own opinions.

[Hippo_Tron]

45. Here's what I think the logic is...

Gun control is an issue that many believe needs to be handled by states and local governments and in many cases they are not wrong.

Take Montana's recently elected progressive Democratic Governor, Brian Schweitzer. Schweitzer is a progressive populist and pretty socially liberal (I know he's pro-choice) in a very dark red state of Montana. The one issue that he can be accused of "caving" on is guns. Schweitzer ran a very anti gun control campaign boasting a 100% NRA rating. However, you have to consider the fact that Montana has a huge hunting tradition, has very few gun control laws, AND is one of the lowest states in the country for incidents of gun violence.

Why is this? Probably because Montana has very few cities and no big ones. In big cities guns are very much a threat to public safety and to officers who are trying to enforce the law. Crime is high in big cities and guns definately aid this. However, in rural areas crime is low and guns are a way of life.

This is where the problem of a federal (let alone a state) weapons ban comes in. What works for some states doesn't work for others. What works for some counties doesn't work for others. It's not that the federal assault weapons ban is necesarilly going to take away the guns that hunters use, it's that people begin to ask "what is the federal government going to take away from us next?"
They aren't wrong and politicians who listen to them aren't "pandering", they are listening to peoples' legitimate concerns. However, those who want cop-killer weapons off the streets aren't wrong, either. Banning certain weapons (without loopholes) will make our streets safer. We need to target gun control to where it is most appropriate and federal bans kind of make this difficult to do.

Feingold understands this, especially being from a state with a large rural community like Wisconsin. He knows that in rural areas people like their guns, something he's undoubtedly heard from constituents in his listening sessions. In this case I think that he was representing his constituents. The only thing that I wish he had done more, was use the opportunity to discuss how we can have gun control but how it shouldn't be on the federal level, but hey nobody's perfect.

[Clarkie1]

47. Don't kid yourself.

A disturbed high school kid with an assault rifle could do just as much killing in a rural area as an urban one.

[Hippo_Tron]

48. Sure they could, but they don't

Statistics show that violence happens in cities, not in rural areas.

[Clarkie1]

49. Besides the fact than guns can move freely from rural to urban areas.

Did not the massacre on the Native American reservation happen in a rural area? I don't remember the specific type of weapon involved.

In any case, assault weapons have no purpose but to kill large numbers of humans. And in cases such as this state and local laws aren't really useful because guns can move freely from place to place.

[beevul]

56. Proof please...

"Did not the massacre on the Native American reservation happen in a rural area? I don't remember the specific type of weapon involved."

The weapon was a weapon taken from a law enforcement officer.

"In any case, assault weapons have no purpose but to kill large numbers of humans."

I call bullshit.

Please prove the above statement using non-biased sources.

[Radical Activist]

53. Different standards for different areas

is a good thing. But the assault weapons ban was very basic minimal stuff that should be applied everywhere. There's no good reason to vote against it.

[beevul]

54. Please explain...

why:

"the assault weapons ban was very basic minimal stuff that should be applied everywhere."

and why:

"There's no good reason to vote against it."

What exactly did the AW ban accomplish?

[Bake]

37. Contrary to poplar belief, there ARE Democrats in the South

The party has for too long completely ignored the South. Dems here will vote for Feingold, if he's our nominee. The challenge is to get our voters here excited enough to turn out. GOTV.

I think this is a very smart move by Russ. And Howard. Listening. What a concept.

Bake

[fujiyama]

50. I'm annoyed

when people point out to his religion as a reason he can't win.

We should write off the bigot vote. They won't vote for Dems anyways and anyways we don't really want their vote.

Also it assumes all southerners are bigots. I see no reason why Feingold wouldn't have a chance in CERTAIN southern states were he to run. If I'm not mistaken, Florida for one has elected Jews to state wide office before. I see no reason why relatively more moderate southern states like VA couldn't be in play. Alabama is a stretch and I don't see any Dem winning there, but hey what Feingold is doing isn't actively campaigning, but rather listening to the people and getting an idea what they're looking for.

Feingold knows his limits. He knows that he's talking to (though to Feingold's credit he talks WITH many as well) a region in which many - both Dems and pukes are uncomfortable about extending all legal rights to people of different sexual orientations. And he's proven that he's not willing to sell out any one group for votes.

Plus this is the best time to figure out a strategy for '08. We need to find out now where the most potential lies. '06 will be a preview of things to come and I think Dean and Feingold are looking at that now. People here are simply obsessing over one or two candidates for '08, which I find somewhat premature. As much as I agree that Clark would be a fine candidate, a lot can happen in the next 2-3 years until the primary campaign really gets underway.

[Clarkie1]

52. "He's proven that he's not willing to sell out any one group for votes."

The vote for assault weapons contradicts that.

So, much as I'd like too believe he wouldn't sell out to another group in the future, I can't.

[beevul]

55. Maybe it wasn't "votes"...

"He's proven that he's not willing to sell out any one group for votes."

"The vote for assault weapons contradicts that."

Perhaps he voted the way he did because it was the right thing to do?

Like when he voted AGAINST the patriot act?

[MollyStark]

57. I don't believe his vote on the AWB contradicts anything

many people feel the AWB is a band aid on a larger problem. The think the AWB falls short of accomplishing it's goals.
Maybe Feingold thinks we should let it expire and then get a stronger ban on the books.

[RevCheesehead]

59. Radical Concept: Russ actually LISTENS to people!

This is nothing new, for those of us who know him. Every year, Russ makes it a point to visit EVERY COUNTY in WI for a "listening session."

I think it is his willingness to listen, as well as his propensity to vote on issues (vs. consensus, party lines, etc..) that has won Russ admiration from both Dems and Republicans.

If he is visiting Alabama, it is because he wants to understand the people there. It may or may not be a political move, but it is a wise move.