Sandy Berger Lied to the Archives staff about his theft

[conservdem]

Berger Pleads Guilty to Taking Materials
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

Published: April 2, 2005


Filed at 12:12 p.m. ET

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Sandy Berger, President Clinton's national security adviser, admitted in federal court that he deliberately took classified documents out of the National Archives and destroyed some of them at his office.

Berger pleaded guilty Friday to one charge of unauthorized removal and retention of classified material, a misdemeanor that carries a maximum sentence of a year in prison and up to a $100,000 fine. Under a plea agreement, he would pay a $10,000 fine, surrender his access to classified government materials for three years and cooperate with investigators.

U.S. Magistrate Deborah Robinson set sentencing for July 8.

Rather than the ``honest mistake'' he described last summer, Berger told Robinson that he intentionally took and deliberately destroyed three copies of the same document dealing with terror threats during the 2000 millennium celebration. He then lied about it to Archives staff when they told him documents were missing.


more at

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/national/AP-Berger-Probe.html

[CatWoman]

1. Geoge Bush lied to America about election theft

you're breaking the rules, you know.

[conservdem]

12. Sorry for breaking the rules, if I am. Which rule is it?

[nickgutierrez]

29. Copyright rule

Section 4, here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules_detailed.html

[Cha]

2. Yeah, when is bushbut

going to be brought before the feds and asked to explain his LIES regarding the DAMNED Iraqi Invasion?

[Lindacooks]

3. And meanwhile, the criminal Bush cabal

gets away with:

ignoring warnings about 9/11

lying about WMDs in Iraq

killing 100,000+ people in an illegal war

and the 'Justice' Department goes after BERGER??

My God, we do live in upside down world.

[acmavm]

4. Okay, what's this all about. I know about him removing the docs, that

part I understand. But what's this shit about the destruction of some of them???? If he did that he was amazingly stupid. Just doesn't make sense to me. And it just gives the crazies ammo to point to 9/11 being someone elses fault, not the bush** cabal.

[lancdem]

7. The docs related to the planned millennium attacks, not 9/11

but it was still very dumb on his part.

[conservdem]

9. The destruction part is strange, but according to the

article, they were just copies and the orginals are at the archives. But, perhaps the orginals did not have notes on them. That is probably it. He took and destroyed the ones with the notes.

[Vadem]

5. I want to know what the hell he was trying to hide!!!!!! I'm a Dem..

so I feel that I'm on the side of the angels, being a Dem; however, I'm so worried about Sandy's obfuscation! What is he trying to cover up????? It makes me very nervous!

[lancdem]

10. The originals are still there

[Vadem]

17. Yes, but from what I've read, he destroyed three copies with...

notations in the margins, relating to strikes on the US. What is he trying to cover up, in relation to the Clinton admiminstration and terrorists?

[lancdem]

22. I wouldn't get too upset

I'm sure we'll find out.

[conservdem]

24. I had thought that before, but now I tend to think

the copies had notes and thus were actually to true copies, but rather originals in and of themselves. Do you think this is a fair take on it or far fetched?

[lancdem]

26. You have a point

I believe the notes were actually Berger's, if I recall correctly.

[Wabbajack]

6. Why did he do it?

[dsc]

8. I would be screaming like a raped rooster

if this were a Bush official. This stinks to high heaven and we need to get to the bottom of it. If he is as guilty as it appears he should suffer the consequences and be made to tell just what he was doing with those documents.

[conservdem]

11. Well put. Glad to see I am not the only one with such views.

[CatWoman]

13. however, when relaying those views

you should stay with the rules.

You didn't provide a link and you posted the entire article.

[conservdem]

15. Sorry. I did break the rules.

You are right. I should not have done so.

I think this is my first post. I will get it correct in the future.

For the record, I got the article from the NY Times.

[CatWoman]

18. It's just as easy to edit your original post

you have at least an hour before the software won't let you.

I've alerted the mods -- they will edit it for you if you don't do it.

[conservdem]

21. I think its ok now.

Since you have aleted the mods, I guess I'll know for sure soon.

[Yupster]

27. What these guys don't understand

when they lie like this is that they are putting thousands of us around the country in a bad situation.

We defend them - we explain their position to many of our friends and families, and then they pull the rug out from under us and make us look like asses to our Republican brother-in-laws by lying.

I won't make excuses for him. One thing, he should never get any security clearance back.

[conservdem]

28. Good points.

[Mr Rabble]

65. i agree with this also

he does not get a pass from me.

[lancdem]

14. Of course, if it were a Bush official

he'd get away with it. :eyes:

[conservdem]

16. Hope you are wrong on that.

[lancdem]

25. There's no accountability with this administration

Bush's party controls the WH and Congress, not to mention much of the media and the judiciary, so scandals get ignored.

