My Response to The "Under God" Crowd

[Steely_Dan]

I received this "mass" email from my sister. My response follows.

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To All On This List: I received this email on Saturday, March 12, 2005:

I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG, OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND TO THE REPUBLIC, FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL!

I was asked to send this on if I agree, or delete if I don't.  What would you like to do?

It is said that 86% of Americans believe in God.  Therefore I have a very hard time understanding why there is such a mess about having "In God We Trust" on our money and having God in the Pledge of Allegiance.  Why don't we just tell the 14% to Sit Down and BE QUIET!!!

If you agree, pass this on; if not simply delete. .

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My Response:

I want to thank those who have forwarded this to me. Our great country is indeed unique and stands as a monument to freedom and individuality.

It is not my intention to force my views onto others. However, since I did not ask for this email and it came to me unsolicited, I feel that I have the right to respond in kind.

First off, contrary to popular belief, the Constitution was not written to protect the majority. It was written to protect that lone voice of descent. That is in fact, what America is all about...that we can tolerate opinions and positions that don't agree with our own. In a country that is founded on freedom, it is essential that we respect even those that we may strongly disagree with.

With that said, I am not writing this to offend anyone. Even with my strongly stated position that "god" should not be in any way shape or form, a part of our government, I still respect those that hold an opposing position.

I’m guessing that a few of you on this list may believe that The Pledge of Allegiance has been recited since the time of our founding fathers. Of course, this is not true. You may be surprised to learn that it was a Francis Bellamy. a Baptist minister, who wrote the original Pledge in August 1892. He was a Christian Socialist.

At the time, Mr. Bellamy pledge did NOT include the words “under God.” That was added some sixty years later in 1954 when Congress was swayed by a vigorous campaign to add the words “under God” by the Knights of Columbus. It was also added as a means to counter the “godless” Soviets during the Cold War.

It’s sort of strange to consider that the words “under God” were added to the Pledge during my lifetime…I was two years old.

Also, contrary to popular belief, our country was NOT founded by Judeo-Christian patriots. Many of the founding fathers were atheist or at least agnostic. The truth is, the first to arrive in our country were those trying to “escape” religious dogma. They did not like the idea of having to worship a single idea of God. For them, it was a matter of “freedom” from a prescribed religion. And, I might add,
they risked their lives traveling across the ocean for this right not to have to worship as the King saw fit.

For me, the idea of America is that we are “free” to worship or not worship as we see fit. Because we are free “not to believe” in a specific deity (in this case, a born-again Christian God), doesn’t it follow that our government should not promote or practice any specific religious belief?

I become uneasy when I think of our government turning into a theocracy. The last time we mixed religion and government, we were burning people at the stake (Salem Witch Trials).

We live in a wonderful country where the diversity of thought is supposedly respected and tolerated. But from what I have seen lately, our country has not been this divided since the Viet Nam War. People’s tolerance of each other’s beliefs are slowly eroding. One particular view of Christianity currently dominates our government and anyone who does not toe the line and “pledge allegiance” is not only unpatriotic but a heretic at best…and at worst, someone that someday may need to be eliminated. Yes, it is frightening to live in a country where we need to watch what we say for fear of retaliation. If you think I exaggerate, I assure you, could spend hours giving you examples of how “those who are different” are treated in our country…and how others are silenced.

No, the Pledge of Allegiance is not a sacred cow that only patriotic men and women should recite endlessly until it looses all meaning…it stands hand in hand with fear.

I will repeat…it is not my intention to offend anyone on this list. I am only expressing my opinion, which the last time I checked was still legal (in most states).

I will add one more point that I think needs repeating. I have been called unpatriotic more than once because of my views. Nothing upsets me more than when this happens. You see, I served my country as a young officer. I “defended” the rights of all Americans…not just the Christian Right. I fought for the rights of others... even those that I may not agree with.

