Hezbollah confirms prisoner swap deal with Israel

[vierundzwanzig]

Lebanon's Hezbollah guerilla group has confirmed it has reached a prisoner swap deal with Israel, announced earlier by Germany.

"Hezbollah confirms what was announced by the German mediator about an agreement on exchanging captives and prisoners with the Israeli enemy, and confirms the details in the German announcement," a Hezbollah statement said.

Hezbollah television later said the deal includes the release of 400 Palestinian, 23 Lebanese and 12 Arab prisoners.

The group will release one Israeli captive and returns the bodies of three soldiers.

Hezbollah television gave the names of the 23 Lebanese and they included prominent prisoners Abdul Karim Obeid and Mustapha al-Dirani, but not Samir al-Qantar, the longest held Lebanese prisoner.

Qantar was involved in an attack that killed three members of an Israeli family in 1979.

Israel last year said it would not release Qantar because he had Israeli blood on his hands.

The Arabs were five Syrian, three Moroccans, three Sudanese and one Libyan, Hezbollah television said.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s1031127.htm

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Muddleoftheroad]

2. I would never do it

The only Hezbollah prisoners I would return wouldn't be mobile.

[kalian]

3. I'm sure that they'll return the favor...

[Jack Rabbit]

4. Later details from the BBC

From the BBC Online
Dated Saturday January 24 20:19 GMT (12:19 pm PST)

Israel prisoner exchange agreed

An exchange of prisoners has been agreed between Israel and the Lebanese militant group Hezbollah, both sides have confirmed.
Under the deal, Hezbollah must first hand over an Israeli businessman and the bodies of three Israeli soldiers.
About 30 Arab detainees are then expected to be freed by the Israelis initially. Hundreds of other Arab releases could follow.
Negotiations for the German-mediated swap have been going on for months.
Israeli lawyer Zvi Rish, who represents two of the most prominent Lebanese prisoners to be released - Sheikh Obeid and Mustafa Darani - said the swaps could begin as early as Tuesday, but neither side has confirmed this.

Read more.

[Muddleoftheroad]

6. All it does

Is encourage the Hezbollah bastards to take more hostages. Perhaps, if they realized that instead of trading, Israel would retaliate against this strategy, they might learn a lesson.

[Aidoneus]

7. do you have any sense of irony?

The reason why Sheikh Obeid & Mustafa Dirani are involved in this is because the Israeli regime had kidnapped them and holds them as hostages for use as bargaining chips.. this not bringing in to the equation the thousands of people that Israeli forces have kidnapped across the decades for leverage in this or that (and the thousands they hold hostage at this very moment). So do you think that Hizbullah has the right to retaliate against Israel's strategy here, or does that only go one way?

[Muddleoftheroad]

8. Kidnapping

I think not. Israel is fighting the terrorist of Hezbollah.

[Aidoneus]

9. how else would you describe how Obeid & Dirani came into their possession?

Even completely Zionist hawks in the Israeli establishment refer to it as a kidnapping for leverage, what keeps you from being honest?
Different rules for different flags?

[Muddleoftheroad]

10. What flag is Hezbollah under but the black flag of terror?

[Aidoneus]

11. it's actually green & yellow

the black flags are flown by some anarchists (particularly fond of the simple black & red, myself).
do you have any hyperbole pills to spare? I may need a couple to keep up if this conversation drags on in a similar fashion as this.

for comparison:



I know of better versions of the Hizbullah flag, but they seem to be stored in non-linkable online photo banks.. so that'll have to due for now. At the least, you can plainly see that it is not black.

[bemildred]

12. It does seem quite bizarre.

Why is Sharon doing this?
It contradicts a good deal of public rhetoric.
Do you have any clues?

[Aidoneus]

13. A couple months ago he had a lot of credibility banking on it

though he didn't fall apart when it stalled over Quntar. Not sure why he's interested, though.. tying up loose ends, perhaps? :shrug:

[bemildred]

15. Eh.

I've been toying with tin-foil-hat type things,
but nothing really jells. I guess we just get
to stay tuned and see what else happens.

