911, WTC Missile Thread

[Phil_Jayhan]

I have put together a good deal of what I have about the first 2 strikes on the WTC;

Personally i think its the best shot we have of showing 911 to be a MIHOP than any other peice of singular evidence;

This board is only 5 hours old, so give it a pass on design and content; But I moved my thread there, which caused me so many problems where I used to hang out;

It is a compilation of the best of the best evidences and proofs on 911; A smoking gun thread;

http://letsroll911.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=3

and that video, slowed down and enlarged slightly, is from the czech helicopter news crew covering 911; In it you have the choicest cuts of proof and a smoking gun to 911 as your going to get, so don't look at it lightly;

http://www.forlarasbenefit.org/philspictures/911videos/ghostplane.closeup.wmv

Give it some study; Cause its all there in that one video, and the original can be still found by contacting this czech news orginaztion.

cheers~
pj :P

[DenverDem]

1. Pretty impressive.

I have heard the hologram/missle theory but this video is quite interesting.

The physics of the buildings falling straight down was intitially unbelievable to me as resultant of aircraft collision. Just too tidy.

Put on your asbestos shorts as the radical denialists around here will attack you mercilessly for questioning the warren report on 9/11.

Seeking the truth evidently hurts "electability".

There are no conspiracies.

[Phil_Jayhan]

3. Denver- No Holgram Theory here

I know Rosalee, who has made the hologram theory alive; She is a great person, and has done so many thousands of hours of work that has been used and recopied, she is, and has become invalubale; And she is most charming to meet in person; Like your own mother, sweet as sugar.

But shes just gone a tad too far, as many of us tend to do while trying to figure out the impossible;

http://letsroll911.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/index.php

I have the best of the best here; I have spoken with 3 congressmans offices, 3 in Illinois, and a senator; Actually many more, but I have recieved, on the phone, while viewing only this thread, a total change of belief in the listeners in less than 90 minutes.

Rosalee from Congressmans Rushes office (D)Illinois); I spoke with for about 90 minutes a few saturdays ago; She went from LIHOP to MIHOP based only on what she saw in my thread and admitted to as much on the phone while viewing this very same thread!

Sandy from Congressman Wellers office (R)Illinois) When she opened this thread, and opened the first movie, "Best video proof showing missile" she said on her own, without any prompting, "That looks like a wire guided missile"

And also Phil Cranes office in Illinois. (R)
I have at least one believer there as well, and after only 45 minutes time!

And Tom Daschles office; I have one staffer who wasn't even a LIHOP and after opur phone call was a MIHOP. total time; 35 minutes.

and Im working on appointments; as thus should all of you who believe;

think about it; when's then last time you called your congressmans officer about anything?

Get with it; Wake up and become an activist;

Thats what our site, only 6 hours old now, is going to embrace;

cheers~
pj :)

http://letsroll911.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/index.php

Time to quit arguing and mobize against the globalists, and Bush. For he is the only reason 911 happened; And all that that implies.

Feel free to start a new thread;

[DenverDem]

4. After studying your site I see where you are coming from

and it is very persuasive. Sorry for my initial misunderstanding after only viewing the video first linked.

Thanks for the obvious days of research and development.

Be very careful of your personal security. You are a true patriot and that is a dangerous thing to be these days.

[DenverDem]

6. The reason I inferred holograms

was the way the plane seems to disappear into the building without causing the expected damage, in the slow motion video.

What is up with that?

[Phil_Jayhan]

7. Why did it just Dissapear into the building?

Thats because of, and only because of the missile blast; It formed a 'shaped charge' so to speak using the principles of sheer velocity;

The missile exploded and caused a giant vacuum to occur, and sucked everything out the exit path;

does that at least make sense?

pj :P

http://letsroll911.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/admin/index.php?sid=990804919ef1d4aa9f5d15854d72d3f6

[TrogL]

10. No, because glass is more fragile than metal

Blasts suck things in???!?!

That's a new one.

[Woody Box]

13. Prepared plane or hologram?

When I saw the running pictures of the impact into the South Tower the first time on thewebfairy.com, I thought: This is it!

I did already know the bulge of UA 175, and these few video frames showed to me clearly that the plane was firing a missile into the tower before the crash.

So UA 175: A prepared big airplane.

Then webfairy presented the smooth "diving" of UA 175 into the tower. She claims it is a hologram.

