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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-24-04 11:53 PM
Original message
Orthodox Union warns Passion film could weaken faith
A major Jewish American Orthodox body Tuesday warned Jews that seeing Mel Gibson's film "The Passion of the Christ," which premiers Wednesday, could weaken their faith.

"If Jews see the film and identify with the image of Jesus, they will dis-identify with their own God given Jewish identity. The result might be inner doubts about their Judaism," the executive vice president of the Orthodox Union, Rabbi Dr.Tzvi Weinreb, said in a statement.

"My concern is for the effect that seeing this movie or even seeing part it, or reading about it, will have on my Jewish brothers and sisters, observant or non observant, old or young."


http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=398216&contrassID=1&subContrassID=8&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y
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Darranar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-25-04 12:02 AM
Response to Original message
1. There are legitimate concerns about the film...
this particular one is not one of them.
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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-25-04 12:17 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. I have not seen it, so I cannot comment on the film itself.

I have seen several articles about it that were pretty funny, and this is one of them.

I have also read that Mr Gibson produced it himself, for 40 million dollars. Fortunately for him, he has not needed to spend a dime on promoting it.

From clips, and from reviews and actor interviews on TV, it appears that although the movie is done all in Latin and Aramaic, I suppose for authenticiy, he elected to choose white European actors.

I have also heard that several Xtian fundie churches have bought blocks of tickets and rented out whole theaters for private showings, presumably in hopes of putting to rest persistent rumors that Jesus was Middle Eastern. ;)
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Darranar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-25-04 12:19 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. There goes Gibson's "historical accuracy" rhetoric...
not that it was unexpected.
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-25-04 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. Pretty funny indeed.
Edited on Wed Feb-25-04 12:56 AM by bemildred
One suspects that Robertson, Falwell, Swaggert and the like
must be looking on in dumbfounded jealousy at this point. The
Rabbi here, of course, needs to be instructed in the discipline
of not giving free publicity to ones adversaries.
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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-25-04 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. The ADL will be flooded with scripts: See page 7! It's anti-semitic!

We've booked the space for the press conference already, Pleeeease read it! It will make you sooo mad!

;)
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-25-04 12:08 AM
Response to Original message
2. Instead of weakening the faith, this film is a sick lie that will offend
Edited on Wed Feb-25-04 12:08 AM by IndianaGreen
Here is an article written by James Carroll. According to fellow DUer Hand, Carroll is a former Catholic seminarian. Carroll saw Gibson's Passion, and then wrote this scathing review of a film he described as obscene and a sick lie.

I thank Hand for finding this article and posting it in the Editorials forum:

JAMES CARROLL
An obscene portrayal of Christ's Passion
By James Carroll, 2/24/2004


"THE PASSION of The Christ" by Mel Gibson is an obscene movie. It will incite contempt for Jews. It is a blasphemous insult to the memory of Jesus Christ. It is an icon of religious violence. Like many others, I anticipated the Gibson film warily, especially because an uncritical rendition of problematic Gospel texts which unfairly blame "the Jews" for the death of Jesus threatened to resuscitate the old "Christ-killer" myth.

But seeing Gibson's film convinces me that it does far worse than that. His highly literal representation of the Passion narratives, his visual presentation of material that, in the tradition, is meant to be read and heard, together with his prejudiced selection of details and his invention of dialogue and incidents, cause one serious problem, very much at the expense of Jews.

<snip>

On screen and in the theater, there is nothing to do but look away. Long after the filmgoer has had enough, even the Romans stop. And here is the anti-Semitic use to which this grotesque scene is put: Then Jesus is returned to the crowd of "the Jews," and then, as if they are indifferent to what the filmgoer has just been physically revolted by, "the Jews" demand the crucifixion of Jesus.

Not even the most savage carnage a filmgoer has ever seen is enough for these monsters. The scene, with the Jewish crowd overriding tender-hearted Pilate, is the most lethal in the Scriptures, but in Gibson's twist, "The Jews" are made to seem more evil than ever.

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2004/02/24/an_obscene_portrayal_of_christs_passion/
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cantwealljustgetalong Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-25-04 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. The Backlash Passion...
...