[Aidoneus]

16. <shrug>

the families of the prisoners on both sides of the "Blue Line" were making waves in the media, perhaps that was enough to prod Nasrallah & Sharon into making moves on it, seeing a chance to look good for it later.

On the other hand, Sharon has presided over a failed suppression of the intifada, growing social inequality, a royally fucked economy, growing international isolation, a couple corruption scandals.. perhaps he wanted something to go right for him, in order to keep Netanyahu at bay in the polls.

[bemildred]

17. You left out the decline in military readiness,

decreased social unity, and soaring national debt.
The security situation has decayed steadily under his
"leadership" also, although a good deal of that may be
assigned to Mr. Bush and his minions and their clueless
ambition.

The interesting point is that the weakening position of the
USA will eventually force Israel, or whatever replaces it, into
the arms of Eurasian powers like the EU, India, China, and Russia,
which are after all much closer and much bigger trading partners.

I just did not see how it actually buys him much, like Bush's
immigrant proposals it just seems designed to piss everyone off,
although I expect those whose relatives and/or their remains are
freed under this deal will be happy.

It is notable in this case, for instance, that Hizbollah had to
be arm-twisted into this already lopsided deal by Iran, they wanted
more and were willing to wait for it, apparently.

Perhaps you are right, any "win" at all starts to look good after
a certain point.

[bemildred]

20. You have to wonder if Jabba's little "Watergate" crisis

is part of it, it look like he's running out of time.

[Aidoneus]

23. that could be

this exchange has been stalled since early 2001, perhaps it is as you say as his motivation here for it to suddenly jumpstart. :shrug:

It's odd, he's a bit like Bush lately--a more historically and consistantly rightwing thuggish tendency would be difficult to find, yet he seems to be going out of his way to alienate his most ardent racist-nationalist base of support with things that would otherwise be perhaps semi-decent if done by one without such a ridiculously shady past of doing the exact opposite. Reading the hardline Zionist-nationalist editorials on this has been sort of like a surreal inversion of how Uri usually writes of Sharon. I forget what the link was that I read the most interesting/strange remark, but apparently he's looking to join Fatah's ticket in the next election.

I was looking over a compilation of past prisoner swaps (something off Yahoo, might've been specifically denoting the subject or sandwiched in with a news piece on this particular swap), and something like this isn't the first time being done. Usually after the Israeli-Arab wars the sides swap afterwards; the Israeli military traditionally seems to seize more people in these events since they usually operate well outside of their borders, thus will have less to trade for after. The Israeli military would naturally have seized far more in this case, as Hizbullah is not operating on the other side of the "Blue Line" to have the same ability for hostage-taking as the Israeli occupation forces did/do in Lebanon & Palestine. Well, if they had managed to empty their torture camp at Khiam before south Lebanon was liberated, the proposed swap here may have ended up being a lot larger and even more lopsided, but it was emptied after the Israeli military retreated.

As for the lopsided demands, in general Hizbullah & Nasrallah wish to succeed where others had failed and this explains their requests. Before this, 40yrs of strong pan-Arab nationalism had failed to make the slightest dent in the Israeli win/loss record in wars, yet they retreated from Lebanon. Arafat, Mazen, and now Abu Ala have as yet failed to gain any signifigant prisoner release by being good stepanfetchits, yet Nasrallah is apparently getting several hundred of these people freed without cravenly bending down to his knees to do it.

Why Sharon would do that for him is bizarre, and hasn't escaped the notice of his new enemies on the matter. At least they're finally promising to turn over maps of the thousands of landmines they planted around south Lebanon while retreating. Those little gifts have killed more people there than Hamas has in its entire life.

It still seems strange--maybe Nasrallah has compromising pictures of Sharon and Saddam on a vacation at that Greek island in the alleged bribery scandal, and is thus doing the world a big favour by suppressing them in exchange for this swap.. :shrug:

[bemildred]

28. The land mine thing was nice.

Something for the little people.
Worth it all by itself.