I was perfectly happy with the prepared plane theory, and don't like the hologram theory, but the "smooth" impact is weird, indeed.

Do you think this here

/// Thats because of, and only because of the missile blast; It formed a 'shaped charge' so to speak using the principles of sheer velocity;

The missile exploded and caused a giant vacuum to occur, and sucked everything out the exit path; ///

is a good explanation? Is that your conviction, opinion, conjecture or just a possibility?


I really don't know how to interpret the smoothness of the impact.

[TrogL]

14. Smooth impact

Take a rock and drop it in a tub of soft margarine. Looks like a smooth impact.

Now take a multi-ton airliner and run it through a building faced with plate glass windows. It'll look about the same from a distance.

Remember that buildlings, especially tall ones, are primarily air surrounded by a scaffolding.

[Woody Box]

15. So you reject the hologram theory

and prefer the prepared-unmanned-plane theory?

That's great :toast:

[TrogL]

17. Never said that

You're doing fallacy of the undivided middle.

I reject the hologram theory. It's nonsense.

I've never heard of "prepared-unmanned-plane". I'm presuming this is similar to the "different plane hit the towers" theory, which is also nonsense.

I'm more into LIHOP. I believe Dubya's gang knew there was going to be an attack on DC with aircraft and did nothing about it so they could have the excuse to invade Afghanistan and Iraq.

[TrogL]

11. Certainly there are conspiracies

This just isn't one of them.

[Solomon]

2. kick

[PragMantisT]

5. Very Interesting

check this out
<http://www.tvbn.com/index.html?http://www.tvbn.com/DrGeneScott/Introduction.shtml>

Sorry, can't get it to work properly.
Click on Newest Program on the left, then scroll down a few entries to Mystery Object at WTC. Interesting show. Did one missile hit and another miss?

[Phil_Jayhan]

8. Check this animated gif out, still running of the LA Times Server!

cheers~
pj :)

http://letsroll911.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=3

[TrogL]

9. So you just keep posting the same material over and over...

and over and over hoping to convince people.

It's not working.

Put the photoshop down and walk away.

Has it occured to you that the problems where you used to hang out might be self-inflicted?

[TrogL]

12. Do you people even understand how holograms work?

Have you ever seen a real hologram?

[DulceDecorum]

16. I saw Allah on the Holodeck

and he told me to attack Saddam Hussein.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/dotmil/arkin020199.htm
http://www.cbsnews.com/elements/2003/01/29/iraq/whoswho538410_0_6_person.shtml

Holographic projection.
The Defense Weekly article describes a quasi-information warfare/psychological operations program that was first discussed by the Air Force after Operation Desert Storm in the Gulf War.
This involves projection of a three-dimensional holographic image to act as a decoy. The Pentagon spoke openly about its use of holographic projections during discussions of its non-lethal weapons program back in 1994. Since then, the program disappeared, most likely becoming a black project.
The article concluded by stating that the U.S. Army's JFK Special Warfare Center and School disclosed back in 1991 that it was looking to develop a 'PSYOPS Hologram System' with the capability to "project persuasive messages and three-dimensional pictures of cloud, smoke, rain droplets, buildings, flying saucers and religious figures.
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/pages/holotech.html

Tinfoil alert:
http://www.virtuallystrange.net/ufo/updates/1998/may/m01-020.shtml

[TrogL]

18. Yeah, right

To project such a hologram over Baghdad on the order of several hundred feet, they calculated, would take a mirror more than a mile square in space, as well as huge projectors and power sources.

[MasterKey]

19. I see what I think is a missile

When are you going to add more to your site?

I have seen this stuff, and its good. Have you contacted the media, or government officials with this footage; Of all I ahev seen, this is by far the most convincing;

Im waiting for more content.

masterkey

[DulceDecorum]

20. Which explains

why everyone I know in New York only saw the planes on TV.
NOBODY I know, actually saw any real life planes at all.
And I know a LOT of people who live in New York.

TrogL,
we know that Commando Solo was active in Bosnia and in Iraq during during the onset of both US-led wars.
Where were they on September 11, 2001 and WHAT were they doing there?

[Abe Linkman]

21. DD - A question, please.

From the first time I saw video images of the "plane" hitting the WTC building, I've always thought it looked oddly like a computer-generated image - mainly because the "plane" just seemed to meld into the building
and exit on the other side.

