Thanks for your answer.
I have respectfully to disagree.
Everything you do present does not prove beyound the shadow of a doubt that a plane (and as you do admit certainly it doesn't prove beyound a shadow of a doubt that UA 93) crashed there.
Only if this would be the case the presentation of the wreckage of the plane would be superfluous.
In fact ONLY the presentation of the wreckage would prove thata plane crashed there and that teh plane was UA 93.
So where is the wreckage?
Why was it not even presented as evidence in the Moussaoui trial?
Why does apparently NOBODY know where the wreckage is??
But back to your argument.
You state:
"The obvious answer (which is, YES!), is uniformly supported by the testimony of all first responders to the crash, including Wallace Miller and two others who were second and third on the scene, all of whom I have spoken to myself. That testimony establishes beyond reasonable questioning that shortly after a plane was seen to be in distress over Shanksville, PA, a huge crash occurred, immediately after which (by which I mean just a minute or two) a huge field of debris containing airplane parts, human remains and airplane cargo was visible."
If youlook at the witnesses who reported on or immediately after 9/11 (and not thre years later) they speak a very different language:
“If they hadn’t told us a plane had wrecked, you wouldn’t have known. It looked like it hit and disintegrated,” Delano said. http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/search/s_12942.html "It didn't look like a plane crash because there was nothing that looked like a plane …. Just like a big pile of charcoal,” Barron said. http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010912somerscenenat4p3.aspJohn Walsh:
"When I got there, the plane was obliterated. You couldn't see the cockpit or the wings or nothing."http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010912somerscenenat4p3.asp Lee Purbaugh:
“There was nothing there. Everything was shredded.”(Among the Heroes, 299)
Nick Tweardy :
“You couldn’t see nothing,” said Nick Tweardy, 20, of Stonycreek Township. “We couldn’t tell what we were looking at. There’s just a huge crater in the woods.” http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/search/s_12940.htmlNina Lensbouer:
"But I got there and there was nothing, nothing there but charcoal. Instantly, it was charcoal." http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010912somerscenenat4p3.aspAnd also officials state the same:
"We haven't seen anything bigger than a phone book, certainly nothing that would resemble a part of a plane," said Capt. Frank Monaco of the Pennsylvania State Police.(Cox News Service, 9/12/01 b)
Lyle Szupinka, State Police Major :
"If you were to go down there, you wouldn't know that was a plane crash”.http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010912somerscenenat4p3.aspThere is one statement that seems to imply the contrary:
"There was a crater in the ground that was really burning. There were pieces of fuselage and clothing all over the area, burning, said Peterson. He said he didn't see any debris longer than a couple of feet long.”http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010911somerset0911p4.aspAs for human remains you've mentioned the witnesses again speak a very differen language:
“Peterson said he saw no bodies at the scene, but saw no signs of life, either.”http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/News/957434/index.htmlSomebody who saw slightly more:
“He (Dave Fox) saw three chunks of torn human tissue.”http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/specialreports/oneyearlater/s_90823.htmland somebody with a very trained eye agrees with the above mentioned observation:
“Immediately after the crash, the seeming absence of human remains led the mind of coroner Wally Miller to a surreal fantasy: that Flight 93 had somehow stopped in mid-flight and discharged all of its passengers before crashing. "There was just nothing visible," he says. "It was the strangest feeling." It would be nearly an hour before Miller came upon his first trace of a body part.”http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A56110-2002May8¬Found=trueAnd:
"This is the most eerie thing," he says. "I have not, to this day, seen a single drop of blood. Not a drop." http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/specialreports/oneyearlater/s_90823.htmlWhen they describe what they see:
“He (Coroner Wallace Miller) was stunned at how small the smoking crater looked, he says, ‘like someone took a scrap truck, dug a 10-foot ditch and dumped all this trash into it.’”http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A56110-2002May8¬Found=true"If you would go down there, it would look like a trash heap," said state police Capt. Frank Monaco. "There's nothing but tiny pieces of debris. It's just littered with small pieces." http://www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010912somerscenenat4p3.aspAnd a very rare close up supports this impression:
"We haven't seen anything bigger than a phone book, certainly nothing that would resemble a part of a plane,” said Capt. Frank Monaco of the Pennsylvania State Police.(Cox, 9/12/01 b)
Your point 1. Difficut but possible (sorry, this certainly doesn't constitute a proof beyound the shadow of a doubt)
Your point 2.
If you have a look how the secret service can manage to plant evidence and control a crash site in foreign countries (eg Lockerbie and the AL Al crash close to Amsterdam) you would be more cautious.
In fact one only needs to have a prepared crater (with explosives) one person one the ground and to assure that the plane comes this way.
Keep in mind that besides Lee Purbaugh NOBODY saw the crash.
So, certainly it would be difficult to fake the crash site.
But you fail to prove beyound a shadow of a doubt that it would be possible.
Therefore I underline my request that in order to establish the truth the wreckage should be presented and I really don't understand why (as with the request for a positive identification of the alleged hijackers) this is not obvious to people.
Btw (I don't want to discuss this in order not to change tghe topic of the OP but as you've talked to people in Shanksville):
Did you also talk to people at Indian Lake (Marina)?
And what do you make of the fact that people east of the crash site witnessed the plane that they believed crashed coming from the east to the crash site
and all the other witnesses who saw the plane approaching the crash site from northeast before disappearing behind the trees?
Thanks.