[AVID]

23. we'd never hear about it

[AVID]

19. Here is a link to ATLjournal article

He wanted to prepare for questioning:

http://www.ajc.com/search/content/auto/epaper/editions/saturday/news_24e4a45810d2208810b1.html

Berger admits to taking files
Ex-Clinton aide pleads guilty, but probably won't serve time
Bob Dart - Cox Washington Bureau
Saturday, April 2, 2005


Washington --- Pleading ''guilty, Your Honor,'' former National Security Adviser Sandy Berger admitted Friday that he had removed classified documents from the National Archives and then lied to authorities about his actions.

''I exercised very poor judgment,'' Berger said outside a federal courthouse. ''I deeply regret it.''

Berger said ''my motivation was to prepare myself and others'' for questioning by the National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States, also known as the 9/11 Commission.

By ''others,'' Berger meant any other former members of the Clinton administration who might be questioned by the commission, said a member of his legal team. However, the attorney said Berger did not share the documents or reveal that he had them.

[AVID]

20. Berger said ''my motivation was to prepare myself and others'' nt

[Vadem]

30. Yes, what the heck does that mean: "my motivation was to....

prepare myself and others".....to what, we must ask????? Ominous, indeed!

[Blue_Roses]

31. this just doesn't make sense

In Richard Clarke's book, "Against All Enemies," he talks highly about Sandy Berger and the millennium attack attempts and how dedicated he was to finding the terrorists before they had any chance of attacking. If Sandy Berger was trying to "cover up" something it was for a damn good reason. This is crap and while there may be more to it, it's not because Sandy Berger is "corrupt"...this stinks to high heavens.

:wtf:

[CatWoman]

33. Best reply I've seen on this thread.

[Vadem]

35. I didn't say Sandy Berger was corrupt!!!! Just tell me what it means...

dammit!....I'm concerned with Sandy's movements...what does it mean?????His actions do not project any reason to proclaim hosannas! I'm worried!

[conservdem]

38. What would be an example of a "dam good reason" for a cover up

[Blue_Roses]

57. what makes you think Berger would

be the one doing the "cover up"...

Nothing is ever as it appears. One thing is for sure, those millennium attack attempts were documented. Maybe Berger wanted to keep them documented in case they just happened to "disappear" in the midst of all that's happened during this administration.

I'm not usually one to wear a tinfoil hat and don't plan to start now, but I think Berger is an honest man and until I see otherwise, I'll continue to believe his motives were in the best interest of this country--whatever it may have been.

[Grooner Five]

58. Isn't that kind of a...

"my country, right or wrong" attitude applied to politics?

Berger did something pretty shifty here. He should explain himself, and end the conjecture.

[Skittles]

32. who gives a shit?

did he lie his way into a war?

[CatWoman]

34. 2d best reply I've seen on this thread.

[conservdem]

36. You do not care about what he did?

Would you feel the same if he were a Republican?

[CatWoman]

37. No, I DON'T care about what he did

and Republicans are committing MUCH FUCKING BIGGER crimes than this bullshit.

[conservdem]

41. I hope your lack of care about his criminal conduct is a minorty

view here and among Dems.

[CatWoman]

42. I feel the same way about your overblown "concern"

[conservdem]

45. You have more experience here than I do, so please tell me which

of us do you think has the more wilely held view on this. Would it be a 50 50 or is your take on this much more like the majority here?

[CoffeeCat]

53. If Sandy Berger was a Republican...

...he would fight off the allegations with lofty, religious rhetoric and hyperbole. He'd quote Bible verses and see to it that the cameras were there when he went to church.

Berger would insist that, as part of the "culture of life" he's being persecuted by the "culture of death" that hates America and despises Jesus.

Berger would then find a controversial, religious debate on which to hitch his wagon. Maybe he would be lucky enough to find a woman in a vegetative state that he could exploit and use to deflect the real issues. He'd ride that train until the notes were a distant memory.

CNN would issue a poll: "Is Christian Republican Sandy Berger being persecuted by the death-loving Democrats who want to ban the Bible?"

Then, our pResident would give Berger a Medal of Freedom for his heroic acts.

Because the mainstream media has become the public information branch of the US government--the story would disappear.

No one would be held accountable. It would never be resolved.

Into oblivion the story would evaporate--never to be seen or heard from again.

That's what would happen, if Sandy Berger was a Republican.

[seabeyond]

39. rw was jumping on everyone every second during this time

they were doing everything they could to deflect. sandy was just used to take the focus off bush. everyone made a huge deal of it, but it wasnt an uncommon practice. the rule was to ask to be able to make a copy. not many followed the rule. but this was during the time where election was up, 9/11 and much more and they and media pounced on sandy. everything i heard about this man he is not corrupt. everyone had good htings to say about him. and the person that turned him in came out being a bush supporter or something?

i think this taking the plea, saying guilty, because he did break the rule. but i dont think it was a big deal rule, and i dont think we should make a big deal

and it wasnt stuck in his pants and socks like first reported. it was a file he picked up with other files, he didnt know he had (when he was asked for him, checked the brief case and was there, he hadnt even gotten into since being in briefcase), and the copy was put in a pocket.

dont remember exactly. but wasnt a to do then, not a to do now. just to make clinton take blame in 9/11 and get it off bush

[CatWoman]

40. this is nothing more but another variation of the

"Clinton trashed the White House" theme.