[Jack Rabbit]

14. A little background

From the BBC Online
Dated Thursday August 23, 2001

Israel court orders prisoner access

The Israeli Supreme Court has ruled that two Lebanese militants, held in Israel for years without charge or trial, must be allowed to receive visits from the International Red Cross.
One of the men, Sheikh Abdel Karim Obeid, was abducted from Lebanon in 1989 and the other, Mustapha Dirani, has been held since 1994.
They were both seized by the Israeli army inside Lebanon to be used as bargaining chips in exchange for information about an Israeli airman, Ron Arad, who was shot down over Lebanon in 1986.
The Red Cross has been trying to get permission to see the men for the past four years, but all attempts have been blocked by Israeli security officials.

Note that the men were seized "to be used a bargaining chips".

It seems that is exactly how they have been used.

[Muddleoftheroad]

18. Black flags are also used by pirates

And others beneath contempt.

I prefer a more direct approach when dealing with such slime.

[Aidoneus]

19. a direct approach with them,

but strange evasions with me.. sigh.

Not that I expect continuity, but what do the black flags & pirates have to do with this?

[Muddleoftheroad]

24. The terrorists

Are reminiscent of pirates of old. They are out only for their own gain and sow pain, murder and destruction.

[Aidoneus]

25. so Gaza is filled with buried treasure?

my witty and hilarious jokes aside, the comparison is unfortunately still shallow and greatly flawed. Such diversions seem to make a big deal of making meticulous effort to entirely avoid a proper consideration of the subject.

[Muddleoftheroad]

26. The same character employed

The comparison stands. The terrorists are the same kind of people who were pirates in another era. They leave destruction in their wake for their own advantage.

[JohnLocke]

29. Very amusing, Aidoneus.

:toast: :toast:

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[tinnypriv]

27. "Kidnapping" - sorry to be awkward, but

You're incorrect.

Israel declared loud and clear very recently that it intended to carry out kidnappings if doing so would further its interests (as it has numerous times in the past). In fact, the story was considered important enough to warrant front page coverage. See below.¹

Note that there was quite a debate in Israel regarding this at the time.²


-----

1. The Ma'ariv quote is part of a bulleted sub-heading, under the headline of 'We will get additional bargaining chips for Ron (Arad)'.
2. For example, O'Sullivan, 'Deal sparks kidnapping debate', Jerusalem Post, 11 Nov 2003.

[Jack Rabbit]

5. . . . and Ha'aretz . . .

From Ha'aretz (Jerusalem)
Dated Sunday January 25

Prisoner exchange to take place in Germany on Thursday
By Aluf Benn and Yoav Stern, Haaretz Correspondent and Haaretz Service

Israel and the Hezbollah organization on Saturday officialy confirmed that the prisoner exchange deal between them has been completed.
The German mediator involved in the prisoner swap deal, Ernest Uhrlau, and the German government confirmed the exchange earlier Saturday.
The deal is expected to come through on Thursday, when Hezbollah will release businessman Elhanan Tennenbaum and the bodies of three Israel Defense Forces soldiers kidnapped in October 2000 - Omar Suwad, Benny Avraham, and Adi Avitan. In return, Israel will free 400 Palestinian prisoners as well as prisoners from Lebanon, Syria and other Arab states.
The Israeli government will release on Tuesday the list of prisoners that it intends to release, 48 hours before the exchange, in order to enable High Court petitions to be submitted against the deal.
Hezbollah secretary general Sheik Hassan Nasrallah is expected to convene a press conference on Sunday.

Read more.

[Aidoneus]

21. Israel exhumes Hizb Allah bodies for return

looks like this will actually be pulled off (after it stalled over Quntar I doubted it would do any better than it has since early 2001). Hizbullah should've come up with something to exchange for Barghouti's freedom, even if they would have to defy the US-Israeli puppets in the PA to do it (apparently Arafat likes the fact that the Israelis is keeping one of his most serious potential rivals on ice for him)..

Israel exhumes Hizb Allah bodies for return
Monday 26 January 2004

The Israeli army has begun to exhume the corpses of scores of Lebanese fighters which are to be returned to their homeland as part of an exchange deal with the Hizb Allah political movement.