You see, I consider myself more patriotic than those who wrap themselves in the flag and spew empty patriotic rhetoric. The essence of America is that we can disagree with our government and NOT suffer retaliation. I disagree with my government’s actions…I am the essence of what America is about.

So when you tell me to “SIT DOWN AND BE QUIET” ask yourself who is being unpatriotic and un-American.


-Paige

[Longhorn]

1. Wow, I wish I had written that!

Very well done! If anything ever had a chance to cause some folks to stop and think for a moment, your essay does! :yourock:

[RevolutionaryActs]

2. Do you hear that? That's me applauding you!

:yourock:

That is a brilliant, well though out and all around wonderful email! It's great, you're great! I love it! :yourock:

:hi:

[rodeodance]

3. beautiful--may I send it some I know??

[babylonsister]

4. Bravo, S_D!

Clear, concise, to the point! Great response! :thumbsup:

[Ithuilwen]

5. Gorgeous. 'Nuff said! nt

[blogbear]

6. GODDA LOVE IT!

AMEN!

[Mz Pip]

7. Bookmarking this

I hope you won't object if I use some of this to respond should I get this e-mail.

Your response was perfect!

Mz Pip
:dem:

[MelissaB]

8. I got the same email from several people.

I wish I could have written something half as good as your reply.

Thanks!

That sit down and shut up BS get me every time.

[FreedomAngel82]

26. It gets me too

And being called un and/or Anti-American. :cry: I hate that more then anything! :argh: Oh and bigots.

[kiraboo]

9. So eloquent and rational! You say what in the heat of anger

and irritation I cannot. Bookmarked! -Lisa

[China_cat]

10. You might also remind them

that Francis Bellamy, author of the pledge and a BAPTIST MINISTER, deliberately left out any mention of a god(s). (Of course he wanted to add equality for minorities and women but was told it wouldn't play in Peoria.)

"Under God" was added to the pledge in 1954 at the insistence of the Knights of Columbus and Eisenhower signed off on it as a sop to the HUAC. That phrase was NEVER part of the pledge from the beginning, as most of its strident adherents would try to tell you.

[Steely_Dan]

11. Thanks For the Kudos

Oh yes...my words are free to use...

-Paige

[KarenS]

12. Great response !!!

When I got something kinda like this from my born-again Sister earlier this week, *sigh* I just deleted it,,,,,
It is hard for me to argue (nicely) with the Self-Righteous among us.

I am bookmarking this too,,,, ThankYou!!

[flaminbats]

13. the SAR does this pledge at every meeting..

years ago..at my school "Indivisible, with liberty and justice for all" was always the loudest line. At the SAR "under God" is the loudest part.

O.K...call me immature. One time, after they screamed aloud UNDER GOD, I yelled "Indivisible with liberty and justice for all." Eventually it turned into a monthly screaming match. They would scream UNDER GOOOOOOOOD to piss me off, but I would only piss off the old Repukes!
:crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy:
So I wised up and left the Sons of the American Revolution. I only joined because I loved history, not to have a freaking screaming match with some crazy old men!!

[mcscajun]

14. Fantastic post!

Adding to the stories here, I took an American Sign Language (ASL) class a few years ago, and we were learning to sign the pledge (don't ask why, I Still Don't Know). But anyhow, I deliberately omitted the signs for "under god" -- and when corrected, I corrected the teacher/class: No, I'm signing the Original Pledge. :)

Sometimes You Just Gotta Preach It.

[Blue Gardener]

15. Wonderful!

I will bookmark this well. It may come in handy sometime.

[Psst_Im_Not_Here]

16. I have recieved this one too

Wish I had had your composure! I lost a couple of friends over that email. Funny thing, I don't really miss them at all!

[troubleinwinter]

17. Wonderful!

I especially like this:

"the Constitution was not written to protect the majority. It was written to protect that lone voice of discent."

I would add the the Constitution was written to PROTECT our freedoms.