First, stir the shit. Gibson did this by fanning the fires kindled by Jews (whose fears were well founded, judging from leaked copies of the script). He made outrageous comments on the order of, "Secular Judaism wants to blame the Holocaust on the Catholic Church." He allowed that he'd cut a scene in which the head Jewish priest cries, "His blood be on us and on our children," because, "Man, if I included that in there, they'd be coming after me at my house, they'd come kill me." Guess who they are?

...

For this project, Newmarket tapped into the current passion for backstory revelations. Soon we were hearing about the miracle (involving a lightning strike) that had occurred on the set. It was taken as an auspicious sign that the actor playing Jesus, Jim Caviezel, had the same initials as the Savior. These tantalizing tidbits were gravied up with a human-interest angle that centered on Gibson's struggle against the classic demons of drink and drugs. By the time he appeared on Primetime last week, the narrative of the sinner redeemed was at the heart of Gibson's conversation with Diane Sawyer. Her questions were as soft and fleecy as the Lamb of God.

Is Gibson an anti-Semite, she asked. "It's a sin," he replied. "There's encyclicals on it." Never mind that Gibson's breakaway Catholic sect rejects the most recent of these pronouncements, along with every other Vatican declaration since the 1960s. Never mind that Gibson's father thinks the Holocaust is mostly fiction and that the millions of Jews who lived in Poland before Hitler's rise merely migrated to places like Brooklyn. Under Sawyer's sympathetic gaze, Mel presented himself as a loving son who wouldn't allow his enemies to "drive a wedge" between his dad and himself. Karl Rove couldn't have programmed him better.

...

Every generation gets the Passion it deserves. Back in the '50s, anyone could take comfort in Gospel spectacles, with their Roman finery and celestial finales. It didn't matter whether you referred to Jesus as he or He. These old films enrage Gibson ostensibly because they were bland but actually because they crudely reflect the ethic of Christian humanism, tempered by firsthand knowledge of the Holocaust. That was then and this is now. Gibson lives in a world, and works in an industry, where Jews are not afraid to be powerful and profane. It is hard for him not to see these Jews as the linchpin of a culture that tempts him, rewards him, and alienates him from his father's convictions. So it has been for millions of Christians in the centuries since the rise of secular society—and millions of Jews have died as a result.

No wonder Gibson rails against scholars who try to place the Gospel in a historical context. That's the sort of thing his father would call a plot by Freemasons and Jews. When you do embed the New Testament in its time, you discover that the earliest books, composed about a generation after the Crucifixion, portray Jesus as beloved by the Jewish masses but reviled by their priests. It's only in the later Gospels, written by men who knew what the Romans had done to the Second Temple, and could do to them, that Pilate takes on an almost benign air and the Jews are affiliated with Satan. These late books are the primary source of Gibson's rendition, which reflects the traditional—and now repudiated—teaching of the Catholic Church.

The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops has yet to weigh in on this film, but they certainly haven't allowed their parishes to be part of the hype. This is a fundamentalist megillah, and it's revealing that Gibson's rejectionist brand of Catholicism meshes so well with a reactionary Protestant agenda. Those who fear that this film will fuel anti-Semitism as it makes its way around the world are right to be alarmed. Despite his promises to the contrary, the curse upon the Jews that appears in Matthew is still in Gibson's Passion, cried out by the mob condemning Jesus but not translated in the subtitles. No one will understand these words as they are spoken in Aramaic, but what will happen when the film reaches other countries and new subtitles are made? And what about the relentless depiction of bloodthirsty Jewish priests and mobs manipulating a weak-willed Pilate? It is naive at best to deny that these images will resonate with what many Muslims think about Jews and what many Christians still feel deep in their hearts. A recent survey by the Anti-Defamation League found that 25 percent of respondents think the Jews killed Jesus.

...

http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0408/goldstein.php
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asthmaticeog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-25-04 11:31 PM
Response to Original message
8. Faith that can be weakened by a movie
isn't very strong to begin with. How ironic that the Orthodox Union, in issuing that statement, sounds very much like the Catholic Church itself did when "Last Temptation of Christ" came out about 15 years ago.
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DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-25-04 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. It kind of reminds me of those arguments about ethnic purity

being the only way to preserve a nation based on the ideals of a religion that is all about tolerance and peace. :)
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