Americans back fence

[Herschel]

A new poll shows that 74 percent of Americans support Israel’s West Bank security fence. The survey, conducted by Public Opinion Strategies for The Israel Project, also found that 69 percent of Americans believed that the International Court of Justice, which will issue a ruling on the security fence next month, should not tell Israel how to protect its citizens.

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http://www.jta.org/brknews.asp?id=94129

America and Israel stand as one. Palestinians take note.

[wuushew]

1. So how is this an independent impartial poll again?

In related news corporate survey finds companies favor self policing over government regulation.

[KingofSwords]

2. and the media makes Americans think..

The security fence is being built on Israel's border. It actually cuts the Palestinian territories in half.

[corporatewhore]

3. I support the Israeli "fence" as much as the Berlin "fence"

[Herschel]

4. The fence need not be permanent

It can be altered or removed as the disputed territories are negotiated.

[ex_jew]

6. Nothing is permanent

I could come to your house, steal your TV, and then decide to give it back. Probably I wouldn't give it back unless some court told me to. But perhaps Israel will just decide on its own to do the right thing. I doubt it, however.

[Herschel]

8. The disputed territories will be negotiated

after Palestinian resistance is broken. Then the Palestinians may see a better life. Not before.

[ex_jew]

9. So you would be happy if the THIEF said he'd discuss

the return of your property once he was satisfied that you had no intention of responding in any way ?

Why did you think the Palestinians find such an absurd proposal to be attractive ? You know, they are human too. Perhaps not God's chosen people, but people nonetheless. Their psychology is probably much like yours. Or do you promise thieves not to take action in the hope they will "negotiate" the return of their property ? I bet not.

What ever happened to "Thou Shalt Not Steal". It was still posted the last time I went to temple, which is admittedly some years ago. Maybe now it says - go ahead and steal, so long as you might give it back at some time in the future, in return for something else.

I saw the commandment, and I try to live by it. How you can expect to find favor in God's eyes and yet ignore the commandment is beyond me.

[Herschel]

11. The territories are disputed

Your invoking the term 'theif' is unseemly. The Palestinians must determine if they will turn from resistance and toward settlement with Israel.

Should they comply, they could eventually obtain levels of independence, under proper Israeli approval.

Whether they respond properly or continue in misery is their decision. Israels' security is paramount and will not be compromised.

Israel is the prevailing power in the area, backed by the world's only superpower. The Palestinians must choose between realism and misery.

[Darranar]

12. What forms of resistance do you object to?

[Herschel]

13. Peaceful resistance is acceptable

Violence will bring them misery.

[Darranar]

14. We agree that most forms of violent resistance...

will accomplish nothing towards an end to their suffering and misery.

[Herschel]

16. Perhaps

We should agree all accomplish nothing. Palestinian resistance justifies Israeli response.

[Darranar]

18. I used the word "most" because there are possible exceptions.

[Herschel]

19. Explain yourself

When do you condone Palestinian violence?

[The Magistrate]

27. Well, Mr. Herschel

Certainly violence directed against Israeli military personnel is legitimate. For better or worse, the two peoples are in a war, and have been for a very long time. The people of Arab Palestine have as much right as any other to levy war on their own behalf. They do not have any less duty to do so in a lawful manner, either, but that is a seperate question.

[Herschel]

28. Begging your pardon

If these parties are considered at war, there should be no objection to Israeli military operations against Palestinians, with the collateral damage accepted as a natural consequence.

[Darranar]

30. There is a difference...

between acknowledging something as legitimate and supporting it.

All Palestinian violence directed at active IDF soldiers is legitimate. I only support it, however, as a last resort to defend innocent people from being deliberately killed (to answer your earlier question).

Israeli military actions directed at military targets are also legitimate, as long as efforts are made to minimize civilian casualties (which does not always occur, though their record is far better then Hamas's). However, I do not support a large portion of these actions, even when they are completely legal.

[Herschel]

31. Please refer me

to an incident when the brave IDF made no effort to minimize civilian casualties.

[Forkboy]

32. Bombing an apartment full of people with a 2000 lb bomb maybe?

[dudeness]

37. hmm

I would suggest to you Herschel, that if I were a grieving Israeli or Palestinian parent..I would consider this conflict a war..btw I find your post offensive..

[ex_jew]

15. Disputed in the sense that both sides want them, I suppose

Much as a THIEF wants my property too. What does Israel's power and that of its backer have to do with the status of the land ? If the THIEF has a tank, does it make any difference ? Does the commandment say "thou shalt not steal, unless backed by overwhelming firepower" ?

Kindly explain to me how Netzarim for instance might possibly be a legitimate spot for Israeli settlers.

[number6]

25. "Resistance is futile"

the BORG

[TexasMexican]

5. Not surprising.

Not many people other than the Mexicans who cross the boarder to come here dont seem to care about the fence between Mexico and the US.

Why should they care about the fence that Israel is building to keep Palestinians out.

If Mexicans did suicide bombings too I'm sure a fence would be the least of our worries.

[Jack Rabbit]

20. That's a poor analogy

Israel's security fence will be much better fortified than the border between the US and Mexico. The US hasn't been at war with Mexico in over a century and a half and I seriously doubt that Mexico would try to settle any dispute with the US through military power; it's hard to imagine that working.

Mexicans who cross the border illegally do so to find work in the US. Up to now, Palestinians crossing to work in Israel have crossed the border legally. The Palestinians whom Israel wishes to keep out of Israel are coming to kill people. The need of the Israelis to prevent such border crossings is much more urgent.

Since Mexicans are coming here to work, they aren't likely to do suicide bombings or anything else to harm the people from whom they seek employment. However, if there were such a problem, our border would become much more secure than it now is.

[Wonco_the_Sane]

7. Until terror stops...

Israel should be able to put a fence wherever they want. Until Palestine negotiates peacefully and gets "real" country status, I will support any Democracy. The Berlin wall is not comparable as it was built to keep people in, not out. East Germany was also not under attack from West.

[KingofSwords]

17. this isn't good...

If ending terror becomes a condition for peace there will never be peace. Hamas and others will commit terrorist acts simply to stop peace talks.

[Blitz]

21. Then the answer is obvious

Hamas and "others" must be destroyed utterly. I think that one of the fundamental problems of the "peace process" disaster is the constant and obstinate attempts to put the peace cart before the elimination of terror horse.

[KingofSwords]

23. can't be done..

You can't logically get rid of all terrorists.

[number6]

26. good luck..

..elimination of terror

[drewb]

33. I'm gonna get to work on that "war on terror"...

Just as soon as I win this "war on drugs"...

I'm a simple man, one war at a time for me...

:loveya:

[bemildred]

24. It tends to get lost in the blather that Arafart(sic) and

the PLO/PNA etc. represent the Palestinians that WANT to
settle the matter, not admittedly on the terms Israel wanted
to dictate, but they wanted to settle, recognize the right of
Israel to exist, live in peace and all that. They have now,
thanks to Sharon and the Likuds enlightened policies, been
demolished as a functional organization, and hence we are
subjected to the constant whining about there being no "partner
for peace", and Hamas and their ilk wax in strength every day.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[kalian]

22. Thanks for stating it....

America and Israel stand as one.

That way my post can't be deleted....

[Forkboy]

29. Most Americans dont even know about it.

[Name removed]

34. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Darranar]

36. Oh, please.