[Bake]

31. Can ANYBODY spell "dissent?????"

The o.p. was beautiful and well-written. It would have been perfect, and should have been perfect, if "dissent" had not been spelled "descent" (a totally different word), or "discent" as in the post to which I am replying. Unfortunately, a spell-checker will not catch the first, which is a proper word (just not the one you meant to use); the second is totally wrong.

I'm not usually anal about stuff like this, but that error ruined an otherwise beautiful piece.

Bake

[Joe Chi Minh]

18. I disagree, but

I think you've hit upon an element of dangerous insincerity which I agree with you about, and don't have a lot of time for, myself. I mean the business about the flag.

The best kind of patriotism is surely only common sense, being motivated by a modest kind of self-interest, love of your family and liking for the people you've grown up with and live and work(ed) with. "Even the robbers do as much". It doesn't need to be dressed up in pompous ceremonial and cant.

In fact, I think the only effect that ever has is likely to be pernicious: bringing out thuggish master-race sentiments and racist belligerence in young low-lifes, and a dangerously ill-informed idealism on the part of good young people.

When a big deal is made of the "flag", alarm bells goes off in my skull, and Smedley Butler's question springs to mind: "Why don't the oil companies just put up their own damn flags on their buildings, instead of the Stars and Stripes". Or words to that effect. By the way, I'm not a pacifist. But now, I'd probably be a conscientious objector in any war of aggression.

AS a UK citizen, I believe that the history we are taught is pathetically biased, and we should all learn more about other countries and the great leaders they have had. Not primarily the dates of battles we waged against them. I saw a programme about Attaturk on cable, a while back. At 64, until then I had known next to nothing about him.

Kipling was not known for his pacifism, at least until his son died, yet I believe it was he who said, "patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel",.. and I think we might add, "and the chickenhawk".

However, I can't stress enough how imnportant the teaching of Christianity in our schools is. It doesn't matter if it is treated as a joke by the muddled-headed kids. Once or twice, we all sang every other verse of the hymn in morning assembly (a very precious institution I now realise), just to see and hear the headmaster and our teachers on the stage singing it for us...

When the very kindly old Chairman of the Governors, Ebeneezer Rees, quoted from the psalms during End of Term Assembly, pronouncing the "s"s with the very sibilant whistling sound he was prone to make, "Oh for the wings of a dove...", a lot of whistling sounds were heard after he had finished his own. So, it's not that most of us were anything but irreligious villains. But, later in life, I remembered a lot of the scripture from those assemblies, at a time when I needed to; and I was surprised to hear how many of my school-mates, who had given no indication of a religious inclination, had become missionaries, clergymen, etc.

[Idioteque]

22. <deleted>, Wrong Post n/t

[Spiffarino]

47. "Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel."

That came from the brilliant and facile mind of Samuel Johnson (1709-1784) from Boswell's "Life of Johnson."


He is probably the most quoted - and quotable - Englishman ever. He wrote the first comprehensive dictionary of the English Language.

"Don't think of retiring from the world until the world will be sorry that you retire. I hate a fellow whom pride or cowardice or laziness drives into a corner, and who does nothing when he is there but sit and growl. Let him come out as I do, and bark."

If only I could be one-quarter as eloquent.

[ktowntennesseedem]

19. I get emails like yours from my coworkers all the time.

I've had many thoughts similar to those you expressed in your reply, but never at once. Where I work about all I have time to do is delete stuff like that, and if I ever did reply, my random and half-complete thoughts would probably do far more harm than good. Thanks for all that you said; you covered every imaginable base, and you did it all with great dignity and respect. :yourock:

(It is interesting to note, however, that I get a lot of "pass-it-on" type messages, e.g. "stand up for Jesus" or "stand up for America," from fellow Christians. The only problem is that here in the Bible-belt a lot of them are Republican, pastor-parroting, theological conservatives, while I'm a Democratic, think-for-myself, theological liberal. Those that have discovered I'm a Democrat don't forward those stupid emails to me anymore; no more "Jesus" emails since I can't possibly be a Christian, and no more "America" email since I can't posibly be a patriot.)