About 50 soldiers from the army's rabbinical branch, using pickaxes in driving rain, disinterred the bodies from a cemetery in northern Israel, close to the town of Rosh Pina.

They were then placed in wooden caskets before being hoisted onto army vehicles.

A total of 59 bodies are due to be handed over on Thursday at the Lebanese-Israeli border crossing of Rosh-Hanikra through a Red Cross intermediary.

--snip--

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/79CBE44E-A182-44E1-AAE1-85D6E2B06E13.htm

[Aidoneus]

30. tenative lists of those prisoners to be freed from Israeli possession

erm, at least tinnypriv can read it.. has there been any English version?

http://list.ips.gov.il/list5.htm
http://list.ips.gov.il/list6.htm
http://list.ips.gov.il/list7.htm

another couple pieces on this to save the effort of another new post to this thread,
Lebanese president says deal proves Israel recognizes Hezbollah`s legitimacy
Names of Palestinian prisoners released
Final prisoner swap list drawn up; Dirani, Obeid to be moved today

[Aidoneus]

31. Hizb Allah leader says Israel tortured him

a slight bit inaccurate description of him--after splitting from AMAL, Dirani was head of his own group called the Believers' Resistance, eventually became loosely affiliated with Hizbullah's Islamic Resistance in fighting the Israeli occupation..
A Haaretz editorial suggests that he's trying to cover himself with this for when he returns, to shield himself from charges of any collaboration with his Israeli kidnappers while he was being held.

Hizb Allah leader says Israel tortured him
Tuesday 27 January 2004

Prominent Hizb Allah detainee Mustafa Dirani says his Israeli interrogators sexually assaulted him, humiliated and systematically tortured him in a futile attempt to get information about a missing Israeli airman.

Israel kidnapped Dirani in 1994 as a bargaining chip in exchange for information on Ron Arad, whose plane was shot down over Lebanon in 1986. Dirani is to be released in a large-scale prisoner swap this week.

On Tuesday, he told a Tel Aviv court that the Shin Bet security services kept him naked in an interrogation facility for a month as they questioned him around the clock.

The interrogators alternately splashed him with hot and freezing water, shook him until he fainted, squeezed his testicles, sodomised him and sexually assaulted him with a stick, he said.

"I would pray that I'd die," said Dirani.

--snip--

Dirani, 53, testified as part of his lawsuit seeking 6 million shekels ($1.3 million) in damages for the alleged abuse, which he said took place years before the Supreme Court ruling. He limped badly and walked with a cane when he entered the Tel Aviv court room. He spoke only reluctantly and had to be coaxed into giving details about the torture.

--snip--

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/EC01FA53-F114-44AF-89F9-75903CB8008F.htm

[Aidoneus]

32. Freed Palestinians Hold Tearful Family Reunions

Freed Palestinians Hold Tearful Family Reunions
24 minutes ago
By Atef Sa'ad

NABLUS, West Bank (Reuters) - Ilham al-Mughrabi was in tears as she hugged and kissed the baby daughter she had not seen in eight months until her release from an Israeli prison in a landmark prisoner exchange on Thursday.

Al-Mughrabi, 22, from the Askar refugee camp outside the city of Nablus, was one of two women among 400 Palestinians freed into the West Bank and Gaza Strip under a German-brokered deal between Israel and the Lebanese guerrilla group Hizbollah.

"I can't believe I'm seeing you again, my sweetheart," al-Mughrabi told her baby, Shahd, an Arabic word for "honey," who was four months old when she was arrested in June. Their only contact while she was in jail had been by mobile phone.

--snip--

Tearful reunions were a common sight in towns throughout the West Bank and Gaza where freed prisoners received loud, horn-blaring welcomes as they were bused in from Israeli jails.

--snip--

Yet the celebrations seemed somewhat muted as many Palestinians expressed disappointment that the bulk of more than 7,000 Palestinians held in Israeli jails -- most of them rounded up during a three-year-old uprising -- were not being freed.

--snip--

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=574&ncid=721&e=1&u=/nm/20040129/wl_nm/mideast_prisoners_scene_dc