The idea of using holographic technology on 9-11 does make sense, but what I'd like to ask you is this: to your knowledge, are their any credible accounts by WTC survivors, firefighters et al. of seeing airplane wreckage inside the building(s)? And, is there, in your opinion also reason to suspect that no planes OR missiles hit the Pentagon?

[DulceDecorum]

23. What plane wreckage?

Flight data recorders provide an extraordinarily full account of just how the plane was operating in the time before a crash. They indicate the exact working of all the aircraft’s many detailed parts.
‘‘It’s almost unheard of for a black box not to survive and in the case of Lockerbie, the recordings provided vital evidence in the investigation into the Pan-Am crash,’’ said Kieran Daly, editor of the Air Transport Intelligence Internet news service.
http://archives.tcm.ie/breakingnews/2001/09/12/story23443.asp

The effort to better understand the events of the day isn’t being made easier by the fact that the voice and data recorders aboard the two hijacked jetliners that hit the twin towers haven’t been recovered.
The four devices - and all the clues they would hold - have failed to turn up in the 1.25 million tons of steel, concrete and other material taken from ground zero.
“It's extremely rare that we don't get the recorders back. I can't recall another domestic case in which we did not recover the recorders,” said Ted Lopatkiewicz, spokesman for the National Transportation Safety Board.
<snip>
The size of a shoe box and painted bright orange, the recorders are built to withstand fire, water and blunt-force impact, and are located in the tail for maximum protection.
But the attacks were an unprecedented survival test for the misnamed “black boxes.” The two wide-bodied jets, carrying a total of 157 people including 10 hijackers, were mostly destroyed by the fires and collapsing towers.
“So little (airplane) debris has been recovered that there's really no way to quantify it,” FBI spokesman Joseph Valiquette said. The only pieces on display at the landfill were a piece of United 175's fuselage and several pieces of landing gear.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/02/25/attack/main501989.shtml

Thursday, September 13, 2001 :
Investigators have located the black box flight recorder from the hijacked plane which crashed into the Pentagon in Washington on Tuesday.
However, firefighters are unable to reach the recorder because the structure is still too dangerous.
http://archives.tcm.ie/breakingnews/2001/09/13/story23581.asp

Friday, September 14, 2001 :
The black box flight data and cockpit voice recorders from the hijacked plane that crashed into the Pentagon have been recovered.
The two black boxes are crucial to uncovering details about the doomed flight's last moments.
Pentagon spokesman Lieutenant Colonel George Rhynedance says the recorders are in the possession of the FBI.
http://archives.tcm.ie/breakingnews/2001/09/14/story23734.asp

In Washington, workers found the two "black boxes" — the flight data recorder and the voice cockpit recorder — from the plane that slammed into the Pentagon. FBI Director Robert Mueller said investigators got information from flight data recorder, but not the voice data recorder in the Pentagon crash.
Both black boxes in the plane that crashed in Pennsylvania have been found. One black box containing the data recorder was found Thursday, the voice recorder today.
Pennsylvania Sens. Rick Santorum and Arlen Spector, visiting the site of the crash in Shanksville, Pa., today, said they had examined the transcripts of cell phone calls made from the plane before the crash and concluded that the passengers tried to overcome the hijackers. Santorum and Spector's hunch was that the plane was headed toward Washington, but the passengers' actions diverted its course.
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/WTC_MAIN010914.html

Both black boxes from the hijacked aircraft which crashed into the Pentagon have also been recovered and turned over to the Federal Aviation Administration.
However, according to a report in the Washington Times, investigators have so far failed to extract information from the Pentagon attack voice recorder because it was so badly damaged.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/1543564.stm

Just how many Gs did that Penta-plane pull anyway?

Commercial aircraft flight recorders are designed to withstand enormous battering. They are constructed to withstand heat, pressure and shock and contain no moving parts, typically recording data in solid state flash memory.
Tests of modern recorders include shooting them from a gas gun in order to generate a maximum force of 3400 g's. They are also subjected to 1100 °C heat and 5000 psi pressure.
Black boxes are in fact painted bright orange to aid recovery. They also emit an acoustic signal to help crash investigators locate them. They are positioned at the rear of an aircraft to avoid bearing the brunt of a collision.
http://www.newscientist.com/hottopics/usterror/usterror.jsp?id=ns99991302

I have said it before and I will say it again,
it really doesn't matter what DulceDecorum thinks,
but I do hope these links help you out, Abe.
Remember,
if the data recorders did NOT survive,
then how do did the rest of the plane make out?