[Spiffarino]

48. Same goes for me in NC

Religious fundies send garbage like that to me all the time. Proudly professing my Christianity makes some people assume that I am a Bush-worshipping, France-bashing, Kool-Aid drinking Republican.

As soon as I respond to them in the manner of our illustrious OP, they get the message rather quickly and clearly...that dog won't hunt. Sometimes I get nasty responses from the Kool-Aid Krowd, but mostly they just leave me alone. And so be it.

[ktowntennesseedem]

50. Yeah, I mostly get dumbfounded silence in response, too.

When they discover I'm of a different stripe, they suddenly don't know what to talk to me about. Which is just as well since they really don't know how to have a respectful conversation with someone that sees things differently than they do.

[demigoddess]

20. I would have added the fact that when I was young we were taught that

saying the pledge frequently as a public act made it worthless as it was not to be used for "entertainment" purposes. Now with everyone saying the pledge as proof of political correctness, I am very uncomfortable.

[jbnow]

21. My response to the issue sounds less patriotic

then yours does, by far.

The God issue doesn't bother me in the same way , except if there is a God I doubt he'd be too attentive to national boundaries. It would be more properly said "One world, under God..."

I object to pledging allegiance to a flag and to the republic for which it stands.
We had to recite it every day in school and I had a lot of questions. A pledge is pretty serious. I knew I didn't pledge any allegiance to a flag...and if they meant what it symbolizes it should say that.
And...I didn't pledge it unconditionally to the republic for which it stands. What if it did some very wrong things?

My questions just got me in trouble. I was a serious little child. I am all grown up but my opinion hasn't changed and when I have to say it, I say it the same way now as I began to say it back then:

I don't pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America,
or to the Republic for which it stands
one Nation, under God, indivisible,
But I do to Liberty and Justice for all.

When the discussion comes up I answer honestly but manage to irritate both sides. Not at all my intent.
I just think pledges and allegiances are serious issues, not to be given by rote or too lightly.

[FreedomAngel82]

28. You do make good points

To me in some way pledging alligance to any type of object is like worshipping an idol if you think about it. I don't have any problem with the God part since that's all I've ever known (I'm only 22) and any other way would just be strange to me.

[Mich Otter]

29. Is there an Un-pledge of Allegiance?

Once you have pledged allegiance, why does anyone need to repeat that pledge again? Isn't a pledge a commitment for a lifetime?
Does a pledge wear out after some set amount of time? What is the time limit?
Are people doing the pledge in the morning, then doing an un-pledge in the evening? Can someone share with me the obviously secret words of the un-pledge that I have not been privy to know?
The pledge of allegiance is such an obvious example of mind washing. Get 'em while they're young.

[XemaSab]

23. Well spoken!

n/t

[Mich Otter]

24. one nation, without gods, with freedom and liberty for all

Thank you for sharing what you wrote, it is very well said.

[FreedomAngel82]

25. Brilliant!

You did a great letter. Also you should've mentioned how if people are being so untollerated of other people's views and beliefs that they should change the pledge again because in our pledge it has "Liberty and Justice for ALL." Not just straight white Christian men/women.

[Idioteque]

27. Very nice response

Everybody calls me crazy for suggesting that "under god" doesn't belong. I often explain to them how it was added in the 50s to differentiate ourselves from the godless communists. I usually follow that with "Now that we are at war with religious zealots, maybe it's time we switch back."

[Sick_of_Rethuggery]

52. Trouble is...

most of the people who are most vociferous on these matters are most often also ignorant (about history, about freedom) -- making the rationalist's task ever harder...

Vivekananda said education is the cure to all that ails the human race and I used to think that was too facile an answer -- may be not...