Nothing fucking more.

[seabeyond]

47. exactly, that is exactly what it is

catwoman, you said it just right

[conservdem]

43. Did you read the article?

He took documents on two occassions. Then he destroyed them. I've been in my state archives, which I bet is far less secure than this, and it seems hard to believe this could have been as inocent as you seem to think it is. More facts might support you view. But SB is not giving more details. The advese inference drawn from that is quite reasonable.

[CatWoman]

44. quick!!! LOOK!!!!!!!

Over here!!!!!!

Berger forged the Hitler Diaries!!!!!

[conservdem]

46. I did not follow this one.

[Catherine Vincent]

48. Maybe Berger wrote notes about GWBush and didn't want people to know

what was written. Something like stupid son of a bitch.

[seabeyond]

49. werent they copies of documents that he destroyed

and the documents that he took out, were amongst the other files that he had in his briefcase and accidently took out. i know there were two issues. one was that he had copied documents because he wanted to get the info right with 9/11 just couldnt put it all in his brain in the sitting. he copied some documents. this is something you are supposed to get permission for that no one gets permission for, but a republican supporter called him out on it. it was garbage. and it was about getting the facts right for the 9/11 commission. they were merely copies.

the other was that he had a document and when he gathered his papers, he gathered that with it and stuck it into his briefcase

they came to his house? and asked for it. he didnt know he had it. found it in the briefcase. color him red, and he gave it to him. was not a big deal, they said it was not a big deal. was not an original. the document was still out there

[stillcool]

50. ...they were only copies....and the originals are still.....

there. i don't get what the big bru-ha-ha is about. Somebody needs to see what notes were written? Why? Is the original not enough? Do they also need to know when he last passed gas?

[CatWoman]

51. and whether he prefers boxers over briefs?

[KittyWampus]

52. He Made An Honest Mistake & There's No Reason To NOT Take His

word. He's not a lying piece of shit like Jr., Cheney, Rove, Perle, Wolfowitz, Rice, Delay, Hastert etc.

Since the Clinton Administration actually: PAID ATTENTION to Intelligence Briefings that warned of Terrorist Attacks around the Millenium and actually held joint meetings with various Intelligence Agencies and actually DID SOMETHING TO AVOID TERRORISM UNLIKE THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION and since Sandy Berger was a part of all that...

WHO THE FUCK CARES

[Yupster]

54. Honest mistake?

He deliberately broke the law and now admits it.

It's not rape, murder or genocide, but it ain't no honest mistake either.

[K-W]

66. ignore mispost

[K8-EEE]

55. Hold Him Accountable

But hold EVERYONE accountable.

Honestly this was so wacky and just STUPID....you wonder if the guy has Alzheimers or something.

[Grooner Five]

56. Why wasn't he asked for an explanation, I wonder?

That seems really odd to me.

[Yupster]

59. I bet that was negotiated

as part of the plea agreement.

His lawyer offered that he would plead guilty to lying, stealing the cocuments and destroying them, would accept a $ 100,000 fine and lose his security clearances, if the government would agree to no jail time and no more questions.

Case closed, everyone is happy.

[Grooner Five]

60. You're probably right...

But for one point - everyone is happy except those who want to know the truth.

[dorktv]

61. Oh well that means he should be taken to the cleaners!

Heaven forbid a Democrat do anything wrong ever because we all know that means ALL Democrats are then lying sacks of bleep.
:eyes:

He broke the rules, admitted to doing so and is paying the price. What a great example of a (former) government official doing the RIGHT thing. Republicans can learn a lot from this guy.

[Grooner Five]

62. One thing they won't learn...

...is to tell us the truth. I'd really like to know why he did what he did, and refuse to excuse Democrats for things that would have me up in arms if done by a Republican. I may be a partisan, but refuse to be a hypocrite.

[AVID]

63. he could always request and be granted an ethics rule change

oh . . wait . . that was delay

[AnotherMother4Peace]

64. I feel like I'm listening to a classic Rovian distraction debate

News broke this week that Bush's hand picked panel slammed his invasion of Iraq - which resulted in the many, many deaths of Iraqi civilians & U.S. troops, the maiming of many more, the tremendous cost to both countries, & the irreparable harm to the country of Iraq - AND the Sandy Berger situation gets just as much coverage - This is an OUTRAGE. BUSH LIED - Where is the accountability here? "Culture of Life" my ass.

[AnotherMother4Peace]

67. Put this in the Rovian red herring file