And why is it that the crater in Shanksville was only eight feet deep?
Eight miserable little feet!!

[Abe Linkman]

25. Wasn't asking what DD THINKS. Was asking about accounts of witnesses.

What I'd like to know, is whether or not anyone is aware of alleged accounts of survivors of the WTC attack who claim they saw airplane parts inside the WTC building. Did anyone on any of the floors where the "planes" allegedly crashed into say that they saw an aircraft ... either before it hit the building...or afterwards? Or even just pieces of any "aircraft"...inside the WTC?

I agree that what DD thinks doesn't matter. (although I do respect your opinions and enjoy it whenever you DO share your thinking with us)

[TrogL]

26. You did see the ball of flame, didn't you?

Anybody on those floors would have been vaporized.

[DulceDecorum]

31. Vaporized woman

To see the photo just put
http://www.
in front of this:
passitkit.com/images/woman_wtc.gif
or go to
http://www.passitkit.com/planes.htm
and look for the phot with the caption
"A closer look shows a survivor looking out from the impact area."

And that is just ONE phot of a person who was RIGHT THERE where the plane hit and was not vaporized.
The firefighter got up there and their reports do not indicate that the scene was anything like TrogL claims.

[TrogL]

32. No wonder you didn't want to post the picture

It's a piece of bent metal.

[OudeVanDagen]

27. on the plaza

aircraft parts were seen on the plaza, which is between and east of the two towers. FDNY reported aircraft parts ... witnesses (evacuees) reported seeing aviation parts and one stated she saw seat parts; later confirmed when she was questioned about color and shapes. Haven't heard anything about anything inside the structures, just on ground.

[DulceDecorum]

29. Link?

And how did the pices of plane get OUTSIDE when
the video shows the whole damn plane going INSIDE the building
like a hand goes into a glove?

[TrogL]

33. Thrown out in the resulting explosion

...or went right on through.

[OudeVanDagen]

36. Tip

Try one of the firefighting websites ... I spent some time today listening to the tapes and also reading transcripts .... no ifs, ands, or buts, aircraft parts were reported on the plaza. By the way ... hand in glove? .... INSIDE? ... what are you talking 'bout DD!? ... you lost me, don't the videos show aircraft parts exiting the wall opposite the collision?

[demodewd]

28. body parts

I'd like to know if body parts were recovered on the lawn or the highway. Descriptions of plane parts raining down like confetti are among the varied accounts. That to me sounds like an explosion caused by a bomb or a set of charges.Parts of the fuselage on the lawn...right?...well then where are the body parts?

[DulceDecorum]

30. The Incredible Penta-lawn 2000?

Guaranteed to resist:
Fire
Explosions
Skid marks
Planes crashing on it

Guaranteed to repel:
Plane debris
Jet fuel
Luggage
Body parts
http://thewebfairy.com/killtown/pentalawn.html

[MasterKey]

34. Yes, one survivor claims to have seen a wing

I remember a report from a survivor, who after crawling out from under his desk after the initial explosion reported seeing an airplane wing outside his office.

Im still trying to remember the websites name, all I remember now is it was a dark green background; But know it's there;

cheers~
pj :)

[LARED]

24. See

http://www.house.gov/science/hot/wtc/wtc-report/WTC_ch2.pdf

Page 19 and 32 for photos of plane wreckage.

[Woody Box]

22. The plane is real. No hologram

I've just visited your site, Phil, great work. I studied the video sequence of the impact. (I knew it already, from webfairy).

My proof that the plane is no hologram:

Look at the impact of the right wing. First, it "vanishes" in the building like a spoon falling into a bowl full of dough.

But shortly after, you see white smoke coming out there - right along the impact line of the wing.

A missile covered by an optical artefact wouldn't have caused this type of damage.

Is there a flaw in my conclusion?

[MasterKey]

35. wtc, 911, missiles, controlled demolition, molten pools

Woody,

I do not believe there is any fault in your argument; I have never believed in the hologram theory; I think it came from watching these video's too many times; Rosalee is great stuff, but shes not perfect.

But your right; The Plane isn't a hologram, and especially so because the cockpit of the plane comes right out the other side of the Tower;

Thats no missile.

It's a cockpit;



cheers~
phil jayhan :)

http://www.letsroll911.org
http://letsroll911.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/index.php