[ailsagirl]

30. Excellent response!!

[IndianaGreen]

32. A rightwing GOP Congress stuck the "Under God" in the Pledge

at the height of McCarthyism in 1954. We need to restore the original language of the Pledge, as its author intended.

[grumpy old fart]

33. my personal favorite pledge remix.......

[Eric J in MN]

34. voice of DISSENT not voice of descent

otherwise, good

[Steely_Dan]

35. Yeah...sorry about that...

[MinneapolisMatt]

36. Wow.

That was really well done, Paige!

The whole "patriotic = god" crap has got to stop. It's so annoying. Last time I checked, our flag was red white and blue, not the Shroud of Turin.

Matt

[ebayfool]

37. Bookmarked & recommended - Thank you for a wonderful response ...

to send back, I'm usually speechless & sputtering when I get these!

[pnorman]

38. The only occasion when I recite that Oath of Allegiance these days,

is at the commencement of my Union meetings. I would say: "One Nation Indivisible", and say "Indivisible" again, to keep in step with the rest. I wouldn't particularly shout it out, but I wouldn't mumble it either.

To those who questioned me about that afterwards, I'd reply: "That's the King James Version; the way it was written back in the 1890s." And then I'd fill them in on the history of that Pledge, as laid out on this thread. I think I gave a few some food for thought. That's all I can hope to do, most of the time.

And THANKS for your above response. It's every bit as good (and appropriate) as the others on this thread have said it was. It's a KEEPER.

pnorman

[amjucsc]

39. Alternate suggestion...

Simply delete the words 'under God' from the pledge, and then send it forward...

Though personally I consider forcing large portions of the population to take constant loyalty oaths to be inherently distasteful..

I am an American. I live in a free country. And I will excercize my freedom. By sitting down, and shutting up, now...

[Citizen Jane]

40. Nice reply, also note "loses" not "looses"

I only point this out because any errors in grammar/spelling tend not only to detract from the over-all quality of such a response, they also allow those who disagree with you to easily dismiss you in their mind. The "morans!"

Ever since I learned about why/when the "Under God" bit was added I just don't say it. Funny, no one has ever asked me about it--not even when we had to say the pledge every morning when I taught in a public HS for two years before grad school.

[RebelOne]

41. Wonderful reply despite "looses." n/t

[Steely_Dan]

42. Sorry About The Spelling Errors

I really didn't check it over very well...I was on a roll.

-Paige

[KarenS]

43. Here's a pledge I like,,,,,

I pledge allegiance to the Earth
And all the Life that It supports

One planet
In our care

Irreplaceable

With respect and sustenance for all

[flygal]

44. Great response!

I had an email exchange with a freeper after the election and he said this country was going to hell b/c of athiest trying to take "under God" out of the pledge. I mentioned it was added during McCarthism and that shut him up.

[Deaniac20]

45. one issue worth surrendering

I am usually not for pandering the the religious crazies, conservatives, yada yada yada. But this is SUCH a small issue that going about on this is one sure way to lose votes. An ultra majority believes in God, and of that 86 percent, that means most liberals believe in God. Let's just let the "In God we Trust" and "One nation under God" go. Lets focus on health care, the economy and jobs, and the environment/energy independence.

[AuntiBush]

46. Knowing Genealogy like I do and Historic facts about

the real reason fled for this continent, you couldn't be more correct. You know you're history well!

My response to them: SIT DOWN AND SHUT THE HELL UP! You are the problem; your actions are ENABLING the RICHEST to continue daily gutting us of our FREEDOMS, CIVIC LIBERTIES!

[BikeWriter]

49. Very good. I salute you! :-)

[progressoid]

51. Very nice - When I get those, I usually get pissed

and just delete it and have a drink instead. I suppose I should relax and formulate a reasoned response too.

[Heidi]

53. Kicked . . .

and "resurrected" from the DU basement because it's been weighing heavily on my mind.